And when someone undercuts you it's with "good enough". That's how being undercut works. It's why we all use Microsoft Office instead of Word Perfect even though WP was hand coded in assembly and faster and more stable and didn't eat your documents for breakfast. Good enough was good enough.
we can't raise wages because then prices go up. It's obvious bullshit since if it were true then we'd still be living in the gilded age. Obviously there is a way for wages to go up faster than prices.
The answer is productivity. As productivity rises one of two things happen. Wages go up and we're all better off, or wages stagnant and decline and only the folks at the top are better off.
Productivity has more or less doubled since the 70s with wages staying the same, so anyone want to guess which of the above happened?
Oh, and be careful when measuring productivity. Right now "productivity" is technically down because there are fewer start ups producing less money in the economy, but raw manufacturing and farm outputs are way, way up, which is the type of productivity that most effects wages.
What's bizzare is watching all these economists try to come up with theories about why wages aren't going up during full employment. A few are finally saying "Unions are dead so workers have no bargaining power" but _very_ few. The right wing figured out some time ago they need to control the media narrative so they just bought everything. You can do that when you're the last man standing after an economic crash you caused and got bailed out of.
they're doing just fine. It had a very small impact on hiring new workers. That said, it's entirely possible those workers are still getting jobs just fine outside Seattle city limits. And that's probably not even a long drive. A common trick the well to do use is incorporate a suburb just outside city limits so they don't have to pay taxes and higher minimum wage to their workers but can still enjoy all the benefits of living in a major city. I'll bet when you look at the data you'll see exactly that at play.
We need a national $15 wage and it needs to adjust for inflation (and "real" inflation, e.g. the price of the sorts of things a minimum wage worker buys, no fair including BMWs in that, no matter what talk radio tells you $15/hr doesn't buy you a BMW).
The study's mostly raw data. The other possibility is that higher wages are drawing more experienced workers the new workers can't compete with. But if that's the case the problem goes away if you make $15 the national wage; e.g. what's actually happening is those less experienced workers are stuck getting jobs outside of Seattle for less pay.
Basically, Seattle's big enough that they're are probably outlying suburbs that have incorporated to dodge taxes and minimum wage laws (my city does just that). They're soaking up the new workers right now, probably right on the boarder. Heck, where I am right now I've got political signs for a proposition to pay for roads in the rich neighborhoods right down the street from me because those neighborhoods are technically another "city" than me. It's so they don't have to pay into the general fund but can take advantage of the city proper's amenities. Crap like this is why we have a national minimum wage.
but my politicians spend non stop good or bad times. Oh... you meant on social programs & healthcare? Yeah, they cut those nonstop. We're in an economic boom over here and the speaker of the house just called to end Social Security & Medicare.
Sure, the top 5% of programmers still get decent work.
But no, they don't charge just as much. You're forgetting about training. US colleges are crazy expensive. You're also forgetting that US workers put in 50-60 hour work weeks while the guys overseas are doing 80. And we used to do 30-40 until we were forced to work harder to compete. Sure, they burn out, but there's literally a billion of them.
I don't really care that my oil filter's only good for 6000 miles when it's $20 bucks. That's because It's cheap, disposable, and good enough..
This is like War Games. The only winning move it not to play.
even though I haven't made min wage in 20+ years. Let me explain (no no, there is no time, let me sum up).
Scenario 1: Guy makes min wage. It's not enough. Guy works really hard, learns new skill gets new job making twice minimum wage. Enters new job market, wages in that market go down because supply just went up.
Scenario 2: Guy makes min wage. It's enough. Guy is content in his job and life. Doesn't enter my segment of the job market. My wages go up because supply goes down.
TL;DR;, Supply and Demand work both ways folks. That guy who can't make a living washing dishes will probably fail at being a computer programmer. Probably. Some don't, and they're gunning for your wages.
in America? Every job site I've seen is at best 80/20 H1-Bs, sometimes 90/10. You can't even get a project management job anymore. Companies did away with all the entry level positions so they could claim there was a shortage of "senior programmers" so there's no career track.
Momma's don't let your babies grow up to be CS Majors, let'em be Doctor's and such.
the ISPs never stop fighting this battle. If you slip up even for a second they win and those kind of wins are usually permanent. It's hard to compete with mega corps for lobbying not just because they've got money to buy propaganda and politicians, but because they've got people who's job is to lobby. You've got full time professionals going up against spirited amateurs.
but you have to make your agenda clear. If the gov't of Iran wants to campaign against Trump that's their prerogative. But if they want to lie and pretend they're Americans campaigning against Trump that's when they've crossed the line. The same is true for the Russians when they campaign for Trump.
I'm clever enough to know that information is useless if you don't know it's source. But there's enough that aren't to swing elections. Democracy and Capitalism both only work when there's enough information to go around.
it's the various telecommunications laws, like Title II. This was all hashed out ages ago. Best case scenario the Internet crosses state lines like mad and falls under the commerce clause. Then there's generations of national telecom laws.
There is no explicit law covering Net Neutrality that Pai is required to enforce. There _is_ common carrier, which by all rights should apply, but he can and does argue that it does not apply. The courts never fully ruled on that, and with the current Supreme Court stacked with right wing, pro-corporatists they will almost certain rule on the side of telecom. Companies like Google won't come to your rescue to try to litigate since they're happy to see their competitors be shut out when they can't pay the ISPs fees.
There's only one way to fix this, and that's at the ballot box. That means if you're in a Red state either somehow convincing the GOP to support Net Neutrality (good luck, it's the sort of regulation that their basic platform opposes) or getting Dems in office since the Dems favor exactly this kind of regulation.
It's like I've said before, you can't have a functioning government except when you don't. We either have a well ordered society with rules that protect us all or we don't. You can't have a winner take all system when you're the winner and strong gov't protections when you're not. Protect everybody or nobody gets protection.
the point was never to get the law through. It's long since been established that the federal government can regulate the Internet under the commerce clause. That isn't controversial. CA knows they're going to lose the court case. They're hoping to get national attention so that the other 49 states will vote pro-NN people in.
I'm in a Red State and I've done the best I can. Voted in my primaries and in my General. If you're reading this in a Red state now's the time to act. Get enough of the right kind of politician (and let's face it, that's the Dems) and they can override Trump's veto.
This is long since settled case law. This entire thing is just a protest vote by California. If/.ers want this fixed they're going to have to go to the polls nationally and get it changed. There's an election in less than 2 weeks. Now's a good time to put up or shut up. Put enough of the right kind of politician in office and they can override President Trump's veto.
Or don't, but then stop bitching when government regulations you like go away.
of muckraking. I keep saying this but we lost a lot when guys like Gawker went away. Sure, they did a lot of awful tabloid journalism, but they also did a fair bit of the investigative stuff that the tabloids paid for.
Somewhat hilariously one of the hardest hitting journalistic outlets today is Teen Vogue. It helps that they're a bit like the court jester in that nobody takes 'em that seriously so they can get away with stories that anywhere else would have the mega corps come down like a ton of bricks.
calling them "right-minded" instead of "right wing".
Also, and I'm not too good at sports, but baseball doesn't have a referee. It's an Umpire. And they're generally pretty fair because of how the rules work. Don't like it? Make some rules. Because if it's one thing I know about the right wing, they love government regulation. Just love it.
1st amendment rules don't apply. 14th amendment ones do. Along with the Civil Rights act. Those are different things. Twitter cannot discriminate against protected classes. Feel free to make political views a protected class. During the Bush Administration several factory owners fired workers for pro-Obama bumper stickers and it was perfectly legal. If you want to expand the scope of the Civil Rights Act nobody on the left is gonna stop you.
Now, my question is are you doing this on purpose as part of a deliberate effort or did you fall for the propaganda from someone else doing that? Either way everyone on this forum reading your post got had. If you're part of the group that got tricked then congrats, you now know you've been tricked. Now go do something about it.
I'm a lefty, and I'm deeply opposed to companies being able to regulate people. The "state" only gets the power to regulate in as much as they are granted that power by Democracy. e.g. all meaningful power derives from Democracy. "Meaningful" here means the ability to control access to food, shelter, healthcare, education and free speech
And here we have the problem with the left, we can't agree on anything. We're a loose knit coalition at best. The right, OTOH, and highly organized around two coalitions: Evangelical Religion and Laissez-faire capitalism. Since these two don't have much overlap the Evangelicals can get what (enforcing their religious beliefs to appease God) they want and the capitalists what they want (low taxes and little to no regulation or worker's rights).
Meanwhile the left will argue endlessly on appropriate gender pronouns...
they don't seem to allow comments on their articles, relying on Facebook and Twitter for community outreach. And they seem to be doing just fine with that.
so I guess he's winning. This is a problem the left has. We like to explain and we like to be right. But being right and explaining don't win debates. There's a whole world of nasty little debate tactics that you can use to win when you're objectively wrong. Google the "Gish Gallop" for one of Trump's favs, but there are dozens, if not hundreds.
we changed the definition of "far right" from "guys who want to shut down Social Security/Medicare, stop funding public schools and do away with clean water regulations" to "Neo-Nazis".
Meanwhile we kept the definition of the far left as "Women who want to cut off men's penises and seize all private property".
The number of "far right" didn't change. They used clever rhetoric and their control of mass media to pretend their ideas weren't radical and hammered that point home until folks were fooled into it. There is a substantial far right in America, we just got tricked into pretending there isn't.
and while we're at it hold Fox News to the editorial standards that used to exist where you can't mix news and editorializing? How about all those billionaires and their unlimited money? Money is speech after all and they've got unlimited speech and power. Ready to start taking away their central power?
Sorry, but you're not fooling anyone. You're in favor of centralized media control when it suits you. You're opposed to it when the slightest resistance is detected.
Here's the thing, you won. You won everything. You control every branch of government. Even the Democrats are mostly right wing now thanks to the Overton window shift. The right own everything. Now you've just got to live with the consequences. Your guy Trump just called himself a Nationalist. He praises dictators for seizing power. He put a pro-torture woman in charge of the CIA. That's all gonna come home to roost soon. Enjoy your Pyrrhic victory. In the meantime can you stop acting like you're some oppressed minority? You're not. You won.
or the violence until he was called out for saying both sides were bad. He never had any intention of repudiating them until it turned into bad press. It was roughly on par with the remorse you get when a kid's caught stealing cookies. Probably less. The kid at least understands his parents are mad. Trump was just reacting to the situation. Like a Pavlovian dog but for racism.
Slashdot Mirror
the "game" is being a CS major. Not being alive.
And when someone undercuts you it's with "good enough". That's how being undercut works. It's why we all use Microsoft Office instead of Word Perfect even though WP was hand coded in assembly and faster and more stable and didn't eat your documents for breakfast. Good enough was good enough.
we can't raise wages because then prices go up. It's obvious bullshit since if it were true then we'd still be living in the gilded age. Obviously there is a way for wages to go up faster than prices.
The answer is productivity. As productivity rises one of two things happen. Wages go up and we're all better off, or wages stagnant and decline and only the folks at the top are better off.
Productivity has more or less doubled since the 70s with wages staying the same, so anyone want to guess which of the above happened?
Oh, and be careful when measuring productivity. Right now "productivity" is technically down because there are fewer start ups producing less money in the economy, but raw manufacturing and farm outputs are way, way up, which is the type of productivity that most effects wages.
What's bizzare is watching all these economists try to come up with theories about why wages aren't going up during full employment. A few are finally saying "Unions are dead so workers have no bargaining power" but _very_ few. The right wing figured out some time ago they need to control the media narrative so they just bought everything. You can do that when you're the last man standing after an economic crash you caused and got bailed out of.
they're doing just fine. It had a very small impact on hiring new workers. That said, it's entirely possible those workers are still getting jobs just fine outside Seattle city limits. And that's probably not even a long drive. A common trick the well to do use is incorporate a suburb just outside city limits so they don't have to pay taxes and higher minimum wage to their workers but can still enjoy all the benefits of living in a major city. I'll bet when you look at the data you'll see exactly that at play.
We need a national $15 wage and it needs to adjust for inflation (and "real" inflation, e.g. the price of the sorts of things a minimum wage worker buys, no fair including BMWs in that, no matter what talk radio tells you $15/hr doesn't buy you a BMW).
The study's mostly raw data. The other possibility is that higher wages are drawing more experienced workers the new workers can't compete with. But if that's the case the problem goes away if you make $15 the national wage; e.g. what's actually happening is those less experienced workers are stuck getting jobs outside of Seattle for less pay.
Basically, Seattle's big enough that they're are probably outlying suburbs that have incorporated to dodge taxes and minimum wage laws (my city does just that). They're soaking up the new workers right now, probably right on the boarder. Heck, where I am right now I've got political signs for a proposition to pay for roads in the rich neighborhoods right down the street from me because those neighborhoods are technically another "city" than me. It's so they don't have to pay into the general fund but can take advantage of the city proper's amenities. Crap like this is why we have a national minimum wage.
but my politicians spend non stop good or bad times. Oh... you meant on social programs & healthcare? Yeah, they cut those nonstop. We're in an economic boom over here and the speaker of the house just called to end Social Security & Medicare.
Socialism for the rich, Dog eat dog for the poor.
Sure, the top 5% of programmers still get decent work.
But no, they don't charge just as much. You're forgetting about training. US colleges are crazy expensive. You're also forgetting that US workers put in 50-60 hour work weeks while the guys overseas are doing 80. And we used to do 30-40 until we were forced to work harder to compete. Sure, they burn out, but there's literally a billion of them.
I don't really care that my oil filter's only good for 6000 miles when it's $20 bucks. That's because It's cheap, disposable, and good enough..
This is like War Games. The only winning move it not to play.
even though I haven't made min wage in 20+ years. Let me explain (no no, there is no time, let me sum up).
Scenario 1: Guy makes min wage. It's not enough. Guy works really hard, learns new skill gets new job making twice minimum wage. Enters new job market, wages in that market go down because supply just went up.
Scenario 2: Guy makes min wage. It's enough. Guy is content in his job and life. Doesn't enter my segment of the job market. My wages go up because supply goes down.
TL;DR;, Supply and Demand work both ways folks. That guy who can't make a living washing dishes will probably fail at being a computer programmer. Probably. Some don't, and they're gunning for your wages.
in America? Every job site I've seen is at best 80/20 H1-Bs, sometimes 90/10. You can't even get a project management job anymore. Companies did away with all the entry level positions so they could claim there was a shortage of "senior programmers" so there's no career track.
Momma's don't let your babies grow up to be CS Majors, let'em be Doctor's and such.
the ISPs never stop fighting this battle. If you slip up even for a second they win and those kind of wins are usually permanent. It's hard to compete with mega corps for lobbying not just because they've got money to buy propaganda and politicians, but because they've got people who's job is to lobby. You've got full time professionals going up against spirited amateurs.
Democratic Socialist.
but you have to make your agenda clear. If the gov't of Iran wants to campaign against Trump that's their prerogative. But if they want to lie and pretend they're Americans campaigning against Trump that's when they've crossed the line. The same is true for the Russians when they campaign for Trump.
I'm clever enough to know that information is useless if you don't know it's source. But there's enough that aren't to swing elections. Democracy and Capitalism both only work when there's enough information to go around.
it's the various telecommunications laws, like Title II. This was all hashed out ages ago. Best case scenario the Internet crosses state lines like mad and falls under the commerce clause. Then there's generations of national telecom laws.
There is no explicit law covering Net Neutrality that Pai is required to enforce. There _is_ common carrier, which by all rights should apply, but he can and does argue that it does not apply. The courts never fully ruled on that, and with the current Supreme Court stacked with right wing, pro-corporatists they will almost certain rule on the side of telecom. Companies like Google won't come to your rescue to try to litigate since they're happy to see their competitors be shut out when they can't pay the ISPs fees.
There's only one way to fix this, and that's at the ballot box. That means if you're in a Red state either somehow convincing the GOP to support Net Neutrality (good luck, it's the sort of regulation that their basic platform opposes) or getting Dems in office since the Dems favor exactly this kind of regulation.
It's like I've said before, you can't have a functioning government except when you don't. We either have a well ordered society with rules that protect us all or we don't. You can't have a winner take all system when you're the winner and strong gov't protections when you're not. Protect everybody or nobody gets protection.
the point was never to get the law through. It's long since been established that the federal government can regulate the Internet under the commerce clause. That isn't controversial. CA knows they're going to lose the court case. They're hoping to get national attention so that the other 49 states will vote pro-NN people in.
I'm in a Red State and I've done the best I can. Voted in my primaries and in my General. If you're reading this in a Red state now's the time to act. Get enough of the right kind of politician (and let's face it, that's the Dems) and they can override Trump's veto.
This is long since settled case law. This entire thing is just a protest vote by California. If /.ers want this fixed they're going to have to go to the polls nationally and get it changed. There's an election in less than 2 weeks. Now's a good time to put up or shut up. Put enough of the right kind of politician in office and they can override President Trump's veto.
Or don't, but then stop bitching when government regulations you like go away.
of muckraking. I keep saying this but we lost a lot when guys like Gawker went away. Sure, they did a lot of awful tabloid journalism, but they also did a fair bit of the investigative stuff that the tabloids paid for.
Somewhat hilariously one of the hardest hitting journalistic outlets today is Teen Vogue. It helps that they're a bit like the court jester in that nobody takes 'em that seriously so they can get away with stories that anywhere else would have the mega corps come down like a ton of bricks.
Think about it. He's big, orange and has really small hands relative to his body size. He's the God Emperor.
calling them "right-minded" instead of "right wing".
Also, and I'm not too good at sports, but baseball doesn't have a referee. It's an Umpire. And they're generally pretty fair because of how the rules work. Don't like it? Make some rules. Because if it's one thing I know about the right wing, they love government regulation. Just love it.
1st amendment rules don't apply. 14th amendment ones do. Along with the Civil Rights act. Those are different things. Twitter cannot discriminate against protected classes. Feel free to make political views a protected class. During the Bush Administration several factory owners fired workers for pro-Obama bumper stickers and it was perfectly legal. If you want to expand the scope of the Civil Rights Act nobody on the left is gonna stop you.
Now, my question is are you doing this on purpose as part of a deliberate effort or did you fall for the propaganda from someone else doing that? Either way everyone on this forum reading your post got had. If you're part of the group that got tricked then congrats, you now know you've been tricked. Now go do something about it.
I'm a lefty, and I'm deeply opposed to companies being able to regulate people. The "state" only gets the power to regulate in as much as they are granted that power by Democracy. e.g. all meaningful power derives from Democracy. "Meaningful" here means the ability to control access to food, shelter, healthcare, education and free speech
And here we have the problem with the left, we can't agree on anything. We're a loose knit coalition at best. The right, OTOH, and highly organized around two coalitions: Evangelical Religion and Laissez-faire capitalism. Since these two don't have much overlap the Evangelicals can get what (enforcing their religious beliefs to appease God) they want and the capitalists what they want (low taxes and little to no regulation or worker's rights).
Meanwhile the left will argue endlessly on appropriate gender pronouns...
they don't seem to allow comments on their articles, relying on Facebook and Twitter for community outreach. And they seem to be doing just fine with that.
so I guess he's winning. This is a problem the left has. We like to explain and we like to be right. But being right and explaining don't win debates. There's a whole world of nasty little debate tactics that you can use to win when you're objectively wrong. Google the "Gish Gallop" for one of Trump's favs, but there are dozens, if not hundreds.
we changed the definition of "far right" from "guys who want to shut down Social Security/Medicare, stop funding public schools and do away with clean water regulations" to "Neo-Nazis".
Meanwhile we kept the definition of the far left as "Women who want to cut off men's penises and seize all private property".
The number of "far right" didn't change. They used clever rhetoric and their control of mass media to pretend their ideas weren't radical and hammered that point home until folks were fooled into it. There is a substantial far right in America, we just got tricked into pretending there isn't.
You can use facts to prove anything that's even remotely true.
Seriously though, this post truth world is starting to creep me out.
and while we're at it hold Fox News to the editorial standards that used to exist where you can't mix news and editorializing? How about all those billionaires and their unlimited money? Money is speech after all and they've got unlimited speech and power. Ready to start taking away their central power?
Sorry, but you're not fooling anyone. You're in favor of centralized media control when it suits you. You're opposed to it when the slightest resistance is detected.
Here's the thing, you won. You won everything. You control every branch of government. Even the Democrats are mostly right wing now thanks to the Overton window shift. The right own everything. Now you've just got to live with the consequences. Your guy Trump just called himself a Nationalist. He praises dictators for seizing power. He put a pro-torture woman in charge of the CIA. That's all gonna come home to roost soon. Enjoy your Pyrrhic victory. In the meantime can you stop acting like you're some oppressed minority? You're not. You won.
or the violence until he was called out for saying both sides were bad. He never had any intention of repudiating them until it turned into bad press. It was roughly on par with the remorse you get when a kid's caught stealing cookies. Probably less. The kid at least understands his parents are mad. Trump was just reacting to the situation. Like a Pavlovian dog but for racism.