You are correct about the yahoo address being used for privacy reasons. I'm not sure why you think the address is a bit suspect, unless you imagine that I might be seeking to sell products or services--which I am not. I feel that solicitation of goods or services on a site like/. is reprehensible.
I live and work in a Metro area of 500,000 residents and have all the work I need locally.Any projects I take on outside of my local area are due to referrals from one of several wireless vendors.Now, you ask if I often give out anonymous WLAN advice. I do so when I have time, but felt especially compelled to reply to the original poster. What I got from the subtext of his post is that he might be young, have some experience in networking but obviously none to little in wireless. Without the site survey and a good contract drawn up by a lawyer he would be headed for certain disaster.
Even more important to me was the fact that the type of install he proposes it perhaps the
most difficult of any to implement. Just thinking about the problems one faces on that sort of rollout makes me want to grab a beer.
Lastly, I am an open source advocate. That said, I feel obligated to help others when I can if the issues are within my area of expertise and do not result in any conflicts with clients or vendors. Many others in the community have been giving of their time and skills, so I like to do my part when I can. I hope this alleviates any concerns you may have.
YIkes! First post. What happened to my paragraphing?
Surely was there when I wrote it all.
Apologies. Guess that's what I get for using an XP box I'm testing for a client.
Hello Cliff:
While I have never posted on Slashdot I felt compelled to register and reply.
PLEASE READ THIS CAREFULLY
Allow me to explain that I am a network consultant and have learned the hard way on wireless--very hard and many sleepless nights.
My first WLAN installation reminds me of where I think you may be right now, but I had done six months of research and had had endless hours of conversations with engineers from several manufacturers.
Before we get to the problems I had, lets start with what you have missed overall: a site survey.
NEVER even agree to take on a task like a WLAN unless you have done an extensive site survey.
First, you will need blueprints if possible or will need to take fairly exact measurements of each apartment, know materials used in construction etc. You'll also need to have floor plans and more.
That said, you should then know the maximum number of users and throw all the specs the manufacturer gave you out the window as regards range, distance and AP's required.
And, I am assuming you will have over 20 users. In two different buildings?
Don't go with consumer grade stuff like SMC for the AP's. SMC is the best of it but still lacks signal strength in many installs.
Go with Cisco for AP's and routers, and ONLY Orinoco Gold cards for laptops and equivalent for desktops.
You'll also need a portable spectrum analyzer and know how to intrepret the data it provides. Not sure if they can be rented but I paid $3,000 for mine and it was a deal.
You'll need to set up the AP's and then go to every location and check SNR etc.--and record all the data. There's a mountain of paperwork on a project like this, just for the site survey alone.
After that's done you will still need to go to each apartment with a mid-range laptop and again record signal strength etc. There will be dead spots, and God only knows where a tenant will put their PC.
Now, you will have to roam about again with the spectrum analyzer AND a laptop to look for both multipath interference and to check for other 802.211b nets in the area.
And did I mention if you are in a congested urban area or near a university or hospital you will also need to contact the admins at those institutions and hope they will cooperate and give you a map of their devices, antennae and locations? They generally will but may not even know where it all is if it's a large institution--and that can be yet another nightmare to solve.
And, forget about promised scalability. Most AP's will really only handle 10 users or so, especially the consumer grade gear. At least unless things have changed drastically since November of 2001, my last nightmare install.
You also have another problem: lack of a homogeneous hardware environment. On the Nigthmare Project 2001 (as I call it now) I had some PC's that never worked right if at all on the WLAN (30 users in one university residence, off-campus.) I spent an average of 8 hrs a day on the phone with high-level engineers from Cisco and SMC. Both companies were good but had to admit at times they had no idea why some problems happened. And I had their home and cell phone numbers.
I know. Was dealing with a mix of Macs, Linux boxen and Windows PC's running anything from 98 to XP. And some were old Gateways, others new Dells. Gateways were the worst.
Forget about the idea that your big worry will be with other 2.4 Ghz devices. Microwaves and phones have seldom been a problem for me on a project unless within 6 ft of the AP or wireless NIC. One stark exception is Panasonic phones, but this is a known issue fopr professionals.
I am NOT anti-wireless but do think you should know that the obstacles you face are severe.
I do this for a living and can say that I would not take on a project like this unless I had a very tight contract (you do have a lawyer, right.)
CAT 5 and other options are cheaper and more reliable--and I haven't even touched on servers or security issues.
Wireless is NOT cheaper, is more difficult to roll out and is a real headache--especially in historical buildings and those "impossible to wire" locations. I still do a lot of it but only for corporate installs where I have an open floor plan and decent line of sight.
I also refuse to do an install now unless I know the company has skilled admins and will allow me indemnification.
Do what you like but don't go into this believing all you have read from manufacturers or home users.
Hope you don't have to learn as painfuly as I did.
OK to email me at wavelanexperts@yahoo.com and I will be happy to chat on the phone or get you my real email.
Good Luck!
Slashdot Mirror
Hello:
You are correct about the yahoo address being used for privacy reasons. I'm not sure why you think the address is a bit suspect, unless you imagine that I might be seeking to sell products or services--which I am not. I feel that solicitation of goods or services on a site like /. is reprehensible.
I live and work in a Metro area of 500,000 residents and have all the work I need locally.Any projects I take on outside of my local area are due to referrals from one of several wireless vendors.Now, you ask if I often give out anonymous WLAN advice. I do so when I have time, but felt especially compelled to reply to the original poster. What I got from the subtext of his post is that he might be young, have some experience in networking but obviously none to little in wireless. Without the site survey and a good contract drawn up by a lawyer he would be headed for certain disaster.
Even more important to me was the fact that the type of install he proposes it perhaps the most difficult of any to implement. Just thinking about the problems one faces on that sort of rollout makes me want to grab a beer.
Lastly, I am an open source advocate. That said, I feel obligated to help others when I can if the issues are within my area of expertise and do not result in any conflicts with clients or vendors. Many others in the community have been giving of their time and skills, so I like to do my part when I can. I hope this alleviates any concerns you may have.
Kindest Regards,
Doc
YIkes! First post. What happened to my paragraphing? Surely was there when I wrote it all. Apologies. Guess that's what I get for using an XP box I'm testing for a client.
Hello Cliff: While I have never posted on Slashdot I felt compelled to register and reply. PLEASE READ THIS CAREFULLY Allow me to explain that I am a network consultant and have learned the hard way on wireless--very hard and many sleepless nights. My first WLAN installation reminds me of where I think you may be right now, but I had done six months of research and had had endless hours of conversations with engineers from several manufacturers. Before we get to the problems I had, lets start with what you have missed overall: a site survey. NEVER even agree to take on a task like a WLAN unless you have done an extensive site survey. First, you will need blueprints if possible or will need to take fairly exact measurements of each apartment, know materials used in construction etc. You'll also need to have floor plans and more. That said, you should then know the maximum number of users and throw all the specs the manufacturer gave you out the window as regards range, distance and AP's required. And, I am assuming you will have over 20 users. In two different buildings? Don't go with consumer grade stuff like SMC for the AP's. SMC is the best of it but still lacks signal strength in many installs. Go with Cisco for AP's and routers, and ONLY Orinoco Gold cards for laptops and equivalent for desktops. You'll also need a portable spectrum analyzer and know how to intrepret the data it provides. Not sure if they can be rented but I paid $3,000 for mine and it was a deal. You'll need to set up the AP's and then go to every location and check SNR etc.--and record all the data. There's a mountain of paperwork on a project like this, just for the site survey alone. After that's done you will still need to go to each apartment with a mid-range laptop and again record signal strength etc. There will be dead spots, and God only knows where a tenant will put their PC. Now, you will have to roam about again with the spectrum analyzer AND a laptop to look for both multipath interference and to check for other 802.211b nets in the area. And did I mention if you are in a congested urban area or near a university or hospital you will also need to contact the admins at those institutions and hope they will cooperate and give you a map of their devices, antennae and locations? They generally will but may not even know where it all is if it's a large institution--and that can be yet another nightmare to solve. And, forget about promised scalability. Most AP's will really only handle 10 users or so, especially the consumer grade gear. At least unless things have changed drastically since November of 2001, my last nightmare install. You also have another problem: lack of a homogeneous hardware environment. On the Nigthmare Project 2001 (as I call it now) I had some PC's that never worked right if at all on the WLAN (30 users in one university residence, off-campus.) I spent an average of 8 hrs a day on the phone with high-level engineers from Cisco and SMC. Both companies were good but had to admit at times they had no idea why some problems happened. And I had their home and cell phone numbers. I know. Was dealing with a mix of Macs, Linux boxen and Windows PC's running anything from 98 to XP. And some were old Gateways, others new Dells. Gateways were the worst. Forget about the idea that your big worry will be with other 2.4 Ghz devices. Microwaves and phones have seldom been a problem for me on a project unless within 6 ft of the AP or wireless NIC. One stark exception is Panasonic phones, but this is a known issue fopr professionals. I am NOT anti-wireless but do think you should know that the obstacles you face are severe. I do this for a living and can say that I would not take on a project like this unless I had a very tight contract (you do have a lawyer, right.) CAT 5 and other options are cheaper and more reliable--and I haven't even touched on servers or security issues. Wireless is NOT cheaper, is more difficult to roll out and is a real headache--especially in historical buildings and those "impossible to wire" locations. I still do a lot of it but only for corporate installs where I have an open floor plan and decent line of sight. I also refuse to do an install now unless I know the company has skilled admins and will allow me indemnification. Do what you like but don't go into this believing all you have read from manufacturers or home users. Hope you don't have to learn as painfuly as I did. OK to email me at wavelanexperts@yahoo.com and I will be happy to chat on the phone or get you my real email. Good Luck!