It does not make you any more of a geek just because something, such as an OS install, is difficult or complicated to do.
I'm not talking about being a geek or not. I'm talking about a lousy concept that seems to be the target of all the IT industry nowadays: "Computers are easy". Well, since you have CS major, you already know that computers, no matter what people tries to do, are not easy. And they are not going to be more easy, as the number of tasks they cover is increasing every day.
I think that if Linux is ever to be for the masses, it is vital that people are not required to realize the complexity of an OS.
AFAIC, Linux could never be ready for the masses: as far as it serves my purposes, I'll stick to it, no matter of what the "masses" do think about it. And this is exactely what every computer user in the world should ask to himself/herself: "is my OS currently serving my purposes? And if not, what am I willing to learn about how to make a switch?"
I've seen, on Usenet, many people that simply install Linux in order to get a more reliable Windows, and then throw the installation CDs out of the windows (the real window:-)) in disgust. Or, worse than that, trying to apply some misconcept inherited by using Windows into Linux (savage format/reinstall when something goes wrong, complete screw up of the filesystem hierarchy, massive security issues).
If Debian is the distribution for the developers for the developers, it should maintain a certain minimum entry level, just for humility's sake, so it doesn't fool people into thinking that it's an "easy" OS.
I'm a comp sci major who has learned a lot about unices from using OS X, yet the Debian install was still so daunting that I nearly gave up midway through.
I'm no CS major (not yet AHR AHR AHR... err...), and I too do hate dselect. The first time I had to sit through two thousand pckages (it was Potato; I don't want to think about Sarge), I was about to shoot myself. Then, I learned to install the base system, and install only the packages I needed via apt-get. It's some kind of trick that you are compelled to learn if you do not like dselect:-). Since then, my installations of a Debian workstation (or laptop) were smooth and painless, and tailored to the machine I was configuring. Trying to do this with another distro without getting a major headache is impossible.
I'd like to point out that, as soon as Debian created tasksel I was the happiest person in this world; this just for demonstrating that I'm not a complete zealot: I love GUIs (I use GNOME2 regularly, logging in directly via GDM2), when they leave the user the option to follow his/hers desires, and not twisting the "poor plebs" mind into the misconcept that everything complex about computers is to be hidden from user's point of view.
Installing an operating system should be easy. And it will require skills most people wish to ignore.
No, it should not.
An OS is the most complex piece of software that a user will ever be asked to install on his/her machine, so it should be uneasy (yuk) to install, so that Joe A. Luser really understand what he is doing.
Intuitive, maybe (never had any problem with the Debian installer, but the new installer system was created to replace the old one, which was unmaintainable). But not easy. An easy installer hides the fact that an OS is intrinsecally a complex thing.
Users that do not want to endeavour in switching to another operating system, should not be induced in thinking that an operating system is just like any other software the install and de-install.
What happens if there's some kind of cataclysm and only a handful of people survive, revert to barbarism, then arise as a new advanced culture thousands of years from now? Future historians will find our libraries and data centers and they'll be USELESS due both to limited shelf life of media and inaccessibility of an unknown format.
Nonsense. If a new civilization arise, then whatever was written, even in stone, will have to be decoded, and we are back to square 1. That's why it took almost two millenia to decode the old egyptian ideograms (and with an handy decoder: if the Rosetta stone were not to be found, we'd still be trying to decode egyptian today), even if they were carved in stone.
The whole idea of some kind of important piece of data that remains in untouched by the eons is utter crap: there's no way to preserve data, as long as a civilization evolves: documents will always need to be syncronized with the current language or culture or whatever, if they are important. Otherwise, they will simply disappear, as they always did in the last ten thousand years.
Re:Is this really nanotech?
on
Lotus Nanotech
·
· Score: 1
I can remember when nanotech implied nano-scale machines
Nano-technology is a technology that deals with the nanometers (10^-9 meters) scale. Nanomachines are a product of nanotech, but this stuff qualifies too, since it deals with ~1nm crystals.
You can drop IE into "standards compliant" mode if you give a proper DOCTYPE declaration (e.g. ) at the top of your documents.
Sorry, but no
IE doesn't fully support CSS2 (namely, the "position" attribute, but also (min/max)-width, etc.), no matter in which language do you pray or cry. And CSS2 it's a standard as well as (X)HTML.
I'm forced to use those crappy frames or a bunch of tables in my pages, instead of using a simple CSS, cleaning up my HTML and making the page actually faster to download. I know, I know: in a world where exists a nightmare^Wsoftware like FrontPage, I shouldn't be too much surprised of this...
When you buy a new VCR set, aren't you supposed to open its user's manual and take a read about timed recording or channel setting? You can not use your previous knowledge, since many VCR user interfaces aren't even similar...
No matter how you, or how software houses, put it, computers are much more complicated than a VCR set, as they do much more things, and in a much more complex way... So, what in the world does prevent you from opening a book or a manual or take a class, in order to use something that, by its own nature, it's complex?
3. Printing needs to be easier to configure. It can't get much easier that printconf (for Red Hat users).
Two days ago I switched from my Good Ol' Laser Printer to an ink jet one (changin the old one's toner would have required more money than buying the new printer).
I've no printconfig (I use Debian), but it took me 30 seconds to change the configuration: drop to a console, type "magicfilterconfig", choose the filter (StylusColor-generic), type "done". Since Debian's policy has changed, magicfilterconf did not touch/etc/printcap; but, it printed on screen what to changed. Just to see what it actually changed, I've also opened/etc/printcap and read the manul page about it... And I've figured out that I could have done it by hand, even if I did not install magicfilterconfig...
In other words, I've not only configured a printer in no time. I've also learned something useful in case I've no tools to do the same job... Even doing that on another *nix that has/etc/printcap! That's what I like in Linux: it forces the user to learn and to open his/hers mind.
Yeah, reading a book or taking a class (or searching online) is so hard. When will people realize that a computer it a techinical thing?
I'm no KDE user since release 0.9-alpha (I used WindowMaker for years, then I switched to GNOME 1.4), although I've followed KDE evolution...
But, how can you say that "9 menu alternatives in konqueror that's way to many"? I'd love to have that possibility when I use my windows box! (Yes, I've tried LiteStep, but I quite don't like it) Only on my linux box I can change the theme of Mozilla, or the GTK theme, or even the entire WM, depending on what mood I have in the morning when I wake up...
You are complaining about having 9 possible menu alternatives... I'd complain about having none... Just choose one, and live happy with it.:-)
No. Saying you have used the flag as toilet paper is in no way instigating others to do the same
In this case, he told a old lady, who had an italian flag out of her window, to "use it as toilet paper". If some italian says so, I feel very angry: my forefathers died for that flag, and for the meaning it had (and still has), and no moron can say "use [the flag] as toilet paper". It was not a form of protest: it was only a demagogic sentence, used to make some redneck asshole to laugh out loud. Hence, the fine...
for instance Umberto Bossi getting fined for saying that he used the italian flag as toilet paper.
Yes, he's an asshole himself, but I do defend his right do use the flag anyway he pleases.
Using the italian flag as toilet paper it's, indeed, an offence to the italian flag.;-) Go in the US and try to burn the US flag...;-)
Telling someone to use the italian flag as toilet paper it's the equivalent of istigating someone to commit the crime above, so the fine it's right...
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It does not make you any more of a geek just because something, such as an OS install, is difficult or complicated to do.
I'm not talking about being a geek or not. I'm talking about a lousy concept that seems to be the target of all the IT industry nowadays: "Computers are easy". Well, since you have CS major, you already know that computers, no matter what people tries to do, are not easy. And they are not going to be more easy, as the number of tasks they cover is increasing every day.
I think that if Linux is ever to be for the masses, it is vital that people are not required to realize the complexity of an OS.
AFAIC, Linux could never be ready for the masses: as far as it serves my purposes, I'll stick to it, no matter of what the "masses" do think about it. And this is exactely what every computer user in the world should ask to himself/herself: "is my OS currently serving my purposes? And if not, what am I willing to learn about how to make a switch?"
I've seen, on Usenet, many people that simply install Linux in order to get a more reliable Windows, and then throw the installation CDs out of the windows (the real window :-)) in disgust. Or, worse than that, trying to apply some misconcept inherited by using Windows into Linux (savage format/reinstall when something goes wrong, complete screw up of the filesystem hierarchy, massive security issues).
If Debian is the distribution for the developers for the developers, it should maintain a certain minimum entry level, just for humility's sake, so it doesn't fool people into thinking that it's an "easy" OS.
I'm a comp sci major who has learned a lot about unices from using OS X, yet the Debian install was still so daunting that I nearly gave up midway through.
I'm no CS major (not yet AHR AHR AHR... err...), and I too do hate dselect. The first time I had to sit through two thousand pckages (it was Potato; I don't want to think about Sarge), I was about to shoot myself. Then, I learned to install the base system, and install only the packages I needed via apt-get. It's some kind of trick that you are compelled to learn if you do not like dselect :-). Since then, my installations of a Debian workstation (or laptop) were smooth and painless, and tailored to the machine I was configuring. Trying to do this with another distro without getting a major headache is impossible.
I'd like to point out that, as soon as Debian created tasksel I was the happiest person in this world; this just for demonstrating that I'm not a complete zealot: I love GUIs (I use GNOME2 regularly, logging in directly via GDM2), when they leave the user the option to follow his/hers desires, and not twisting the "poor plebs" mind into the misconcept that everything complex about computers is to be hidden from user's point of view.
Just my 0.02
Installing an operating system should be easy. And it will require skills most people wish to ignore.
No, it should not.
An OS is the most complex piece of software that a user will ever be asked to install on his/her machine, so it should be uneasy (yuk) to install, so that Joe A. Luser really understand what he is doing.
Intuitive, maybe (never had any problem with the Debian installer, but the new installer system was created to replace the old one, which was unmaintainable). But not easy. An easy installer hides the fact that an OS is intrinsecally a complex thing.
Users that do not want to endeavour in switching to another operating system, should not be induced in thinking that an operating system is just like any other software the install and de-install.
I thought "Wow, this is really funny", and then I was somewhat disapointed that the cyrstals couldn't work. Kinda like being told there was no Santa
Whoa! Waitwaitwaitwait! THERE IS NO SANTA?!
Damn, I've already sent him a letter for a new SMP box... Guess I'll have to send a letter to CowboyNeal...
What happens if there's some kind of cataclysm and only a handful of people survive, revert to barbarism, then arise as a new advanced culture thousands of years from now? Future historians will find our libraries and data centers and they'll be USELESS due both to limited shelf life of media and inaccessibility of an unknown format.
Nonsense. If a new civilization arise, then whatever was written, even in stone, will have to be decoded, and we are back to square 1. That's why it took almost two millenia to decode the old egyptian ideograms (and with an handy decoder: if the Rosetta stone were not to be found, we'd still be trying to decode egyptian today), even if they were carved in stone.
The whole idea of some kind of important piece of data that remains in untouched by the eons is utter crap: there's no way to preserve data, as long as a civilization evolves: documents will always need to be syncronized with the current language or culture or whatever, if they are important. Otherwise, they will simply disappear, as they always did in the last ten thousand years.
I can remember when nanotech implied nano-scale machines
Nano-technology is a technology that deals with the nanometers (10^-9 meters) scale. Nanomachines are a product of nanotech, but this stuff qualifies too, since it deals with ~1nm crystals.
You can drop IE into "standards compliant" mode if you give a proper DOCTYPE declaration (e.g. ) at the top of your documents.
Sorry, but no
IE doesn't fully support CSS2 (namely, the "position" attribute, but also (min/max)-width, etc.), no matter in which language do you pray or cry. And CSS2 it's a standard as well as (X)HTML.
I'm forced to use those crappy frames or a bunch of tables in my pages, instead of using a simple CSS, cleaning up my HTML and making the page actually faster to download. I know, I know: in a world where exists a nightmare^Wsoftware like FrontPage, I shouldn't be too much surprised of this...
If it's not intuitive, it's not set up correctly.
let me use a simple similitude, here.
When you buy a new VCR set, aren't you supposed to open its user's manual and take a read about timed recording or channel setting? You can not use your previous knowledge, since many VCR user interfaces aren't even similar...
No matter how you, or how software houses, put it, computers are much more complicated than a VCR set, as they do much more things, and in a much more complex way... So, what in the world does prevent you from opening a book or a manual or take a class, in order to use something that, by its own nature, it's complex?
3. Printing needs to be easier to configure.
It can't get much easier that printconf (for Red Hat users).
Two days ago I switched from my Good Ol' Laser Printer to an ink jet one (changin the old one's toner would have required more money than buying the new printer).
I've no printconfig (I use Debian), but it took me 30 seconds to change the configuration: drop to a console, type "magicfilterconfig", choose the filter (StylusColor-generic), type "done". Since Debian's policy has changed, magicfilterconf did not touch /etc/printcap; but, it printed on screen what to changed. Just to see what it actually changed, I've also opened /etc/printcap and read the manul page about it... And I've figured out that I could have done it by hand, even if I did not install magicfilterconfig...
In other words, I've not only configured a printer in no time. I've also learned something useful in case I've no tools to do the same job... Even doing that on another *nix that has /etc/printcap! That's what I like in Linux: it forces the user to learn and to open his/hers mind.
Yeah, reading a book or taking a class (or searching online) is so hard. When will people realize that a computer it a techinical thing?
Totally agree on this...
I'm no KDE user since release 0.9-alpha (I used WindowMaker for years, then I switched to GNOME 1.4), although I've followed KDE evolution...
But, how can you say that "9 menu alternatives in konqueror that's way to many"? I'd love to have that possibility when I use my windows box! (Yes, I've tried LiteStep, but I quite don't like it) Only on my linux box I can change the theme of Mozilla, or the GTK theme, or even the entire WM, depending on what mood I have in the morning when I wake up...
You are complaining about having 9 possible menu alternatives... I'd complain about having none... Just choose one, and live happy with it. :-)
No. Saying you have used the flag as toilet paper is in no way instigating others to do the same
In this case, he told a old lady, who had an italian flag out of her window, to "use it as toilet paper". If some italian says so, I feel very angry: my forefathers died for that flag, and for the meaning it had (and still has), and no moron can say "use [the flag] as toilet paper". It was not a form of protest: it was only a demagogic sentence, used to make some redneck asshole to laugh out loud. Hence, the fine...
for instance Umberto Bossi getting fined for saying that he used the italian flag as toilet paper. Yes, he's an asshole himself, but I do defend his right do use the flag anyway he pleases.
Using the italian flag as toilet paper it's, indeed, an offence to the italian flag. ;-) ;-)
Go in the US and try to burn the US flag...
Telling someone to use the italian flag as toilet paper it's the equivalent of istigating someone to commit the crime above, so the fine it's right...