Perhaps yes, if Coca Cola controlled 90% of the world's supermarkets, and forced you to buy a six-pack of Coke every time you went through the checkout lane
You mean if they gave you a free six-pack when you bought some of their other products.
Thanks to Microsoft, I am typically forced to buy a copy of Windows with a new PC, myself and my friends are continually stuck with an inferior product which we are coerced to use,
You can ask for any software to be removed from a new computer at the store. I think this may be even supported by law. In any case the price you pay is negligible.
You say you are foced to use it, but what exactly is stopping you using Linux?
If Microsoft uses their market dominance to turn the web into a Windows-only system, it affects me very much.
Calm down, I dont think thats going to happen in the near future. Why would they do that anyways? And how? There are many non Windows users on the web. Stop overreacting!
a world that MS does not control looks much more appealing to me
I dont think you realise were we would be today without microsoft. They have done quite a bit to revolutionise the computer world, and to populate the internet!
force Microsoft to openly publish the {APIs|source} to Windows.
Hahahah, and how the heck are they going to do that? Youve gone off the field, up the grand stand, and out of the ballpark! Dont hold your breath! Windows is owned by MS, they made it! There is no way they will be 'forced' to give it away! "Hey Joe thats a pretty nice stakeboard, me and the other kids from the street think its pretty unfair, so well have to break into your house and steal it!"
No amount of money is going to save Microsoft from a court ruling. (If you are thinking of bribes,
A court ruling may do someting, but it cannot stop microosft dead in its tracks! Trust me, depending on the scenario, there will eb a way out! I wasnt implying bribery, thats just stupid!
If MSFT tanks because everybody decides to abandon the sinking ship, Bill Gates will be significantly less rich then he is now
Yeah, but dont worry, Im sure he'll have enough spare change sitting around to secure the future of the next 5 generations of his family and still donate to charity when he dies...
Indeed my thoughts also! This sudden tidal wave of anti-MS comotion that just came... I suppose its partically the media's fault. I still dont see why every little step of this exhausted trial has to be docummented so throroughly! But then again, he is the richest man on earth! I guess people like to know whats up, and the media know that anyone will be up for it as soon as they mention 'richest man on earth' in the first line of the report!
Now, all of a sudden, PepsiCo (who owns Pepsi and Pizza Hut) decides that along with every pizza, the user has to receive a bottle of Pepsi.
The Pepsi is not free... despite whatever marketing gimicks they use.
Okay is this referring to IE or the general Windows thing?
Ill assume you mean their Windows distribution tactics... Okay firstly [im not sure so dont quote me on this] but I think it is possibly even illegal for a computer to be sold to you with software you do not want on it. In any case, nothing is stopping you from formatting and installing Linux!
The price you are paying is (a) probably refundable if you tell them that you dont want windows. (Most computer stores will give you the runaround at this point cause they cant be bothered to uninstall it!) and (b) the price you are paying is close to negligable.
Every time you buy a can of coke, what do you pay for? The coke, well call that 10c (overestimating), the can, well say 3c. I dont know how much a can of coke costs in the US but Im sure its not 13c! So where does (price-13c) go? Advertising, transportation, etc. SO what you are trying to say is that every time you buy a can of coke you may wish to buy one that has been advertised, and one that hasnt? Maybe this analogy is a bit screwed but I think its pretty accurate!
Pizza Hut is spending the money you gave them, to give you pepsi. You bought the Pepsi, and there was no way to buy the pizza without it...
Point 1: The price you paid for it is most likely negligable, and most people will take the pepsi. If you are so in love with coke throw it out and buy a coke.
Ponit 2: If you prefer coke, just because u got a free (or close to free) pepsi isnt going to make you buy pepsi over coke next time you go shopping.
Point 3: You probably would have been able to buy the pizza without it, and the particular distributor just cant be bothered with it.
Going back to the assumption that 90% of the consumers in the world buy Pizza Hut pizza, what reason could ANYONE have to buy Coke?
Because they prefer it, and becuase they only get pepsi with their pizza. (And only if they buy pizza at Pizza Hut!) Not sure how far this goes with in the analogy.
Besides, noone is forcing you to buy Pizza Hut pizza! If you liek their pizza so much then you are obviously willing to take the pepsi just to have the tasty pizza! If not, then shop at your local pizza takeaway and take whatever drinks you want! If every other outled gets shut down and bought out (a) start your own; or (b) homemade pizza, or (c) dont eat pizza, its only contributing to a heart attack!
(Don't get me wrong here... I love a downing a Pizza Hut pizza...
Yeah same here, and I also live playing around on my Linux box. So I gues were even?
If Pizza Hut was going to force people to buy cola, they should at LEAST give the user the option of taking a competitor's product.
But thats totally ridiculous! Its their company theyll do what they want (the 5 year-old point of view:) but really...noones forcing you to buy their pizza!
well im sure you can appreciate the fact that microosft is concentrating mainly on Windows development for obvious reasons, though I guess that doesnt excuse them for neglecting other OSs...
"The debut of Internet Explorer and its rapid improvement gave Netscape an incentive to improve Navigator's quality at a competitive rate. The inclusion of Internet Explorer with Windows at no separate charge increased general familiarity with the Internet and reduced the cost to the public of gaining access to it, at least in part because it compelled Netscape to stop charging for Navigator. These actions thus contributed to improving the quality of Web browsing software, lowering its cost, and increasing its availability, thereby benefiting consumers."
Well theres one of the things I've been going on about in [one of] the other anti-ms threads going on today.
Just give the guys a break okay? I dont see why this whole thing has to be stressed so much, and every little step documented like crazy, especially since this has already taken months, and will prbably go on for much longer...since no side will give up.
It is pretty obvious that all you guys are poised at your swivel chairs, in anticipation of seeing MS lose the trial so you can say 'I told you so'.
Step back for a second and consider a couple of factors: (1)This whole thing is totally ridiculous. Would you ask Coca Cola to include a pepsi in every sixpack? And then sue them for stomping all over your business if they refuse? Really thats basically whats going on here! (2)More importantly; why the heck does this affect you guys? Face it, youre just wasting revenge! Whats the bet that most of you use *nix, or other OS's, and not windows? Am I right or am I right? So if that is the case then you are really not really affected by this whole IE/Netscape fiasco anyways, are you? SO just go on using your fave distro of linux and Netscape navigator, and leave microsoft alone! This doesn't affect you so stop making an inflated deal about it!
Going on from that idea... if MS do lose out in the end, what will you personally gain? Apart from the 'i-told-you-so satisfaction factor'? Nothing much...especially if you dont use Windows! And we all know that whatever happens nothing is going to put a dent into Microsoft... the sheer amount of money that Bill has makes me believe he could get out of anything, any situation could be remedied. If worse come to worse whats stopping him 'donating' a total packet to some new company that has just started up, which my sheer coincidence is called 'Microosft MKII'? Kind of scary when you think about it, eh? All that money...he could do anything...short of taking over the world -- but maybe he already has.... lol, scary thoughts!
- Well, that CNN poll is now down to 18% for MS...looks like my target of falling from 60% to 0% in one day due to the the 'slashdot effect' is seeming more and more realistic every minute! - (Hye rob, you gotta stop letting all these MS articles get though, Im running out of original ideas to go on about in endless posts in response to every artice you post:p)
okay now Im freaked man... No wait, now that im a little saner I realise its not as it seems:) I actually have a quantum 4.3 gigger, and the new IBM disk I just bought is in fact 14 gigs I think... oh and my 4.3 gig hasnt crashed (yet) -- monthly incremental backups put all that spare storage space to good use!
Well...its still a pretty similar setup! It freaked me out at first...I thought it was a sign:)
I bet itll be less than a couple of years before Im like, shit me where did 13gigs go? Because right now I can assure you that when I got my 4gig I was like, aaaaah this will never run out! EVER!! And then it was as if it magically filled up with nothing....and that nothing came back afetr formatting too:) Weird....is it me or is bleeding edge software getting far too bloated thses days? 4 gigs is enough to store like every book in the state library! AH well...
I have to say Im very happy with my new IBM 14 gig baby...I clocked her at over 15 seconds to spin down after power off. ooooohhh baby you gotta love that sound!
I guess its a bit like tryingto put out a chemical fire using water! You think youre doing a good thing but in actualk fact you are just fuelling the fire:o
Now will you look at that! 52/48 split scores! Could this poisibly have anything to do with the fact that this is mentioned deep in here, and not on the front page of slashdot? hehe, just goes to show 'the slashdot efect':)
some of us really like to use the world's fastest computers for their processing power, and not the dorky OS that came with them
yeah okay, I admit that is an issue, however I must say that you are surely a major minority! I guess you should replace any references I make to 'macs' with 'MacOS' because thats what I was truly referring to! In the end the hardware doenst really matter too much, its the OS that matters, and if you've thrown out MacOS and turned to Linux I have nothing to do but congratulate you:)
NT has been known to crash. You don't use it to control heart-lung machines or production lines
If done correclty NT can control such mission critical systems such as banks...withoutn failure... I guess thos does mean that you have to have clusters and other computers to take the load when one goes ddown...but it is possible. NT shouldn't crash too much if configured and used correctly.
I am a very testing user that likes to take NT to its limits, and I managed to get quite a few crashes out of NT4. I have ben running Windows2000 advanced server for about 5 months now, it hasnt crashed on me once, and I am getting uptimes of 3 weeks plus. Yes, its nowhere nere loinux stability, but it sure is an improveent on the traditional Win95 and even NT4 stability factor:)
Closed source code is not fixable
if your company is big enough you can pay MS they will come over to you and fix your probs when they occur.
Again I agree that this is not an option for smaller companies [like yours?], and I do agree that the whole system is less than perfect.
Like I said, im just debating here, and am pretty much indifferent when the truth comes out of me.
Well, by the time I had rolled out of bed and got to the survey Microsoft was down on the stakes to like 60/40...and now that I go back to check its 70/30 against MS! I guess the 'slasdot effect' might be taking its place:)
Well, its becoming blatantly obvious that the slashdot effect has totally destroyed this survey! Only a few hour later now, and it has gone from a 60% in favor of MS, down to almost 80/20 against Microsoft. Oh well...
Ill bookmark the URL and see if by tomorrow its 100% against MS:)
NOBODY, not the principal, not the superintendant, no-one, is allowed to use their brain in any form whatsoever, because they fear that they'll be accountable if something happens down the road.
These polls are written by people without any clue of how to write unbiased polls. It's really sad. You'd think CNN would have a contract with a public-polling firm to help them write unbiased polls
Yeah, thats exactly what I mean when I speak about 'what is this world coming to!?!'
People dont have a clue about anything and just want to go out and make money, money, thats all its ever about!
That recent MTV Hackers thing was a perfect example! They went in knowing jack shit, came out knowing jack shit, misinformed the public, and hopefully (for them) made money from the incompetent rush job...
If I hear another news reporter talk about the end of the world, and the approaching 'new millenium' I'm gonna shoot myself! Its not the new millenium you misinformed and incompetent retards! And if everyone does go absolutely crazy it will only be because you, the media, made it a big deal and got people psyched in the first place!!
Do you really want a world without windows? Hell, yes!
And why is that? What exactly is Windows doing to you? Would you rather that the people that are running Windows now start running macs, and remain at the drooling vegetable state of computer user? And dont even try and say that they will turn to *nix, becuase that will not happen. At least right now it is not ready to happen! Most people that use computers are not competent enough, and do not want the hassle of linux, plus, having something made by a company like Microsoft makes people feel secure with their choice. And ensures if they have trouble tech support is always there to fall back on!
Why are most banks running on WindowsNT and not *nix? Could it be that the thought of Microsoft support flying over and debugging their problem and coding a hotfix for it on the spot, could it be that this option sounds more appealing than posting to a newsgroup and waiting for someone to help?
And if the home users that are barely working their way around windows now, decide to switch to *nix, think of the future of usent/irc/discussion-board threads. Right now someone comes in and asks a stupid sounding question from the friendly guru and gets a kickban and an 'RTFM' in response. If the number of incompetent *nix newbies suddenly becomes 60% of the computer population, and nothing but stupid sounding questions are being asked, what will happen to the *nix community?
Dont get me worng...I'm just debating here. To tell you the truth I think that Linux is 'better' then Windows, but I dont agree with the bias against MS, and I dont agree that Linux is ready for consumption by the general public!
(Maybe I should give it a rest and stop writing such long rants...but I cant stay away from a debate...)
And how exactly did they do that? By making a better product? What that isnt allowed? If netscape wasnt just hanging aroung thinking of how it had the market by the balls and actually got off their asses ot make something decent then maybe users would have stuck with them!
The fact is that Netscape's pre IE browser was a total piece of shit! They didn't bother to make anything standardised, it wasnt designed like a product should be, hell it didnt even have support for keyboard operation! The last time I saw a Netscape browser was around version 3.0 when the options dialog was designed so badly that I had to spend an hour battling with Netscape's incompetent programming! It looked like somnething experimental coded by a 12 year old who just learnt C!
And then microsoft comes out and gives them a run for their money -- a little healthy competition cant hurt! But then Nescape get all bent out of shape and start crying like a baby, and wasting people's time! Of course if your product is the only one available, and users have no choice but to use your product, and your product is totally crap, and you are taking its popularity for granted... in that case, a little competent competition did indeed hurt! Microsoft went out, and made a better product! What is wrong with that?
Microsoft made Windows, they'll put whatever features they want in it! Its not like they are forcing people to use IE, its just an extra, for free! If you got a free movie with your VCR do you complain that its not the movie you wanted? Is there anything stopping you from going out and buying the movie you want and watching it? If the video exploded when you tried to put in that movie they didnt want you to see then that would be differentm but that is not the case! Windows runs Netscape perfectly fine, they are not crippling Netscape's product in anyway!
In any case, if Netscape are getting all mad at MS including IE with Windows why dont they go out and make their own operating system and include whatever they want with it? Whats stopping them? They are the ones running on Windows, so what the heck is their problem with microsoft doing what they want with their own operating system!?!
Netscape had the brilliant idea, I credit them for that, but they didnt work hard enough for it! For in the computer industry its not who comes up with the idea, rather who manages to make sense of it and exploit its potential! Netscape weren't doing it too well, and Microsoft came along and beat them at their own game! What more is there to say?
In fact it was this exact situation when Microsoft started! Bill Gates and Paul Allen saw that this was an upcoming technology, and concluded that time was of the essence. Bill Gates dropped out of Harvard to work at Microsoft full time so they could be the first to make use of the power of computers. And look here -- looks like they did a good job, and people liked it, and thats why Bill is the richest man on Earth! If they were slacking off like Netscape, someone would have come along and set them straight right away, and they wouldnt't be here today -- but that was not the case! They did do a good job, and they still are!
Well, by the time I had rolled out of bed and got to the survey Microsoft was down on the stakes to like 60/40...and now that I go back to check its 70/30 against MS! I guess the 'slasdot effect' might be taking its place:)
And to agree with plunge on: 'One banner ad displayed, one email address databased.... ' the corporate types of today make me sick! What is it with todays world? Money, thats all there is that matters to them! I guess in this case, with a respectible company they're probably using the email addresses just to confirm that these no multiple posts from the same person, but I doubt its working:) Okay so the money-less society didnt work out...that doesnt mean you have to go to the otehr extreme!
Now for a couple of cents that are actually on topic... Give microosft a break will you? I mean they did after all do allot of good for the computer industry! They were the pioneers of their time! Just forget your anti-MS bias for a second and think about a world without microosft! There would probably be at least 10 different operating systems to coordinate between -- and we already have enough trouble with compatibility issues these days... I'm not saying that Winows is better than *nix, but it is more suitable for the beginners! Can ytou imagine a world where everyone ran linux? think of the incompetent newbies that wouldnt have a clue!!
The way I see it, Macs are for 5 year olds who have just graduated from their Fisher-Price trucks and ready to move on... and *nix is for the hardcore enthusiasts that want to spend 2 months typing in cryptic conf files, just so after its all done you will know exactly what is going on, exactly how everything works, everything! If its one thing that annoys me most its the Mac way of life, where you dont know that the hell is going on with your system, and youre just siutting there like a vegetabe! For me, Windows seems to be the happy pappy sloshing around in the middle. Its not as hardcore as *nix, though it does let you have a little control over your system, and unlike the mac, does have a character prompt, not just bloody icons!
So stop and think for a second before you let your predetermined anti-microsoft mindset take over! Do you really want a world without windows? If anything, in that world you'll have noone ot pick on! Its like that kid in the second grade...you hated him and annoyed his as hell, but when he finally stopped coming out to play with you it still felt a little lonely -- you had noone to pick on anymore:) hehe But more importantly, witout Windows, what else would 70% (or whatever it is) of the computers in the world be running?
The other thing to think about, is the competence of the suits that are spinning this scandal! Do you really think that some 50 yearold hi court judge knows shit about computers? They have already demonstrated their incompetence and lack of knowledge in the field! They are just trying to get someone to explain the situation and then apply the laws and guidelines they are used to -- they havent realised that the real world ways they are used to do not apply for the computer world of today! If microsoft wants to improve their operating system and add features whats wrong with that? MS made it clear that the OS relied heavily on explorer, the suits refused to comprehend and continued bleating 'take it off', then microosft removed it and started offering a crippled, completely IE-free version of Windows, and then they shot back and accused MS of being smartasses! What the hell is with that!
The fact stands that the media and the legal types have no place in the computer industry, and just like the media have been tlaking of the world exploding on the night of the millenium -- when the millenium is over a year off -- and telling us to stockpile 6 months food and supplies and go to a bunker to let the millenium pass, just as that has been going on, so the legal types on the case have been taking incomplete and incompetent infrmaion from some 12 year old down the road who 'knows computers'!
I'm not saying that Microosft is the best, just that they deserve a fair go, and not to be put down for something like this!! ...Linux forever...:)
"And the only question that stands in my mind right now is, will this get moderated down to -3 as soon as i post it because of people's anti-ms bias, or just becasue its a long and mostly off topic rant..."
well why dont they lay off and *dont* document things they dont understand!
"yes suzy, have that report for the tuesday show on my desk by tomorow morning, you know the one with the alien interview...make sure you get in all that detial about how they sirvive, and about their parralell universe...try and ask some questions about abductions and why thay do them"
later that day: "hello mr Joe Bow, im a reporter, Suzy Smith, and I am wondering, are you an alien from a parralel universe?" "well, it must be your lucky day, I am!" "okay well theres a few question i have..."
it may sound redicoulous but really thats exactly whats going on! and it too is riduculous...argh!!
oh shit, i misspelled StarTrek, i shouldve proofed that post first! good thing its not my real email address on here...might have gotten some real flaming for that:) gimme a brek its 5am! (or i dont really need to preview this one do I? its only a short one, what could i have done wrong? -- i checked i havent misspelled startrek...)
jesus fu...er...fuggin christ (is swearing allowed on slashdot:P ) it makes my blood boil to read about that sort of b/s the media are just out for money, at this rate the news will be 75% fictional by 2010. "and today the sun exploded and we all died, but one clever teenage HACKER... [bzzz HACKER ****HACKER*** oooh oohh watch this this is cool] saved us all, so tell us Mr. 1337 haX0r fuX0r headX0r, you say you hacked the universe mainframe and reprogrammed it, and then you clicked on the recycle bin icon and then you dragged all those deleted files of planets and people, one by one, adn you saved them all? wow we owe our lives to you! all hail the Mr. 1337 haX0r dickX0r headX0r!"
we really need to do something about this, this is getting out of hand, does it violate something to call it a documentary and have it full of *bullshit*! (alright you smartasses that insist on referencing an RFCxxxx document on every post, now's your chance!)
I think a moderate group of 'hackers' should join forces and go and beat the crap out of some media people, hehehe. make a stand! go and destroy the MTV offices! But that woudltn eb very hacker like would it? And we'd have to do it after the saturday late night StarTreck Original rerun...
I guess that really the 'genuine' hacker doesnt really care, I guess its a matter of who gives a shit, these people are all screwed and misinforming eeveryone....etc.... blah, but why should i interrupt the coding of my new networked toaster for these non-worthy lusers, especially wehn I havent even written the subroutine to handle drawing pictures by burning the toast to varying degrees! Heck I dont even have the algorithm connecting color intensity to average current applied to the micro-heat-element over time. I cant afford to be wasting time on things like the '/media/', and especially not if it requires me to get out of this chair and go out into that place some people call 'real life' ugh, reminds me of college days, i dotn want to go back there! I guess the best we can hope for is a DOS attack:) but that wouldnt be very hacker like either would it
ahh well i guess ive calmed down now...and managed to make an idiot of myself! jesus its 5am, i gotta breack this vicous slashdot cycle:)
Slashdot Mirror
Perhaps yes, if Coca Cola controlled 90% of the world's supermarkets, and forced you to buy a six-pack of Coke every time you went through the checkout lane
:)
You mean if they gave you a free six-pack when you bought some of their other products.
Thanks to Microsoft, I am typically forced to buy a copy of Windows with a new PC, myself and my friends are continually stuck with an inferior product which we are coerced to use,
You can ask for any software to be removed from a new computer at the store. I think this may be even supported by law. In any case the price you pay is negligible.
You say you are foced to use it, but what exactly is stopping you using Linux?
If Microsoft uses their market dominance to turn the web into a Windows-only system, it affects me very much.
Calm down, I dont think thats going to happen in the near future. Why would they do that anyways? And how? There are many non Windows users on the web. Stop overreacting!
a world that MS does not control looks much more appealing to me
I dont think you realise were we would be today without microsoft. They have done quite a bit to revolutionise the computer world, and to populate the internet!
force Microsoft to openly publish the {APIs|source} to Windows.
Hahahah, and how the heck are they going to do that? Youve gone off the field, up the grand stand, and out of the ballpark! Dont hold your breath! Windows is owned by MS, they made it! There is no way they will be 'forced' to give it away! "Hey Joe thats a pretty nice stakeboard, me and the other kids from the street think its pretty unfair, so well have to break into your house and steal it!"
No amount of money is going to save Microsoft from a court ruling. (If you are thinking of bribes,
A court ruling may do someting, but it cannot stop microosft dead in its tracks! Trust me, depending on the scenario, there will eb a way out! I wasnt implying bribery, thats just stupid!
If MSFT tanks because everybody decides to abandon the sinking ship, Bill Gates will be significantly less rich then he is now
Yeah, but dont worry, Im sure he'll have enough spare change sitting around to secure the future of the next 5 generations of his family and still donate to charity when he dies...
Have a nice day. Please come again
Indeed my thoughts also! This sudden tidal wave of anti-MS comotion that just came... I suppose its partically the media's fault. I still dont see why every little step of this exhausted trial has to be docummented so throroughly! But then again, he is the richest man on earth! I guess people like to know whats up, and the media know that anyone will be up for it as soon as they mention 'richest man on earth' in the first line of the report!
bah...reporters!
you don't have the right to a coke..you are free to try to find someone to sell you coke..
exactly! You go to ehm because you like their food, noones forcing you to buy from them though!
Now, all of a sudden, PepsiCo (who owns Pepsi and Pizza Hut) decides that along with every pizza, the user has to receive a bottle of Pepsi.
:) but really...noones forcing you to buy their pizza!
The Pepsi is not free... despite whatever marketing gimicks they use.
Okay is this referring to IE or the general Windows thing?
Ill assume you mean their Windows distribution tactics... Okay firstly [im not sure so dont quote me on this] but I think it is possibly even illegal for a computer to be sold to you with software you do not want on it. In any case, nothing is stopping you from formatting and installing Linux!
The price you are paying is (a) probably refundable if you tell them that you dont want windows. (Most computer stores will give you the runaround at this point cause they cant be bothered to uninstall it!) and (b) the price you are paying is close to negligable.
Every time you buy a can of coke, what do you pay for? The coke, well call that 10c (overestimating), the can, well say 3c. I dont know how much a can of coke costs in the US but Im sure its not 13c! So where does (price-13c) go? Advertising, transportation, etc. SO what you are trying to say is that every time you buy a can of coke you may wish to buy one that has been advertised, and one that hasnt? Maybe this analogy is a bit screwed but I think its pretty accurate!
Pizza Hut is spending the money you gave them, to give you pepsi. You bought the Pepsi, and there was no way to buy the pizza without it...
Point 1: The price you paid for it is most likely negligable, and most people will take the pepsi. If you are so in love with coke throw it out and buy a coke.
Ponit 2: If you prefer coke, just because u got a free (or close to free) pepsi isnt going to make you buy pepsi over coke next time you go shopping.
Point 3: You probably would have been able to buy the pizza without it, and the particular distributor just cant be bothered with it.
Going back to the assumption that 90% of the consumers in the world buy Pizza Hut pizza, what reason could ANYONE have to buy Coke?
Because they prefer it, and becuase they only get pepsi with their pizza. (And only if they buy pizza at Pizza Hut!) Not sure how far this goes with in the analogy.
Besides, noone is forcing you to buy Pizza Hut pizza! If you liek their pizza so much then you are obviously willing to take the pepsi just to have the tasty pizza! If not, then shop at your local pizza takeaway and take whatever drinks you want! If every other outled gets shut down and bought out (a) start your own; or (b) homemade pizza, or (c) dont eat pizza, its only contributing to a heart attack!
(Don't get me wrong here... I love a downing a Pizza Hut pizza...
Yeah same here, and I also live playing around on my Linux box. So I gues were even?
If Pizza Hut was going to force people to buy cola, they should at LEAST give the user the option of taking a competitor's product.
But thats totally ridiculous! Its their company theyll do what they want (the 5 year-old point of view
well im sure you can appreciate the fact that microosft is concentrating mainly on Windows development for obvious reasons, though I guess that doesnt excuse them for neglecting other OSs...
"The debut of Internet Explorer and its rapid improvement gave Netscape an incentive to improve Navigator's quality at a competitive rate. The inclusion of Internet Explorer with Windows at no separate charge increased general familiarity with the Internet and reduced the cost to the public of gaining access to it, at least in part because it compelled Netscape to stop charging for Navigator. These actions thus contributed to improving the quality of Web browsing software, lowering its cost, and increasing its availability, thereby benefiting consumers."
:p)
Well theres one of the things I've been going on about in [one of] the other anti-ms threads going on today.
Just give the guys a break okay? I dont see why this whole thing has to be stressed so much, and every little step documented like crazy, especially since this has already taken months, and will prbably go on for much longer...since no side will give up.
It is pretty obvious that all you guys are poised at your swivel chairs, in anticipation of seeing MS lose the trial so you can say 'I told you so'.
Step back for a second and consider a couple of factors:
(1)This whole thing is totally ridiculous. Would you ask Coca Cola to include a pepsi in every sixpack? And then sue them for stomping all over your business if they refuse? Really thats basically whats going on here!
(2)More importantly; why the heck does this affect you guys? Face it, youre just wasting revenge! Whats the bet that most of you use *nix, or other OS's, and not windows? Am I right or am I right? So if that is the case then you are really not really affected by this whole IE/Netscape fiasco anyways, are you? SO just go on using your fave distro of linux and Netscape navigator, and leave microsoft alone! This doesn't affect you so stop making an inflated deal about it!
Going on from that idea... if MS do lose out in the end, what will you personally gain? Apart from the 'i-told-you-so satisfaction factor'? Nothing much...especially if you dont use Windows! And we all know that whatever happens nothing is going to put a dent into Microsoft... the sheer amount of money that Bill has makes me believe he could get out of anything, any situation could be remedied. If worse come to worse whats stopping him 'donating' a total packet to some new company that has just started up, which my sheer coincidence is called 'Microosft MKII'? Kind of scary when you think about it, eh? All that money...he could do anything...short of taking over the world -- but maybe he already has.... lol, scary thoughts!
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Well, that CNN poll is now down to 18% for MS...looks like my target of falling from 60% to 0% in one day due to the the 'slashdot effect' is seeming more and more realistic every minute!
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(Hye rob, you gotta stop letting all these MS articles get though, Im running out of original ideas to go on about in endless posts in response to every artice you post
okay now Im freaked man... :) I actually have a quantum 4.3 gigger, and the new IBM disk I just bought is in fact 14 gigs I think... oh and my 4.3 gig hasnt crashed (yet) -- monthly incremental backups put all that spare storage space to good use!
:)
:) Weird....is it me or is bleeding edge software getting far too bloated thses days? 4 gigs is enough to store like every book in the state library! AH well...
No wait, now that im a little saner I realise its not as it seems
Well...its still a pretty similar setup! It freaked me out at first...I thought it was a sign
I bet itll be less than a couple of years before Im like, shit me where did 13gigs go? Because right now I can assure you that when I got my 4gig I was like, aaaaah this will never run out! EVER!! And then it was as if it magically filled up with nothing....and that nothing came back afetr formatting too
I have to say Im very happy with my new IBM 14 gig baby...I clocked her at over 15 seconds to spin down after power off. ooooohhh baby you gotta love that sound!
moving each one in single increments
How exactly do you 'move' anything??? Am i missing something here?
They've done this before, they can do it again.
:)
Really? When have they done somthing like that? I must've missed it
offtopic.... :)
I think that was actually mentioned in the 'slashdot updates' thread anyways. Sowell see what rob thinks of our great ideas
They didn't integrate a web browser with the OS to get rid of kludgy proprietary help files or anything, they did it to kill a competitor.
Now that I have to disagree with! That was a really good descision that they made and it has made the whole windows experience better in my opinion...
I guess its a bit like tryingto put out a chemical fire using water! You think youre doing a good thing but in actualk fact you are just fuelling the fire :o
Now will you look at that! 52/48 split scores! Could this poisibly have anything to do with the fact that this is mentioned deep in here, and not on the front page of slashdot? hehe, just goes to show 'the slashdot efect' :)
some of us really like to use the world's fastest computers for their processing power, and not the dorky OS that came with them
:)
yeah okay, I admit that is an issue, however I must say that you are surely a major minority! I guess you should replace any references I make to 'macs' with 'MacOS' because thats what I was truly referring to! In the end the hardware doenst really matter too much, its the OS that matters, and if you've thrown out MacOS and turned to Linux I have nothing to do but congratulate you
NT has been known to crash. You don't use it to control heart-lung machines or production lines
:)
If done correclty NT can control such mission critical systems such as banks...withoutn failure... I guess thos does mean that you have to have clusters and other computers to take the load when one goes ddown...but it is possible. NT shouldn't crash too much if configured and used correctly.
I am a very testing user that likes to take NT to its limits, and I managed to get quite a few crashes out of NT4. I have ben running Windows2000 advanced server for about 5 months now, it hasnt crashed on me once, and I am getting uptimes of 3 weeks plus. Yes, its nowhere nere loinux stability, but it sure is an improveent on the traditional Win95 and even NT4 stability factor
Closed source code is not fixable
if your company is big enough you can pay MS they will come over to you and fix your probs when they occur.
Again I agree that this is not an option for smaller companies [like yours?], and I do agree that the whole system is less than perfect.
Like I said, im just debating here, and am pretty much indifferent when the truth comes out of me.
Well, by the time I had rolled out of bed and got to the survey Microsoft was down on the stakes to like 60/40...and now that I go back to check its 70/30 against MS! I guess the 'slasdot effect' might be taking its place :)
:)
Well, its becoming blatantly obvious that the slashdot effect has totally destroyed this survey! Only a few hour later now, and it has gone from a 60% in favor of MS, down to almost 80/20 against Microsoft. Oh well...
Ill bookmark the URL and see if by tomorrow its 100% against MS
NOBODY, not the principal, not the superintendant, no-one, is allowed to use their brain in any form whatsoever, because they fear that they'll be accountable if something happens down the road.
sad...truly sad! Its a very sad state of affairs.
These polls are written by people without any clue of how to write unbiased polls. It's really sad. You'd think CNN would have a contract with a public-polling firm to help them write unbiased polls
Yeah, thats exactly what I mean when I speak about 'what is this world coming to!?!'
People dont have a clue about anything and just want to go out and make money, money, thats all its ever about!
That recent MTV Hackers thing was a perfect example! They went in knowing jack shit, came out knowing jack shit, misinformed the public, and hopefully (for them) made money from the incompetent rush job...
If I hear another news reporter talk about the end of the world, and the approaching 'new millenium' I'm gonna shoot myself! Its not the new millenium you misinformed and incompetent retards! And if everyone does go absolutely crazy it will only be because you, the media, made it a big deal and got people psyched in the first place!!
Do you really want a world without windows?
Hell, yes!
And why is that? What exactly is Windows doing to you? Would you rather that the people that are running Windows now start running macs, and remain at the drooling vegetable state of computer user? And dont even try and say that they will turn to *nix, becuase that will not happen. At least right now it is not ready to happen! Most people that use computers are not competent enough, and do not want the hassle of linux, plus, having something made by a company like Microsoft makes people feel secure with their choice. And ensures if they have trouble tech support is always there to fall back on!
Why are most banks running on WindowsNT and not *nix? Could it be that the thought of Microsoft support flying over and debugging their problem and coding a hotfix for it on the spot, could it be that this option sounds more appealing than posting to a newsgroup and waiting for someone to help?
And if the home users that are barely working their way around windows now, decide to switch to *nix, think of the future of usent/irc/discussion-board threads. Right now someone comes in and asks a stupid sounding question from the friendly guru and gets a kickban and an 'RTFM' in response. If the number of incompetent *nix newbies suddenly becomes 60% of the computer population, and nothing but stupid sounding questions are being asked, what will happen to the *nix community?
Dont get me worng...I'm just debating here. To tell you the truth I think that Linux is 'better' then Windows, but I dont agree with the bias against MS, and I dont agree that Linux is ready for consumption by the general public!
(Maybe I should give it a rest and stop writing such long rants...but I cant stay away from a debate...)
Cut off Netscape's air supply.
And how exactly did they do that? By making a better product? What that isnt allowed? If netscape wasnt just hanging aroung thinking of how it had the market by the balls and actually got off their asses ot make something decent then maybe users would have stuck with them!
The fact is that Netscape's pre IE browser was a total piece of shit! They didn't bother to make anything standardised, it wasnt designed like a product should be, hell it didnt even have support for keyboard operation! The last time I saw a Netscape browser was around version 3.0 when the options dialog was designed so badly that I had to spend an hour battling with Netscape's incompetent programming! It looked like somnething experimental coded by a 12 year old who just learnt C!
And then microsoft comes out and gives them a run for their money -- a little healthy competition cant hurt! But then Nescape get all bent out of shape and start crying like a baby, and wasting people's time! Of course if your product is the only one available, and users have no choice but to use your product, and your product is totally crap, and you are taking its popularity for granted... in that case, a little competent competition did indeed hurt! Microsoft went out, and made a better product! What is wrong with that?
Microsoft made Windows, they'll put whatever features they want in it! Its not like they are forcing people to use IE, its just an extra, for free! If you got a free movie with your VCR do you complain that its not the movie you wanted? Is there anything stopping you from going out and buying the movie you want and watching it? If the video exploded when you tried to put in that movie they didnt want you to see then that would be differentm but that is not the case! Windows runs Netscape perfectly fine, they are not crippling Netscape's product in anyway!
In any case, if Netscape are getting all mad at MS including IE with Windows why dont they go out and make their own operating system and include whatever they want with it? Whats stopping them? They are the ones running on Windows, so what the heck is their problem with microsoft doing what they want with their own operating system!?!
Netscape had the brilliant idea, I credit them for that, but they didnt work hard enough for it! For in the computer industry its not who comes up with the idea, rather who manages to make sense of it and exploit its potential! Netscape weren't doing it too well, and Microsoft came along and beat them at their own game! What more is there to say?
In fact it was this exact situation when Microsoft started! Bill Gates and Paul Allen saw that this was an upcoming technology, and concluded that time was of the essence. Bill Gates dropped out of Harvard to work at Microsoft full time so they could be the first to make use of the power of computers. And look here -- looks like they did a good job, and people liked it, and thats why Bill is the richest man on Earth! If they were slacking off like Netscape, someone would have come along and set them straight right away, and they wouldnt't be here today -- but that was not the case! They did do a good job, and they still are!
Well, by the time I had rolled out of bed and got to the survey Microsoft was down on the stakes to like 60/40...and now that I go back to check its 70/30 against MS! I guess the 'slasdot effect' might be taking its place :)
:) Okay so the money-less society didnt work out...that doesnt mean you have to go to the otehr extreme!
:) hehe But more importantly, witout Windows, what else would 70% (or whatever it is) of the computers in the world be running?
:)
And to agree with plunge on: 'One banner ad displayed, one email address databased.... ' the corporate types of today make me sick! What is it with todays world? Money, thats all there is that matters to them! I guess in this case, with a respectible company they're probably using the email addresses just to confirm that these no multiple posts from the same person, but I doubt its working
Now for a couple of cents that are actually on topic...
Give microosft a break will you? I mean they did after all do allot of good for the computer industry! They were the pioneers of their time! Just forget your anti-MS bias for a second and think about a world without microosft! There would probably be at least 10 different operating systems to coordinate between -- and we already have enough trouble with compatibility issues these days... I'm not saying that Winows is better than *nix, but it is more suitable for the beginners! Can ytou imagine a world where everyone ran linux? think of the incompetent newbies that wouldnt have a clue!!
The way I see it, Macs are for 5 year olds who have just graduated from their Fisher-Price trucks and ready to move on... and *nix is for the hardcore enthusiasts that want to spend 2 months typing in cryptic conf files, just so after its all done you will know exactly what is going on, exactly how everything works, everything! If its one thing that annoys me most its the Mac way of life, where you dont know that the hell is going on with your system, and youre just siutting there like a vegetabe! For me, Windows seems to be the happy pappy sloshing around in the middle. Its not as hardcore as *nix, though it does let you have a little control over your system, and unlike the mac, does have a character prompt, not just bloody icons!
So stop and think for a second before you let your predetermined anti-microsoft mindset take over! Do you really want a world without windows? If anything, in that world you'll have noone ot pick on! Its like that kid in the second grade...you hated him and annoyed his as hell, but when he finally stopped coming out to play with you it still felt a little lonely -- you had noone to pick on anymore
The other thing to think about, is the competence of the suits that are spinning this scandal! Do you really think that some 50 yearold hi court judge knows shit about computers? They have already demonstrated their incompetence and lack of knowledge in the field! They are just trying to get someone to explain the situation and then apply the laws and guidelines they are used to -- they havent realised that the real world ways they are used to do not apply for the computer world of today! If microsoft wants to improve their operating system and add features whats wrong with that? MS made it clear that the OS relied heavily on explorer, the suits refused to comprehend and continued bleating 'take it off', then microosft removed it and started offering a crippled, completely IE-free version of Windows, and then they shot back and accused MS of being smartasses! What the hell is with that!
The fact stands that the media and the legal types have no place in the computer industry, and just like the media have been tlaking of the world exploding on the night of the millenium -- when the millenium is over a year off -- and telling us to stockpile 6 months food and supplies and go to a bunker to let the millenium pass, just as that has been going on, so the legal types on the case have been taking incomplete and incompetent infrmaion from some 12 year old down the road who 'knows computers'!
I'm not saying that Microosft is the best, just that they deserve a fair go, and not to be put down for something like this!!
...Linux forever...
"And the only question that stands in my mind right now is, will this get moderated down to -3 as soon as i post it because of people's anti-ms bias, or just becasue its a long and mostly off topic rant..."
where did that option for a daily headline digest in your email dissapear off to?
well why dont they lay off and *dont* document things they dont understand!
"yes suzy, have that report for the tuesday show on my desk by tomorow morning, you know the one with the alien interview...make sure you get in all that detial about how they sirvive, and about their parralell universe...try and ask some questions about abductions and why thay do them"
later that day: "hello mr Joe Bow, im a reporter, Suzy Smith, and I am wondering, are you an alien from a parralel universe?"
"well, it must be your lucky day, I am!"
"okay well theres a few question i have..."
it may sound redicoulous but really thats exactly whats going on! and it too is riduculous...argh!!
oh shit, i misspelled StarTrek, i shouldve proofed that post first! good thing its not my real email address on here...might have gotten some real flaming for that :) gimme a brek its 5am! (or i dont really need to preview this one do I? its only a short one, what could i have done wrong? -- i checked i havent misspelled startrek...)
jesus fu...er...fuggin christ (is swearing allowed on slashdot :P ) it makes my blood boil to read about that sort of b/s the media are just out for money, at this rate the news will be 75% fictional by 2010. "and today the sun exploded and we all died, but one clever teenage HACKER... [bzzz HACKER ****HACKER*** oooh oohh watch this this is cool] saved us all, so tell us Mr. 1337 haX0r fuX0r headX0r, you say you hacked the universe mainframe and reprogrammed it, and then you clicked on the recycle bin icon and then you dragged all those deleted files of planets and people, one by one, adn you saved them all? wow we owe our lives to you! all hail the Mr. 1337 haX0r dickX0r headX0r!"
:) but that wouldnt be very hacker like either would it
:)
we really need to do something about this, this is getting out of hand, does it violate something to call it a documentary and have it full of *bullshit*! (alright you smartasses that insist on referencing an RFCxxxx document on every post, now's your chance!)
I think a moderate group of 'hackers' should join forces and go and beat the crap out of some media people, hehehe. make a stand! go and destroy the MTV offices! But that woudltn eb very hacker like would it? And we'd have to do it after the saturday late night StarTreck Original rerun...
I guess that really the 'genuine' hacker doesnt really care, I guess its a matter of who gives a shit, these people are all screwed and misinforming eeveryone....etc.... blah, but why should i interrupt the coding of my new networked toaster for these non-worthy lusers, especially wehn I havent even written the subroutine to handle drawing pictures by burning the toast to varying degrees! Heck I dont even have the algorithm connecting color intensity to average current applied to the micro-heat-element over time. I cant afford to be wasting time on things like the '/media/', and especially not if it requires me to get out of this chair and go out into that place some people call 'real life' ugh, reminds me of college days, i dotn want to go back there! I guess the best we can hope for is a DOS attack
ahh well i guess ive calmed down now...and managed to make an idiot of myself! jesus its 5am, i gotta breack this vicous slashdot cycle