I knew the teacher in my high school who managed the student television station. She bought an iMac, with her own pocket money, for the students to use for video editing, and still had to hush it up. She had brought in an earlier iMac a few years before, and got chastised for it. Apparently the school has some contract with Compaq, of all companies.
She was urging the administration to buy a bunch of iMacs for the video editing lab in the new school in the district, but they went with huge, $20,000 machines instead, which, according to this teacher and some students I've talked to, do no more than Final Cut Pro on an iMac. And you could get 6 iMacs and 6 copies of FPC for that price, easy.
Your basic contradiction is to say that all of OS X's extra features should be omitted from a server, and then to say that without them, OS X requires just as much support. That's basically a tautology: Remove from the equation what Apple offers, and Apple will have nothing to offer. The fact is that Aqua and all the other extras that make Mac OS X Server be Mac OS X Server are exactly what allow companies to reduce their IT staff.
I'm running a production server on an old AGP Power Mac G4. I'd post the link, but I don't think my customer would appreciate it.
However, having come up at almost the same time after the outage, Arthur (my server) and Savoy (a friend's server, hosting his personal site via Debian Woody) will duke it out in an uptime contest. I don't see why Arthur can't win--or, really, why the race should ever end, short of another outage.
Or, they'll come back 6 months down the line and say 'we're ready to do this now' - which happens more often then you'd believe.
Damn! I'm about to do that!
It's actually just for a fast SDSL for a startup, but it's the same situation. I had to ask for a price quote. I talked to a salesman, and he even gave me some sort of deal. I relayed the price to my client, and he basically said he expects to be ready for it in about 6 months.
Certianly the biggest mistake the open source communtiy could make is to not take them seriously.
I disagree. I think it is certainly the biggest mistake the open source community could make to take SCO seriously. The primary motivation for SCO's lawsuit is to drive up the stock price. Every post that takes that suit seriously in any way does exactly that. That will reward the executives, and piss the rest of us off further.
I lk t lv ll th vwls t f wrds. T svs lts f tm t wrt bt ts pn n th ss t rd nd mks m lk lk cmplt dpsht.
I actually had to type like that for a while--either that, or type slowly, search-and-peck style. I broke my left wrist a couple of weeks ago, and before I got a splint, I couldn't type with my left hand. Since I use the Dvorak keyboard layout, that pretty much meant no vowels.
Search and peck isn't really an option, because I've rearranged the letters on my keyboard (stealing from another keyboard in the process) to spell the following:
No, you moron, he was saying that the classes he could find required more than that. That was the entire point of the statement you quote, and it completely defeats your point.
Often, the problem isn't lack of a manual, it's that the users don't read them. The manufacturers ship computers with less and less manual, to make it less intimidating opening those books. Apple has gone to digital manuals entirely, for instance, decreasing the amount of documentation to try to get people to use what's left.
To emphasize how abhorrent users find any sort of manual to be, take the example of my dad. We got our first Mac over ten years ago, and he has to ask me what the menubar is every time I mention it when supporting him. Last summer, since I was going away for college in the fall and wouldn't be around to help him, he got Mac OS X for Dummies to help him learn how to use the thing.
I think maybe it was Christmas vacation that I was home and he was having printer trouble. We have a laser printer with a network card, and it's somewhat unreliable, but after I had fixed the problem and printed something from my computer, his still wouldn't work. The conversation went something like this.
Me: Oh, no big deal--you have to do the same thing you had to do before to get it to print, except now you can just do it once and it will keep working. Dad: I haven't printed anything in a while. I don't remember how to do that. Me: Well, I've shown you before--have you looked in that book? Dad: What book? Me: Mac OS X for Dummies. Dad: Oh, that's right! No, I'll go look in it. [Go back to whatever I was doing. Five minutes later, my dad comes upstairs, asking me for help. I figure he's following some demonstration and wants help, but end up having to help him find the book.] Dad: Oh, thanks! Alright, where would it be in the book? Me: I don't know, look it up. {thinking: What, you think I know the contents of the whole book, which I haven't read, off the top of my head?} Dad: Look it up where? Me: {stares in disbelief} I'd start with the index, but the table of contents is also an option... Dad: What should I look under in the index? Me: How about 'P' for "Printers"?
He came back upstairs five minutes later and told me book had the solution. This is a man who has a master's degree in history, and he doesn't know how to use a book's index.
True, but if I were a mechanic and somebody asked me to fix a car he had wrapped around a tree at 55 mph, and for free, I would tell him to shove it. Imagine, then, how techs feel when people butter their floppy drives, and then expect free support and repair.
No, it really doesn't. It does just work. You don't have to know where Terminal is to use the computer, nor should you have to buy and read a book to find Terminal if you want it. Similarly with the other goodies the grandparent poster mentioned. Part of the beauty of the Macintosh has always been that it is very difficult to mess it up. As long as you're not stupid enough to go into/System and/Library without knowing what you're doing, you're pretty safe--so play around, try things, see what happens. If all the options were onscreen at all times with full descriptions of what each one does, you'd need a monitor the size of a wall to get any work done.
It still irks me that you have to consider calling security on the student that actually reports it. Sort of reminds me of a line from a classic movie: "Sorry, Luke; just doing my job." But I suppose that's the way of the world.
[battle sounds]
[SCO defeats a worthless-piece-of-crap-knight]
IBM: You fight with the strength of many men, Sir knight.
I am IBM, King of the Supercomputers.
[pause]
I seek the finest and the bravest companies in the land to
join me in my Court of Linux.
[pause]
You have proved yourself worthy; will you join me?
[pause]
You make me sad. So be it. Come, RedHat.
SCO: None shall pass.
IBM: What?
SCO: None shall pass.
IBM: I have no quarrel with you, good Sir knight, but I must
distribute this kernel.
SCO: Then you shall die.
IBM: I command you, as King of the Supercomputers, to stand aside!
SCO: I move for no man.
IBM: So be it!
[hah]
[parry thrust]
[IBM chops SCO's patent claims off]
IBM: Now stand aside, worthy adversary.
SCO: 'Tis but a scratch.
IBM: A scratch? Your patent claims are nonsense!
SCO: No, they aren't.
IBM: Well, what's that then?
SCO: I've had worse.
IBM: You liar!
SCO: Come on you pansy!
[hah]
[parry thrust]
[IBM chops SCO's copyright claims off]
IBM: Victory is mine!
[kneeling]
We thank thee Linus, that in thy merc-
[SCO kicks IBM in the head while he is praying]
SCO: Come on then.
IBM: What?
SCO: Have at you!
IBM: You are indeed brave, Sir knight, but the fight is mine.
SCO: Oh, had enough, eh?
IBM: Look, you stupid bastard, you've got no IP left.
SCO: Yes I have.
IBM: Look!
SCO: Just a flesh wound.
[Headbutts IBM in the chest]
IBM: Look, stop that.
SCO: Chicken! Chicken!
IBM: Look, I'll have your trade secrets. Right!
[whop]
SCO: Right, I'll do you for that!
IBM: You'll what?
SCO: Come 'ere!
IBM: What are you going to do, sue me?
SCO: I own Unix!
IBM: You're a loony.
SCO: The Black Knight always triumphs! Have at you!
IBM: Come on then.
[whop]
[IBM chops SCO's contract claims off]
IBM: All right; we'll settle out of court. Come, RedHat.
SCO: Oh, oh, I see, running away then. You yellow
bastards! Come back here and take what's coming to you. I'll bite
your patents off!
First I have to verify their claim, second I have to consider the damage they may have done (purposefully or not). If this means a call to security then I am obligated to do that. After that I have to consider fixing my system and damage control.
I find it disturbing that fixing the problem takes a backseat to investigating the student. Frankly, I would hope that you wouldn't investigate that student at all--first, fix the problem, and second, examine your logs for evidence that the flaw has been exploited. Investigating the student will discourage anyone who finds an exploit in the future from telling you--after all, if this person had just made use of the exploit instead of reporting it, he would have improved his grades for free, avoided the hassle of trying to defend himself in a kangaroo court, and almost certainly wouldn't have been caught.
In a case where being caught doing nothing is likely to carry the same consequences as being caught doing something horrible, many people will prefer a slim chance at being caught with blood on their hands over a surefire legal hassle and potential expulsion for trying to do some good. (Of course, there's the option of neither reporting it nor exploiting it, which many more people would prefer, but you'd still rather have them report it.)
Any response that discourages people from reporting exploits reveals an attitude that you consider yourself invulnerable--if you thought there might be more bugs, you'd encourage people to report them so you could fix them. There will always be bugs; the more you accept this and act accordingly, the cleaner your application will be.
1984, by George Orwell. It's standard geek fare; you really shouldn't post around here without reading it. For that matter, it's a standard part of modern English-speaking culture, and you're a hypocrite to call someone ignorant without reading it.
Well, if you count Mac OS X as a variant of BSD, then BSD is definitely not dying. I understand that's somewhat controversial, though--which makes the whole issue of whether or not BSD is dying controversial till that's settled (assuming BSD would be dying without Mac OS X, a subject on which I am not competent to comment).
So, a 200W power supply putting out 200W will generate less heat than a 400W power supply putting out the same...
By "putting out the same" I meant "putting out the same as the 200W PSU", which was 200W. I can see how you would misread that phrase to mean "putting out 400W", so I apologize for the confusion.
Maybe hold control and alt with your index finger and hit delete with your middle finger? Or thumb and index finger, respectively, if you only have a left hand.
Alternatively, you could get a Mac.
I broke my left wrist a few days ago and have been typing one-handed since then. I haven't had any major problems other than having to type very slowly search-and-peck style, so I don't really have much sympathy for your complaint. Sorry.
An N-watt PSU will have N watts of maximum output, but it will also generate heat. Heat is measured in watts as well (or can be; energy is energy, after all). So, a 300W PSU putting out 300W will use >300W of power from the wall. Running "more efficiently" at or near capacity probably means that the relationship of wasted power to output power is non-linear, reaching a plateau or at least slowing its increase towards the top end. So, a 200W power supply putting out 200W will generate less heat than a 400W power supply putting out the same--and since that heat is generated using electricity that you pay for, the 200W PSU may be a better choice.
This is not to say that said non-linear relationship is actually the case; I know more about physics and electronics than I do about power supplies specifically. Also, a lot of people are saying that keeping a PSU at its maximum load too constantly can shorten its life and cause spectacular failures (arcs and sparks, anyone?). I don't know who to believe; I just trust Apple's judgment in the PSU they gave me.
Slashdot Mirror
It's .avi, you insensitive clod!
I knew the teacher in my high school who managed the student television station. She bought an iMac, with her own pocket money, for the students to use for video editing, and still had to hush it up. She had brought in an earlier iMac a few years before, and got chastised for it. Apparently the school has some contract with Compaq, of all companies.
She was urging the administration to buy a bunch of iMacs for the video editing lab in the new school in the district, but they went with huge, $20,000 machines instead, which, according to this teacher and some students I've talked to, do no more than Final Cut Pro on an iMac. And you could get 6 iMacs and 6 copies of FPC for that price, easy.
Your basic contradiction is to say that all of OS X's extra features should be omitted from a server, and then to say that without them, OS X requires just as much support. That's basically a tautology: Remove from the equation what Apple offers, and Apple will have nothing to offer. The fact is that Aqua and all the other extras that make Mac OS X Server be Mac OS X Server are exactly what allow companies to reduce their IT staff.
I'm running a production server on an old AGP Power Mac G4. I'd post the link, but I don't think my customer would appreciate it.
However, having come up at almost the same time after the outage, Arthur (my server) and Savoy (a friend's server, hosting his personal site via Debian Woody) will duke it out in an uptime contest. I don't see why Arthur can't win--or, really, why the race should ever end, short of another outage.
Or, they'll come back 6 months down the line and say 'we're ready to do this now' - which happens more often then you'd believe.
Damn! I'm about to do that!
It's actually just for a fast SDSL for a startup, but it's the same situation. I had to ask for a price quote. I talked to a salesman, and he even gave me some sort of deal. I relayed the price to my client, and he basically said he expects to be ready for it in about 6 months.
I think I can believe that happening a lot.
Certianly the biggest mistake the open source communtiy could make is to not take them seriously.
I disagree. I think it is certainly the biggest mistake the open source community could make to take SCO seriously. The primary motivation for SCO's lawsuit is to drive up the stock price. Every post that takes that suit seriously in any way does exactly that. That will reward the executives, and piss the rest of us off further.
I lk t lv ll th vwls t f wrds. T svs lts f tm t wrt bt ts pn n th ss t rd nd mks m lk lk cmplt dpsht.
I actually had to type like that for a while--either that, or type slowly, search-and-peck style. I broke my left wrist a couple of weeks ago, and before I got a splint, I couldn't type with my left hand. Since I use the Dvorak keyboard layout, that pretty much meant no vowels.
Search and peck isn't really an option, because I've rearranged the letters on my keyboard (stealing from another keyboard in the process) to spell the following:
`3.1415926535
my-wrongly[]\
vanquished'
waxed/fork
No, you moron, he was saying that the classes he could find required more than that. That was the entire point of the statement you quote, and it completely defeats your point.
Often, the problem isn't lack of a manual, it's that the users don't read them. The manufacturers ship computers with less and less manual, to make it less intimidating opening those books. Apple has gone to digital manuals entirely, for instance, decreasing the amount of documentation to try to get people to use what's left.
To emphasize how abhorrent users find any sort of manual to be, take the example of my dad. We got our first Mac over ten years ago, and he has to ask me what the menubar is every time I mention it when supporting him. Last summer, since I was going away for college in the fall and wouldn't be around to help him, he got Mac OS X for Dummies to help him learn how to use the thing.
I think maybe it was Christmas vacation that I was home and he was having printer trouble. We have a laser printer with a network card, and it's somewhat unreliable, but after I had fixed the problem and printed something from my computer, his still wouldn't work. The conversation went something like this.
Me: Oh, no big deal--you have to do the same thing you had to do before to get it to print, except now you can just do it once and it will keep working.
Dad: I haven't printed anything in a while. I don't remember how to do that.
Me: Well, I've shown you before--have you looked in that book?
Dad: What book?
Me: Mac OS X for Dummies.
Dad: Oh, that's right! No, I'll go look in it.
[Go back to whatever I was doing. Five minutes later, my dad comes upstairs, asking me for help. I figure he's following some demonstration and wants help, but end up having to help him find the book.]
Dad: Oh, thanks! Alright, where would it be in the book?
Me: I don't know, look it up. {thinking: What, you think I know the contents of the whole book, which I haven't read, off the top of my head?}
Dad: Look it up where?
Me: {stares in disbelief} I'd start with the index, but the table of contents is also an option...
Dad: What should I look under in the index?
Me: How about 'P' for "Printers"?
He came back upstairs five minutes later and told me book had the solution. This is a man who has a master's degree in history, and he doesn't know how to use a book's index.
True, but if I were a mechanic and somebody asked me to fix a car he had wrapped around a tree at 55 mph, and for free, I would tell him to shove it. Imagine, then, how techs feel when people butter their floppy drives, and then expect free support and repair.
No, it really doesn't. It does just work. You don't have to know where Terminal is to use the computer, nor should you have to buy and read a book to find Terminal if you want it. Similarly with the other goodies the grandparent poster mentioned. Part of the beauty of the Macintosh has always been that it is very difficult to mess it up. As long as you're not stupid enough to go into /System and /Library without knowing what you're doing, you're pretty safe--so play around, try things, see what happens. If all the options were onscreen at all times with full descriptions of what each one does, you'd need a monitor the size of a wall to get any work done.
It's alright, I hit that moderator with an Unfair meta-mod. They'll get the picture after a while, assuming we're in the majority.
If we're not, then let the majority rule.
Fair enough.
It still irks me that you have to consider calling security on the student that actually reports it. Sort of reminds me of a line from a classic movie: "Sorry, Luke; just doing my job." But I suppose that's the way of the world.
How about a Monty Python view?
[battle sounds]
[SCO defeats a worthless-piece-of-crap-knight]
IBM: You fight with the strength of many men, Sir knight.
I am IBM, King of the Supercomputers.
[pause]
I seek the finest and the bravest companies in the land to
join me in my Court of Linux.
[pause]
You have proved yourself worthy; will you join me?
[pause]
You make me sad. So be it. Come, RedHat.
SCO: None shall pass.
IBM: What?
SCO: None shall pass.
IBM: I have no quarrel with you, good Sir knight, but I must
distribute this kernel.
SCO: Then you shall die.
IBM: I command you, as King of the Supercomputers, to stand aside!
SCO: I move for no man.
IBM: So be it!
[hah]
[parry thrust]
[IBM chops SCO's patent claims off]
IBM: Now stand aside, worthy adversary.
SCO: 'Tis but a scratch.
IBM: A scratch? Your patent claims are nonsense!
SCO: No, they aren't.
IBM: Well, what's that then?
SCO: I've had worse.
IBM: You liar!
SCO: Come on you pansy!
[hah]
[parry thrust]
[IBM chops SCO's copyright claims off]
IBM: Victory is mine!
[kneeling]
We thank thee Linus, that in thy merc-
[SCO kicks IBM in the head while he is praying]
SCO: Come on then.
IBM: What?
SCO: Have at you!
IBM: You are indeed brave, Sir knight, but the fight is mine.
SCO: Oh, had enough, eh?
IBM: Look, you stupid bastard, you've got no IP left.
SCO: Yes I have.
IBM: Look!
SCO: Just a flesh wound.
[Headbutts IBM in the chest]
IBM: Look, stop that.
SCO: Chicken! Chicken!
IBM: Look, I'll have your trade secrets. Right!
[whop]
SCO: Right, I'll do you for that!
IBM: You'll what?
SCO: Come 'ere!
IBM: What are you going to do, sue me?
SCO: I own Unix!
IBM: You're a loony.
SCO: The Black Knight always triumphs! Have at you!
IBM: Come on then.
[whop]
[IBM chops SCO's contract claims off]
IBM: All right; we'll settle out of court. Come, RedHat.
SCO: Oh, oh, I see, running away then. You yellow
bastards! Come back here and take what's coming to you. I'll bite
your patents off!
(With thanks to this site.)
First I have to verify their claim, second I have to consider the damage they may have done (purposefully or not). If this means a call to security then I am obligated to do that. After that I have to consider fixing my system and damage control.
I find it disturbing that fixing the problem takes a backseat to investigating the student. Frankly, I would hope that you wouldn't investigate that student at all--first, fix the problem, and second, examine your logs for evidence that the flaw has been exploited. Investigating the student will discourage anyone who finds an exploit in the future from telling you--after all, if this person had just made use of the exploit instead of reporting it, he would have improved his grades for free, avoided the hassle of trying to defend himself in a kangaroo court, and almost certainly wouldn't have been caught.
In a case where being caught doing nothing is likely to carry the same consequences as being caught doing something horrible, many people will prefer a slim chance at being caught with blood on their hands over a surefire legal hassle and potential expulsion for trying to do some good. (Of course, there's the option of neither reporting it nor exploiting it, which many more people would prefer, but you'd still rather have them report it.)
Any response that discourages people from reporting exploits reveals an attitude that you consider yourself invulnerable--if you thought there might be more bugs, you'd encourage people to report them so you could fix them. There will always be bugs; the more you accept this and act accordingly, the cleaner your application will be.
Nobody knows the passwords...
This must lead to endless support calls from teachers.
I have discovered a truly marvelous sig, unfortunately the sig limit is too small to contain i
.sig. Unless you stole it from me, of course.
Dammit, I thought I had been original! Now I have to change my
And not a very well-read one that replied.
1984, by George Orwell. It's standard geek fare; you really shouldn't post around here without reading it. For that matter, it's a standard part of modern English-speaking culture, and you're a hypocrite to call someone ignorant without reading it.
Well, if you count Mac OS X as a variant of BSD, then BSD is definitely not dying. I understand that's somewhat controversial, though--which makes the whole issue of whether or not BSD is dying controversial till that's settled (assuming BSD would be dying without Mac OS X, a subject on which I am not competent to comment).
It wasn't his .sig, but yes, it was a literary allusion that the parent poster obviously didn't get.
It's also an operating system.
Oh, sorry, kernel.
Sorry, let me clarify...
So, a 200W power supply putting out 200W will generate less heat than a 400W power supply putting out the same...
By "putting out the same" I meant "putting out the same as the 200W PSU", which was 200W. I can see how you would misread that phrase to mean "putting out 400W", so I apologize for the confusion.
Maybe hold control and alt with your index finger and hit delete with your middle finger? Or thumb and index finger, respectively, if you only have a left hand.
Alternatively, you could get a Mac.
I broke my left wrist a few days ago and have been typing one-handed since then. I haven't had any major problems other than having to type very slowly search-and-peck style, so I don't really have much sympathy for your complaint. Sorry.
An N-watt PSU will have N watts of maximum output, but it will also generate heat. Heat is measured in watts as well (or can be; energy is energy, after all). So, a 300W PSU putting out 300W will use >300W of power from the wall. Running "more efficiently" at or near capacity probably means that the relationship of wasted power to output power is non-linear, reaching a plateau or at least slowing its increase towards the top end. So, a 200W power supply putting out 200W will generate less heat than a 400W power supply putting out the same--and since that heat is generated using electricity that you pay for, the 200W PSU may be a better choice.
This is not to say that said non-linear relationship is actually the case; I know more about physics and electronics than I do about power supplies specifically. Also, a lot of people are saying that keeping a PSU at its maximum load too constantly can shorten its life and cause spectacular failures (arcs and sparks, anyone?). I don't know who to believe; I just trust Apple's judgment in the PSU they gave me.
...there's more to life than flame wars.
Just an observation. You may now proceed.