Re:This is why there are moderated groups
on
Usenet Gag Order
·
· Score: 2
Yes, but freedom doesn't mean "I can do whatever the hell I want!" It's tempered by responsibilities that go along with it. Freedom of Movement is one of my rights, but if I run around naked screaming obsenities in a shopping mall (just an example:) ), I'm going to have that freedom taken away. Ie. I'll be banned from the mall or spend a little time in jail.
I don't know the details, but if this fellow was threatening or harassing people, a restraining order is probably reasonable. Societies' right not to have to put up with morons overrules individual freedoms.
Some of my professors have given us printed notes with copyright dates on them, and I would respect that (heck, when I use their notes in assignments, I'll usually reference them).
Handwritten notes, though, I consider mine and I've never been presented with any contracts from a prof about what I can and cannot do with information presented in class.
I would think this would mainly be an issue for grad students who are doing work under profs who are doing industry sponsored research, or who plan to publish papers based on their work. Who would care about CS101 notes, since they're pretty much the same world wide?
I kind of like VisualAge, though. Features like compilation-as-you-go, the respository and auto-versioning are kind of nice. Maintaining different versions has saved my life on projects in the past.
I imagine you could probably makes Emacs do that, but having to learn elisp to add functionality to my java development environment just seems wrong somehow:)
I've used VisualAge under Win95 & NT, and it was a little sluggish (mind you, it was on a pentium 200, so the machine itself may be to blame). Does anyone know if the linux port is any zippier?
Kawa is a much better IDE for small projects, VisualAge is kind of intended for a team building a large project. I heard a rumour about linux Kawa port a few months ago, but nothing seems to have surfaced.
Jean Chretien is still the Prime Minister, and he is the leader of the Liberal party, and is still Prime Minister. He is not a member of the Bloc Quebecois or the Parti Quebecois (the national & provincial seperatist parties respectively).
If the Seperatists had been in power on national level, Canada would have been split up long ago and my province would probably belong to the States right now (no offence to the Americans out there, but...ugh!)
Yes, I agree that M$ (and the software industry in general) should be more liable for poor product quality.
But...the lawsuit mentioned in the article was about M$ charging too much for software, which is entirely different. If you win a lawsuit against a software manufacturer over a buggy product, then more power to you. It would be about time the industry was forced to be accountable.
Suing someone because their product is more expensive than you want it to be, though, is ridiculous. I hate paying money for things, but I'm not going to sue someone everytime I have to pull out my wallet. If I think a product isn't worth what is being charged for it...I just don't purchase it!
Nope. Our PM is a Liberal (which means something different than when you Americans call someone a liberal:) ). The seperatists are the folks up in Quebec who want to break off into a sovereign state.
I have to say, even if the target is M$, I find stupid lawsuits really galling. The ad agency probably bought, what, a dozen licenses? Which means M$'s monopolistic practices cost them about $500. It's barely worth going to small claims court, and they are probably suing for several million. *sigh*
I did think the comments from the Microsoft spokesperson how said the lawsuit was baseless because Windows is priced way cheaper than their competitors. Huh? Cheaper than Linux? Cheaper than BeOS?
I had been planning on installing BeOS in the near future, and had been lamenting the lack of Java.
They're suggesting a fast timeframe, though. Beta verion in less than 2 months? Production version by 1Q2000? I also wonder which version they'll be porting 1.2, or 1.3 (hopefully 1.3 since it has the client-optimized version of Hotspot). Mind you, I guess much of the Swing stuff is already written in Java, which should make it pretty easy to port (at least, that's what the Java advertising always says:) )
I wish them the best of luck, but won't be shocked if those delivery dates slip at bit.
I for one *hate* online books and manuals. I'll use them in a pinch, but I find it so much easier with a book on my desk that I can thumb through while coding. I curse everything I open a software package and there are no paper manuals.
On the other hand, maybe what I need is a second computer with all of my documentation on it beside my main box:)
I haven't used a PalmPilot yet, but, wasn't the point of them that you had a nice little device that you could carry around in your pocket, would be useful and you wouldn't need to lug a bunch of stuff around?
What comes next? Full sized monitor, hard drive, printer and a few more peripherals. Suddenly, you have a very expensive 486!!
I got a chuckle out of the article when they called them "anonymous developers" (to make them sound more dangerous and shady??) and then proceeded to quote one Jon Johansen, the founder of MoRE:)
While I like the idea of many different distributions, I thing they should really try to offer a new product. Did the press release have an details about how they are going to make it easier? (I personally don't see how Debian is any more difficult to install than RedH at, and I found it easier than Mandrake)
People who barf up new distributions should go to some length to add new features or something unique, rather than just re-package an older, established dist. (I'm not saying these folks won't, I'm just complaining in general:) )
It's an inconvenience and an annoyance when stuff like this happens, but it's probably a necessary evil. Not everyone will agree with RMS or ESR or anyone else, so no one should be forced to use on particular lisence.
If there were a standards body that official stamped things as Open Source, and they required everyone to use, say, GPL, you would loose a lot of developers who don't like GPL and don't want to code under it. Many lisences, even with the headaches they cause, help keep the number of Free Software developers large and growing.
I'd rather have Qt & KDE along with the lisence conflicts, then not Qt/KDE at all. At least the fact that they were able to come to an amicable agreement shows that OSS participants have a sense of community and can actually work together, even through differences of opinion!
The problem with any approach that focuses on requirements, design, and style is that it doesn't help those software development lifecycle stages where software spends most of it's time: integration and maintenance.
But the whole point of Software Engineering is to make maintenance & integration easier!! Suppose you are handed a tarball full of Mozilla or Linux kernel source code. If you have never looked at it before, you would be lost. All of the documentation that SE processes generate is designed to make this easier. Requirements allow you to see what the software was meant to do.
Granted, a lot of OSS projects start off scratching an itch (which is a very informal requirement doc), but a lot of the newer OSS projects like (Gnome) start off with a plan and goal and the requirements give you someting to compare to, to see if you are meeting that goal.
UML diagrams, design documents, requirements all came around *because* it is so difficult to write huge projects without structure.
And what if there is no code ready to modify? If you have to start from scratch, you'll be doing to OSS community a huge favour by providing good documents along with your source!
Hmm...Well, actually I guess it means that smoking sections really bug me because the smoke drifts everywhere anyway (darned Brownian motion!) Would you go swiming in a pool that had a sign saying, "Absolutely no peeing in the non-peeing section." rather than just "Absolutely no peeing?"
I enjoyed the article. I think it was great to seem them discussing differences of opion, you didn't see Bill Joy shouting, "ESR...you're a PUTZ" or anything like that.
Everyone involved offered up well thought, interesting points. I am a fan of Java, and I think I may be a little more accepting of SCSL in regards to Java. SCSL isn't open source, it's a different tool meant towards a different end.
I've had an idea for a technology that I think will revolutionize computing. I call the notion, "Stored Program Computing". Basicly, instead of having seperate data areas for data & program instructions, you have one large array of memory and store both data AND computer programs there. With clever encoding, it will be easy for the CPU to tell the difference between data & instructions. I predict this will lead to an incredible increase in computer useasbility. It will facilitate another idea I've had, which I call "Time Sharing" (we'll swap programs/data in and out of memory allowing many users or processes to share the same computer).
Apparently, back in the '50s, some obscure electrician named Von Newbie (or something like that) had a similar idea, which is why I'm flying off to Norway, where it doesn't matter who comes up with the idea first, only who files the patent first.
Naturally, I'm going to have vigorously defend my patent, demanding royalties from manufacturers who have created products using my tech, software vendors who write software taking advantage of my design, and users (Remember: it takes two to violate my patent, one thieving corporation to build the device, and another to use it)
Thank you, and I'll be expecting my royalty checks soon!
In my Digital Logic and Computer Organization courses at school, we used LogicWorks from
Capilano to simulate the circuits we were building. As far as I know, they only make Windows and Mac versions, but some of my classmates said it ran quite nicely under Wine.
Digital Logic was pretty fun, but often gave me a headache:)
Slashdot Mirror
Yes, but freedom doesn't mean "I can do whatever the hell I want!" It's tempered by responsibilities that go along with it. Freedom of Movement is one of my rights, but if I run around naked screaming obsenities in a shopping mall (just an example :) ), I'm going to have that freedom taken away. Ie. I'll be banned from the mall or spend a little time in jail.
I don't know the details, but if this fellow was threatening or harassing people, a restraining order is probably reasonable. Societies' right not to have to put up with morons overrules individual freedoms.
Dana
Some of my professors have given us printed notes with copyright dates on them, and I would respect that (heck, when I use their notes in assignments, I'll usually reference them).
Handwritten notes, though, I consider mine and I've never been presented with any contracts from a prof about what I can and cannot do with information presented in class.
I would think this would mainly be an issue for grad students who are doing work under profs who are doing industry sponsored research, or who plan to publish papers based on their work. Who would care about CS101 notes, since they're pretty much the same world wide?
Dana
Now I know we shouldn't dignify flamebait with responeses, but...
yeah...the evil bastards are so subtle with their corporate tool that it looks EXACTLY THE SAME as before the take over. Sigh...
Dana
I kind of like VisualAge, though. Features like compilation-as-you-go, the respository and auto-versioning are kind of nice. Maintaining different versions has saved my life on projects in the past.
:)
I imagine you could probably makes Emacs do that, but having to learn elisp to add functionality to my java development environment just seems wrong somehow
Dana
I've used VisualAge under Win95 & NT, and it was a little sluggish (mind you, it was on a pentium 200, so the machine itself may be to blame). Does anyone know if the linux port is any zippier?
Kawa is a much better IDE for small projects, VisualAge is kind of intended for a team building a large project. I heard a rumour about linux Kawa port a few months ago, but nothing seems to have surfaced.
Dana
Jean Chretien is still the Prime Minister, and he is the leader of the Liberal party, and is still Prime Minister. He is not a member of the Bloc Quebecois or the Parti Quebecois (the national & provincial seperatist parties respectively).
If the Seperatists had been in power on national level, Canada would have been split up long ago and my province would probably belong to the States right now (no offence to the Americans out there, but...ugh!)
Dana
Hmm...the webpages I've visited all spell it seperatist. It may be one of our silly Canadian ways of spelling things.
(We pronounce Z differently, too)
Dana
Yes, I agree that M$ (and the software industry in general) should be more liable for poor product quality.
But...the lawsuit mentioned in the article was about M$ charging too much for software, which is entirely different. If you win a lawsuit against a software manufacturer over a buggy product, then more power to you. It would be about time the industry was forced to be accountable.
Suing someone because their product is more expensive than you want it to be, though, is ridiculous. I hate paying money for things, but I'm not going to sue someone everytime I have to pull out my wallet. If I think a product isn't worth what is being charged for it...I just don't purchase it!
Dana
Nope. Our PM is a Liberal (which means something different than when you Americans call someone a liberal :) ). The seperatists are the folks up in Quebec who want to break off into a sovereign state.
Dana
I have to say, even if the target is M$, I find stupid lawsuits really galling. The ad agency probably bought, what, a dozen licenses? Which means M$'s monopolistic practices cost them about $500. It's barely worth going to small claims court, and they are probably suing for several million. *sigh*
I did think the comments from the Microsoft spokesperson how said the lawsuit was baseless because Windows is priced way cheaper than their competitors. Huh? Cheaper than Linux? Cheaper than BeOS?
Dana
I had been planning on installing BeOS in the near future, and had been lamenting the lack of Java.
:) )
They're suggesting a fast timeframe, though. Beta verion in less than 2 months? Production version by 1Q2000? I also wonder which version they'll be porting 1.2, or 1.3 (hopefully 1.3 since it has the client-optimized version of Hotspot). Mind you, I guess much of the Swing stuff is already written in Java, which should make it pretty easy to port (at least, that's what the Java advertising always says
I wish them the best of luck, but won't be shocked if those delivery dates slip at bit.
Dana
My worry would be that the sites would use non-standard IE 'features' that would leave OSes like BeOS and Linux, which don't have IE, out of the loop.
If we find sites that are too IE-friendly, Netscape/Mozilla/Opera users have to put pressure on them early to ensure they are standards compliant!
Dana
I for one *hate* online books and manuals. I'll use them in a pinch, but I find it so much easier with a book on my desk that I can thumb through while coding. I curse everything I open a software package and there are no paper manuals.
:)
On the other hand, maybe what I need is a second computer with all of my documentation on it beside my main box
Dana
I think it's cute that they aren't posting the findings in Word, only Word Perfect 6 and PDF.
:)
Very diplomatic
Dana
I haven't used a PalmPilot yet, but, wasn't the point of them that you had a nice little device that you could carry around in your pocket, would be useful and you wouldn't need to lug a bunch of stuff around?
What comes next? Full sized monitor, hard drive, printer and a few more peripherals. Suddenly, you have a very expensive 486!!
Dana
Umm...I usually go to those rooms called 'Bathrooms', but perhaps they build theatres differently up here in Canada :)
I got a chuckle out of the article when they called them "anonymous developers" (to make them sound more dangerous and shady??) and then proceeded to quote one Jon Johansen, the founder of MoRE :)
Dana
While I like the idea of many different distributions, I thing they should really try to offer a new product. Did the press release have an details about how they are going to make it easier? (I personally don't see how Debian is any more difficult to install than RedH at, and I found it easier than Mandrake)
:) )
People who barf up new distributions should go to some length to add new features or something unique, rather than just re-package an older, established dist. (I'm not saying these folks won't, I'm just complaining in general
Dana
It's an inconvenience and an annoyance when stuff like this happens, but it's probably a necessary evil. Not everyone will agree with RMS or ESR or anyone else, so no one should be forced to use on particular lisence.
If there were a standards body that official stamped things as Open Source, and they required everyone to use, say, GPL, you would loose a lot of developers who don't like GPL and don't want to code under it. Many lisences, even with the headaches they cause, help keep the number of Free Software developers large and growing.
I'd rather have Qt & KDE along with the lisence conflicts, then not Qt/KDE at all. At least the fact that they were able to come to an amicable agreement shows that OSS participants have a sense of community and can actually work together, even through differences of opinion!
Dana
The problem with any approach that focuses on requirements, design, and style is that it doesn't help those software development lifecycle stages where software spends most of it's time: integration and maintenance.
But the whole point of Software Engineering is to make maintenance & integration easier!! Suppose you are handed a tarball full of Mozilla or Linux kernel source code. If you have never looked at it before, you would be lost. All of the documentation that SE processes generate is designed to make this easier. Requirements allow you to see what the software was meant to do.
Granted, a lot of OSS projects start off scratching an itch (which is a very informal requirement doc), but a lot of the newer OSS projects like (Gnome) start off with a plan and goal and the requirements give you someting to compare to, to see if you are meeting that goal.
UML diagrams, design documents, requirements all came around *because* it is so difficult to write huge projects without structure.
And what if there is no code ready to modify? If you have to start from scratch, you'll be doing to OSS community a huge favour by providing good documents along with your source!
Dana
Hmm...Well, actually I guess it means that smoking sections really bug me because the smoke drifts everywhere anyway (darned Brownian motion!) Would you go swiming in a pool that had a sign saying, "Absolutely no peeing in the non-peeing section." rather than just "Absolutely no peeing?"
(Sorry for any confusion!)
Dana
I enjoyed the article. I think it was great to seem them discussing differences of opion, you didn't see Bill Joy shouting, "ESR...you're a PUTZ" or anything like that.
Everyone involved offered up well thought, interesting points. I am a fan of Java, and I think I may be a little more accepting of SCSL in regards to Java. SCSL isn't open source, it's a different tool meant towards a different end.
Dana
I've had an idea for a technology that I think will revolutionize computing. I call the notion, "Stored Program Computing". Basicly, instead of having seperate data areas for data & program instructions, you have one large array of memory and store both data AND computer programs there. With clever encoding, it will be easy for the CPU to tell the difference between data & instructions. I predict this will lead to an incredible increase in computer useasbility. It will facilitate another idea I've had, which I call "Time Sharing" (we'll swap programs/data in and out of memory allowing many users or processes to share the same computer).
Apparently, back in the '50s, some obscure electrician named Von Newbie (or something like that) had a similar idea, which is why I'm flying off to Norway, where it doesn't matter who comes up with the idea first, only who files the patent first.
Naturally, I'm going to have vigorously defend my patent, demanding royalties from manufacturers who have created products using my tech, software vendors who write software taking advantage of my design, and users (Remember: it takes two to violate my patent, one thieving corporation to build the device, and another to use it)
Thank you, and I'll be expecting my royalty checks soon!
Dana
In my Digital Logic and Computer Organization courses at school, we used LogicWorks from
:)
Capilano to simulate the circuits we were building. As far as I know, they only make Windows and Mac versions, but some of my classmates said it ran quite nicely under Wine.
Digital Logic was pretty fun, but often gave me a headache
Dana
It doesn't seem like trickery to me. They're being pretty open about it: Do our drudge work, and win a prize.
Besides...documenting software really *is* drudge work (IMHO), and at least they are trying to make it a little more interesting by offering prizes.
And getting people to examine the code this way may bring out some interesting ideas that will be useful to the developers.
Dana