First off, what the hell is a "database core" ? Why would you virtualize it? You just cluster them if you need more than 1 physical hosts resources and if you need less than that you just install multiple instances of whatever DBMS you're working with.
And I don't know who told you your guests could run on another type of hardware but they lied to you. There's no emulation happening. If the OS is designed to run on x86 hardware it won't magically run on another architecture.
Not a cure-all by any means, but one more trick for the toolbox. Very useful during a maintenance window. Obviously Cisco specific.
(tftp/scp/etc new-config to router)
router# reload in 2
router# copy flash://new-config run
(something along those lines, this is off the top of my head, basically copy your new config to the running config)
if it works, wr it to startup config, if you get disconnected, wait 2 minutes for the router to reboot and automatically load the previous startup-config. Adjust the time as necessary depending on change/complexity.
Also use something like RANCID or KiwiCatTools to help handle managing your configuration changes.
But the best trick of all is using a full blown router emulator like gns3.
It's a MIPS emulator that loads unmodified IOS images. You can build complex scenarios and even attach them to NICs on the host PC. I've built labs with several routers attached to bridged NICs in VMWare guests. So you can literally start, say, a webserver on one vmware guest and access it across your gns3 "network". You can also bridge it to physical NICs -- you could have a 7206vxr router running on an old PC!
Plenty of limitations. Namely it can only run a specific set of IOS images for specific models and you have to use an NM-16ESW to simulate switching since switching is done in ASICs.
When you see 60Mb/s via CIFS thats megabits, not bytes.
gigabit equipment is cheap, not inexpensive. I'm fine with 100mb cisco 3500 series MANAGED switches over some piece of shit netgear from walmart. I can easily stream 1080p over 100mb/s ethernet, and my Internet connection is only about 20mb/s. I'm not interested in paying thousands of dollars to upgrade to managed gigabit switches.
Yeah and I'll only have to hire 15 guys to scrounge around for old PCs all day in classified ads and pick them up in trucks. Not to mention transport, clean, test and maintain them. Oh and what's the failure rate again? How often do I have users sitting around twiddling their thumbs because their $30 dumpster PC caught fire in the middle of the day?
Then it's poorly implemented. Once a virtual desktop solution is setup, they basically run themselves.
You should just be using less helpdesk technicians to support the same workload, those same (but fewer) techs should just be able to do it without leaving their desks, for the most part.
Well if I can put 100 users on a single dual socket quad core server + VMware View (or Citrix XenDesktop) and roll out 100 thin clients, is that less expensive (including management costs) than rolling out 100 desktop PCs?
It's close to the same hardware but requires a lot less horsepower. I think we're using sub-1Ghz Via Eden CPUs and maybe 1Gb of RAM. We pay about $100-$200 less per seat compared to the cheapest desktop PC Dell sells, looking at the desktop hardware alone.
Managing thin clients is much less expensive. They also use less power. Not one solution works everywhere, but there's definitely instances in which the TCO is much better for thin clients. For example, we have lots and lots of sites, but only a few dozen users per site. These sites are also spread all over the southeast US. It makes much more sense to roll out thin clients and centralize the desktops than have 50 or 60 network techs scrambling between buildings.
We've been using thin clients and Citrix at over 40 locations for over 6,000 employees for almost 9 years now.
The "one safe place" to find apps is using Published (/Streamed) Applications to Virtualized Desktops. Citrix has been delivering published apps for a decade. Not exactly what we'd call a small, under-the-radar company.
I don't think everything will be written in.NET or javascript.
You're crazy I love my virtual desktop. I have 10x the computing power I ever had with a desktop PC and when I vpn in from home everything is exactly where I left it.
Who the hell has network failures that are anything more than tiny isolated incidents where a switch fan failed and you lost a block of 50 or so people for 15 minutes while you swapped it out? This isn't 1994.
Network uptimes are in the 5 9's these days. We have 4 hour guaranteed MTTR on our WAN (they're actually under 2 in practice, but guarantee 4). Not to mention we've got backup WAN circuits (broadband VPN).
We use IGEL here. The entry level isn't bad, but once you start adding features the price starts climbing. Although their licensing model is really nice and their management software is great.
The sad part is, we can basically get a full blown desktop PC from HP for the same price. Although I'd much rather manage a couple thousand thin clients than Windows XP desktops.
Well you're a moron because 99% of the time it's the exact same components, except you might get 3D drive guard with a "business" machine. You think there's some lab somewhere where scientists in lab coats with clipboards take "business class" laptops and hit them with rubber mallets, drop them off counter tops and let cats urinate on them?
"By the time you get all the components that provide the processing and I/O throughput of those high-end boxes, the x86/64 commodity hardware cost advantage has evaporated."
Slashdot Mirror
If by "a few years ago" you mean a decade, then yes, I agree completely.
First off, what the hell is a "database core" ? Why would you virtualize it? You just cluster them if you need more than 1 physical hosts resources and if you need less than that you just install multiple instances of whatever DBMS you're working with.
And I don't know who told you your guests could run on another type of hardware but they lied to you. There's no emulation happening. If the OS is designed to run on x86 hardware it won't magically run on another architecture.
6,100 employees 44 locations + 2 datacenters.
3 admins (1 network 2 systems) and 2 helpdesk technicians
"mp3 files are like .jpg image files such that they lose a little quality/data each time they are copied"
Is this a joke?
"incidentally, do not EVER buy a Drobo, not if you care about your data; it's dangerous to store data on that device) "
Care to give some details?
Fedora ... servers? Yikes.
You realize you'll need to do a distro upgrade in a minimum of 13 months after you deploy them, right?
If you want an RPM based distro I'd seriously consider checking out CentOS.
Not a cure-all by any means, but one more trick for the toolbox. Very useful during a maintenance window. Obviously Cisco specific.
(tftp/scp/etc new-config to router)
router# reload in 2
router# copy flash://new-config run
(something along those lines, this is off the top of my head, basically copy your new config to the running config)
if it works, wr it to startup config, if you get disconnected, wait 2 minutes for the router to reboot and automatically load the previous startup-config. Adjust the time as necessary depending on change/complexity.
Also use something like RANCID or KiwiCatTools to help handle managing your configuration changes.
But the best trick of all is using a full blown router emulator like gns3.
It's a MIPS emulator that loads unmodified IOS images. You can build complex scenarios and even attach them to NICs on the host PC. I've built labs with several routers attached to bridged NICs in VMWare guests. So you can literally start, say, a webserver on one vmware guest and access it across your gns3 "network". You can also bridge it to physical NICs -- you could have a 7206vxr router running on an old PC!
Plenty of limitations. Namely it can only run a specific set of IOS images for specific models and you have to use an NM-16ESW to simulate switching since switching is done in ASICs.
you know you can just hold control and click the link with the left mouse button?
Fedora did up until at least 11, I haven't installed 12 yet.
100mb / 8 = 12.5MB/s
When you see 60Mb/s via CIFS thats megabits, not bytes.
gigabit equipment is cheap, not inexpensive. I'm fine with 100mb cisco 3500 series MANAGED switches over some piece of shit netgear from walmart. I can easily stream 1080p over 100mb/s ethernet, and my Internet connection is only about 20mb/s. I'm not interested in paying thousands of dollars to upgrade to managed gigabit switches.
Yeah and I'll only have to hire 15 guys to scrounge around for old PCs all day in classified ads and pick them up in trucks. Not to mention transport, clean, test and maintain them. Oh and what's the failure rate again? How often do I have users sitting around twiddling their thumbs because their $30 dumpster PC caught fire in the middle of the day?
Sounds like a brilliant way to run a business.
A sub $200 thin client is either awful or includes no management software and I can buy brand new HP desktops for $300.
Then it's poorly implemented. Once a virtual desktop solution is setup, they basically run themselves. You should just be using less helpdesk technicians to support the same workload, those same (but fewer) techs should just be able to do it without leaving their desks, for the most part.
Well if I can put 100 users on a single dual socket quad core server + VMware View (or Citrix XenDesktop) and roll out 100 thin clients, is that less expensive (including management costs) than rolling out 100 desktop PCs?
It's close to the same hardware but requires a lot less horsepower. I think we're using sub-1Ghz Via Eden CPUs and maybe 1Gb of RAM. We pay about $100-$200 less per seat compared to the cheapest desktop PC Dell sells, looking at the desktop hardware alone.
Managing thin clients is much less expensive. They also use less power. Not one solution works everywhere, but there's definitely instances in which the TCO is much better for thin clients. For example, we have lots and lots of sites, but only a few dozen users per site. These sites are also spread all over the southeast US. It makes much more sense to roll out thin clients and centralize the desktops than have 50 or 60 network techs scrambling between buildings.
We've been using thin clients and Citrix at over 40 locations for over 6,000 employees for almost 9 years now.
.NET or javascript.
The "one safe place" to find apps is using Published (/Streamed) Applications to Virtualized Desktops. Citrix has been delivering published apps for a decade. Not exactly what we'd call a small, under-the-radar company.
I don't think everything will be written in
Thin clients never "failed".
You're crazy I love my virtual desktop. I have 10x the computing power I ever had with a desktop PC and when I vpn in from home everything is exactly where I left it.
That's a pile of shit. I type over 120 wpm and use the entire office suite via Citrix ICA and it runs flawlessly.
Who the hell has network failures that are anything more than tiny isolated incidents where a switch fan failed and you lost a block of 50 or so people for 15 minutes while you swapped it out? This isn't 1994.
Network uptimes are in the 5 9's these days. We have 4 hour guaranteed MTTR on our WAN (they're actually under 2 in practice, but guarantee 4). Not to mention we've got backup WAN circuits (broadband VPN).
We use IGEL here. The entry level isn't bad, but once you start adding features the price starts climbing. Although their licensing model is really nice and their management software is great.
The sad part is, we can basically get a full blown desktop PC from HP for the same price. Although I'd much rather manage a couple thousand thin clients than Windows XP desktops.
Clearly spoken like someone who's never managed a large install base of workstations.
Most admins can't build a pc? Really? You honestly believe that?
Well you're a moron because 99% of the time it's the exact same components, except you might get 3D drive guard with a "business" machine. You think there's some lab somewhere where scientists in lab coats with clipboards take "business class" laptops and hit them with rubber mallets, drop them off counter tops and let cats urinate on them?
Those apps might run in WINE so that might not be correct.
"By the time you get all the components that provide the processing and I/O throughput of those high-end boxes, the x86/64 commodity hardware cost advantage has evaporated."
One word: scaling
Yeah and one webserver would be even simpler and less reliable. And no webserver would be even simpler. Good argument.