Great, so theoretically by buying an Android device I get openness.
In reality in a year, we'll be buying locked down fragmented variations of Android that offer nothing in terms of openness and have diverged to far from the default OS to be truely 'compatible'... intentionally... so that Verizon, AT&T and T-Mobile can continue to sell access to the GPS for an additional $10/month and have you buy from THEIR app stores.
Whats that you say? Most of it has already happened?
So great, in theory Android is open, in practice not so much. What was your point again? Where you telling us Windows qualifies as 'open' because I have in my posession a good portion of the source code? Theory and practice are two entirely different things, you're trying to compare the theoretical world of one device with another device in the real world. Doesn't work.
Why would any Apple user (or any other phone user) give a shit how many Android devices sell? You think theres some sort of 'Android Envy' or something?
Why? Slashdot geeks care about 'open' to a silly extreme.
The rest of us don't. We just care about how it directly effects us. We don't give a shit that we can't run some one elses hacked together copy of the OS, the one that came with it works just fine for what we want to do with it.
I can put any app on my phone if I want, it just costs a little more, and I've paid the privilege... and never used it for anything more than developing apps to sell on the app store.
The reality is, most of us, as adults, don't have time to dick around hacking our phones to do silly shit with half assed broken software from someone else. Most of us have lives. Families to feed and jobs to keep.
Nothing about the 'openness' of the phone in the way you mean it has any effect on me. I do expect my phone to be 'open' but my definition is rational, yours is fanatical and rather different than any view taken anywhere in history. Nothing about the 'closed nature' of the iPhone or any other phone is any different than the closed nature of the millions of other things people have made.
The 'openness' you talk about is a new privilege you think of as a right. You are simply wrong. It isn't a right, its a privilege. You do not have a right to tell Apple (or anyone else) what to do with their products. You do have the right to ignore their products, and thats good for you.
Seriously, no one that matters cares, and that includes many 'geeks' which you tried to speak for. I've seen plenty of geeks with iPhones, and only one with an Android phone... and they are a Google employee. Never more than blackberries and winmo phones in the hands of geeks in the US. None of the platforms that people actually use are 'open' in the way you want them to be... and no one that owns one cares, so that selling point isn't nearly as important as you seem to think it is.
Once the fad of being always connected to your email ends, you can expect people will revert to 'I just want a phone that makes calls and is thin'.
Apple provided a dumb smartphone and it sold like wildfire.
People don't want a uber powerful smartphone, in case you guys haven't noticed yet. They want one that works and is easy to use. Apps and email are nice but once the fad is over that selling point will disappear. Web browsing is definitely here to stay and you aren't going to do any better than Mobile Safari right this instant so they've got a good shot at winning over the general population while the other 'smart phones' spend all their time just being confusing and annoying to use.
Funny, I'd argue Apple has a good shot... for exactly the reasons you listed.
Lots of options isn't always the best way to win. You want to win the phone market you have to sell to regular people who don't know what to do with 80 options.
Options may rule the slashdot crowd, but it doesn't anywhere else.
We're just reverting to the age old argument: Geeks and Devs don't have a fucking clue about designing good user experiences.
No, it isn't, and thats a silly argument. If you have 'Lines of white' that run through your document then something is seriously fucked up in your document. I'm not sure how 2 spaces can turn into 'Lines of white'... unless you have line lengths of 1 character.
It should be reasonable rare that you have more than 2 sentence breaks on a single line unless the line is unusually long (like a wide screen computer monitor) in which case, you'll see even fewer 'lines of white' and the spacing between sentences becomes even more important to the reader.
Now, when you get into typography and design
When you LEARN about typography and design, then you can get back to me. So you 'got into it' and thats what you do... well, you are doing it wrong, being 'into it' doesn't change that.
The reality of it is, you just went on ranting about what is right and wrong and you don't even understand the question raised or you don't understand the medium your composing in, either way you don't actually know what you're talking about.
You're talking about the spacing between lines and between paragraphs. The subject at hand is the number of spaces after the end of one sentence and the first character of the next sentence, which you couldn't possibly have doubled up in your post because HTML doesn't work that way and slashdot doesn't allow you to use the nbsp entity. You just added an extra ENTER which is not a SPACE.
So you just ignore the previously defined rules and accept the new, incorrect ones imposed by LaTeX?
Just because something generates it wrong doesn't make it a feature or the way it should be.
To go one step further, that very 'automatic' handling of spacing also needs to be overridden... ALL THE TIME in common text so you really gain nothing, you have to specify what you want either way.
Now the additional, broken, rules that LaTeX imposes are causing more problems than they are fixing.
You may think this is a good thing, in my world, computers don't try to fix problems automatically for the user UNLESS they are certainly right, which LaTeX does not know enough about the english language rules to determine. That means its not a feature, its a flaw masquerading as a feature.
Lets go ahead and make this a full fledged argument for the dense.
If you are using spacing for column alignment your just ignorant.
Its not a matter of preference really, its a matter of ignorance.
Tabs can be 1 space or 20 or 4 or 8 or 2. Spaces can be spaces, there is no flexibility.
Using a space to indent is like using hard coded text when you should have used a define.
It shows a true lack of experience. I stand behind that statement, regardless of how many lines of 'kernel code' you've written.
As for sentences... well... just because the stupid fucks who made the first web browsers were illiterate doesn't mean its acceptable. 2 spaces between sentences to make it clear that its a new sentence and a new thought, far easier to read.
Of course, before you get down to the matter of 1 space or 2, you should probably conquer the problem of no one being able to write a coherent sentence or complete a thought without running on like this one.
The 1 or 2 space 'issue' will be far less of an issue when you learn how to write properly in general as it will become obvious as to why it exists.
You also end up with a lot fewer silly looking posts like this.
Does it count as insurance fraud if he took out a life insurance policy with a special bonus payout for assassination/murder on himself knowing that the announcement would get him whacked?
Would I be a bad person if I got such a policy on him now?:/
I want to know whats in the insurance file, surely enough of us could get together and paypal up a hitman or something right? I haven't been on IRC for a while but I'm sure theres a channel on EFNet for hiring a hitman, hell probably even some bots that take credit cards by now.
Do you think he had a thought before announcing this or this sort of thing just comes naturally?
I wonder if he'll be able to leak the documents that tell us who hired the hitman before he gets knocked off?
Is there a pool for how long his life expectancy is now? I got 100 USD on 3 months.
Yes, you are both right, why the hell do you people keep acting like the two things are mutually exclusive?
Interestingly enough, there are even laws that make it specifically legal for people to do this sort of thing in a responsible manner! Its freaking CRAZY I know but true.
Of course you don't believe anything crap right wing Americans tell you... you're too busy being ignorant of alternative view points because those view points are labeled 'right wing'.
Look, you're entitled to your opinions on things, we all are. You are free to disagree all day long with any group of people you want.
What you are doing is writing off an entire large part of the population because of a silly label that is a description of a small portion of extremists in the population.
You sir, are an ignorant political racist (tm). We'd all be better off if we could at least acknowledge that viewpoints that don't align perfectly with our own may not be utterly ludicrous. Just because you don't agree on everything doesn't mean they have nothing of value to offer. You do your self a disservice to be so smug.
It is possible that some things the 'left wingers' say are actually true and that some things the 'right wingers' say is actually true.
And its certain that both of them are liars.
Think for yourself, and not based on which team you picked on your voters card.
That soldier released far more than a video and some secret war documents. If thats all it were, then they would just be douche bags and nothing more. Both Wikileaks and 'that soildier' released information about current operations. Information that could actually be used to kill American soldiers, and natives, and other countries soldiers. 'The video' was spun SO HARD that my head almost twisted off reading the freaking subtitles added on to it.
Wikileaks and that soldier didn't release untainted information, they skewed the facts into something completely other than what happened in order to get hits to their website.
Anyone who actually has half a clue watched the video and saw the truth, and the truth had absolutely nothing to do with the people killed in the video or the pilots.
We have legal ways to get the information, AFTER its no longer going to get someone killed. We have LEGITIMATE WAYS TO GET OUR GOVERNMENT TO GIVE US INFORMATION, we really don't NEED some tool with not a clue about what he's seeing spewing it onto a population that also has no clue what they are looking at.
You clearly think the government (whichever one) is pure evil.
Most Americans on the other hand, as surprising as you may find this, aren't fanatical lunatics who realize that the government isn't perfect, but its also not pure evil and somethings happen for a reason, even if I as a particular individual don't understand them.
I don't blindly follow the government, but I also know when to let someone else do the job that I'm not experienced enough to do nor do I have the full picture.
You don't have half the picture apparently because you've spent too much time reading Wikileaks and not actual facts.
[Wikileaks] If you are doing nothing wrong, you have nothing to hide and this information won't hurt anyone, all information should be public information, except my personal information which shouldn't be because its mine and I'm special. You only don't want anyone to know because you're big and EVERYTHING you do is pure evil. You never have any valid reason to keep secrets, theres no reason what so ever, and secrets mean you are doing things that are evil!!!!@$!@$!@%@#^@#$^#$%&#$%&@#%! Its not like I spin it to make it worse than it actually worse, nor do I EVER lie about anything or change my story after getting caught.
[Goverment] No, its bad because not all information we have is about the evil things we never do, some of it is secret to protect people, like you, which is why we don't leak your personal information ourselves (except today, where will make an exception just to fuck you over Mr Assange since you're claiming we're going to do that anyway, lets get it out of the way). And we never do anything bad, so theres no reason you need to see the information anyway. We never lie or cheat or screw the people over either.
Translation: ITS NOT FUCKING BLACK AND WHITE. THERE IS ROOM FOR A PROPER, INTELLIGENT MIDDLE GROUND. BOTH ORGANIZATIONS RAN BY SELFISH MONEY GRABBING ATTENTION WHORING CUNTS WHO HAVE NO INTEREST IN ANYONE BUT YOURSELVES. YOU ARE BOTH CLEARLY BAD LIARS.
My Personal Opinion as if it wasn't obvious: Julian Assange is not anywhere near the right man for the job. Two polar opposites don't equal out to one middle ground. I'm going to side with the government because I DO have SOME control over it, where as I have none over a particular individual and when its this important, I'm going to want some control of some sort over it.
"If you got nothing to hide, you should not fear Wikileaks"
Please give me all your personal information, bank account numbers, credit card numbers and any other information I need to drain your bank accounts dry and order services as if I was you.
Post them as a reply to this and share them with all of slashdot if you have nothing to hide.
What? You do have something to hide and fear by letting the information out?
If you're going to use that battle cry you better have your information freely and publicly available or your nothing nor than an ignorant hypocrite.
You're comparing journalists to a guy who gets shit sent to him by other people and blindly dumps it on a website without even looking at it to a journalist he finds facts and verifies them and considers the consequences of their actions before making information public...
Really? The newspapers are worried because some guy posts unverified raw dumps of data?
They already get this shit, they filter it and we don't see, sometimes we should see it but they think 'hey, maybe this will get someone hurt, lets not run it right now so those people don't get hurt!'
Yea, I'm sure mainstream media is worried about him... just like they worry about gossip rags, which are more or less the same class of service.
Slashdot Mirror
Shrug, according to street reports, the first 30 days of sales of the iPhone 4 would be equivelent to about half of the first or second quarter.
So yes, the numbers didn't drop and infact expanded over previous quarters and they were STILL low compared to the next couple.
Great, so theoretically by buying an Android device I get openness.
In reality in a year, we'll be buying locked down fragmented variations of Android that offer nothing in terms of openness and have diverged to far from the default OS to be truely 'compatible' ... intentionally ... so that Verizon, AT&T and T-Mobile can continue to sell access to the GPS for an additional $10/month and have you buy from THEIR app stores.
Whats that you say? Most of it has already happened?
So great, in theory Android is open, in practice not so much. What was your point again? Where you telling us Windows qualifies as 'open' because I have in my posession a good portion of the source code? Theory and practice are two entirely different things, you're trying to compare the theoretical world of one device with another device in the real world. Doesn't work.
Why would any Apple user (or any other phone user) give a shit how many Android devices sell? You think theres some sort of 'Android Envy' or something?
I'm a geek. It has no effect on me.
Why? Slashdot geeks care about 'open' to a silly extreme.
The rest of us don't. We just care about how it directly effects us. We don't give a shit that we can't run some one elses hacked together copy of the OS, the one that came with it works just fine for what we want to do with it.
I can put any app on my phone if I want, it just costs a little more, and I've paid the privilege ... and never used it for anything more than developing apps to sell on the app store.
The reality is, most of us, as adults, don't have time to dick around hacking our phones to do silly shit with half assed broken software from someone else. Most of us have lives. Families to feed and jobs to keep.
Nothing about the 'openness' of the phone in the way you mean it has any effect on me. I do expect my phone to be 'open' but my definition is rational, yours is fanatical and rather different than any view taken anywhere in history. Nothing about the 'closed nature' of the iPhone or any other phone is any different than the closed nature of the millions of other things people have made.
The 'openness' you talk about is a new privilege you think of as a right. You are simply wrong. It isn't a right, its a privilege. You do not have a right to tell Apple (or anyone else) what to do with their products. You do have the right to ignore their products, and thats good for you.
Seriously, no one that matters cares, and that includes many 'geeks' which you tried to speak for. I've seen plenty of geeks with iPhones, and only one with an Android phone ... and they are a Google employee. Never more than blackberries and winmo phones in the hands of geeks in the US. None of the platforms that people actually use are 'open' in the way you want them to be ... and no one that owns one cares, so that selling point isn't nearly as important as you seem to think it is.
In case you haven't actually looked outside your basement recently, that has already been decided.
Really, whats it good at?
Once the fad of being always connected to your email ends, you can expect people will revert to 'I just want a phone that makes calls and is thin'.
Apple provided a dumb smartphone and it sold like wildfire.
People don't want a uber powerful smartphone, in case you guys haven't noticed yet. They want one that works and is easy to use. Apps and email are nice but once the fad is over that selling point will disappear. Web browsing is definitely here to stay and you aren't going to do any better than Mobile Safari right this instant so they've got a good shot at winning over the general population while the other 'smart phones' spend all their time just being confusing and annoying to use.
Funny, I'd argue Apple has a good shot ... for exactly the reasons you listed.
Lots of options isn't always the best way to win. You want to win the phone market you have to sell to regular people who don't know what to do with 80 options.
Options may rule the slashdot crowd, but it doesn't anywhere else.
We're just reverting to the age old argument: Geeks and Devs don't have a fucking clue about designing good user experiences.
No ... no one bothered counting those 8 people because they are statistically irrelevant, stop bringing them up like they matter.
No, including the iPad is silly really.
But I'm curious to see what android pads are available today?
Two spaces is a river of white?
No, it isn't, and thats a silly argument. If you have 'Lines of white' that run through your document then something is seriously fucked up in your document. I'm not sure how 2 spaces can turn into 'Lines of white' ... unless you have line lengths of 1 character.
It should be reasonable rare that you have more than 2 sentence breaks on a single line unless the line is unusually long (like a wide screen computer monitor) in which case, you'll see even fewer 'lines of white' and the spacing between sentences becomes even more important to the reader.
When you LEARN about typography and design, then you can get back to me. So you 'got into it' and thats what you do ... well, you are doing it wrong, being 'into it' doesn't change that.
The reality of it is, you just went on ranting about what is right and wrong and you don't even understand the question raised or you don't understand the medium your composing in, either way you don't actually know what you're talking about.
You're talking about the spacing between lines and between paragraphs. The subject at hand is the number of spaces after the end of one sentence and the first character of the next sentence, which you couldn't possibly have doubled up in your post because HTML doesn't work that way and slashdot doesn't allow you to use the nbsp entity. You just added an extra ENTER which is not a SPACE.
Thats okay, you'll get it right one day. We'll wait for you to catch up.
I think it is rather clear that his Emacs setup was broken, not the use of tabs.
I don't use emacs so I don't know if thats the default setup, but its most certainly a retarded setup for writing code.
So you just ignore the previously defined rules and accept the new, incorrect ones imposed by LaTeX?
Just because something generates it wrong doesn't make it a feature or the way it should be.
To go one step further, that very 'automatic' handling of spacing also needs to be overridden ... ALL THE TIME in common text so you really gain nothing, you have to specify what you want either way.
Now the additional, broken, rules that LaTeX imposes are causing more problems than they are fixing.
You may think this is a good thing, in my world, computers don't try to fix problems automatically for the user UNLESS they are certainly right, which LaTeX does not know enough about the english language rules to determine. That means its not a feature, its a flaw masquerading as a feature.
So, for 10 years, you've been doing it wrong.
Just because you have done it that way doesn't mean you're right, it just means you've been wrong longer.
You also think capitalizing all words of a title is the right thing as well I'm sure.
Lets go ahead and make this a full fledged argument for the dense.
If you are using spacing for column alignment your just ignorant.
Its not a matter of preference really, its a matter of ignorance.
Tabs can be 1 space or 20 or 4 or 8 or 2. Spaces can be spaces, there is no flexibility.
Using a space to indent is like using hard coded text when you should have used a define.
It shows a true lack of experience. I stand behind that statement, regardless of how many lines of 'kernel code' you've written.
As for sentences ... well ... just because the stupid fucks who made the first web browsers were illiterate doesn't mean its acceptable. 2 spaces between sentences to make it clear that its a new sentence and a new thought, far easier to read.
Of course, before you get down to the matter of 1 space or 2, you should probably conquer the problem of no one being able to write a coherent sentence or complete a thought without running on like this one.
The 1 or 2 space 'issue' will be far less of an issue when you learn how to write properly in general as it will become obvious as to why it exists.
You also end up with a lot fewer silly looking posts like this.
Thanks for telling us how you do it wrong.
Does it count as insurance fraud if he took out a life insurance policy with a special bonus payout for assassination/murder on himself knowing that the announcement would get him whacked?
Would I be a bad person if I got such a policy on him now? :/
I want to know whats in the insurance file, surely enough of us could get together and paypal up a hitman or something right? I haven't been on IRC for a while but I'm sure theres a channel on EFNet for hiring a hitman, hell probably even some bots that take credit cards by now.
Do you think he had a thought before announcing this or this sort of thing just comes naturally?
I wonder if he'll be able to leak the documents that tell us who hired the hitman before he gets knocked off?
Is there a pool for how long his life expectancy is now? I got 100 USD on 3 months.
Yes, you are both right, why the hell do you people keep acting like the two things are mutually exclusive?
Interestingly enough, there are even laws that make it specifically legal for people to do this sort of thing in a responsible manner! Its freaking CRAZY I know but true.
Of course you don't believe anything crap right wing Americans tell you ... you're too busy being ignorant of alternative view points because those view points are labeled 'right wing'.
Look, you're entitled to your opinions on things, we all are. You are free to disagree all day long with any group of people you want.
What you are doing is writing off an entire large part of the population because of a silly label that is a description of a small portion of extremists in the population.
You sir, are an ignorant political racist (tm). We'd all be better off if we could at least acknowledge that viewpoints that don't align perfectly with our own may not be utterly ludicrous. Just because you don't agree on everything doesn't mean they have nothing of value to offer. You do your self a disservice to be so smug.
It is possible that some things the 'left wingers' say are actually true and that some things the 'right wingers' say is actually true.
And its certain that both of them are liars.
Think for yourself, and not based on which team you picked on your voters card.
Wouldn't the proper response to the problem be something along the lines of:
Proper punishment for those who were guilty
AND
Not turning it into a frenzy/riot by sensationalizing it in the name of whistleblowing
The original post says 'they should keep their mouth shut so the public doesn't get hurt'
You respond with 'no, the public getting hurt is entirely okay because now we know and the original crime won't go unpunished.
Both are equally irrational statements.
You can actaully punish the criminals without sensationalizing it and causing the public undue harm.
The two things are NOT mutually exclusive. The logic isn't real hard here.
That soldier released far more than a video and some secret war documents. If thats all it were, then they would just be douche bags and nothing more. Both Wikileaks and 'that soildier' released information about current operations. Information that could actually be used to kill American soldiers, and natives, and other countries soldiers. 'The video' was spun SO HARD that my head almost twisted off reading the freaking subtitles added on to it.
Wikileaks and that soldier didn't release untainted information, they skewed the facts into something completely other than what happened in order to get hits to their website.
Anyone who actually has half a clue watched the video and saw the truth, and the truth had absolutely nothing to do with the people killed in the video or the pilots.
We have legal ways to get the information, AFTER its no longer going to get someone killed. We have LEGITIMATE WAYS TO GET OUR GOVERNMENT TO GIVE US INFORMATION, we really don't NEED some tool with not a clue about what he's seeing spewing it onto a population that also has no clue what they are looking at.
You clearly think the government (whichever one) is pure evil.
Most Americans on the other hand, as surprising as you may find this, aren't fanatical lunatics who realize that the government isn't perfect, but its also not pure evil and somethings happen for a reason, even if I as a particular individual don't understand them.
I don't blindly follow the government, but I also know when to let someone else do the job that I'm not experienced enough to do nor do I have the full picture.
You don't have half the picture apparently because you've spent too much time reading Wikileaks and not actual facts.
[Wikileaks] If you are doing nothing wrong, you have nothing to hide and this information won't hurt anyone, all information should be public information, except my personal information which shouldn't be because its mine and I'm special. You only don't want anyone to know because you're big and EVERYTHING you do is pure evil. You never have any valid reason to keep secrets, theres no reason what so ever, and secrets mean you are doing things that are evil!!!!@$!@$!@%@#^@#$^#$%&#$%&@#%! Its not like I spin it to make it worse than it actually worse, nor do I EVER lie about anything or change my story after getting caught.
[Goverment] No, its bad because not all information we have is about the evil things we never do, some of it is secret to protect people, like you, which is why we don't leak your personal information ourselves (except today, where will make an exception just to fuck you over Mr Assange since you're claiming we're going to do that anyway, lets get it out of the way). And we never do anything bad, so theres no reason you need to see the information anyway. We never lie or cheat or screw the people over either.
Translation: ITS NOT FUCKING BLACK AND WHITE. THERE IS ROOM FOR A PROPER, INTELLIGENT MIDDLE GROUND. BOTH ORGANIZATIONS RAN BY SELFISH MONEY GRABBING ATTENTION WHORING CUNTS WHO HAVE NO INTEREST IN ANYONE BUT YOURSELVES. YOU ARE BOTH CLEARLY BAD LIARS.
My Personal Opinion as if it wasn't obvious: Julian Assange is not anywhere near the right man for the job. Two polar opposites don't equal out to one middle ground. I'm going to side with the government because I DO have SOME control over it, where as I have none over a particular individual and when its this important, I'm going to want some control of some sort over it.
Please give me all your personal information, bank account numbers, credit card numbers and any other information I need to drain your bank accounts dry and order services as if I was you.
Post them as a reply to this and share them with all of slashdot if you have nothing to hide.
What? You do have something to hide and fear by letting the information out?
If you're going to use that battle cry you better have your information freely and publicly available or your nothing nor than an ignorant hypocrite.
You're comparing journalists to a guy who gets shit sent to him by other people and blindly dumps it on a website without even looking at it to a journalist he finds facts and verifies them and considers the consequences of their actions before making information public ...
Really? The newspapers are worried because some guy posts unverified raw dumps of data?
They already get this shit, they filter it and we don't see, sometimes we should see it but they think 'hey, maybe this will get someone hurt, lets not run it right now so those people don't get hurt!'
Yea, I'm sure mainstream media is worried about him ... just like they worry about gossip rags, which are more or less the same class of service.