Remember, this is Solaris 7, running on Intel hardware. We're not talking about the killer Sun Enterprise machines here, with 64 CPUs and a coupl'a terrabytes RAM. Solaris does actually run on Intel hardware, and interestingly enough, is less expensive than either NetWare or NT. In the process, it comes out smelling pretty good, even in a ZDNet benchmark.
Performance over Long Term
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NOS Crossroads
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· Score: 1
I'd like to see one of these benchmarks run for a MONTH. 10x penalty for time taken to reboot servers. We'd see how badly the memory leaks in the OS would degrade performance over time.
On the one end, we've got people trying to take out patents on technology that has already been around for years. On the other end, we've got patents about to expire on devices that haven't even been built yet.
One might get the idea that patents are becoming less and less applicable in this day and age...;-)
> Anything that removes the concepts of free will and human speciality destroys the basis of many religious and philosophical belief systems.
Why is it that every time people start talking about AI, you get a bunch of closet philosophers who proclaim that, "If we do create a truly Intellegent machine, it will invalidate all the world's religions." I just don't get the connection. How is it that the ability to create a machine so complex that it becomes aware of its own existance will suddenly change the fact that there is or isn't a God (or gods) and people's fundamental measures of right and wrong? I'd say that these people have a very narrow view of what religion is.
There will always be things in this universe that are beyond our comprehension, and as long as this is true, people will struggle to explain what cannot be explained. Some will turn to science and the ability to reduce everything to rules and formulas. Others will turn to religion and the belief that there is more to this universe than we can see and touch and measure. The existance of "thinking" machines will certainly complicate this search for Truth, but it will not make one side or the other go away.
> but would I use Linux for anything other than fun? Today, no. Tomorrow, maybe.
Hold on a minute before you jump on the "I'm not a Linux fanatic" bandwagon!
I agree with your, "no one-size-fits-all tools" statement, but I think you underestimate the power Linux has RIGHT NOW. There are a LOT of places where it fits in now - look at the latest Web survey. Linux isn't going to eat Microsoft's lunch this year, but it's gaining fast, both in market share and features.
You're right - don't sell Linux for something it ain't (yet), but then don't undersell it either.
I wish we'd see more of these, and not just from Australia! I don't know how many people I've seen suckered by these scams. Mostly they are relatively benign, like the "FORWARD THIS MESSAGE TO EVERYONE ON YOUR ADDRESS LIST AND GET $5,000 FROM DISNEY" scam I just saw the other day, or "Good Times Virus" warnings I'm still seeing five years later.
Somehow, people seem to implicitly trust anything they see on a computer. You have to smack them a couple of times before they seem to get the point - Think before you hit that [Send] button!!!
The article said they could use any publically available patches that existed on the date the second benchmark was run. This makes a lot of sense. It gives the Linux people an opportunity to tune the server, while at least maintaining SOME semblance of a "real world environment." In theory, anyone with some knowledge could use the same tricks to tune their server.
Give me a friggin' break! Why is it that, every time some governing body says, "You can't do that," hordes of people mess their pants and start running around in circles chanting, "First Amendment! First Amendment"?
Now, calm down, take a deep breath and try to engage one or two brain cells before you shoot off at the mouth. This is a Trademark issue. It has nothing to do with the content of your silly little Web page. You can still make fun of Company X, or say nasty things about them, you just can't use their Tradmark as your domain name!
I agree that the "similar" clause is troublesome (and it does seem like "too little, too late"), but it seems that trademark protection should extend to domain names. I sure wouldn't want to type in something like "www.disneyworld.net" and find myself on a site selling pornographic movies!
(OK, OK... so Disney should have the $$$ to buy up most of the names that contain the word "disney", but they can't get ALL the combinations, and there are a lot more companies that don't have as much cash to throw around.)
> If you choose to use DejaNews for anything, any information you provide to them is thiers. Accept it.
Yes, but there is a world of difference between the right to gather personal information on your users (obstensibly to serve them better), and selling that information to other people. I don't have any problem with DejaNews keeping a log of my activities, as long as they do not give this information out without my consent.
I'm not a lawyer, but I think that there is already legal precedent for ISPs being sued for giving out personal information on their subscribers.
Last I heard, the kids were all into Gothic Horror and Dungeons & Dragons:-/
Face it - Narrow minded people will seek out a scapegoat any time something like this happens. It's been this way since the beginning of time. It's because "THEY" were Black, or Mexican, or Athiests or Fundamentalists, or they played D&D, or they watched too many violent TV programs, or they spent all their time on the Internet. Narrow minded people long for simple explanations to complex problems. They want to reinforce the US vs. THEM - i.e., "We would NEVER do that, because we're DIFFERENT!"
Get used to it. People are frightened by change, and Lord knows the Internet represents change! They wouldn't have pointed fingers at the kids for spending all their time in the LIBRARY, because that's too familiar. But, if they live in chat rooms, or play games of imagination, then they are branded as misfits.
It ain't going to end any time soon unfortunately.
Filtering is a Bad Thing, But...
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ISP Sues Spammer
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· Score: 1
"Filtering" requirements currently under discussion are generally bogus, since they still put the burden on the ISP or end user (i.e., I still end up paying for SPAM even if I don't receive it), but...
...think what might happen if the cockroaches discover that 99.9999% of their 10 million addresses are getting bounced? The practice might quietly die on its own...
Unfortunately, labeling requirements are difficult to enforce, since a large portion of the problem is small time operators working out of their homes, using software they bought for $39.95. Who's going to track down all those people?
SPAM is different from snail mail. With the Post Office, you pay for each item delivered. It may be a small amount, but it adds up. With the SPAM, it is the carrier (i.e., the ISP), and ultimately the end user who pays for the bandwidth. This is why junkmail FAXING is illegal. This is why SPAM should be illegal.
> The beauty of Linux is all you need is a 386 to run it,
Yes and no. You can run it on a 386, bit don't even think about running X11 on less than a P75. On the other hand, the support for old hardware is pretty good, especially with some of the newer installation packages (RH and such). If you have an old system that is already running under Windows, you shouldn't have any trouble setting up Linux on it.
My mother taught me to use my first computer...;-)
Seriously, my mother has her masters in chemestry and was a 7th and 8th grade teacher for about 18 years before she retired about three years ago. She had a computer someone donated to the school (an old SYKES running BASIC) back in the early 70's that I sometimes wrote programs for. My father was a programmer when computers were built from discrete transformers wirewrapped to boards.
Both of them love to hear me talk about what I'm working on. They have fallen a little behind on technology (they are retired, and sort of enjoy not having to worry about all those things now), but they know what I'm talking about.
Don't discount people just because they are in the "older" generation!
If you want to help, then PLEASE check out the Linux Documentation Project. There is a lot of documentation already being written, and some of it is excellent. The last thing we need is to have a lot of people spending time on duplicated effort.
Until then, would somebody tell those idiots that there aren't that man all-Microsoft IT shops in the world.
Two things:
Yes, there are plenty of MS-only shops, or shops that are "close enough" to be primarily worried about serving MS clients (NT/Win9x). I think it's fair to benchmark "Server X with NT/Win9x Clients."
Second, it's already been shown that Linux/Samba is still faster than NT, even in an otherwise MS centric shop, mixed in with other NT servers.
I suspect that they've crippled the Linux server somehow (disabled SMP in the kernel or used a Really Old version), or carefully selected benchmarks that rely on features NT is better at. I've seen plenty of tests (done some myself) where two systems perform very differently depending on the nature of the benchmark.
Now here's an intuitively obvious xterm trick. Use the [Ctrl][middle-btn] (or simultaneous [btn1][btn2] for those with a 2 button mouse) to give you the xterm controls popup! Use this to select the scrollbar. Of course, you can also specify it on the command line when you start the xterm (+sb).
(I don't know how many years I'd been using X11 before someone showed me that one.)
BY THE WAY, I'm not sure of the original author's intent, but he may have been speaking of more than just text cut-n-paste. Unix has been able to do this with text for years, but cutting and pasting formatting, images, diagrams and other sorts of data is more recent. I remember when Motif first implemented drag-n-drop. Can I drag an icon for an image file into a word processor and have it integrate the image into the document I'm working on? Maybe yes. Maybe no.
> All the stuff comparing the OSes to women was just plain stupid. It didn't serve to make any point...
Oh come on! I'm pretty conservative, and I could have done without the JPG files, but I think he used a perfect metaphor! Haven't you ever heard a Mac user (Or for that matter, a die-hard Linux user) talking about his computer? You'd think they have sex with the thing by the way they gush over its features. It's as bad as religion (and I'm religious too). When you've spent that much time fighting for the existence of your OS against the onslaught of the Evil Empire, when you know you can serve the user better, only to have the limelight stolen by someone else...
Well, he might have come up with some other metaphor, but not one with the same level of resonance as the julted girlfriend.
The fact that it advertises pornography sites is peculiar. A much more effective virus would advertise "Make Money Fast."
Are you kidding??? Porno sites are HUGE money makers. Just like drug dealers, they offer you a couple "free" tidbits, and then sucker you in for a paying subscription. The way they proliferate (and send out their SPAM teasers), they've got to be making money hand over fist.
You know, after all the time we've spent complaining about media types repeating the tired old mantra about how, "Linux is hard to set up and use," perhaps we should thank them. After all, Linux is not like Win9x, where you're supposed to plug it in and start playing. Perhaps we should turn that around to, "Linux can be used by anyone, as long as they are willing to spend some time learning." However, we have to be careful not to become software bigots
We are turning a corner in the growth of Linux. If we want to break out of the "hackers only" market, then we must break out of the "hackers only" mindset. Just because some user wants their computer to work like a toaster, is that a Bad Thing? Remember, Linux is about choice. I like to build my hardware from scratch just because I want to know everything that's inside my box. I enjoy tinkering. The next person just wants to go down to CompUSA and buy a sealed box, stick her Linux boot floppy in and install the OS. Am I a "better engineer" than she is? Is it any different to want plig-n-play hardware than it is to want plug-n-play software?
We have spent a lot of time enjoying our nice little exclusive Linux Hackers club. We've put our blood, sweat and tears into building Linux into a viable alternative to the Evil Empire, and now that effort is coming to fruition. However, change brings... uh... a lot of changes.
Be careful what you ask for. You just might get it...
Except, of course, that the Linux kenel and almost all applications and utilities--everything from gzip to bash to KDE--are compiled with gcc or egcs
Uh... gcc is just a "C" compiler, albeit a very good one. However, you could use some other x86 based compiler (go out and buy a commercial one) and build the kernel. Heck! I was compiling "C" programs long before RMS came up with gcc. They just weren't "free".
Having said that, while it is possible to create a non-GNU Linux kernel, it'd be a pretty lame system without any of the other FSF tools!
Does anyone else get the feeling that this whole DOJ thing is an exercise in futility? I seriously doubt that the DOJ will be able to find a "solution" that properly fixes the Microsoft situation. (Sort of like trying to perform brain surgery with a baseball bat.) I'm not with those who feel there shouldn't be any government controls over businesses, but in this case, I don't think the DOJ (or the States) has a clue how to fix the situation in a way that is fair to all parties, but still puts an end to whatever illegal practices MS is engaging in.
Wake up and smell the coffee. Microsoft's days of complete control of the industry are numbered. They can't beat Linux into submission like they did with OS/2 or the original Mac - there isn't any company there to crush or buy out. People KNOW now that Windows is a piece of trash, and there are alternatives. Microsoft isn't about to go the way of the dinosaur, but there is enough of a hole in it's armor that other players will start to inflict damage. Unix is long from dead. Apple is making slow headway. Linux is making it's way into the server market, and as applications continue to roll out, it will continue to build strength on the desktop.
Microsoft has played dirty for too long, and people resent it. Fires are popping up left and right now, and Bill can't put all of them out at the same time any more.
The point is not that all of these things can't already be done, but that there are so many different ways to accomplish it. ("The wonderful thing about standards is...") Of course, the article doesn't give any real information about the IPP standard, but I'm assuming that the intent is to make this functionality available on many different OS platforms, interfaced with many different applications, tied into many different kinds of printers, and do them all in the same way.
(Is anyone else amused by the statement that, "the bottleneck at this point is Microsoft"?;-)
Slashdot Mirror
Remember, this is Solaris 7, running on Intel hardware. We're not talking about the killer Sun Enterprise machines here, with 64 CPUs and a coupl'a terrabytes RAM. Solaris does actually run on Intel hardware, and interestingly enough, is less expensive than either NetWare or NT. In the process, it comes out smelling pretty good, even in a ZDNet benchmark.
I'd like to see one of these benchmarks run for a MONTH. 10x penalty for time taken to reboot servers. We'd see how badly the memory leaks in the OS would degrade performance over time.
One might get the idea that patents are becoming less and less applicable in this day and age... ;-)
Why is it that every time people start talking about AI, you get a bunch of closet philosophers who proclaim that, "If we do create a truly Intellegent machine, it will invalidate all the world's religions." I just don't get the connection. How is it that the ability to create a machine so complex that it becomes aware of its own existance will suddenly change the fact that there is or isn't a God (or gods) and people's fundamental measures of right and wrong? I'd say that these people have a very narrow view of what religion is.
There will always be things in this universe that are beyond our comprehension, and as long as this is true, people will struggle to explain what cannot be explained. Some will turn to science and the ability to reduce everything to rules and formulas. Others will turn to religion and the belief that there is more to this universe than we can see and touch and measure. The existance of "thinking" machines will certainly complicate this search for Truth, but it will not make one side or the other go away.
Hold on a minute before you jump on the "I'm not a Linux fanatic" bandwagon!
I agree with your, "no one-size-fits-all tools" statement, but I think you underestimate the power Linux has RIGHT NOW. There are a LOT of places where it fits in now - look at the latest Web survey. Linux isn't going to eat Microsoft's lunch this year, but it's gaining fast, both in market share and features.
You're right - don't sell Linux for something it ain't (yet), but then don't undersell it either.
Somehow, people seem to implicitly trust anything they see on a computer. You have to smack them a couple of times before they seem to get the point - Think before you hit that [Send] button!!!
"Gentlemen.. START YOUR ENGINES!"
Now, calm down, take a deep breath and try to engage one or two brain cells before you shoot off at the mouth. This is a Trademark issue. It has nothing to do with the content of your silly little Web page. You can still make fun of Company X, or say nasty things about them, you just can't use their Tradmark as your domain name!
(OK, OK... so Disney should have the $$$ to buy up most of the names that contain the word "disney", but they can't get ALL the combinations, and there are a lot more companies that don't have as much cash to throw around.)
Yes, but there is a world of difference between the right to gather personal information on your users (obstensibly to serve them better), and selling that information to other people. I don't have any problem with DejaNews keeping a log of my activities, as long as they do not give this information out without my consent.
I'm not a lawyer, but I think that there is already legal precedent for ISPs being sued for giving out personal information on their subscribers.
Face it - Narrow minded people will seek out a scapegoat any time something like this happens. It's been this way since the beginning of time. It's because "THEY" were Black, or Mexican, or Athiests or Fundamentalists, or they played D&D, or they watched too many violent TV programs, or they spent all their time on the Internet. Narrow minded people long for simple explanations to complex problems. They want to reinforce the US vs. THEM - i.e., "We would NEVER do that, because we're DIFFERENT!"
Get used to it. People are frightened by change, and Lord knows the Internet represents change! They wouldn't have pointed fingers at the kids for spending all their time in the LIBRARY, because that's too familiar. But, if they live in chat rooms, or play games of imagination, then they are branded as misfits.
It ain't going to end any time soon unfortunately.
Unfortunately, labeling requirements are difficult to enforce, since a large portion of the problem is small time operators working out of their homes, using software they bought for $39.95. Who's going to track down all those people?
See the CAUCE home page
Yes and no. You can run it on a 386, bit don't even think about running X11 on less than a P75. On the other hand, the support for old hardware is pretty good, especially with some of the newer installation packages (RH and such). If you have an old system that is already running under Windows, you shouldn't have any trouble setting up Linux on it.
Seriously, my mother has her masters in chemestry and was a 7th and 8th grade teacher for about 18 years before she retired about three years ago. She had a computer someone donated to the school (an old SYKES running BASIC) back in the early 70's that I sometimes wrote programs for. My father was a programmer when computers were built from discrete transformers wirewrapped to boards.
Both of them love to hear me talk about what I'm working on. They have fallen a little behind on technology (they are retired, and sort of enjoy not having to worry about all those things now), but they know what I'm talking about.
Don't discount people just because they are in the "older" generation!
If you want to help, then PLEASE check out the Linux Documentation Project. There is a lot of documentation already being written, and some of it is excellent. The last thing we need is to have a lot of people spending time on duplicated effort.
Two things:
- Yes, there are plenty of MS-only shops, or shops that are "close enough" to be primarily worried about serving MS clients (NT/Win9x). I think it's fair to benchmark "Server X with NT/Win9x Clients."
- Second, it's already been shown that Linux/Samba is still faster than NT, even in an otherwise MS centric shop, mixed in with other NT servers.
I suspect that they've crippled the Linux server somehow (disabled SMP in the kernel or used a Really Old version), or carefully selected benchmarks that rely on features NT is better at. I've seen plenty of tests (done some myself) where two systems perform very differently depending on the nature of the benchmark.Not sure if this is what you're looking for, but try the Linux Chiq.
(I don't know how many years I'd been using X11 before someone showed me that one.)
BY THE WAY, I'm not sure of the original author's intent, but he may have been speaking of more than just text cut-n-paste. Unix has been able to do this with text for years, but cutting and pasting formatting, images, diagrams and other sorts of data is more recent. I remember when Motif first implemented drag-n-drop. Can I drag an icon for an image file into a word processor and have it integrate the image into the document I'm working on? Maybe yes. Maybe no.
Oh come on! I'm pretty conservative, and I could have done without the JPG files, but I think he used a perfect metaphor! Haven't you ever heard a Mac user (Or for that matter, a die-hard Linux user) talking about his computer? You'd think they have sex with the thing by the way they gush over its features. It's as bad as religion (and I'm religious too). When you've spent that much time fighting for the existence of your OS against the onslaught of the Evil Empire, when you know you can serve the user better, only to have the limelight stolen by someone else...
Well, he might have come up with some other metaphor, but not one with the same level of resonance as the julted girlfriend.
Are you kidding??? Porno sites are HUGE money makers. Just like drug dealers, they offer you a couple "free" tidbits, and then sucker you in for a paying subscription. The way they proliferate (and send out their SPAM teasers), they've got to be making money hand over fist.
We are turning a corner in the growth of Linux. If we want to break out of the "hackers only" market, then we must break out of the "hackers only" mindset. Just because some user wants their computer to work like a toaster, is that a Bad Thing? Remember, Linux is about choice. I like to build my hardware from scratch just because I want to know everything that's inside my box. I enjoy tinkering. The next person just wants to go down to CompUSA and buy a sealed box, stick her Linux boot floppy in and install the OS. Am I a "better engineer" than she is? Is it any different to want plig-n-play hardware than it is to want plug-n-play software?
We have spent a lot of time enjoying our nice little exclusive Linux Hackers club. We've put our blood, sweat and tears into building Linux into a viable alternative to the Evil Empire, and now that effort is coming to fruition. However, change brings... uh... a lot of changes.
Be careful what you ask for. You just might get it...
Uh... gcc is just a "C" compiler, albeit a very good one. However, you could use some other x86 based compiler (go out and buy a commercial one) and build the kernel. Heck! I was compiling "C" programs long before RMS came up with gcc. They just weren't "free".
Having said that, while it is possible to create a non-GNU Linux kernel, it'd be a pretty lame system without any of the other FSF tools!
Wake up and smell the coffee. Microsoft's days of complete control of the industry are numbered. They can't beat Linux into submission like they did with OS/2 or the original Mac - there isn't any company there to crush or buy out. People KNOW now that Windows is a piece of trash, and there are alternatives. Microsoft isn't about to go the way of the dinosaur, but there is enough of a hole in it's armor that other players will start to inflict damage. Unix is long from dead. Apple is making slow headway. Linux is making it's way into the server market, and as applications continue to roll out, it will continue to build strength on the desktop.
Microsoft has played dirty for too long, and people resent it. Fires are popping up left and right now, and Bill can't put all of them out at the same time any more.
(Is anyone else amused by the statement that, "the bottleneck at this point is Microsoft"? ;-)