"3-4 Cannabis cigarettes a day are associated with the same evidence of acute and chronic bronchitis and the same degree of damage to the bronchial mucosa as 20 or more tobacco cigarettes a day."
"No drug is always safe for everybody, but after 150 years of scientific study, the only proven health problem from cannabis is that its smoke can be linked to bronchitis"
""The most compelling concerns regarding marijuana smoking in HIV/AIDS patients are the possible effects of marijuana on immunity."
Actually cannabis has been shown to be helpful:
"The effectiveness of cannabis for treating symptoms related to HIV/AIDS is widely recognized."
Because the burden of proof is on those that believe that it's harmless rather than those that don't believe it to be safe. Which is just the way that it should be.
Ever hear of innocent before proven guilty? Hundreds of years of use has shown hemp to be safe but nothing has proven it to be harmful. If you have any evidence I'm wrong please provide it. Because I asked you to provide and I made a statement that it was used safety for hundreds of years, I've provide my own evidence. In the 1930s when congress was "debating", "debating" because it wasn't a real debate, the Marijuana Tax Act of 1937 Dr. James Woodward testified before congress on behalf of the AMA that hemp was used safely for hundreds of years.
Plus there's the part where pot smokers are willing to lie cheat and basically make up evidence to justify things like medicinal marijuana.
That's because it's illegal, not because it's dangerous.
Because it's a drug and then you become a junkie and kill people.
And I'd really like that reason to be just a joke.
Unfortunately not only is it not a joke, it's actually a lie. Marijuana does not make people violent despite what "Reefer Madness" depicts. Instead it makes users tranquil.
Actually yes, I believe opium should be legal, actual it used to be a legal drug. As was cocaine, ever hear of Coca-Cola? It used to have cocaine in it. As long as a person isn't harming anyone else they should be able to do whatever they want. What should be illegal is the harm. That applies to all drugs and not just street drugs but prescription drugs as well. And prostitution, and... even suicide. If I tried it though I'm be committed and locked up.
Not that I would, while I wish I had died, it has not gotten so bad I would commit hari kari or sepaku. Though I no longer do I used to believe in reincarnation. When I think about suicide I also think about that. Then I'll think that if reincarnation is true then I'd have to come back and go through it all over again. Some of the doctors and therapists I saw also said I must be stubborn, otherwise I would not have survived.
Huh? I'm sorry to hear about that and I'm glad that you came out alright.
I didn't come out alright, as I said I wish I had died.
You quoted my statement on addiction, which was a rebuttal to your statement that pot is not addictive
Maybe you confused me with someone else, can you point out where I made a comment about addiction? While I did include your statement I did not make a comment about addiction. What I did say was that not one person died from smoking marijuana then pointed out that people died from transportation accidents and drowning tubs. But I noticed you didn't provide any evidence anyone has died from smoking marijuana.
One reason could be commercial influence on the AMA
Actually the AMA opposed criminalization of hemp AKA marijuana:
"Dr. James Woodward testified before congress on behalf of the AMA when they "debated", it wasn't a real debate, the Marijuana Tax ACT of 1937 which made marijuana illegal. This is what he said, "there is no evidence that marijuana is a dangerous drug". He called federal testimony "tabloid sensationalism" and said hemp had been used more than 100 years as a drug by doctors safely. What was his and the AMA's reward? They were ridiculed.
It's the degree of danger that is the major factor here. That can be discussed, but saying that those aren't valid reasons, I feel, is a poor argument.
Those arguments may be valid for you but for many others of us they are not valid reasons.
Also, studies have indicated similar withdrawal symptoms from regular pot smokers as those seen from nicotine addiction.
So!? While not one person has died from smoking marijuana, I dare to find one person that has, 1000s die riding bikes and almost 50,000 people died in transportation accidents in 2000 alone. I almost became one of those to die when I was hit while riding my bike, and I wish I had. While in a coma the docs told my family it would be a miracle if I lived. I'd argue that with those docs, my life since then has been a living hell. Should transportation be illegal? According to the chart linked to, 341 people died drowning in bathtubs in 2000, should bathtubs be illegal?
If you think these questions are ridiculous, I think they are less ridiculous than making victim less crime laws.
Cannabis/Marijuana is carcinogenic, and about four times as carcinogenic as tobacco.
Where's your data backing up your statement? I'll make my own statement and provide a link to back it up: "Marijuana Does Not Raise Lung Cancer Risk". It's actually not my statement but the title on an article.
Drug testing very much has to do with legality. Drug testing only got started when Reagan started pushing for drug testing as part of his War on Drugs.
the world would be a far better place if the roles of pot and booze were reversed (that pot was legal and booze was not). having experienced both enough to know this subject quite well, I stand firmly on my statements. if you don't have any experience in this (first-hand) then you should LISTEN to those that do have direct experience.
I have experience with both too. I was also born in the Land of the Free and believe there should be no victimless crimes. Neither drinking or smoking should be illegal. What should be, and is in some cases, is the consequences of drinking or smoking. You cause an accident drunk or stoned and you pay, same with any other harm.
Marijuana possession over 1 ounce should be illegal, however the government should sell weed it seizes. Make selling it illegal. People will still continue to produce it, but the government will reap the profits.
BS, the US is supposed to be the land of the free not the Soviet Union. Marijuana should be legalized again.
I'm of the opinion that all driving while intoxicated laws are inappropriate. Either you're driving recklessly or not. If you are, go to jail. If not, go home and sleep it off.
Really! Sometimes the indication that someone is driving recklessly is when they plow into the side of a car, killing and maiming the occupants.
I was hit by one of those reckless drivers, though he wasn't drunk, high, or stoned. I was hit and spent days in a coma because a diabetic did not take care of himself. That was more than 10 years ago and my life has been a living hell since.
That's something I don't hear talked about much--the health affects caused by smoking pot, as in smoke and tars being sucked into the lungs. I'm assuming it's as bad as tobacco?
Actually marijuana isn't as bad cancer wise as tobacco. Marijuana Does Not Raise Lung Cancer Risk. It may be worse for other things, but as the story the thread links to says, it also provides some benefits.
I'm not following your logic. Tobacco and alcohol seem to be getting taxed just fine, and marijuana isn't any easier to process than either of them.
What you believe is wrong. I can brew beer without paying any tax. Legally I can make 100 gallons without being required to pay. However nobody will even know how much I do make unless I tell them. And growing marijuana is easier than brewing.
Allow someone to grow, say, three plants at home and make it a $1,000 penalty. More than three and it's a felony. It would divert lots of money away from the black market (with some going to Home depot). The mexican cartels would take a serious hit as would all grow-ops.
Even better would be to just relegalize marijuana and get repeal the Marijuana Tax Act of 1937. Allow people to legally grow, own, and possess any amount of hemp. Making hemp illegal was the opposite of what Thomas Jefferson thought of, he proposed requiring all farmers to grow hemp.
By the way, Dutch Governemental research has shown drivers to be LESS likely to cause accidents or break speeding laws while stoned, compared to sober or drunk drivers.
That's because despite the false info spread by drug warriors, marijuana dies not make users hyperactive. Or violent, instead users become more careful, and lain back. I read a study years ago that said that's why the old Soviet Union outlawed hemp, the military couldn't afford it's personnel wanting to kick back and relax and not willing to fight.
Ever tried living for one month eating only stuff you've grown at your home?
When I lived in Florida I was able to grow enough in my mom's back yard to eat from late spring to fall. And by canning, dehydrating, and using other methods of preserving food I could grow almost all of the food I needed for a year. As I live in a major city a few hundred miles south of Canada I can't do that now however last year I was able to grow enough food for a few months.
That didn't refute anything I said. It's legal to make at home, it's legal to be sold in stores, and it's taxed.
Homebrew is only taxed if more than 100 gallons is removed from a single adult residence or 200 gallons if 2 or more live in the residence. I live alone and can make 100 gallons of beer and wine a year without having to pay a tax. Personally I couldn't, wouldn't want to, drink that much myself unless I distilled it. On the other hand, maybe I could brew a lot and sell cases of it to others. In that case I should pay taxes. I've been thinking about doing something like that, but instead of selling the beer use it to trade for other things. Of course, legally I'd still have to pay taxes.
Reading the title you probably know but most people do not know that the word "canvas" as painters used it came from hemp, cannabis. Rembrandt, Van Gogh, and other painters painted on hemp canvas.
the first and third presidents of the USA, George Washington and Thomas Jefferson grew hemp on their farms. The second president John Adams wanted to use hemp as a cash crop.
Yeah but they weren't smoking it. Marijuana generally refers to dope not rope
When hemp was outlawed drug warriors called it marijuana to confuse people. In testimony before congress Dr. James Woodward speaking for the AMA said the AMA did not know that the "killer weed from Mexico" that was called marijuana was hemp. The AMA only learned what was being talked about was in fact hemp 2 days before the hearing. He further stated "We cannot understand yet, Mr Chairman, why this bill had been prepared in secret for two years without any intimation, even to the profession" that it was being prepared.
Slashdot Mirror
http://medicalmarijuana.procon.org/viewresource.asp?resourceID=141
You included the cons from a Pros and Cons page but did not include the pros. However I'll address some of those cons.
"Smoked marijuana damages the brain, heart, lungs, and immune system."
"Heavy Marijuana Use Doesn't Damage Brain"
"Does marijuana damage the heart?"
"Marijuana is More Damaging to the Lungs Than Tobacco"
"4. Marijuana suppresses the immune system"
"3-4 Cannabis cigarettes a day are associated with the same evidence of acute and chronic bronchitis and the same degree of damage to the bronchial mucosa as 20 or more tobacco cigarettes a day."
"No drug is always safe for everybody, but after 150 years of scientific study, the only proven health problem from cannabis is that its smoke can be linked to bronchitis"
""The most compelling concerns regarding marijuana smoking in HIV/AIDS patients are the possible effects of marijuana on immunity."
Actually cannabis has been shown to be helpful:
"The effectiveness of cannabis for treating symptoms related to HIV/AIDS is widely recognized."
Falcon
It keeps an awful lot of cops in business.
It also keeps prices high for traffickers and sellers.
Neither of those parties want to see it legalized. Only the users with no sales interests do.
While the part about organized crime is true there are law enforcement officers who want to legalize marijuana:
Falcon
Because the burden of proof is on those that believe that it's harmless rather than those that don't believe it to be safe. Which is just the way that it should be.
Ever hear of innocent before proven guilty? Hundreds of years of use has shown hemp to be safe but nothing has proven it to be harmful. If you have any evidence I'm wrong please provide it. Because I asked you to provide and I made a statement that it was used safety for hundreds of years, I've provide my own evidence. In the 1930s when congress was "debating", "debating" because it wasn't a real debate, the Marijuana Tax Act of 1937 Dr. James Woodward testified before congress on behalf of the AMA that hemp was used safely for hundreds of years.
Plus there's the part where pot smokers are willing to lie cheat and basically make up evidence to justify things like medicinal marijuana.
That's because it's illegal, not because it's dangerous.
Falcon
marijuana is still illegal.
Because it's a drug and then you become a junkie and kill people.
And I'd really like that reason to be just a joke.
Unfortunately not only is it not a joke, it's actually a lie. Marijuana does not make people violent despite what "Reefer Madness" depicts. Instead it makes users tranquil.
Falcon
So you feel that Opium should be legalized?
Actually yes, I believe opium should be legal, actual it used to be a legal drug. As was cocaine, ever hear of Coca-Cola? It used to have cocaine in it. As long as a person isn't harming anyone else they should be able to do whatever they want. What should be illegal is the harm. That applies to all drugs and not just street drugs but prescription drugs as well. And prostitution, and ... even suicide. If I tried it though I'm be committed and locked up.
Not that I would, while I wish I had died, it has not gotten so bad I would commit hari kari or sepaku. Though I no longer do I used to believe in reincarnation. When I think about suicide I also think about that. Then I'll think that if reincarnation is true then I'd have to come back and go through it all over again. Some of the doctors and therapists I saw also said I must be stubborn, otherwise I would not have survived.
Huh? I'm sorry to hear about that and I'm glad that you came out alright.
I didn't come out alright, as I said I wish I had died.
You quoted my statement on addiction, which was a rebuttal to your statement that pot is not addictive
Maybe you confused me with someone else, can you point out where I made a comment about addiction? While I did include your statement I did not make a comment about addiction. What I did say was that not one person died from smoking marijuana then pointed out that people died from transportation accidents and drowning tubs. But I noticed you didn't provide any evidence anyone has died from smoking marijuana.
Falcon
One reason could be commercial influence on the AMA
Actually the AMA opposed criminalization of hemp AKA marijuana:
"Dr. James Woodward testified before congress on behalf of the AMA when they "debated", it wasn't a real debate, the Marijuana Tax ACT of 1937 which made marijuana illegal. This is what he said, "there is no evidence that marijuana is a dangerous drug". He called federal testimony "tabloid sensationalism" and said hemp had been used more than 100 years as a drug by doctors safely. What was his and the AMA's reward? They were ridiculed.
Falcon
Here's one: law enforcement officers want as many things as possible to be illegal, to protect their job security, so they lobby hard.
Actually that's not a rational reason, there are many law enforcement officers who want to legalize marijuana, such as:
And that's only a few exmples.
Falcon
It's the degree of danger that is the major factor here. That can be discussed, but saying that those aren't valid reasons, I feel, is a poor argument.
Those arguments may be valid for you but for many others of us they are not valid reasons.
Also, studies have indicated similar withdrawal symptoms from regular pot smokers as those seen from nicotine addiction.
So!? While not one person has died from smoking marijuana, I dare to find one person that has, 1000s die riding bikes and almost 50,000 people died in transportation accidents in 2000 alone. I almost became one of those to die when I was hit while riding my bike, and I wish I had. While in a coma the docs told my family it would be a miracle if I lived. I'd argue that with those docs, my life since then has been a living hell. Should transportation be illegal? According to the chart linked to, 341 people died drowning in bathtubs in 2000, should bathtubs be illegal?
If you think these questions are ridiculous, I think they are less ridiculous than making victim less crime laws.
Falcon
If you want it to be legal any evidence for keeping it illegal you will toss aside as irrelevant or minor.
And what is this evidence?
Why is it illegal. Because it is a mind altering drug, which can easily be abused
Water can be abused, is it illegal? There are also mind altering things that are legal. Besides why should mind alterers be illegal?
Just because something can be abused does not mean it should be illegal.
As for Tobacco, and Alcohol
Yea, they tried making alcohol illegal. It was called Prohibition and not only did it fail it also made organized crime powerful.
We are slowing making Tobacco more and more illegal, as well trying to moderate Alcohol consumptions
Yea, I went to sleep in the Land of the Free and woke up in the Soviet Union, except even they didn't make drinking or smoking tobacco illegal.
Thomas Jefferson who farmed hemp should be rolling in his grave. As should John Adams and other Founding Fathers of the USA.
Falcon
Cannabis/Marijuana is carcinogenic, and about four times as carcinogenic as tobacco.
Where's your data backing up your statement? I'll make my own statement and provide a link to back it up: "Marijuana Does Not Raise Lung Cancer Risk". It's actually not my statement but the title on an article.
Falcon
Drug testing very much has to do with legality. Drug testing only got started when Reagan started pushing for drug testing as part of his War on Drugs.
Falcon
the world would be a far better place if the roles of pot and booze were reversed (that pot was legal and booze was not). having experienced both enough to know this subject quite well, I stand firmly on my statements. if you don't have any experience in this (first-hand) then you should LISTEN to those that do have direct experience.
I have experience with both too. I was also born in the Land of the Free and believe there should be no victimless crimes. Neither drinking or smoking should be illegal. What should be, and is in some cases, is the consequences of drinking or smoking. You cause an accident drunk or stoned and you pay, same with any other harm.
Falcon
That's a good book everyone on this thread should read. I've pulled out my 1985 paperback edition about 5 tymes to reply to a post on this thread.
Falcon
Marijuana possession over 1 ounce should be illegal, however the government should sell weed it seizes. Make selling it illegal. People will still continue to produce it, but the government will reap the profits.
BS, the US is supposed to be the land of the free not the Soviet Union. Marijuana should be legalized again.
Falcon
I'm of the opinion that all driving while intoxicated laws are inappropriate. Either you're driving recklessly or not. If you are, go to jail. If not, go home and sleep it off.
Really! Sometimes the indication that someone is driving recklessly is when they plow into the side of a car, killing and maiming the occupants.
I was hit by one of those reckless drivers, though he wasn't drunk, high, or stoned. I was hit and spent days in a coma because a diabetic did not take care of himself. That was more than 10 years ago and my life has been a living hell since.
Falcon
Eating a lot of things that are legal aren't healthy either, do you propose to make them illegal as well?
Falcon
That's something I don't hear talked about much--the health affects caused by smoking pot, as in smoke and tars being sucked into the lungs. I'm assuming it's as bad as tobacco?
Actually marijuana isn't as bad cancer wise as tobacco. Marijuana Does Not Raise Lung Cancer Risk. It may be worse for other things, but as the story the thread links to says, it also provides some benefits.
Falcon
Um... It's equally hard to tax something smuggled in/grown and sold illegally.
Repeal the Marijuana Tax Act of 1937, which made hemp AKA marijuana illegal. Then allow farmers to grow hemp just as Thomas Jefferson did.
Falcon
I'm not following your logic. Tobacco and alcohol seem to be getting taxed just fine, and marijuana isn't any easier to process than either of them.
What you believe is wrong. I can brew beer without paying any tax. Legally I can make 100 gallons without being required to pay. However nobody will even know how much I do make unless I tell them. And growing marijuana is easier than brewing.
Falcon
Allow someone to grow, say, three plants at home and make it a $1,000 penalty. More than three and it's a felony. It would divert lots of money away from the black market (with some going to Home depot). The mexican cartels would take a serious hit as would all grow-ops.
Even better would be to just relegalize marijuana and get repeal the Marijuana Tax Act of 1937. Allow people to legally grow, own, and possess any amount of hemp. Making hemp illegal was the opposite of what Thomas Jefferson thought of, he proposed requiring all farmers to grow hemp.
Falcon
By the way, Dutch Governemental research has shown drivers to be LESS likely to cause accidents or break speeding laws while stoned, compared to sober or drunk drivers.
That's because despite the false info spread by drug warriors, marijuana dies not make users hyperactive. Or violent, instead users become more careful, and lain back. I read a study years ago that said that's why the old Soviet Union outlawed hemp, the military couldn't afford it's personnel wanting to kick back and relax and not willing to fight.
Falcon
Ever tried living for one month eating only stuff you've grown at your home?
When I lived in Florida I was able to grow enough in my mom's back yard to eat from late spring to fall. And by canning, dehydrating, and using other methods of preserving food I could grow almost all of the food I needed for a year. As I live in a major city a few hundred miles south of Canada I can't do that now however last year I was able to grow enough food for a few months.
Falcon
That didn't refute anything I said. It's legal to make at home, it's legal to be sold in stores, and it's taxed.
Homebrew is only taxed if more than 100 gallons is removed from a single adult residence or 200 gallons if 2 or more live in the residence. I live alone and can make 100 gallons of beer and wine a year without having to pay a tax. Personally I couldn't, wouldn't want to, drink that much myself unless I distilled it. On the other hand, maybe I could brew a lot and sell cases of it to others. In that case I should pay taxes. I've been thinking about doing something like that, but instead of selling the beer use it to trade for other things. Of course, legally I'd still have to pay taxes.
Falcon
Reading the title you probably know but most people do not know that the word "canvas" as painters used it came from hemp, cannabis. Rembrandt, Van Gogh, and other painters painted on hemp canvas.
Falcon
the first and third presidents of the USA, George Washington and Thomas Jefferson grew hemp on their farms. The second president John Adams wanted to use hemp as a cash crop.
Yeah but they weren't smoking it. Marijuana generally refers to dope not rope
When hemp was outlawed drug warriors called it marijuana to confuse people. In testimony before congress Dr. James Woodward speaking for the AMA said the AMA did not know that the "killer weed from Mexico" that was called marijuana was hemp. The AMA only learned what was being talked about was in fact hemp 2 days before the hearing. He further stated "We cannot understand yet, Mr Chairman, why this bill had been prepared in secret for two years without any intimation, even to the profession" that it was being prepared.
Falcon