So, if I accuse you of drug possession, but don't have any proof, I can argue that you simply hid the stash somewhere and prosecute you without evidence?
I believe that his views are quite insightful and maybe even correct. OSS zealotry might work for you and me, however, most people see their computer as a tool, not as a statement of ideology. Hardware and software vendors make their products to carter to most people. If OSS doesn't become a little more flexible to appeal to the masses it will never outgrow its niche market.
What I would like to see is Opera support in ASP.NET's Atlas (MS Ajax library). Although I have to admit that IE, Firefox and Safari support is a great accomplishment by itself.
I actually saw a demo of this on the discovery channel. The dolphins don't tag unauthorized swimmers. They tag whoever is in the water. And by identifying they mean pushing the nose to the swimmer's leg and a metal clamp will... clamp them.
The dolphins were also very capable of detecting and identifying underwater mines.
It was beyond impressive. Made me want to play Red Alert for a couple of hours.:-)
[sarcasm]Using Linux in universities is be great for graphic design courses that use Photoshop and for engineering graphic labs that use AutoCad.[/sarcasm]
A lot of college courses cannot be taught using Linux computers. And if I have to pay for a college education I would like to be taught how to use the software that is used in the workforce.
Linux is a great operating system. However, an operating system is only as useful as the software that it can run.
Would you care to enlighten me as of why is.NET a "not even that great of a VM"?
C# is Java with the power of hindsight. Java is Smalltalk with the syntax of C. Guido Van Rossum has stated that Python owes a lot to ABC. Every computer language has borrowed features from others. It is the way that computer language development work. If you can make a better product by taking features from another and adding and improving then you should do it.
The MSFT-employee-wannabe that you speak of is the father of the GNOME desktop. Without GNOME, QT might not have been open sourced in the first place. Without a man like Miguel to give GNOME a forward direction, we might still be using Motif. When your contributions to the open source movement become a tenth of what Miguel has done then your rant might have more merit.
If there is one Microsoft technology that deserves admiration is the.NET framework. If there is one man who has the objectivity to look beyond the zealotry to see technologies for their merits is Miguel. MONO is an excellent development environment for Linux. It bridges the gap between high performance but difficult to use languages like C++ and low performance high RAD languages like Python.
Minimum wage jobs are a necessity, whether the minimum wage is 5 bucks or 10. Do you really believe that society doesn't have a need for fry cooks, fruit pickers and Wallmart clerks? Those are required jobs that need to be filled, and if all of those employees decided to climb the economic ladder society itself would collapse and the standards would be set even higher.
As long as there is a need for low end jobs society itself must protect the low end employees from exploitation.
Thank god (whichever one you like) for the people that work the worst jobs so that we can enjoy our little piece of Utopian society. Pretending that those jobs don't have to be filled or don't need to exist is simply moronic.
What you want is an Object Relational Mapping Layer and generator.
For the.NET framework or MONO try dOOdads with MyGeneration. It is free. Don't let the names fool you. That is some enterprise quality software.
You get support for 12 databases and get to write code like this without having to write config files or xml definitions.
// Load and Save
Employees emps = new Employees();
if(emps.LoadByPrimaryKey(42))
{
emps.LastName = "Just Got Married";
emps.Save();
}
// Add a new record
Employees emps = new Employees();
emps.AddNew();
emps.FirstName = "Mr.";
emps.LastName = "dOOdad";
emps.Save();
You wouldn't use CAL model for unlimited connections to SQL unless of course you have unlimited CALs
The SQL server NEVER connects with the client (browser) in a web app environment. It connects ONLY with the web server/servers. You can have 1000 anonymous SSL connections (this is how it is done) connecting with the web server and the web server connects with the SQL server. What is the number of connections for the unlimited users? ONE. Only one connection to the SQL Server.
My best friend is in corporate licensing sales at MS
Does he know how web apps work? Did he explain the licensing scheme to you correctly? What you are describing are intranet apps that connect directly to the SQL server using Windows Authentication. Web apps or Rich Client apps that use web services do not need or use or like or promote the use of Windows authentication and they do not connect to the SQL Server directly. There is one connection to the SQL server for each Web Server and it doesn't have to be authenticated. SSL works great.
This is the process whether it is web browsers or rich clients with web services.
Unlimited anonymous users connect with one or more Web Servers through SSL. The web server connects with the SQL Server. The number of connections to the SQL server is one for each Web Server. Windows authentication is not used. There is no need for CALs or external connectors.
You don't need connector licenses to use web hosted applications like web apps and web services. You use SSL to protect the data flow that needs to be encrypted, like passwords, credit card info, or anything confidential. You don't need connector licenses to connect to SQL servers like Postgresql or MySQL either.
This is a common scenario for an e-commerce site, or any site that users can create accounts on. A bulletin board is another example.
If you are using Integrated Windows Authentication for that kind of apps you are limiting yourself to clients that run IE. Use SSL instead and make your app cross browser compatible, the way it should be.
For a web server you use the Web Server edition for less than $400. For the web you don't need client access licences $0. For a small to medium database you can always use Postgresql on a debian server for $0. That is the combination that I normally use and the time that I save developing the apps is worth a lot more than the $400 that I spent on the.net web server.
You can always start here. The best source for tutorials is google.;-) Download the Visual Web Developer express for free. It might be the only Visual Studio that you ever need to develop.net web apps and web services. A lot of app wizards use SQL Server by default. If you are lazy like me you will be tempted to use them. I recommend not doing that. There are drivers for postgresql, mysql and just about everything else out there.
The best advice that I can give you to make the transition is to think in terms of applications instead of scripts. That might not make sense now but eventually it will be obvious. And always use code-behind.
If you need any specific advice you can email me at my username at gmail. Helping each other is what the slashdot community should be about.:-)
I can usually buy two or three of those with the money that I save in development time. Your results might vary, everybody likes something different. If I had to buy 50 of those then I might consider using something like JBOSS or LAMP.
Yes,.NET targets rich client apps and browser apps. However, to use the web you use a web browser, not a rich client. The only way that they could break compatibility and force you to download the.NET runtime is to convert IE into a rich client platform. Could they do that? Yes they could. Are they giving any indication that they are going to do that in the near future? Not at all.
About rich clients with.NET web services. While they work great with winforms they also work great with GTK. I developed a live scoreboard that transfers data from a rich WinForms client to.NET web services. I am currently developing linux GTK# clients for Windows.NET web services with mono.
Slashdot is my education too. I am sorry for snaping at you like I did. I have learned a lot from this community, however, it seems to be completely anti MS to the point of having people wilfully spreading misinformation.
I believe using the right tool for the right job. Every tool shines in a particular situation. I like Debian for database, file, print and domain servers. I like Ubuntu and SuSE for bussiness clients. I like.NET servers for web services. I like Windows for games and engineering apps and Macs for... well... "cool people", mainly graphic artists and 14 year old girls.;-)
.NET 2.0 web technology is cross browser compatible. It produces standards compliant xhtml and JavaScript. Its beta AJAX Atlas library currently works equally well in both Firefox and IE.
The fact that they decided to make their hotmail service work "better" in IE is a child of the shameful proprietary Active X web that they tried to create.
Their current approach to web client technology is based on a completely different philosophy that embraces standards.
If you study the.NET framework you will notice that there are not any plans to embed it into the browsers like Java or Flash plugins currently do.
It already does. There are a couple of excellent AJAX libraries available for ASP.NET 1.1 and 2.0.
Microsoft has also released Atlas beta, which in my opinion is very elegant and effective. (It currently only works with Firefox and IE but should support everything else when it reaches 1.0)
Please, educate yourself before trolling utter rubbish like the one in your comment. Some people might believe it.
The.NET technology that is used for web browsers is ASP.NET. ASP.NET produces standards compliant xhtml and JavaScript that is sent to your browser. The only place where you will need to upgrade to.NET 3.0 is in the web server. Server side browser technologies never leave the server. They translate its content to something that your browser will understand. When you click "view source" you are not viewing.NET, you are viewing its output.
You don't need to download.NET 3.0 to run.NET 3.0 browser apps in the same way that you don't need to download PHP, Python, Ruby or Perl to your computer to use Slashdot or Digg or Google, etc.
The saddest part is that this is already happening. Universities and schools are suspending and expelling students based on the content of their blogs. It also happened to a flight attendant and to many others.
Slashdot Mirror
So, if I accuse you of drug possession, but don't have any proof, I can argue that you simply hid the stash somewhere and prosecute you without evidence?
I believe that his views are quite insightful and maybe even correct. OSS zealotry might work for you and me, however, most people see their computer as a tool, not as a statement of ideology. Hardware and software vendors make their products to carter to most people. If OSS doesn't become a little more flexible to appeal to the masses it will never outgrow its niche market.
What I would like to see is Opera support in ASP.NET's Atlas (MS Ajax library). Although I have to admit that IE, Firefox and Safari support is a great accomplishment by itself.
I am pretty certain that you are confusing the GPL with the LGPL. Look it up.
I actually saw a demo of this on the discovery channel. The dolphins don't tag unauthorized swimmers. They tag whoever is in the water. And by identifying they mean pushing the nose to the swimmer's leg and a metal clamp will... clamp them.
:-)
The dolphins were also very capable of detecting and identifying underwater mines.
It was beyond impressive. Made me want to play Red Alert for a couple of hours.
Didn't the Mythbusters debunk this? Maybe they are just easily distracted.
mmmmmmm..... kari.....
Wait. What? Oh, yeah. Didn't the Mythbusters debunk this?
mmmmmmm..... kari.....
doo...doo...doo... Hey! Where did that cool plastic castle come from?
[sarcasm]Using Linux in universities is be great for graphic design courses that use Photoshop and for engineering graphic labs that use AutoCad.[/sarcasm]
A lot of college courses cannot be taught using Linux computers. And if I have to pay for a college education I would like to be taught how to use the software that is used in the workforce.
Linux is a great operating system. However, an operating system is only as useful as the software that it can run.
Would you care to enlighten me as of why is .NET a "not even that great of a VM"?
C# is Java with the power of hindsight. Java is Smalltalk with the syntax of C. Guido Van Rossum has stated that Python owes a lot to ABC. Every computer language has borrowed features from others. It is the way that computer language development work. If you can make a better product by taking features from another and adding and improving then you should do it.
The MSFT-employee-wannabe that you speak of is the father of the GNOME desktop. Without GNOME, QT might not have been open sourced in the first place. Without a man like Miguel to give GNOME a forward direction, we might still be using Motif. When your contributions to the open source movement become a tenth of what Miguel has done then your rant might have more merit.
.NET framework. If there is one man who has the objectivity to look beyond the zealotry to see technologies for their merits is Miguel. MONO is an excellent development environment for Linux. It bridges the gap between high performance but difficult to use languages like C++ and low performance high RAD languages like Python.
If there is one Microsoft technology that deserves admiration is the
Minimum wage jobs are a necessity, whether the minimum wage is 5 bucks or 10. Do you really believe that society doesn't have a need for fry cooks, fruit pickers and Wallmart clerks? Those are required jobs that need to be filled, and if all of those employees decided to climb the economic ladder society itself would collapse and the standards would be set even higher.
As long as there is a need for low end jobs society itself must protect the low end employees from exploitation.
Thank god (whichever one you like) for the people that work the worst jobs so that we can enjoy our little piece of Utopian society. Pretending that those jobs don't have to be filled or don't need to exist is simply moronic.
What you want is an Object Relational Mapping Layer and generator. .NET framework or MONO try dOOdads with MyGeneration. It is free. Don't let the names fool you. That is some enterprise quality software.
// Load and Save
// Add a new record
For the
You get support for 12 databases and get to write code like this without having to write config files or xml definitions.
Employees emps = new Employees();
if(emps.LoadByPrimaryKey(42))
{
emps.LastName = "Just Got Married";
emps.Save();
}
Employees emps = new Employees();
emps.AddNew();
emps.FirstName = "Mr.";
emps.LastName = "dOOdad";
emps.Save();
http://mygenerationsoftware.com/
Disclaimer: I don't work for the company, but I believe that their free solution answers the parent's question.
Does he know how web apps work? Did he explain the licensing scheme to you correctly? What you are describing are intranet apps that connect directly to the SQL server using Windows Authentication. Web apps or Rich Client apps that use web services do not need or use or like or promote the use of Windows authentication and they do not connect to the SQL Server directly. There is one connection to the SQL server for each Web Server and it doesn't have to be authenticated. SSL works great.
This is the process whether it is web browsers or rich clients with web services.
Unlimited anonymous users connect with one or more Web Servers through SSL. The web server connects with the SQL Server. The number of connections to the SQL server is one for each Web Server. Windows authentication is not used. There is no need for CALs or external connectors.
You don't need connector licenses to use web hosted applications like web apps and web services. You use SSL to protect the data flow that needs to be encrypted, like passwords, credit card info, or anything confidential. You don't need connector licenses to connect to SQL servers like Postgresql or MySQL either.
If you are using Integrated Windows Authentication for that kind of apps you are limiting yourself to clients that run IE. Use SSL instead and make your app cross browser compatible, the way it should be.
For a web server you use the Web Server edition for less than $400. For the web you don't need client access licences $0. For a small to medium database you can always use Postgresql on a debian server for $0. That is the combination that I normally use and the time that I save developing the apps is worth a lot more than the $400 that I spent on the .net web server.
You can always start here. The best source for tutorials is google. ;-) Download the Visual Web Developer express for free. It might be the only Visual Studio that you ever need to develop .net web apps and web services. A lot of app wizards use SQL Server by default. If you are lazy like me you will be tempted to use them. I recommend not doing that. There are drivers for postgresql, mysql and just about everything else out there.
:-)
Some nice things that might help you out AFTER you've gotten your feet wet:
1. Data layer code generation with Mygeneration and dOOdads. http://www.mygenerationsoftware.com/
2. Well defined (clean) URLs: http://metasapiens.com/PageMethods/
3. Ajax (What you want is the UpdatePanel): http://atlas.asp.net/
The best advice that I can give you to make the transition is to think in terms of applications instead of scripts. That might not make sense now but eventually it will be obvious. And always use code-behind.
If you need any specific advice you can email me at my username at gmail. Helping each other is what the slashdot community should be about.
You don't have to.
You can get the web edition server for less than $400 USD.
I can usually buy two or three of those with the money that I save in development time. Your results might vary, everybody likes something different. If I had to buy 50 of those then I might consider using something like JBOSS or LAMP.
This is some very interesting information. Maybe I am wrong. Some more research might alter my perspective on the technology.
:-)
Could you provide some links or examples please?
Yes, .NET targets rich client apps and browser apps. However, to use the web you use a web browser, not a rich client. The only way that they could break compatibility and force you to download the .NET runtime is to convert IE into a rich client platform. Could they do that? Yes they could. Are they giving any indication that they are going to do that in the near future? Not at all.
.NET web services. While they work great with winforms they also work great with GTK. I developed a live scoreboard that transfers data from a rich WinForms client to .NET web services. I am currently developing linux GTK# clients for Windows .NET web services with mono.
About rich clients with
Slashdot is my education too. I am sorry for snaping at you like I did. I have learned a lot from this community, however, it seems to be completely anti MS to the point of having people wilfully spreading misinformation.
.NET servers for web services. I like Windows for games and engineering apps and Macs for... well... "cool people", mainly graphic artists and 14 year old girls. ;-)
I believe using the right tool for the right job. Every tool shines in a particular situation. I like Debian for database, file, print and domain servers. I like Ubuntu and SuSE for bussiness clients. I like
.NET 2.0 web technology is cross browser compatible. It produces standards compliant xhtml and JavaScript. Its beta AJAX Atlas library currently works equally well in both Firefox and IE.
.NET framework you will notice that there are not any plans to embed it into the browsers like Java or Flash plugins currently do.
The fact that they decided to make their hotmail service work "better" in IE is a child of the shameful proprietary Active X web that they tried to create.
Their current approach to web client technology is based on a completely different philosophy that embraces standards.
If you study the
It already does. There are a couple of excellent AJAX libraries available for ASP.NET 1.1 and 2.0.
Microsoft has also released Atlas beta, which in my opinion is very elegant and effective. (It currently only works with Firefox and IE but should support everything else when it reaches 1.0)
Please, educate yourself before trolling utter rubbish like the one in your comment. Some people might believe it.
.NET technology that is used for web browsers is ASP.NET. ASP.NET produces standards compliant xhtml and JavaScript that is sent to your browser. The only place where you will need to upgrade to .NET 3.0 is in the web server. Server side browser technologies never leave the server. They translate its content to something that your browser will understand. When you click "view source" you are not viewing .NET, you are viewing its output.
.NET 3.0 to run .NET 3.0 browser apps in the same way that you don't need to download PHP, Python, Ruby or Perl to your computer to use Slashdot or Digg or Google, etc.
The
You don't need to download
The saddest part is that this is already happening. Universities and schools are suspending and expelling students based on the content of their blogs. It also happened to a flight attendant and to many others.
Mind if I quote you?