No, it's quite common for US cops (generally hired from the dregs of society) to do things like that and worse. Start reading about civil forfeiture abuse, where travelers and business owners are relieved of valuables and cash under "suspicion" without trial. Obama and Holder tried to curtail this, Trump and Sessions fully support it...
We just differ as to the topic. The real topic should be the US "justice" system. Glad other nations are seeing its excessive harshness and refusing to play ball with it.
As opposed to countless people who were sentenced to death in the US, and later released due to erroneous convictions or coerced confessions? How about Cameron Todd Willingham, who was likely innocent of his crime, but was executed on the evidence given by an untrained "arson investigator."
Exactly -- and with Trump and the Evil Elf in office, the only meaningful reforms are happening on the state level, not Federal. i.e. marijuana legalization, bail reform, sentencing guideline reform.
Holder and Obama were stepping in the correct direction, but sadly they've been replaced by a bunch of aged reactionaries.
Thing is, the US encourages plea bargaining, and punishes people who dare exercise their right to a fair trial (if they lose) disproportionately. The reduced sentences you mention are often only given with a plea bargain.
Picture this: you're falsely accused of a crime and too poor to afford a good lawyer. Would you rather risk 30 years in prison, no parole, at trial, or will you plead guilty to a lesser felony, do a year in prison, and come out marked as a felon for life. Many people are pressured into doing the latter even if they're not actually guilty of anything.
The US "justice" system is evil, and generally run by evil/corrupt people.
"Unnamed co-conspirators?" Evidence seems strong in this case. Right. Maybe the US didn't actually present enough evidence that he should be prosecuted. It's not the first time that US prosecutors have gone on a witch-hunt based on flimsy evidence.
Babar Ahmed should have gotten zero time in the US and been tried in the UK. As heinous as supporting al-Qaeda is, his technical crime was hosting a website raising money for al-Qaeda on a web provider that had a presence in the US. Honestly, he owed the US no allegiance, and should have been prosecuted in the UK in the first place.
Extraditing him then sending him back to the UK was a big waste of US money and time.
Exactly -- US needs to fix its sentencing guidelines and allow for the possibility of Federal parole if it wants the world to play ball with its justice system. I hope for many more cases like this in the future -- it might be one of many nudges the US needs to fix its abusive injustice/incarceration system.
UK takes cars of its citizens. Protects them from extradition, gives them tax-supported healthcare. The US? Land of medical bankruptcies, guns for any yob who can fog a mirror, killings by police, and excessive prison sentencing. US would have been better off if the "founding fathers" had been shot as traitors and it had remained a British colony. Britain even ended slavery 30 years before the US did.
Don't come to America, where the US police have backlogs of un-processed evidence from rape cases but are more than happy to go after people for small quantities of drugs. Even if they aren't drugs -- recent case where some dumb cop arrested someone for suspicion of drug possession, which turned out to be donut crumbs.
I'd take a higher rate of theft and even terrorism over a "justice" system that abuses its own citizens and tries to abuse people worldwide.
No, but the sentence for you doing so should be no more than a month or two in prison. Sentence should fit the crime and be on the low side -- I'm proud to be a bleeding-heart liberal.
Considering that the UK jails 1/5 of the people that the US does (per capita), I'd say the UK is doing fine. Meanwhile, the US wastes a lot of tax money and lives being the greatest incarcerator in the world. Kudos to the UK courts for not throwing another person into the pit of the US injustice system.
"Antibiotic-resistant eczema" is called "a convenient excuse to not do the Americans' bidding."
The problem is that US sentencing is too harsh, and he might be looking at what's essentially a life sentence, without possibility of parole (US Federal system did away with that in the 80s). He didn't kill anyone, there's no evidence that he did any actual damage. Too harsh. As long as the US system allows for the possibility of excessive sentencing of that type, other countries will keep pushing back and telling the US where to stuff their so-called "justice" system.
I say we laugh in the faces of people who think that non-violent criminals should be subject to the whims of the overly-harsh US "justice" system. Beating ill people -- sign of a true sociopath.
Maybe, maybe not. The UK still has the concepts of "parole" and "suspended sentences" -- the broken American Federal prison system did away with those in the 1980s. The US "justice" system is too harsh for anyone other than a violent, hardened criminal to deserve it.
UK will likely be freezing some Russians' assets and denying entry to others. Seeing as wealthy Russians love to invest in the UK, this will hit them in the most painful spot: the pockets.
Any proof that he actually stole anything of value or profited from his so-called crimes? This was more like a drunk teenager climbing the fence into my backyard, looking around, and maybe making a commotion. Yeah, some Americans' response might be to shoot without asking questions, but fortunately, the British know better.
I hope he never does a day of time and lives out his life free as a bird. The US needs to learn that it's not at the beck and call of the US (aka the greatest incarcerator in the world) 24/7/365.
Think of this as saving both US and British tax money by not jailing someone for a non-violent crime.
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No, it's quite common for US cops (generally hired from the dregs of society) to do things like that and worse. Start reading about civil forfeiture abuse, where travelers and business owners are relieved of valuables and cash under "suspicion" without trial. Obama and Holder tried to curtail this, Trump and Sessions fully support it...
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/...
https://www.washingtonpost.com...
Excessive sentencing is a good enough reason not to extradite. Glad the British court told the US where to put it.
Want extradition? Present the full evidence, or bugger off. Not willing to present the full evidence? See prior sentence.
We just differ as to the topic. The real topic should be the US "justice" system. Glad other nations are seeing its excessive harshness and refusing to play ball with it.
Obama and Holder supported sentencing reform and chose not to interfere with states that reformed their drug laws. Trump and Evil Elf, not so much.
As opposed to countless people who were sentenced to death in the US, and later released due to erroneous convictions or coerced confessions? How about Cameron Todd Willingham, who was likely innocent of his crime, but was executed on the evidence given by an untrained "arson investigator."
Gary McKinnon was the UFO guy, not Lauri Love. Rest of your point stands as is.
Exactly -- and with Trump and the Evil Elf in office, the only meaningful reforms are happening on the state level, not Federal. i.e. marijuana legalization, bail reform, sentencing guideline reform.
Holder and Obama were stepping in the correct direction, but sadly they've been replaced by a bunch of aged reactionaries.
Thing is, the US encourages plea bargaining, and punishes people who dare exercise their right to a fair trial (if they lose) disproportionately. The reduced sentences you mention are often only given with a plea bargain.
Picture this: you're falsely accused of a crime and too poor to afford a good lawyer. Would you rather risk 30 years in prison, no parole, at trial, or will you plead guilty to a lesser felony, do a year in prison, and come out marked as a felon for life. Many people are pressured into doing the latter even if they're not actually guilty of anything.
The US "justice" system is evil, and generally run by evil/corrupt people.
"Unnamed co-conspirators?" Evidence seems strong in this case. Right. Maybe the US didn't actually present enough evidence that he should be prosecuted. It's not the first time that US prosecutors have gone on a witch-hunt based on flimsy evidence.
Babar Ahmed should have gotten zero time in the US and been tried in the UK. As heinous as supporting al-Qaeda is, his technical crime was hosting a website raising money for al-Qaeda on a web provider that had a presence in the US. Honestly, he owed the US no allegiance, and should have been prosecuted in the UK in the first place.
Extraditing him then sending him back to the UK was a big waste of US money and time.
Exactly -- US needs to fix its sentencing guidelines and allow for the possibility of Federal parole if it wants the world to play ball with its justice system. I hope for many more cases like this in the future -- it might be one of many nudges the US needs to fix its abusive injustice/incarceration system.
We don't draw and quarter people for shoplifting, even though that would likely be a deterrent. Why? Because the punishment has to fit the crime.
Saying something should have been a deterrent is not an argument for excessively harsh punishment.
UK takes cars of its citizens. Protects them from extradition, gives them tax-supported healthcare. The US? Land of medical bankruptcies, guns for any yob who can fog a mirror, killings by police, and excessive prison sentencing. US would have been better off if the "founding fathers" had been shot as traitors and it had remained a British colony. Britain even ended slavery 30 years before the US did.
Don't come to America, where the US police have backlogs of un-processed evidence from rape cases but are more than happy to go after people for small quantities of drugs. Even if they aren't drugs -- recent case where some dumb cop arrested someone for suspicion of drug possession, which turned out to be donut crumbs.
I'd take a higher rate of theft and even terrorism over a "justice" system that abuses its own citizens and tries to abuse people worldwide.
No, but the sentence for you doing so should be no more than a month or two in prison. Sentence should fit the crime and be on the low side -- I'm proud to be a bleeding-heart liberal.
Considering that the UK jails 1/5 of the people that the US does (per capita), I'd say the UK is doing fine. Meanwhile, the US wastes a lot of tax money and lives being the greatest incarcerator in the world. Kudos to the UK courts for not throwing another person into the pit of the US injustice system.
"Antibiotic-resistant eczema" is called "a convenient excuse to not do the Americans' bidding."
The problem is that US sentencing is too harsh, and he might be looking at what's essentially a life sentence, without possibility of parole (US Federal system did away with that in the 80s). He didn't kill anyone, there's no evidence that he did any actual damage. Too harsh. As long as the US system allows for the possibility of excessive sentencing of that type, other countries will keep pushing back and telling the US where to stuff their so-called "justice" system.
I say we laugh in the faces of people who think that non-violent criminals should be subject to the whims of the overly-harsh US "justice" system. Beating ill people -- sign of a true sociopath.
Maybe, maybe not. The UK still has the concepts of "parole" and "suspended sentences" -- the broken American Federal prison system did away with those in the 1980s. The US "justice" system is too harsh for anyone other than a violent, hardened criminal to deserve it.
UK will likely be freezing some Russians' assets and denying entry to others. Seeing as wealthy Russians love to invest in the UK, this will hit them in the most painful spot: the pockets.
Any proof that he actually stole anything of value or profited from his so-called crimes? This was more like a drunk teenager climbing the fence into my backyard, looking around, and maybe making a commotion. Yeah, some Americans' response might be to shoot without asking questions, but fortunately, the British know better.
Mod parent up, insightful.
Maybe the Brits don't care about being on good terms with the Orange-Haired Clown.
I hope he never does a day of time and lives out his life free as a bird. The US needs to learn that it's not at the beck and call of the US (aka the greatest incarcerator in the world) 24/7/365.
Think of this as saving both US and British tax money by not jailing someone for a non-violent crime.
Someone needs to remind the US that it's not master of the universe, and it needs to be cut down to size. Sounds like the UK court is doing that.