I'm not making any specific claims, I'm simply participating in this discussion. I'm telling you what I see from perspective as a low-level participant in this war. I don't follow up most of the reports I read with an Internet news search. In many cases there are events that do make the news and I often compare what the news reports to ours. When they get the correct video footage associated with the story that is often useful to add clarity to the bland reports I get. Nobody has proof that this particular report is politcally motivated, but it sure seems that way, eh? I just hope that people don't automatically take the report for gospel and use it to fit their political agenda, although I know it will happen. I would love for the people to be able to see all the reporting that is out there and make their own decisions, but it's not practical and most of it is classified. If there is something specific that you want to know, FOIA it and someday you can get the answer. I don't have the time to chase down unclassified releases of the reports I read, I'm trying to filter through all the noise and find something useful for the soldiers I have the responsibility of informing.
Christians fought and killed eachother and other religions in the past as well. And still do today, but not nearly as much. So what is to say it is not the time for Islam to recognize the need for peace and the chance to start something here?
And most of the people here have more electricity and more water than a year ago! Many have more electricity than before the war. It is more equitably distributed now than it was then, so some Iraqis have less. If they'd stop trying to destroy their own infrastructure, there would be a lot more progress.
If Sunni and Shi'a are radical Islam, then what isn't radical Islam? Yes there are radical Sunni, radical Shi'a, just as there are radicals in every other religion. The entire sect is not radical. The government here has been drafted carefully to try to prevent any one group from being in complete power, but ultimately the shape of Iraq's government is in the hands of its soon to be elected government.
I'm talking about reality based reality. As real as it gets without personally being there. I read the military intelligence reports daily as part of my job. The reports state the facts as they are known at the time and thereafter because they have to. If our own reports are not factual they are of little use to us in pursuit of our goals at the time. The spin is applied higher up.
I learned this from reading our intelligence reports, which is my job. And before you go off on that, please remember that we have a vested interest in knowing who we target and who we kill. I understand that our reports are often incomplete, but from the reports that do get followed up I have a good feeling for the casualties that we cause. We don't want to kill anyone we don't have to, but the reality over here is something that doesn't translate to CNN or BBC. Our intelligence is far from perfect, but we take action as best we can to protect ourselves and the Iraqi people.
Your hindsight is near perfect! So where were we going to get those 740,000 troops? Even if Germany and France had committed troops it would not have been near that number. I know damn well how many of our people have been killed by small arms fire. And it'll be a lot better when the civilians, of which there are a lot, take charge of more of their own safety and security. All the people here have their own self-interests, but MOST of them are not fighting. The process has been started and we will finish it. Iraq as a free, democratic, self-elected, modern Arab nation will be a reality in the long-term and far more valuable as a foothold against the cancer of RADICAL Islam that plagues our world than for whatever political cost or gain in the short term.
Boy am I glad we went to war without our allies. It's a good thing Britain, Australia, Japan, South Korea, Poland, and the dozens of others aren't here because I want to do it all myself. So Germany and France didn't come? Germany and France sold weapons to Iraq leading up to the war? Who are our Allies?
Alright smart guy, you come up with a plan to disarm the people. I disagree with a lot of things about this war, and I think it could have been planned better. But you are welcome to come over here and disarm the people so they can be killed by the bad guys who still have weapons. AK-47s do not represent a significant threat to our forces! It is far more valuable to have lightly armed civilians capable of defending their homes and neighborhoods from the bad guys(TM) (which they are starting to do now) than it would be to have spent months or years trying to disarm the entire population!
Yes, because the media is always right and always reports accurately especially when they have reliable Iraqi civilians feeding them information. And the media is unbiased of course. I understand what the Israeli's go through with the media reports having now heard how ours and the world's reports what happens here. It's a lot different from reality.
I'm calling BS on this article. They conducted a sampling survey to generate these numbers? Come on now. I'm more inclined to believe iraqbodycount.org and the media always gets it wrong (and never corrects themselves.) And to blame most of the deaths on the US bombing? Total horse $hit. Have innocent people died in Iraq? Hell yes. Have many of them been our fault? Yes. Have any of them been deliberate? No. Half of the innocent lives lost over here, by estimation and observation for the past eight months I've been in Baghdad (being a little involved in intelligence reports), come from the insurgents/terrorists. Their road-side bombs and car bombs as often target civilians and Iraqi security forces (the ones who take huge personal risk upon themselves and their families to try to make a difference in the future of their country) as they target Coalition Forces. This article is BS BS BS BS!
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I'm not making any specific claims, I'm simply participating in this discussion. I'm telling you what I see from perspective as a low-level participant in this war. I don't follow up most of the reports I read with an Internet news search. In many cases there are events that do make the news and I often compare what the news reports to ours. When they get the correct video footage associated with the story that is often useful to add clarity to the bland reports I get. Nobody has proof that this particular report is politcally motivated, but it sure seems that way, eh? I just hope that people don't automatically take the report for gospel and use it to fit their political agenda, although I know it will happen. I would love for the people to be able to see all the reporting that is out there and make their own decisions, but it's not practical and most of it is classified. If there is something specific that you want to know, FOIA it and someday you can get the answer. I don't have the time to chase down unclassified releases of the reports I read, I'm trying to filter through all the noise and find something useful for the soldiers I have the responsibility of informing.
Christians fought and killed eachother and other religions in the past as well. And still do today, but not nearly as much. So what is to say it is not the time for Islam to recognize the need for peace and the chance to start something here? And most of the people here have more electricity and more water than a year ago! Many have more electricity than before the war. It is more equitably distributed now than it was then, so some Iraqis have less. If they'd stop trying to destroy their own infrastructure, there would be a lot more progress. If Sunni and Shi'a are radical Islam, then what isn't radical Islam? Yes there are radical Sunni, radical Shi'a, just as there are radicals in every other religion. The entire sect is not radical. The government here has been drafted carefully to try to prevent any one group from being in complete power, but ultimately the shape of Iraq's government is in the hands of its soon to be elected government.
I'm talking about reality based reality. As real as it gets without personally being there. I read the military intelligence reports daily as part of my job. The reports state the facts as they are known at the time and thereafter because they have to. If our own reports are not factual they are of little use to us in pursuit of our goals at the time. The spin is applied higher up.
I learned this from reading our intelligence reports, which is my job. And before you go off on that, please remember that we have a vested interest in knowing who we target and who we kill. I understand that our reports are often incomplete, but from the reports that do get followed up I have a good feeling for the casualties that we cause. We don't want to kill anyone we don't have to, but the reality over here is something that doesn't translate to CNN or BBC. Our intelligence is far from perfect, but we take action as best we can to protect ourselves and the Iraqi people.
Your hindsight is near perfect! So where were we going to get those 740,000 troops? Even if Germany and France had committed troops it would not have been near that number. I know damn well how many of our people have been killed by small arms fire. And it'll be a lot better when the civilians, of which there are a lot, take charge of more of their own safety and security. All the people here have their own self-interests, but MOST of them are not fighting. The process has been started and we will finish it. Iraq as a free, democratic, self-elected, modern Arab nation will be a reality in the long-term and far more valuable as a foothold against the cancer of RADICAL Islam that plagues our world than for whatever political cost or gain in the short term.
Boy am I glad we went to war without our allies. It's a good thing Britain, Australia, Japan, South Korea, Poland, and the dozens of others aren't here because I want to do it all myself. So Germany and France didn't come? Germany and France sold weapons to Iraq leading up to the war? Who are our Allies?
My source is a little common sense and reality. Unfortunately the American people at home don't often get that, certainly not from the media.
Alright smart guy, you come up with a plan to disarm the people. I disagree with a lot of things about this war, and I think it could have been planned better. But you are welcome to come over here and disarm the people so they can be killed by the bad guys who still have weapons. AK-47s do not represent a significant threat to our forces! It is far more valuable to have lightly armed civilians capable of defending their homes and neighborhoods from the bad guys(TM) (which they are starting to do now) than it would be to have spent months or years trying to disarm the entire population!
Yes, because the media is always right and always reports accurately especially when they have reliable Iraqi civilians feeding them information. And the media is unbiased of course. I understand what the Israeli's go through with the media reports having now heard how ours and the world's reports what happens here. It's a lot different from reality.
I'm calling BS on this article. They conducted a sampling survey to generate these numbers? Come on now. I'm more inclined to believe iraqbodycount.org and the media always gets it wrong (and never corrects themselves.) And to blame most of the deaths on the US bombing? Total horse $hit. Have innocent people died in Iraq? Hell yes. Have many of them been our fault? Yes. Have any of them been deliberate? No. Half of the innocent lives lost over here, by estimation and observation for the past eight months I've been in Baghdad (being a little involved in intelligence reports), come from the insurgents/terrorists. Their road-side bombs and car bombs as often target civilians and Iraqi security forces (the ones who take huge personal risk upon themselves and their families to try to make a difference in the future of their country) as they target Coalition Forces. This article is BS BS BS BS!