And on the other hand, you have the DNC, which is of the belief that no one can do anything without their assistance
No, that is not "on the other hand", it is on the same hand. The main difference between the dems and the GOP is that the Dems wants the government to control everything so that they can dole out cash to the un-deserved. The GOP wants the government to control everything because they want to re-make the US in the name of Jesus. There is NO difference at the end result, which is a MASSIVE federal government. Remember, NOBODY in modern history grew the FED as fast as the GOP under G. W. Bush.
The problem is that BOTH major parties in the US have gone the "let's grow the FED big and fat" route. The only reason the GOP is still there is because those who favor a small government still vote GOP, allowing the FED-growing Jesus freaks free reign. We can't get the GOP back by continuing to support their current direction. One or two elections where people with a spine STOP VOTING GOP and the REAL GOP will reclaim the power within the GOP and there will be no more talk about ancient superstitions concocted by illiterate Jewish goat herders.
I vote for the local politicians and state politicians who I agree with, they just usually happen to have an (R) by their name.
And thereby you leave the faith of this country in the hands of the nut-case Jesus freaks. Why? Do you really think that is not the consequence of your actions?
At the national level I vote for the following: Gun-rights, Israel, War on Terror, National Defense/Security
And you keep doing that even though the only thing you GET is big government, draconian laws that seriously impede individual freedom, the removal of habeas corpus, a massive eroding of the US constitution.
How far are you willing to compromise the integrity of the US just because your favorite Jesus freak spews the party line but VOTES the Jesus line? G. W. Bush was, BY FAR, the biggest socialist this country has seen in power since WWII.
then taxing the hell out of them
So you ARE one of those nut-jobs that can keep two diametrically opposite political views in your head at the same time and think you are sane when you vote for both of them. Can you please explain why the government should "tax the hell" out of some companies but not others? Why are you so in love with high taxes, I thought you Repugnicans were for LOW taxes. You see, this is your and the entire GOP's problem. You want to tax with your EMOTIONS and you have long since let rational thought go down the toilet. I feel sorry for you. It must be some sort of disease.
The solution to revolution is Democracy. You keep all the same old cronies in power, but you give the impression of choice, people can't rebel and create a revolution if they are them selves responsible for the current totalitarian government, can they? Of course not.
Democracy is an illusion, more so in Europe than in the US, but almost equally in both places.
Why less in Europe? In Europe the authorities dear be more openly totalitarian. Look at the stuff around the European Constitution. When countries started voting "NO THANK YOU", the EU went in an threatened anyone who didn't vote as they were supposed to vote with sanctions. Then they re-printed the same constitution on a different colored paper, called it "new shit" and told everybody "this time you'd better vote as you're supposed to or we'll kick your ass big time". Europe today is moving rapidly towards North Korea. France is leading the charge. Hopefully the Brits will sooner or later again find their wits and dump the whole experiment. It failed. Time to move on. Let the PIGS stew in their own fat.
But the GOP as such does. So, if you support the GOP, you support the Jesus freaks and the legislation of morality. Originally antithetical to the entire GOP idea. The GOP as an organization has turned into a Jesus chanting bunch of socialists. That includes the previous administration. An administration that grew the FED beyond anything seen since the great depression. Yup, G. W. Bush was a Stalin-age socialist through and through.
Vote GOP today and sadly that is exactly what you are voting for. The only cure is for those of us who know how dangerous that stuff is is to not vote GOP until they come to their senses and send all the Jesus freaks back to the Dems where they belong. Jesus being a socialist and all.
Actually more so. The GOP has been in charge of the majority of the largest government growth periods, off which GW Bush was one of the most terrifying ones. Amazingly, the FED has a tendency (in modern times) to shrink during Dem rule.
The GOP went utterly socialist once they allowed the Jesus freaks to run the show. For Pete's sake, Jesus was a socialist long before they even invented the idea.
Lying *not* inherently bad? According to what standard?
According to any standard. Particularly the types of standards that involve government. The reason the US was created was that despotic rulers of various kinds tried to legislate morality. That is un-American.
Cool, so let's ban mountain climbing, parachuting, driving a car, walking across the road, owning a lawnmower... In fact, let's just put Stalin into government and let him decide what is good for us or not.
Why is it that it is so hard for people to understand that we do not have freedom of speech until also those who's ideas are repulsive to us are allowed to speak. Why do we not have liberty until those who do what disgusts us are allowed to do it.
The government has no business legislating morality. That is why we have the second amendment, so that any government that tries can be removed with prejudice.
I object to gambling for the same reason I object to handing a beer to an alcoholic
Your objection is dumb, immature, not thought through and misses the mark by a mile. If you want to make them "equivalent", then you'd have to say that you object to gambling for the same reason you object to the sale of alcohol. Otherwise you are claiming that all those who gamble are addicts, which is plainly wrong and a rather arrogant assumption.
So, whoever does this for CISCO (they probably don't do them in-house) are incompetent morons, and CISCO should be advised to hire someone who knows Java 101. With regression test suites, it is trivial to ensure this compatibility.
On the other hand, if you have this problem, why is it an issue? Maintaining several versions of a JRE is trivial. The only issue would be security, but for most LOB apps that is not a real issue since they live behind a FW.
I would re-evalute my relationship with whomever is doing your LOB apps. Honestly. They are an incompetent bunch of idiots. As I said, for years we delivered and supported LOB apps that would run on any platform and all minor Java upgrades. They would also always be forwards compatible, that is, our 1.4 based apps runs perfectly fine on Java 1.5 (Java 5). Java 5 apps would not necessarily run on older JRE versions however.
Ensuring such compatibility is trivial in Java, and a company that is incapable of doing so is populated with incompetent idiots.
Maybe we just have better coding practices than others, but we develop on personal windows boxes, build and test on Linux, AIX and Sun and deploy mostly on Linux and Sun. We have never had to do any work at all moving to a new platform, and that is with a Java app that now has a few million lines of code.
Clearly, some people apparently have some problems writing portable Java code, but LOB apps today are usually based on some sort of app server, and the app servers are easily cross-platform, making the LOB app cross-platform. For larger LOB apps, developing in Java gives you ample performance and somewhere between easy and trivial amounts of work in porting. Most LOB Java apps today are server-side with a web interface, and the main issue with portability is whether it runs in both IE and Mozilla.
If a Java app comes with its own Java run-time, so what? Is that a problem? I have at least four Java environments on my dev boxes at any point in time, and they cause no problems for each other.
My angle? Are you SERIOUSLY claiming that it is MORE DIFFICULT to port a LOB app written in Java from one OS to another than it is to port one that is written in C or C++ or CICS/Cobol or Delphi or something like that? Really?
You have clearly never seen a Java app then. I have moved a very large LOB app through Java from 1999 through 2006, no major issues. This means that either you have done something very odd, or your competence level simply isn't what it should be.
I know of several of those, I even replaced a disk on a PDP-11 in the mid '90s for a system like that. I would recommend people make the investment in moving on though.
This, btw, is one of the very, very important reasons that so many business apps are written in Java. Not only is the Java environment, with a significant margin, the most useful environment for developing LOB apps, it is also reasonably future proof as operating systems come and go.
Definition of interpreted language from wikipedia [wikipedia.org]:
And I quote from YOUR article: While Java is translated to a form that is intended to be interpreted, just-in-time compilation is often used to generate machine code - in other words... compiled.
It is funny when you are SO dumb that you provide Wikipedia documentation for it.
Further down in the article it says: Many interpreted languages are first compiled to some form of virtual machine code, which is then either interpreted or compiled at runtime to native code.
The above accurately describes Java. Java is first COMPILED to intermediary code, and then (these days) the intermediary code (or pcode) is COMPILED into machine code.
Thank you for referring to that article that ALSO proves you a moron.
Correct. It does the COMPILING. Good to see you finally caught on. Now, back to the original statement, even though it is the runtime that does the COMPILING, why does that prevent optimizations?
Pcode is not compiled code
If you wrote the pcode from scratch it is not compiled. If it was the result of a COMPILATION process, it is compiled. Just as your help files, the.chm files on windows are COMPILED help files.
Something is compiled that went through a compiler whether that is C that went through a APD Pascal compiler (output is C), Help files (went through the Microsoft Help compiler) Java bytecode, went through the Java compiler etc. Again, please read up on what a compiler is, I have sent you many, many references that ALL refer to various types of COMPILERS. Including the Java COMPILER - javac.
Java is not a compiled language
And all of the references I sent you, you didn't read A SINGLE ONE of them?
Oh, and why do you refuse to answer the original question here? What is it that prevents Java compiled bytecode to be optimized? What is it that prevents a Java compiler from optimizing prior to turning out bytecode. You are the one that stated Java could not be optimized. Why is that so? Why will you not answer it?
Slashdot Mirror
And on the other hand, you have the DNC, which is of the belief that no one can do anything without their assistance
No, that is not "on the other hand", it is on the same hand. The main difference between the dems and the GOP is that the Dems wants the government to control everything so that they can dole out cash to the un-deserved. The GOP wants the government to control everything because they want to re-make the US in the name of Jesus. There is NO difference at the end result, which is a MASSIVE federal government. Remember, NOBODY in modern history grew the FED as fast as the GOP under G. W. Bush.
The problem is that BOTH major parties in the US have gone the "let's grow the FED big and fat" route. The only reason the GOP is still there is because those who favor a small government still vote GOP, allowing the FED-growing Jesus freaks free reign. We can't get the GOP back by continuing to support their current direction. One or two elections where people with a spine STOP VOTING GOP and the REAL GOP will reclaim the power within the GOP and there will be no more talk about ancient superstitions concocted by illiterate Jewish goat herders.
I vote for the local politicians and state politicians who I agree with, they just usually happen to have an (R) by their name.
And thereby you leave the faith of this country in the hands of the nut-case Jesus freaks. Why? Do you really think that is not the consequence of your actions?
At the national level I vote for the following: Gun-rights, Israel, War on Terror, National Defense/Security
And you keep doing that even though the only thing you GET is big government, draconian laws that seriously impede individual freedom, the removal of habeas corpus, a massive eroding of the US constitution.
How far are you willing to compromise the integrity of the US just because your favorite Jesus freak spews the party line but VOTES the Jesus line? G. W. Bush was, BY FAR, the biggest socialist this country has seen in power since WWII.
then taxing the hell out of them
So you ARE one of those nut-jobs that can keep two diametrically opposite political views in your head at the same time and think you are sane when you vote for both of them. Can you please explain why the government should "tax the hell" out of some companies but not others? Why are you so in love with high taxes, I thought you Repugnicans were for LOW taxes. You see, this is your and the entire GOP's problem. You want to tax with your EMOTIONS and you have long since let rational thought go down the toilet. I feel sorry for you. It must be some sort of disease.
higher moral standards
Who's morals? Governments with morals go authoritarian.
Indeed you are.
The solution to revolution is Democracy. You keep all the same old cronies in power, but you give the impression of choice, people can't rebel and create a revolution if they are them selves responsible for the current totalitarian government, can they? Of course not.
Democracy is an illusion, more so in Europe than in the US, but almost equally in both places.
Why less in Europe? In Europe the authorities dear be more openly totalitarian. Look at the stuff around the European Constitution. When countries started voting "NO THANK YOU", the EU went in an threatened anyone who didn't vote as they were supposed to vote with sanctions. Then they re-printed the same constitution on a different colored paper, called it "new shit" and told everybody "this time you'd better vote as you're supposed to or we'll kick your ass big time". Europe today is moving rapidly towards North Korea. France is leading the charge. Hopefully the Brits will sooner or later again find their wits and dump the whole experiment. It failed. Time to move on. Let the PIGS stew in their own fat.
Gambling is illegal in person
Is it? Since when? Someone needs to call 911 and send them all to Vegas and Reno then. Or New York. Or New Jersey. Or California.
I'm not against this bill per se, but it is silly that if you did the same exact thing, but without the internet involved it would be illegal.
It isn't, so why did you post?
run anonymously by organized criminal networks outside the US
Sigh. Is it POSSIBLE get more xenophobically paranoid? Get over it dude. You are just sick. Get some help.
True conservatives (i.e. Republicans) are also against gambling
They are, but on a PERSONAL level. A Republican would never even DREAM about legislating such an issue.
Not all Republicans fit into that description.
But the GOP as such does. So, if you support the GOP, you support the Jesus freaks and the legislation of morality. Originally antithetical to the entire GOP idea. The GOP as an organization has turned into a Jesus chanting bunch of socialists. That includes the previous administration. An administration that grew the FED beyond anything seen since the great depression. Yup, G. W. Bush was a Stalin-age socialist through and through.
Vote GOP today and sadly that is exactly what you are voting for. The only cure is for those of us who know how dangerous that stuff is is to not vote GOP until they come to their senses and send all the Jesus freaks back to the Dems where they belong. Jesus being a socialist and all.
Actually more so. The GOP has been in charge of the majority of the largest government growth periods, off which GW Bush was one of the most terrifying ones. Amazingly, the FED has a tendency (in modern times) to shrink during Dem rule.
The GOP went utterly socialist once they allowed the Jesus freaks to run the show. For Pete's sake, Jesus was a socialist long before they even invented the idea.
A truthful society would be horrendous to live in. Think about it.
Lying *not* inherently bad? According to what standard?
According to any standard. Particularly the types of standards that involve government. The reason the US was created was that despotic rulers of various kinds tried to legislate morality. That is un-American.
Cool, so let's ban mountain climbing, parachuting, driving a car, walking across the road, owning a lawnmower... In fact, let's just put Stalin into government and let him decide what is good for us or not.
Why is it that it is so hard for people to understand that we do not have freedom of speech until also those who's ideas are repulsive to us are allowed to speak. Why do we not have liberty until those who do what disgusts us are allowed to do it.
The government has no business legislating morality. That is why we have the second amendment, so that any government that tries can be removed with prejudice.
It's immoral.
Why?
I object to gambling for the same reason I object to handing a beer to an alcoholic
Your objection is dumb, immature, not thought through and misses the mark by a mile. If you want to make them "equivalent", then you'd have to say that you object to gambling for the same reason you object to the sale of alcohol. Otherwise you are claiming that all those who gamble are addicts, which is plainly wrong and a rather arrogant assumption.
Just change your opinion, it is dumb.
So, whoever does this for CISCO (they probably don't do them in-house) are incompetent morons, and CISCO should be advised to hire someone who knows Java 101. With regression test suites, it is trivial to ensure this compatibility.
On the other hand, if you have this problem, why is it an issue? Maintaining several versions of a JRE is trivial. The only issue would be security, but for most LOB apps that is not a real issue since they live behind a FW.
I would re-evalute my relationship with whomever is doing your LOB apps. Honestly. They are an incompetent bunch of idiots. As I said, for years we delivered and supported LOB apps that would run on any platform and all minor Java upgrades. They would also always be forwards compatible, that is, our 1.4 based apps runs perfectly fine on Java 1.5 (Java 5). Java 5 apps would not necessarily run on older JRE versions however.
Ensuring such compatibility is trivial in Java, and a company that is incapable of doing so is populated with incompetent idiots.
Maybe we just have better coding practices than others, but we develop on personal windows boxes, build and test on Linux, AIX and Sun and deploy mostly on Linux and Sun. We have never had to do any work at all moving to a new platform, and that is with a Java app that now has a few million lines of code.
Clearly, some people apparently have some problems writing portable Java code, but LOB apps today are usually based on some sort of app server, and the app servers are easily cross-platform, making the LOB app cross-platform. For larger LOB apps, developing in Java gives you ample performance and somewhere between easy and trivial amounts of work in porting. Most LOB Java apps today are server-side with a web interface, and the main issue with portability is whether it runs in both IE and Mozilla.
If a Java app comes with its own Java run-time, so what? Is that a problem? I have at least four Java environments on my dev boxes at any point in time, and they cause no problems for each other.
Oh, and do you have ANY idea what a LOB app is?
My angle? Are you SERIOUSLY claiming that it is MORE DIFFICULT to port a LOB app written in Java from one OS to another than it is to port one that is written in C or C++ or CICS/Cobol or Delphi or something like that? Really?
You have clearly never seen a Java app then. I have moved a very large LOB app through Java from 1999 through 2006, no major issues. This means that either you have done something very odd, or your competence level simply isn't what it should be.
I know of several of those, I even replaced a disk on a PDP-11 in the mid '90s for a system like that. I would recommend people make the investment in moving on though.
This, btw, is one of the very, very important reasons that so many business apps are written in Java. Not only is the Java environment, with a significant margin, the most useful environment for developing LOB apps, it is also reasonably future proof as operating systems come and go.
Definition of interpreted language from wikipedia [wikipedia.org]:
And I quote from YOUR article: While Java is translated to a form that is intended to be interpreted, just-in-time compilation is often used to generate machine code - in other words... compiled.
It is funny when you are SO dumb that you provide Wikipedia documentation for it.
Further down in the article it says: Many interpreted languages are first compiled to some form of virtual machine code, which is then either interpreted or compiled at runtime to native code.
The above accurately describes Java. Java is first COMPILED to intermediary code, and then (these days) the intermediary code (or pcode) is COMPILED into machine code.
Thank you for referring to that article that ALSO proves you a moron.
The RUNTIME does the compiling
Correct. It does the COMPILING. Good to see you finally caught on. Now, back to the original statement, even though it is the runtime that does the COMPILING, why does that prevent optimizations?
Pcode is not compiled code
If you wrote the pcode from scratch it is not compiled. If it was the result of a COMPILATION process, it is compiled. Just as your help files, the .chm files on windows are COMPILED help files.
Something is compiled that went through a compiler whether that is C that went through a APD Pascal compiler (output is C), Help files (went through the Microsoft Help compiler) Java bytecode, went through the Java compiler etc. Again, please read up on what a compiler is, I have sent you many, many references that ALL refer to various types of COMPILERS. Including the Java COMPILER - javac.
Java is not a compiled language
And all of the references I sent you, you didn't read A SINGLE ONE of them?
Oh, and why do you refuse to answer the original question here? What is it that prevents Java compiled bytecode to be optimized? What is it that prevents a Java compiler from optimizing prior to turning out bytecode. You are the one that stated Java could not be optimized. Why is that so? Why will you not answer it?