"3W LEDs (one amp into an XRE or XPG) need something like 9 square inches of aluminum stock in free air"
Dunno where you get that one from. I've got 300w panels being cooled by dual 5x7 chunks of 1040 aluminum.
"I think that LEDs might be doing better than 40% right now, too"
Nope, that's the current max for single wavelengths. I work very closely with companies like Cree, Nichia, etc. Not much of any company's LED product gets close to that number, excepting the UV/Blue LEDs.
Because your dimmer is in the wrong fucking spot. Do it AFTER the power driver. If you can't, then spend the extra to get a remote-controlled lamp that works in the socket as described.
It's like slashdot suddenly forgot that it's a fucking geek/nerd spot. You fuckers should already have electricity down by now, and know where to place a fucking potentiometer. It's not like this information hasn't been available since the fucking 1960s, after all, half a fucking century ago.
You'll be displeased. Single-color wavelengths are so much more efficient you'll likely end up getting a color temp you don't want even with a remote control doing RGB.
Already been there, already done that. You'll see my LED work around football/tennis pitches in EU and Australia.
First off, the data sheets for any LED that is NOT IR/UV specific will never mention Ir/UV, despite them emitting plenty (most white diodes are a highly-efficient UV LED with a specialized phosphor blend, and IR is a natural by-product of thermodynamics.)
Try again when you know the basics of science, please.
"No, it's not. PF is about the "shape" of the load, not the magnitude of the load."
WRONG. The power factor of an AC electrical power system is defined as the ratio of the real power flowing to the load, to the apparent power in the circuit.
Ignore the idiot AC that doesn't know shit about semiconductors and power transfer.
"Consumer CFLs are extremely voltage sensitive, particularly to over-voltage."
sounds like your CFL makers failed to think about power lines being possibly more efficient than regulation (131V is actually a good voltage to ensure you aren't under-volt killing your equipment when run through a transformer, and a resistor should handle the rest) and failed to consider current regulation.
"I'm glad to see energy star mean something. Most of the time it means fuck-all."
ALL OF THE TIME IT MEANS FUCK-ALL.
It's a bullshit certification company for MARKETING PURPOSES.
And if you can't pay, you can't play, and are at the mercy of those consumers stupid enough to fall for ES certification.
Here's how stupid ES certification is:
They do not certify LED-based growing lamps. This proves they're incompetent in dealing with certifying light of any sorts, despite these lights having higher efficiencies than full-range white LED light in every fucking measure.
The big issue here is really the ballast/electronics, not the phosphors or in-tube electrodes.
That sylvania needs to be replaced, though, if it lasts as long as you claim. It's well past phosphor droop levels, even if it only had a true life cycle of 10,000 hours, over that time.
"Now I am just waiting for someone to sell a reasonably powerful G16.5 base led (like 300+ lumens/25-40 W equivalent)"
Sure, you want my dual Cree MK-R lamp? 400 lumens for 2 watts if you can keep the junctins at room temperature. If not, maybe you'll get 170 lumens per watt. I'll build one for you to fit an E26/27 socket or get one of my four Chinese makers to build it to specs you'll never get from anyone else.
Protip: LEDs HATE humidity, and most of them are NOT reliably sealed until you add some pressure from a lens assembly.
The MK-Rs Cree sent me are HORRIBLE in higher-humidity applications. So far, I've had several MK-Rs, brand new engineering samples, fail just hanging a few inches from my covered fish tank.
Sadly, this has been the case with EVERY 'high-humidity' LED manufacturer I've worked with/tested.
"and the heat output from individual LEDs is so low"
Maybe from your cheap-ass tail-thru LEDs.
You try powering a 1w SMD-LED without any thermal consideration.
You'll be lucky to get 500 hours of operating time out of it. It will slag itself.
Just saying since I'm working with 15w LEDs in a 7mm x 7mm package, and those can slag themselves within a few SECONDS without proper thermal consideration.
The myth of LEDs don't emit heat is bullshit. HPS is about 20% efficient in energy in/light out. LED at the max is 40% in single wavelengths currently.
So the reality is you get a 400w LED, you might emit 25% less heat vs an equivalent power HPS, but you're still dumping more than 200w of heat out into the air/localized fixture.
" Comment on TFA mentions this -- electrolytic capacitors have a lifetime that is very sensitive to heat, and can be quite short."
Except most CFLs I see use tantalum capacitors, not electrolytics, because tantalum caps are smaller, much smaller, and cheaper, and mroe reliable.
Plenty of companies send them to me, and I do LED lighitng, and they think these CFLs can still compare. Not when I'm pushing 150+ lumens per watt for visual lighting, you can't compete.
You mean power transformer with resistors. Not quite a rectifier. Trying to use a diode as a rectifier in an LED system is dumb as shit and leads to the most failures unless the power supply is already rolling the DC needed.
This is why I use constant current drivers with more components.
"There are quite a few incandescent that do not have a long life if run in the upside down position, or if run in a fixture that gets hotter than normal."
You're thinking HID lamps. Incandescent doesn't give two fucks about orientation.
Source: I design and install lighting from horticulture to interior lighting.
Slashdot Mirror
"3W LEDs (one amp into an XRE or XPG) need something like 9 square inches of aluminum stock in free air"
Dunno where you get that one from. I've got 300w panels being cooled by dual 5x7 chunks of 1040 aluminum.
"I think that LEDs might be doing better than 40% right now, too"
Nope, that's the current max for single wavelengths. I work very closely with companies like Cree, Nichia, etc. Not much of any company's LED product gets close to that number, excepting the UV/Blue LEDs.
"They are great, but don't work with dimmers."
Because your dimmer is in the wrong fucking spot. Do it AFTER the power driver. If you can't, then spend the extra to get a remote-controlled lamp that works in the socket as described.
It's like slashdot suddenly forgot that it's a fucking geek/nerd spot. You fuckers should already have electricity down by now, and know where to place a fucking potentiometer. It's not like this information hasn't been available since the fucking 1960s, after all, half a fucking century ago.
And it comes out with far less efficiency versus a standard RGBW array.
Try again when you understand actual LED technology.
That's called ceramic recombination.
And those phosphors are far better than fluorescent phosphors.
See?
Fuck you're so wrong it's not even funny. Update your knowledgebase. At best we need a boost in the 420 and 670 nm range.
Get with the times, please.
You'll be displeased. Single-color wavelengths are so much more efficient you'll likely end up getting a color temp you don't want even with a remote control doing RGB.
Already been there, already done that. You'll see my LED work around football/tennis pitches in EU and Australia.
only 90 for a Philips Cree-stealing LED?
I get 93+ CRI for real Cree equipment at half the price and 7000K. And I get the heatsink, drivers, and boards for free.
You're so wrong it's not even funny.
First off, the data sheets for any LED that is NOT IR/UV specific will never mention Ir/UV, despite them emitting plenty (most white diodes are a highly-efficient UV LED with a specialized phosphor blend, and IR is a natural by-product of thermodynamics.)
Try again when you know the basics of science, please.
" The LED casts a cold spectrum that to my eyes is just a yellowish version of what florescent light emits."
This is because Philips lights suck in CRI.
Go Cree if you want real color temps. Philips is just a shit-tier knockoff and does nothing to truly further the LED industry.
"No, it's not. PF is about the "shape" of the load, not the magnitude of the load."
WRONG. The power factor of an AC electrical power system is defined as the ratio of the real power flowing to the load, to the apparent power in the circuit.
Ignore the idiot AC that doesn't know shit about semiconductors and power transfer.
"Consumer CFLs are extremely voltage sensitive, particularly to over-voltage."
sounds like your CFL makers failed to think about power lines being possibly more efficient than regulation (131V is actually a good voltage to ensure you aren't under-volt killing your equipment when run through a transformer, and a resistor should handle the rest) and failed to consider current regulation.
"I'm glad to see energy star mean something. Most of the time it means fuck-all."
ALL OF THE TIME IT MEANS FUCK-ALL.
It's a bullshit certification company for MARKETING PURPOSES.
And if you can't pay, you can't play, and are at the mercy of those consumers stupid enough to fall for ES certification.
Here's how stupid ES certification is:
They do not certify LED-based growing lamps. This proves they're incompetent in dealing with certifying light of any sorts, despite these lights having higher efficiencies than full-range white LED light in every fucking measure.
The big issue here is really the ballast/electronics, not the phosphors or in-tube electrodes.
That sylvania needs to be replaced, though, if it lasts as long as you claim. It's well past phosphor droop levels, even if it only had a true life cycle of 10,000 hours, over that time.
Just bear in mind your current CFLs are likely nearing the end of the useful electrode/phosphor lifespan by now.
Very soon you'll be hitting incan efficiencies. Might want to refresh those CFLs or go LED.
"Now I am just waiting for someone to sell a reasonably powerful G16.5 base led (like 300+ lumens/25-40 W equivalent)"
Sure, you want my dual Cree MK-R lamp? 400 lumens for 2 watts if you can keep the junctins at room temperature. If not, maybe you'll get 170 lumens per watt. I'll build one for you to fit an E26/27 socket or get one of my four Chinese makers to build it to specs you'll never get from anyone else.
Into the bathroom? BAD MOVE.
Protip: LEDs HATE humidity, and most of them are NOT reliably sealed until you add some pressure from a lens assembly.
The MK-Rs Cree sent me are HORRIBLE in higher-humidity applications. So far, I've had several MK-Rs, brand new engineering samples, fail just hanging a few inches from my covered fish tank.
Sadly, this has been the case with EVERY 'high-humidity' LED manufacturer I've worked with/tested.
"and the heat output from individual LEDs is so low"
Maybe from your cheap-ass tail-thru LEDs.
You try powering a 1w SMD-LED without any thermal consideration.
You'll be lucky to get 500 hours of operating time out of it. It will slag itself.
Just saying since I'm working with 15w LEDs in a 7mm x 7mm package, and those can slag themselves within a few SECONDS without proper thermal consideration.
The myth of LEDs don't emit heat is bullshit. HPS is about 20% efficient in energy in/light out. LED at the max is 40% in single wavelengths currently.
So the reality is you get a 400w LED, you might emit 25% less heat vs an equivalent power HPS, but you're still dumping more than 200w of heat out into the air/localized fixture.
Speaking as an LED light manufacturer and current leading tester of the MK-R and XP-G2 LEDs from Cree.
" Comment on TFA mentions this -- electrolytic capacitors have a lifetime that is very sensitive to heat, and can be quite short."
Except most CFLs I see use tantalum capacitors, not electrolytics, because tantalum caps are smaller, much smaller, and cheaper, and mroe reliable.
Plenty of companies send them to me, and I do LED lighitng, and they think these CFLs can still compare. Not when I'm pushing 150+ lumens per watt for visual lighting, you can't compete.
The only real difference is the lack of a vent and the inclusion of a sealing ring.
"and might eventually even give a good color."
Guess you've not been watching LED for the past 5 years.
Better look at this, pal.
You mean power transformer with resistors. Not quite a rectifier. Trying to use a diode as a rectifier in an LED system is dumb as shit and leads to the most failures unless the power supply is already rolling the DC needed.
This is why I use constant current drivers with more components.
Just FYI, here's how much of a scam Energy Star is - they can't even prosecute LED grow light manufacturers claiming ES compliance.
So they keep on going. Take money when they can, give certs out to those that can pay, and that's it.
Welcome to my nightmare. Energy Star needs to be wiped the fuck out.
"Exactly -- I'm looking for a consistent quality ACROSS brands. Certification should mean that el cheapo brand performs well,"
el cheapo can't get certified despite higher-quality because of the insane barrier to entry - cost of certification.
Energy Star is a scam, plain and simple. A RICO scam, at that.
"There are quite a few incandescent that do not have a long life if run in the upside down position, or if run in a fixture that gets hotter than normal."
You're thinking HID lamps. Incandescent doesn't give two fucks about orientation.
Source: I design and install lighting from horticulture to interior lighting.
The leading cause for CFL death is ELECTRONICS HEAT.
And when you buy CFL bulbs that have the entire ballast contained within a sealed and unventilated plastic housing, what the hell do you expect?