The only murderous people at Homestead were the strikers, not the ones trying to escort and defend the non-striking workers:
It was the strikers who opened fire first. They murdered a few Pinkertons, tried to burn alive those agents who attempted to surrender, and then after accepting the agents' surrender, proceeded to torture them.
At Homestead, Pinkertons were trying to escort replacement workers into a steel mill. The strikers opened fire first, murdered a few Pinkertons, tried to burn alive Pinkertons who were attempting to surrender, and then after accepting the Pinkertons' surrender, proceeded to torture them.
Not at all suprising that Wikipedia conspicuously fails to mention this.
You do not know the meaning of fascism. Instead, you're using the term as a mere epithet.
Fascists have a view of world history in which ethnic or national groups are primary. They have a Hobbesian theory of society and the State where the nation must be reified as an individual, where disagreement and competition must be forcibly suppressed. Economic ideology is corporatist: having nothing to do with business corporations, but rather a form of guild socialism - central planning, where market competition is suppressed by the State, and sectors of society and the economy, such as agriculture, business, labor, etc. are regimented into organizations under a single governing body and forced to negotiate with each other to establish policies in the interest of each organization and the body as a whole.
The sentence referring to Supreme Court rulings between 1876 and 1939 is a lie. In U.S. vs. Miller, for example, the court never questioned that the Second Amendment was an individual right, only whether or not a short-barrelled shotgun was an appropriate military weapon.
At Homestead, Pinkertons were trying to escort replacement workers into a steel mill. The strikers opened fire first, murdered a few Pinkertons, tried to burn alive Pinkertons who were attempting to surrender, and then after accepting the Pinkertons' surrender, proceeded to torture them.
I was down at the foot of Beaver Avenue, Allegheny, yesterday, when Captain Rogers employed me to go up the river on his boat â" the Little Bill.
Our boat had in tow one barge of Pinkerton men and the Tide had the other. While going up, the Tide was disabled, and we took our barge up in front of Homestead, and then went back for the Tide's.
We made a landing at the Homestead mills about five o'clock this morning. The shore was crowded with the locked out men and their sympathizers.
The armed pinkerton men commenced to climb up the banks. Then the workmen opened fire on the detectives.
The men shot first, and not until three of the pinkerton men had fallen did they respond to the fire.
I am willing to take an oath that the workmen fired first, and that the Pinkerton men did not shoot until some of their number had been wounded.
The workmen were so strong in numbers that it was useless for the three fifty or four hundred Pinkertons men to oppose them further, so they retreated to the barges, carrying their dead and wounded.
One Pinkerton man was shot through the head and instantly killed, and five were wounded.
We backed out into the river, anchored the barges, and then took the dead and wounded men up to Port Perry, whence they were sent on the Baltimore and Ohio Railroad to Pittsburg. We then went down to Homestead again.
We were going along peaceably and expecting no trouble. When we reached the mills the strikers opened fire on the Little Bill from both sides. It was then I was hit.
The bullets broke the glass and splintered the woodwork. Captain Alexander McMichaels was at the wheel. The bullets crashed through the glass pilothouse, and to save his life, he had to rush below. Captain Rogers was on board, and he displayed great bravery.
When the firing commenced, we all laid down on the floor to escape the bullets, but I was not quick enough, and was wounded. There was a cessation in the firing, and the pilot secured control of the boat before it ran into the bank, which it came near doing.
There was no one on board at the time we were fired upon, but the crew, Captain Rogers, and one Pinkerton man, J.H. Robinson of Chicago.
When we approached Homestead from Port Perry we could see the attempts to set fire to the barges.
The strikers had a carload of what appeared to be oil, and were pouring it on the river and igniting it. The barges at this time were out in the middle of the river.
Considering that this "specific class" is constantly being redefined to be ever-more stringent, I would say that the original assessments by the previous posters are correct.
"General Bradley said that we must draw the line somewhere. The President stated he agreed on that. General Bradley said that Russia is not yet ready for war. The Korean situation offered as good an occasion for action in drawing the line as anywhere else."
The Korean War did not start with the partition. It started when North Korea invaded South Korea at the behest of Stalin.
"In 1961, Kennedy agreed that America should finance an increase in the size of the South Vietnamese Army from 150,000 to 170,000. He also agreed that an extra 1000 US military advisors should be sent to South Vietnam to help train the South Vietnamese Army. Both of these decisions were not made public as they broke the agreements made at the 1954 Geneva Agreement."
North Vietnam had made the decision to attempt to conquer the South well before Kennedy's action.
The article is entitled "Covert United States foreign regime change actions." What are you claiming it is discussing instead of covert foreign regime change actions executed by the United States? Why are you denying the validity of US government provided declassified information?
The article does not claim what you say it does. The US was not involved in the coups that occurred in Brazil and Chile, for instance.
The US did not start the Korean War, nor did it start the Vietnam War. The figures for military and civilian deaths are from both sides. I can only conclude that the figures for the civil wars in Cambodia and Laos were pulled from his ass, as Wikipedia lists the total number of dead (presumably both civilian and military) for the Cambodian Civil War at 200,000 to 300,000, and the Laotian Civil War at 20,000 to 200,000.
For Iraq, the vast majority of killings is Muslims slaughtering other Muslims.
The Wikipedia article you cite gives a long list, but fails to prove that the US was directly responsible for most of the regime changes that actually occured.
A memorable example is the Tucson shooting. He was brought down during a reload. Hence, it would have ended sooner if the gunman didn't have easy access to extended clips.
And shortly after Reagan created the Taliban and Al Qaeda.
This is, of course, a lie. The mujahedeen in Afghanistan that was supported by the United States became the Northern Alliance, whose leader was murdered by the Taliban the day before 9/11.
The whole point of Sarbanes-Oxley is people had no clue Enron was doing weird shit.
Untrue. Those who carefully examined Enron's books smelled something funny, and then when word got out, investors and creditors panicked, causing Enron's demise. Compare this with MF Global, where nobody who carefully examined MF Global's books could tell that MF Global had pissed away its customer's money.
Compare what happened before Sarbanes-Oxley, and what happened after Sarbanes-Oxley; before SOX, you were able to find out that Enron's books were full of shit before you lost money. After SOX, you only found out about this sort of strange accounting after your financial institution went under, and you found yourself left with nothing.
Unregulated capitalism ALWAYS and INEVITABLY can ONLY devolve into outright fascism [syn: corporatism] (which is exactly what is happening in the USA right now).
You obviously don't know what fascism is.
Fascists have a view of world history in which ethnic or national groups are primary, and a Hobbesian theory of society and the State where the nation must be reified as an individual, where disagreement and competition must be forcibly suppressed. Economic ideology is corporatist - having nothing to do with business corporations. Rather, it is a form of guild socialism - central planning, where market competition is suppressed by the State, and sectors of society and the economy, such as agriculture, business, labor, etc. are regimented into organizations under a single governing body and forced to negotiate with each other to establish policies in the interest of each organization and the body as a whole.
The US was not responsible for starting either the Korean or Vietnam wars, and certainly did not kill 2 million people during the Vietnam war, which is actually the figure for both sides. In Iraq, most of the killing done was Muslim-on-Muslim violence.
Mao, on the other hand, was responsible for around 30 to 60 million deaths, possibly as high as 76 million, according to R.J. Rummel. Pol Pot, around 3 million.
Your assertion is not so much absurd as it is insane. I'll see your "The US has killed more civilians since WW2 than everyone else put together", and raise you a Mao and a Pol Pot.
Therefore we should cut-off food and starve 1 million Iranians just like we starved 1 million Iraqis during the 1990s embargo.
The sanctions on Iraq never restricted food or medicine.
And when that doesn't work (because it won't), we should bomb the hell out of them and kill (or maim) another 1 million innocent men, women, and children like we did in Iraq in 2002 to 2011.
The vast majority of civilian deaths in Iraq during that period was due to Muslim-on-Muslim violence, not US bombs.
We encouraged our long-time friend Saddam to invade Kuwait (document revealed by wikileaks & read on the floor by Congressman Paul). And then we acted surprised and attacked Saddam. We set it up. We executed it.
Untrue. (Yes, I know who April Glaspie is, and no, she did not give Hussein permission on behalf of the US government to invade Kuwait.)
Intervened in a civil war, taking the side of the neo-fascists against the Greek left which had fought the Nazis courageously. The neo-fascists won and instituted a highly brutal regime, for which the CIA created a new internal security agency, KYP. Before long, KYP was carrying out all the endearing practices of secret police everywhere, including systematic torture.
After the communists lost an election and a referendum, the armed forces of the Greek communist party fought to impose a totalitarian dictatorship on Greece, with substantial moral and material support from the Soviet Union, against those who either fled or fought against the Nazis, causing a considerable loss of life.
After World War II, the United States suppressed the popular progressive forces in favor of the conservatives who had collaborated with the Japanese. This led to a long era of corrupt, reactionary, and brutal governments.
"Popular progressive forces" being Stalin, who ordered the invasion and conquest of Korea, right?
The CIA orchestrated a wide-ranging campaign of sabotage, terrorism, dirty tricks, and psychological warfare against East Germany. This was one of the factors which led to the building of the Berlin Wall in 1961.
I suppose you honestly do believe that the Berlin Wall was built to keep people out.
Prime Minister Mossadegh was overthrown in a joint U.S./British operation. Mossadegh had been elected to his position by a large majority of parliament
After the murder of his predecessor, whose policies Mossadegh opposed.
A CIA-organized coup overthrew the democratically-elected and progressive government of Jacobo Arbenz,
Arbenz never won a free and fair election.
initiating 40 years of death-squads, torture, disappearances, mass executions, and unimaginable cruelty, totaling well over 100,000 victims -indisputably one of the most inhuman chapters of the 20th century. Arbenz had nationalized the U.S. firm, United Fruit Company, which had extremely close ties to the American power elite. As justification for the coup, Washington declared that Guatemala had been on the verge of a Soviet takeover, when in fact the Russians had so little interest in the country that it didn't even maintain diplomatic relations. The real problem in the eyes of Washington, in addition to United Fruit, was the danger of Guatemala's social democracy spreading to other countries in Latin America.
Or rather, what happened was that Arbenz instituted land reform, but then banned opposing political parties, dismissed the supreme court, arrested the parliament, suspended civil rights, murdered his opponents, and sought arms from the Soviet Union to deal with his enemies. Only then did the CIA start sending guns to the resistance.
The slippery slope began with siding with ~ French, the former colonizers and collaborators with the Japanese, against Ho Chi Minh and his followers who had worked closely with the Allied war effort and admired all things American.
Bullshit.
Ho Chi Minh was, after all, some kind of Communist. He had written numerous letters to President Truman and the State Department asking for America's help in winning Vietnamese independence from the French and finding a peaceful solution for his country.
Ho Chi Minh was sent from Moscow, where one of his duties prior to 1944 was organizing the murder of Vietnamese nationalists, to rule over Vietnam. Once in power, he purged 85 percent of the Communist party. During forced collectivization, which happened long before the US responded to his making war against the South, Ho Chi Minh set execution quotas of five people or five percent of each village.
Slashdot Mirror
Believers in âoeconsensusâ and âoepeer reviewâ are priests:
http://dresdencodak.com/2011/0...
The only murderous people at Homestead were the strikers, not the ones trying to escort and defend the non-striking workers:
It was the strikers who opened fire first. They murdered a few Pinkertons, tried to burn alive those agents who attempted to surrender, and then after accepting the agents' surrender, proceeded to torture them.
People trying to legitimately defend their property from violent trespassers are not "thugs", except maybe to the deranged.
At Homestead, Pinkertons were trying to escort replacement workers into a steel mill. The strikers opened fire first, murdered a few Pinkertons, tried to burn alive Pinkertons who were attempting to surrender, and then after accepting the Pinkertons' surrender, proceeded to torture them.
Not at all suprising that Wikipedia conspicuously fails to mention this.
You do not know the meaning of fascism. Instead, you're using the term as a mere epithet.
Fascists have a view of world history in which ethnic or national groups are primary. They have a Hobbesian theory of society and the State where the nation must be reified as an individual, where disagreement and competition must be forcibly suppressed. Economic ideology is corporatist: having nothing to do with business corporations, but rather a form of guild socialism - central planning, where market competition is suppressed by the State, and sectors of society and the economy, such as agriculture, business, labor, etc. are regimented into organizations under a single governing body and forced to negotiate with each other to establish policies in the interest of each organization and the body as a whole.
The sentence referring to Supreme Court rulings between 1876 and 1939 is a lie. In U.S. vs. Miller, for example, the court never questioned that the Second Amendment was an individual right, only whether or not a short-barrelled shotgun was an appropriate military weapon.
At Homestead, Pinkertons were trying to escort replacement workers into a steel mill. The strikers opened fire first, murdered a few Pinkertons, tried to burn alive Pinkertons who were attempting to surrender, and then after accepting the Pinkertons' surrender, proceeded to torture them.
From The New York Times, July 7, 1892, John T. McCurry quoted:
I was down at the foot of Beaver Avenue, Allegheny, yesterday, when Captain Rogers employed me to go up the river on his boat â" the Little Bill.
Our boat had in tow one barge of Pinkerton men and the Tide had the other. While going up, the Tide was disabled, and we took our barge up in front of Homestead, and then went back for the Tide's.
We made a landing at the Homestead mills about five o'clock this morning. The shore was crowded with the locked out men and their sympathizers.
The armed pinkerton men commenced to climb up the banks. Then the workmen opened fire on the detectives.
The men shot first, and not until three of the pinkerton men had fallen did they respond to the fire.
I am willing to take an oath that the workmen fired first, and that the Pinkerton men did not shoot until some of their number had been wounded.
The workmen were so strong in numbers that it was useless for the three fifty or four hundred Pinkertons men to oppose them further, so they retreated to the barges, carrying their dead and wounded.
One Pinkerton man was shot through the head and instantly killed, and five were wounded.
We backed out into the river, anchored the barges, and then took the dead and wounded men up to Port Perry, whence they were sent on the Baltimore and Ohio Railroad to Pittsburg. We then went down to Homestead again.
We were going along peaceably and expecting no trouble. When we reached the mills the strikers opened fire on the Little Bill from both sides. It was then I was hit.
The bullets broke the glass and splintered the woodwork. Captain Alexander McMichaels was at the wheel. The bullets crashed through the glass pilothouse, and to save his life, he had to rush below. Captain Rogers was on board, and he displayed great bravery.
When the firing commenced, we all laid down on the floor to escape the bullets, but I was not quick enough, and was wounded. There was a cessation in the firing, and the pilot secured control of the boat before it ran into the bank, which it came near doing.
There was no one on board at the time we were fired upon, but the crew, Captain Rogers, and one Pinkerton man, J.H. Robinson of Chicago.
When we approached Homestead from Port Perry we could see the attempts to set fire to the barges.
The strikers had a carload of what appeared to be oil, and were pouring it on the river and igniting it. The barges at this time were out in the middle of the river.
Liar.
Considering that this "specific class" is constantly being redefined to be ever-more stringent, I would say that the original assessments by the previous posters are correct.
Liar. Al Queda did not exist when the US was funding the Afghan mujahedeen (who later became the Northern Alliance).
The Korean War did not start with the partition. It started when North Korea invaded South Korea at the behest of Stalin.
North Vietnam had made the decision to attempt to conquer the South well before Kennedy's action.
The article does not claim what you say it does. The US was not involved in the coups that occurred in Brazil and Chile, for instance.
The US did not start the Korean War, nor did it start the Vietnam War. The figures for military and civilian deaths are from both sides. I can only conclude that the figures for the civil wars in Cambodia and Laos were pulled from his ass, as Wikipedia lists the total number of dead (presumably both civilian and military) for the Cambodian Civil War at 200,000 to 300,000, and the Laotian Civil War at 20,000 to 200,000.
For Iraq, the vast majority of killings is Muslims slaughtering other Muslims.
The Wikipedia article you cite gives a long list, but fails to prove that the US was directly responsible for most of the regime changes that actually occured.
Both those figures are complete lies.
Newly manufactured "military grade assault rifles" have been banned from civilians since 1986.
He was not reloading. His "extended clip" jammed.
This is, of course, a lie. The mujahedeen in Afghanistan that was supported by the United States became the Northern Alliance, whose leader was murdered by the Taliban the day before 9/11.
Untrue. Those who carefully examined Enron's books smelled something funny, and then when word got out, investors and creditors panicked, causing Enron's demise. Compare this with MF Global, where nobody who carefully examined MF Global's books could tell that MF Global had pissed away its customer's money.
Compare what happened before Sarbanes-Oxley, and what happened after Sarbanes-Oxley; before SOX, you were able to find out that Enron's books were full of shit before you lost money. After SOX, you only found out about this sort of strange accounting after your financial institution went under, and you found yourself left with nothing.
That quote is a fake.
You obviously don't know what fascism is.
Fascists have a view of world history in which ethnic or national groups are primary, and a Hobbesian theory of society and the State where the nation must be reified as an individual, where disagreement and competition must be forcibly suppressed. Economic ideology is corporatist - having nothing to do with business corporations. Rather, it is a form of guild socialism - central planning, where market competition is suppressed by the State, and sectors of society and the economy, such as agriculture, business, labor, etc. are regimented into organizations under a single governing body and forced to negotiate with each other to establish policies in the interest of each organization and the body as a whole.
Capitalism is diametrically opposed to fascism.
The US was not responsible for starting either the Korean or Vietnam wars, and certainly did not kill 2 million people during the Vietnam war, which is actually the figure for both sides. In Iraq, most of the killing done was Muslim-on-Muslim violence.
Mao, on the other hand, was responsible for around 30 to 60 million deaths, possibly as high as 76 million, according to R.J. Rummel. Pol Pot, around 3 million.
Your assertion is not so much absurd as it is insane. I'll see your "The US has killed more civilians since WW2 than everyone else put together", and raise you a Mao and a Pol Pot.
The sanctions on Iraq never restricted food or medicine.
The vast majority of civilian deaths in Iraq during that period was due to Muslim-on-Muslim violence, not US bombs.
Untrue. (Yes, I know who April Glaspie is, and no, she did not give Hussein permission on behalf of the US government to invade Kuwait.)
After the communists lost an election and a referendum, the armed forces of the Greek communist party fought to impose a totalitarian dictatorship on Greece, with substantial moral and material support from the Soviet Union, against those who either fled or fought against the Nazis, causing a considerable loss of life.
"Popular progressive forces" being Stalin, who ordered the invasion and conquest of Korea, right?
I suppose you honestly do believe that the Berlin Wall was built to keep people out.
After the murder of his predecessor, whose policies Mossadegh opposed.
Arbenz never won a free and fair election.
Or rather, what happened was that Arbenz instituted land reform, but then banned opposing political parties, dismissed the supreme court, arrested the parliament, suspended civil rights, murdered his opponents, and sought arms from the Soviet Union to deal with his enemies. Only then did the CIA start sending guns to the resistance.
Bullshit.
Ho Chi Minh was sent from Moscow, where one of his duties prior to 1944 was organizing the murder of Vietnamese nationalists, to rule over Vietnam. Once in power, he purged 85 percent of the Communist party. During forced collectivization, which happened long before the US responded to his making war against the South, Ho Chi Minh set execution quotas of five people or five percent of each village.