XFCE... I hadn't used it in a while until I got frustrated with Gnome 3... it is now basically Gnome 2.X minus some of the settings in control panel. It looks almost identical. I used Xubntu and on my SSD it boots in about 5 seconds, no joke.
Well, ever since Xfce devs decided to transform their DE into a GNOME 2.x clone with Xfce 4.0, two teams were developing basically the same thing. Pretty retarded if you ask me. So the GNOME devs went on and ended the "two teams doing the same" shit and no do something new.
Unity is available for openSUSE but not as default if that was your question. So far Unity for openSUSE is only available from an not officially supported repository.
Switching the whole distro just because one does not like the default DE is pretty stupid. One can always stay with the same distro and just switch DEs, especially considering that GNOME 3.x ships with a GTK3 port of classic GNOME Panel, including Metacity.
Err... so 2 OS's that are already developed, marketed and beta tested are more expensive then 1 new one?
Yeah, the article author seems to be a clueless retard. On one hand he claims that Nokia developed a whole new platform with MeeGo and OTOH he claims that Nokia can simply take Linux and easily make it Meltemi without much cost. He totally misses the fact that MeeGo is already done (see N9) and that many players -- mostly Intel -- also contributed to it. That means the development workload was shared. With Meltemi Nokia has to develop everything besides the kernel by itself: Way more costly. The first "conspiracy theory" which paints "Nokia as a bunch of bumbling idiots" is actually not far off. Had Nokia simply announced back then with the WP7 news that Nokia would work to broaden the scope of MeeGo to target feature phones as well and replace S40 and Symbian, MeeGo would still be alive today(*) it would target the whole range from feature phones to tablets.
(*= Some of you may know the Maemo "Mer" community. It was announced that Mer wants to pick up MeeGo and continue it. The only remaining question is whether Linux Foundation allows Mer to use the MeeGo trademark. See http://blog.rburchell.com/2011/10/meego-reconstructed-plan-of-action-and.html for details.)
Sony Ericsson is known to put out quality hardware, Nokia is known for just putting out.
SE makes good hardware? Since when? I've had 3 SE phones and they all sucked on the hardware level (software as well -- eg. worst T9 ever). I'd go so far saying that any hardware related to post-1990 Sony sucks.
Re:For those of us who prefer a video
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GNOME 3.2 Released
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· Score: 1
That video just demonstrates why I'm sticking with 2.30.2. No traditional taskbar method of switching between applications is a deal breaker.
The classic GNOME Panel is still part of GNOME 3. If the GPU allows it, GNOME Shell is just default. It can be reverted to Panel at any time.
Microsoft and Apple have been buddy buddy for some years now, both teaming up against Google, which is a shame
It was Google who decided to end the alliance with Apple (which was forged against MS) and directly compete against Apple after gathering lots of insight Eric Schmidt gathered when he was on Apple's board of directors.
Everybody knows that Steve Jobs is a very emotional leader. So when Google backstabbed Apple he didn't just shrug it off as mere business tactic. Although, by Jobs' standards he reacted very calm. Bing was added to Safari etc. in addition to Google, unlike the time when one GPU maker (can't remember whether it was AMD or NVidia) blew the story about new Mac hardware and he decided to ditch that GPU altogether and exclusively move to the competitor for quite some time.
I wouldn't call dropping everything but KDE as proof that they have very few contributors left.
It's a plain fact that Mandriva fired many employees over the last years. The latest round of large-scale layoffs was in 2010 or so which resulted in founding Mageia by the fired employees. Whether dropping GNOME is a result of that or not doesn't really matter in the end: Fact stays that Mandriva has almost no engineers left.
Red Hat and SUSE are successful because they have stuck to a single and coherent vision for their brand of Linux, because they have a good sales model that pushes support for their brand of Linux, because they have played major roles within the Linux community in general which attracts community contributors to use and support your distro, and because they have had strong word of mouth within the community.
Ubuntu has a way more chatty community than SUSE. Still: SUSE and Red Hat are financially successful while Canonical and Mandriva are not. When an enterprise customer hits a bug in RHEL or SLED, Red Hat / SUSE call their engineers, the engineers fix the bug for the customer, then after some additional testing the fix is released as update for all RHEL/SLED customers and then the fix gets upstreamed. Then and only then can wannabe-pros like Mandriva and Canonical try to backport that fix to their "enterprise" distribution. Which manager would buy enterprise support from a distributor that can't even fix bugs?
you have to remember that we are talking LTS for their free product. If you are a company you can purchase their "enterprise" Linux which has a different support cycle than the community version.
Um, no. Check mandriva.com again. Last time I checked, there was an enterprise desktop offering by Mandriva that shipped GNOME as default (unlike the KDE-focused consumer variant). That product seems to have vanished which leads me to the conclusion that that product was deprecated in favor of Mandiva 2011 LTS (that said even the consumer-level Mandriva Power Pack costs money and deserves an LTS cycle).
Also, Mandriva has forty-five engineers to date, most of them are in Brazil (which by the way is very KDE heavy country.)
Red Had and SUSE each have hundreds.
Re:Call me when things slow down ...
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Mandriva 2011 Out
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· Score: 1
Sounds like openSUSE + Evergreen (Community-supported long term bugfixes) + handpicked OBS repos.
Re:The new UI looks like an attempt to emulate Uni
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Mandriva 2011 Out
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· Score: 1
If anything, this proves how flexible Plasma Workspaces are. A handful of new Plasma widgets and you can end up with a completely different environment. I hope Mandriva and Rosa upstream their work to KDE that everyone could optionally use it.
Even though Mandriva is a French distribution, some parts of it are only available in Russian an English. Well, I guess such things happen after one fires most of its staff... I guess they see their future in the Russian market...
Mandriva will have an LTS option hopefully by the end of this year.
And who will maintain that? Every now and then Mandriva dramatically cuts its work force. You can't properly maintain a distribution for 3 years and additionally even release non-LTS versions at the same time without any engineers left.
Red Hat and SUSE both employ hundreds of engineers. That's why they are successful. How many engineers does Mandriva have left? 5? It certainly can't be that many if they need to drop anything but KPW as available and supported desktops...
I'm not aware of any drop in usage statistics of Fedora which ships G3 as default. So there should be a lot of people who like it, just not those who spend their time commenting on Slashdot;-)
Am I the only person in the universe who likes gnome 3?
I'm a KDE guy but I find GNOME Shell to be the second best thing after Plasma Desktop. I really can't stand GNOME 2.x and all the other DEs that still cling to 1990s conventions two decades later. If I wanted a Windows 95 GUI, I'd just use Windows 95. I prefer KPD's "everything is a widget" approach because I like high configurability but GS's completely new workspace approach is great, too.
Apart from sample gadget apps I have yet to see the appeal. I haven't seen a single native looking QML app for PC yet, the controls for doing so aren't even done yet, so how are they supposed to replace UI files?
Of course they are not done, because Qt 5.0 is not yet done. During Qt 4.x QML was an invention mainly for smartphones. QML for desktop apps won't happen before Qt 5.0.
If KDE wants something for tablets, they should pick a certain version of their DE that they deem provides the minimal functionality that a tablet needs, and fork it from there. That way, the tablet side of things can meet its own requirements, w/o touching the desktop.
Your way increases the workload by 100% which is insane for a community project with very limited resources. KDE's approach is so much better because it does not need any forks.
Wasn't Meego already targeted @ the tablet market, granted non-KDE, but w/ the Qt tools & everything? When neither Nokia nor Intel could make it popular on tablets, how can KDE pull that off?
You're wrong. There so far there isn't an official MeeGo release for tablets. Intel and Nokia are still working on that which is why MeeGo couldn't have been a tablet success so far. (The WeTab uses a proprietary tablet GUI.)
I'm glad to hear that, because 4.0 truly sent me to Gnome. I don't really like Gnome, but the first few KDE 4 releases were almost unusable for me.
How often do we have to repeat that 4.0 and 4.1 were not meant for end users and that the 3.5.10 release (which happened AFTER 4.1) is proof of that? 4.2 was for end users. Granted, there were a few glitches in 4.2.0 but after 4.2.1 the Plasma Desktop ride was nothing but pleasant for me.
Slashdot Mirror
How dare you to correct a "Score:5, Insightful" comment with actual truth.
GNOME 3 sucks, I don't want a redefined UI, I want a robust, customizable, feature packed system. GNOME 2 does just that.
GNOME 3 is more customizable than GNOME 2.x ever was. GNOME Shell is written in JavaScript, so your customizations are just a text editor away.
XFCE... I hadn't used it in a while until I got frustrated with Gnome 3... it is now basically Gnome 2.X minus some of the settings in control panel. It looks almost identical. I used Xubntu and on my SSD it boots in about 5 seconds, no joke.
Well, ever since Xfce devs decided to transform their DE into a GNOME 2.x clone with Xfce 4.0, two teams were developing basically the same thing. Pretty retarded if you ask me.
So the GNOME devs went on and ended the "two teams doing the same" shit and no do something new.
Does this mean both distros adobted Unity?
Unity is available for openSUSE but not as default if that was your question.
So far Unity for openSUSE is only available from an not officially supported repository.
Switching the whole distro just because one does not like the default DE is pretty stupid. One can always stay with the same distro and just switch DEs, especially considering that GNOME 3.x ships with a GTK3 port of classic GNOME Panel, including Metacity.
Btw: What has Compiz to do with that?
Err... so 2 OS's that are already developed, marketed and beta tested are more expensive then 1 new one?
Yeah, the article author seems to be a clueless retard. On one hand he claims that Nokia developed a whole new platform with MeeGo and OTOH he claims that Nokia can simply take Linux and easily make it Meltemi without much cost.
He totally misses the fact that MeeGo is already done (see N9) and that many players -- mostly Intel -- also contributed to it. That means the development workload was shared. With Meltemi Nokia has to develop everything besides the kernel by itself: Way more costly.
The first "conspiracy theory" which paints "Nokia as a bunch of bumbling idiots" is actually not far off. Had Nokia simply announced back then with the WP7 news that Nokia would work to broaden the scope of MeeGo to target feature phones as well and replace S40 and Symbian, MeeGo would still be alive today(*) it would target the whole range from feature phones to tablets.
(*= Some of you may know the Maemo "Mer" community. It was announced that Mer wants to pick up MeeGo and continue it. The only remaining question is whether Linux Foundation allows Mer to use the MeeGo trademark. See http://blog.rburchell.com/2011/10/meego-reconstructed-plan-of-action-and.html for details.)
Sony Ericsson is known to put out quality hardware, Nokia is known for just putting out.
SE makes good hardware? Since when? I've had 3 SE phones and they all sucked on the hardware level (software as well -- eg. worst T9 ever).
I'd go so far saying that any hardware related to post-1990 Sony sucks.
That video just demonstrates why I'm sticking with 2.30.2. No traditional taskbar method of switching between applications is a deal breaker.
The classic GNOME Panel is still part of GNOME 3. If the GPU allows it, GNOME Shell is just default. It can be reverted to Panel at any time.
Microsoft and Apple have been buddy buddy for some years now, both teaming up against Google, which is a shame
It was Google who decided to end the alliance with Apple (which was forged against MS) and directly compete against Apple after gathering lots of insight Eric Schmidt gathered when he was on Apple's board of directors.
Everybody knows that Steve Jobs is a very emotional leader. So when Google backstabbed Apple he didn't just shrug it off as mere business tactic. Although, by Jobs' standards he reacted very calm. Bing was added to Safari etc. in addition to Google, unlike the time when one GPU maker (can't remember whether it was AMD or NVidia) blew the story about new Mac hardware and he decided to ditch that GPU altogether and exclusively move to the competitor for quite some time.
iPod Mini was a huge success when Apple ditched it in order to replace it with iPod Nano.
I don't know what you are writing about but it has nothing to do with the story.
why does all commits look like done by volunteers of RosaLabs
If comments here are to be believed, then Rosa and Mandriva are owned by the same (Russian) investor.
I wouldn't call dropping everything but KDE as proof that they have very few contributors left.
It's a plain fact that Mandriva fired many employees over the last years. The latest round of large-scale layoffs was in 2010 or so which resulted in founding Mageia by the fired employees.
Whether dropping GNOME is a result of that or not doesn't really matter in the end: Fact stays that Mandriva has almost no engineers left.
Red Hat and SUSE are successful because they have stuck to a single and coherent vision for their brand of Linux, because they have a good sales model that pushes support for their brand of Linux, because they have played major roles within the Linux community in general which attracts community contributors to use and support your distro, and because they have had strong word of mouth within the community.
Ubuntu has a way more chatty community than SUSE. Still: SUSE and Red Hat are financially successful while Canonical and Mandriva are not.
When an enterprise customer hits a bug in RHEL or SLED, Red Hat / SUSE call their engineers, the engineers fix the bug for the customer, then after some additional testing the fix is released as update for all RHEL/SLED customers and then the fix gets upstreamed. Then and only then can wannabe-pros like Mandriva and Canonical try to backport that fix to their "enterprise" distribution.
Which manager would buy enterprise support from a distributor that can't even fix bugs?
you have to remember that we are talking LTS for their free product. If you are a company you can purchase their "enterprise" Linux which has a different support cycle than the community version.
Um, no. Check mandriva.com again. Last time I checked, there was an enterprise desktop offering by Mandriva that shipped GNOME as default (unlike the KDE-focused consumer variant). That product seems to have vanished which leads me to the conclusion that that product was deprecated in favor of Mandiva 2011 LTS (that said even the consumer-level Mandriva Power Pack costs money and deserves an LTS cycle).
Also, Mandriva has forty-five engineers to date, most of them are in Brazil (which by the way is very KDE heavy country.)
Red Had and SUSE each have hundreds.
Sounds like openSUSE + Evergreen (Community-supported long term bugfixes) + handpicked OBS repos.
If anything, this proves how flexible Plasma Workspaces are. A handful of new Plasma widgets and you can end up with a completely different environment.
I hope Mandriva and Rosa upstream their work to KDE that everyone could optionally use it.
Even though Mandriva is a French distribution, some parts of it are only available in Russian an English.
Well, I guess such things happen after one fires most of its staff... I guess they see their future in the Russian market...
Mandriva will have an LTS option hopefully by the end of this year.
And who will maintain that? Every now and then Mandriva dramatically cuts its work force. You can't properly maintain a distribution for 3 years and additionally even release non-LTS versions at the same time without any engineers left.
Red Hat and SUSE both employ hundreds of engineers. That's why they are successful. How many engineers does Mandriva have left? 5? It certainly can't be that many if they need to drop anything but KPW as available and supported desktops...
I'm not aware of any drop in usage statistics of Fedora which ships G3 as default. So there should be a lot of people who like it, just not those who spend their time commenting on Slashdot ;-)
Am I the only person in the universe who likes gnome 3?
I'm a KDE guy but I find GNOME Shell to be the second best thing after Plasma Desktop. I really can't stand GNOME 2.x and all the other DEs that still cling to 1990s conventions two decades later. If I wanted a Windows 95 GUI, I'd just use Windows 95.
I prefer KPD's "everything is a widget" approach because I like high configurability but GS's completely new workspace approach is great, too.
it pisses me off that Dolphin uses it for its search
Dolphin does not use Strigi if it's disabled in System Settings.
Apart from sample gadget apps I have yet to see the appeal. I haven't seen a single native looking QML app for PC yet, the controls for doing so aren't even done yet, so how are they supposed to replace UI files?
Of course they are not done, because Qt 5.0 is not yet done. During Qt 4.x QML was an invention mainly for smartphones. QML for desktop apps won't happen before Qt 5.0.
If KDE wants something for tablets, they should pick a certain version of their DE that they deem provides the minimal functionality that a tablet needs, and fork it from there. That way, the tablet side of things can meet its own requirements, w/o touching the desktop.
Your way increases the workload by 100% which is insane for a community project with very limited resources. KDE's approach is so much better because it does not need any forks.
it needs to go on a diet.
Which part of modularizing in the interview didn't you understand?
Wasn't Meego already targeted @ the tablet market, granted non-KDE, but w/ the Qt tools & everything? When neither Nokia nor Intel could make it popular on tablets, how can KDE pull that off?
You're wrong. There so far there isn't an official MeeGo release for tablets. Intel and Nokia are still working on that which is why MeeGo couldn't have been a tablet success so far. (The WeTab uses a proprietary tablet GUI.)
I'm glad to hear that, because 4.0 truly sent me to Gnome. I don't really like Gnome, but the first few KDE 4 releases were almost unusable for me.
How often do we have to repeat that 4.0 and 4.1 were not meant for end users and that the 3.5.10 release (which happened AFTER 4.1) is proof of that?
4.2 was for end users. Granted, there were a few glitches in 4.2.0 but after 4.2.1 the Plasma Desktop ride was nothing but pleasant for me.