For the wrath of God is revealed from heaven against all ungodliness and unrighteousness of men, who hold the truth in unrighteousness;
19. Because that which may be known of God is manifest in them; for God hath shewed it unto them.
20. For the invisible things of him from the creation of the world are clearly seen, being understood by the things that are made, even his eternal power and Godhead; so that they are without excuse:
21. Because that, when they knew God, they glorified him not as God, neither were thankful; but became vain in their imaginations, and their foolish heart was darkened.
22. Professing themselves to be wise, they became fools,
23. And changed the glory of the uncorruptible God into an image made like to corruptible man, and to birds, and fourfooted beasts, and creeping things.
24. Wherefore God also gave them up to uncleanness through the lusts of their own hearts, to dishonour their own bodies between themselves:
25. Who changed the truth of God into a lie, and worshipped and served the creature more than the Creator, who is blessed for ever. Amen.
26. For this cause God gave them up unto vile affections: for even their women did change the natural use into that which is against nature:
Changing the speed limit has no measurable effect on the speed people drive (if the change is small),
That goes contrary to what I saw when the national 55 mph was mandated, and when the limits were raised again. At first people ignored the 55 mph and drove the speed they were used to, but after heavy enforcement the norm was about 60 mph (a cop usually won't pull you over unless you're doing more than 5 mph). When the limit was raised to 65, most people started doing 70.
As to the red light cameras, yes, those are put in for revenue, but in the name of safety. Ironically, they have been shown to increase the number of accidents, and some cities are discontinuing their use. Also, some cities have discovered that the expense of installation and maintenance isn't nearly covered by increased fine revenues.
That's the Jewish/Muslim bible, and for Christians was superceded by the new testament and the new covenant. God may hate sodomy, but in fact he loves homosexuals, whose sins are no worse than anyone else's. Actually, you might want to look at the list Moses brought down since you're so old tastament -- nothing in the ten comandments about homosexuality, but plenty against wanting what's not yours, against adultery, against slander, against murder. If "god hates fags" he hates the homophobic Newt Gingrich far more, that adulterous, slandering, money-grubbing asshole.
Actually, the new testament is down on rich people more than anyone. I don't think homosexuality is even mentioned in the new testament, is it?
Odd, then, that his wikipedia page puts so much emphasis on his athiesm (or "antitheism" as he put it) than anything else, even his writing. As I'd never heard of the guy, all I have to go on is wikipedia. I'm sure many of the mods are the same way. And, believe it or not, not everyone at slashdot is an athiest or antitheist.
You rant "I come to slashdot hoping to read some great comments about Hitchens and the first post i see moded up is someone being an religious apologist" yet you offer nothing of substance about him at all, yet you get a +4 insightful for your complete lack of isnight or information, and nothing interesting at all.
And religious apologist? I have many things to apologize for in my life, but religion isn't one of them. I will defend my religion against those who aould attack it, though. I'm sure the "religious apologist" you attacked feels the same way.
Mod me down for my beliefs and opinions, but from what I read in wikipedia, the guy sound like an A-grade asshole. Bashing Mother Theresa? WTF? I wouldn't have wanted to know the guy.
Removal of personal responsibility... has resulted in preventing Darwin Award winners from dying before they breed, thus steadily reducing the overall competence of the population.
It's amazing how few understand evolution. You do realise that you've had three years to breed before you can drive? That one can die without being stupid, and in fact the stupid can stupidly kill the intelligent with nothing more than stupidity?
You do realise that stupid people breed more than intelligent people? That redneck with an 85 point IQ and ten kids trumps my IQ and two kids. The slut that gets pregnant at age 13 trumps the intelligent girl who waits until college is over to have kids, only to be run over by the idiot with ten kids and a cell phone before she breeds? The childless nerd is the Darwin Award winner, not the retarded redneck with fifteen kids.
Darwinism doesn't work with people, not since we pretty much took care of all our predators.
How about instead of trying to toddler-proof the world, we teach little Johnny and little Sally how to be responsible
There's no such thing as a responsible five year old. It's the parent hat has to be responsible for their kids' safety. And you know what? I think the idea that leaving safety messages off of ladders and such is, well, STUPID. Double for dangers which aren't readily apparent.
You would do away with Billy's bicycle helmet, depriving the world of a first class physicist when his tire slips and he gets brain damage from the fall. If stupidity was fatal, you'd be dead by now.
This is why I've learned to deem Christianity as nothing more than hypocrisy.
Not Christianity, just many Christians. "And when thou prayest, thou shalt not be as the hypocrites are: for they love to pray standing in the synagogues and in the corners of the streets, that they may be seen of men. Verily I say unto you, They have their reward." -- Matthew 6:5
"You hypocrite, first take the log out of your own eye, and then you will see clearly to take the speck out of your brother's eye." -- Matthew 7:5
Bus? Have you ever ridden one? I can usually walk five miles faster than I can wait for a bus, then stop every single block taking a long, torturous route to where I want to be. All the while sitting next to somebody who hasn't bathed in months, who doesn't smell so bad with all the deisel smoke. And the trip cost a buck one way, which would get me twice as far if I used that dollar to buy gasoline with.
I want cars that drive themselves. What kind of a luddite are you, anyway?
Too many traffic accidents? Lets not bother to teach driving the right way, too much trouble. Lets just lower the speed limit to 55 MPH, because, speed kills, doesn't it?
But that's not why they lowered the limit. It was lowered to save fuel; we were in the middle of the Arab oil embargo when the 55 mph speed limit was passed, and fuel saving was the only reason put forth.
However, "speed kills" was a counter to people who wanted the limit raised after the crisis was over and the gas lines and rationing were done with.
if we start making lists of wicked actions I'm pretty sure which one will be the longest.
How will you be able to tell the truly religious from the wolves in sheep's clothing? It isn't always easy (the first hint is, if they wear a suit and tie, they really worship money). Christ spoke at length about these sorts of people, and in fact it was those very money-worshipers who ran the church (much like the medeval Catholic leaders) who had him put to a torturous death. They were a little upset that he got pissed at them for selling trinkets in the temple. Money worshipers disguised as religious people assassinated him.
Would I have behaved differently if I had a phone pressed to my ear?
Dark road, buzzed? If you'd been on the phone you probably wouldn't have seen the deer until you'd already hit it. It would have been *crash* *SCREECH* "WHAT THE FUCK WAS THAT????"
The whole "be nice to people" is a small part of Christianity.
I can't figure out if you're truly ignorant or if you're a liar. The basis of Christianity is forgiveness, its golden rule is "treat others as you would want to be treated." It carries no homophobia (although a lot of Christians do), no mysogyny, nor intolerance, and takes away fear of even death itself.
Seriously; if you told your child that you were going to throw her in the furnace for being bad
You might actually want to READ the book you're bashing. Christianity doesn't say you'll go to hell for sinning (that's Judism and Islam), it says that your sins have already been paid for with bloody, torturous death, and all you have to do to obtain eternal life is accept that sacrifice that was made for you.
Name one good, moral action that could not have been conceived of by a person of no faith.
Name one good, moral action that could not have been conceived of by a person of faith. Faith in a god or no god has nothing to do with a person's character or the ability to do good.
Leave driving to professionals, so the general public doesn't waste 2 hours a day on useless labor like driving
You make the mistaken assumption that the guy in the eighteen wheeler is a good driver. Why, then, did I see one blast through a red light in city traffic yesterday? Followed by a garbage truck that turned right in front of traffic, completely ignoring the stop sign?
A drivers license should cost at least $10,000.
In which case a bus across town is going to cost $20 and a McDonald's hamburger will be $30, because of the extra cost of transportation. Sorry, dude, but your idea is really stupid, and I say this as someone who was trained as a professional driver by the USAF.
Christianity especially have been used for lots of bad, and has always been used to control other people and is manipulative and evil by design.
Everything in the world, including all religions, have been used by evil people to do evil. But evil by design? That's just ignorant. Don't go bashing a book before you've read it. All the evil done in the name of religion goes against everything Jesus taught.
Theravada Buddhism is almost completely different. It promotes the idea of people thinking themselves and not just accepting what someone else tells them to.
I spent a year in Thailand in 1974, and you're flat out wrong.
It doesn't believe in some imaginary persons or miracles
Yes, it does. The devout Bhuddist Thais had little decorated bird house things to keep evil spirits out of their homes. You seem as ignorant of Bhuddism as you are Christianity.
Buddha has actually lived
And Jesus didn't? Son, I pity your willful ignorance. You might want to research a tiny bit before spewing your nonsense.
If only most Christians would actually follow that. Last time I checked bombing abortion clinics, beating up gays, starting holy wars, etc didn't fit the bill of "be nice to people".
First, you have to understand that a large number, maybe a majority of people who call themselves "Christians" aren't really. Take Newt Gingrich, for example, claiming to be a Christian? Gives his wife divorce papers as she's in the hospital dying? Going after Clinton for his affair when Gingrich was also having one? What a laugh, Gingrich is less a Christian than Hitchens was. Gingrich is the wolf in sheep's clothing we were warned about, as are the VERY few who bomb abortion clinics, beat up gays (and protest at soldiers' funerals because the military is letting gays in), etc.
Holy war? Where? When? The only holy wars I've seen were waged by people who worship money, not Christ. Are you thinking about that dustup in Turkey five HUNDRED fucking years ago?
Some nerds break into computers. A very tiny minority, is it fair to judge you and me for what script kiddies do? Likewise, don't bash Christians because some who call themselves Christians do unChristian things in Christ's name. Remember: wolf in sheep's clothing.
BTW, Pat Roberson converted more Christians to athiesm than Christopher Hitchens ever dreamed of converting. Robertson's another wolf. I have to give Hitchens and Dawkins credit, at least they're/were being/been honest about their beliefs.
This was the passing of a brilliant man, but why is it an article on slashdot?
Perhaps the extreme coincidence of dying on the same day a war he championed ended? Although I suspect that the one thing that makes him slashdot-worthy is simply that he was an athiest. Lots of athiests here.
No. Speed limits are set so someone with bald tires and bad shocks can drive on it when it's wet and still not be that dangerous. Speed limits aren't set to what the "average" person would drive, but for the fastest an average driver in a less than average car can drive. Set the limit so it's safe for a professional in a Lotus and the limit would be well over 150mph.
If speed limits were to raise revenue* the fines would be smaller, which would give people an incentive to speed, rather than the disincentive the $150+ fines give. No way am I going to risk $150 to get to St Louis ten minutes faster. Ten dollar fine? Sure, I'll get there in 45 minutes rather than the hour and a half it takes (provided it's sunny, the road is dry, and my car's in good condition).
* Yes, there are some "speed trap" towns that lower the limit from 55 to 30 as you round a corner, these are indeed to generate revenue. But these are the exception, not the rule.
Then I commended mirth, because a man hath no better thing under the sun, than to eat, and to drink, and to be merry: for that shall abide with him of his labour the days of his life, which God giveth him under the sun.
Ecclesiastes 9:5-7
For the living know that they shall die: but the dead know not any thing, neither have they any more a reward; for the memory of them is forgotten.
Also their love, and their hatred, and their envy, is now perished; neither have they any more a portion for ever in any thing that is done under the sun.
Go thy way, eat thy bread with joy, and drink thy wine with a merry heart; for God now accepteth thy works.
Well, actually, it's a rorschach test. What you see in the clouds, stars, or ink blots says a lot about your personality and thinking, and may even show mental illness.
Are you implying that a theist who believes in an afterlife would be more cavalier with their physical health since they consider life on Earth as merely a speed bump on the trip to eternal salvation?
I don't know about him, but that's how I am.
I know that holds true for many evangelicals with regard to our natural resources and the health of the planet (("F**k the earth, god gave it to us to rape and pillage so don't complain to me about my Hummer!")
Those people are idiots who don't read their bibles, particularly the parable about the vinyard.
most religious people I know are generally not smokers and drinkers.
I think you might be surprised, unless you live in Kansas or all your religious friends are Pentacostal or Southern Baptist. To most Christians, smoking and drinking is to be avoided for fear of becoming addicted to the substance, i.e. loving the smoke or drink more than they love God, which is a big sin. Most smokers and drinkers I know are, in fact, Christians (although not Evangelicals). Jesus himself was a drinker, you know.
And so they want to make it illegal for everyone. I don't think I like that either. The basic mentality there is "if too many people can'd do xxx safely, we're going to make it illegal for anyone to do xxx". That looks ok until you're one of the (minority/few/whatever) that can (or I suppose, think you can) do it safely, and lose the right.
A heavy drinking alcoholic isn't even buzzed at a.15 BAC. Should we raise the drinking limit because alcohoolics can drive better after a six pack than I can after three beers?
Slashdot Mirror
Context is everything.
The sin was turning away from God.
Changing the speed limit has no measurable effect on the speed people drive (if the change is small),
That goes contrary to what I saw when the national 55 mph was mandated, and when the limits were raised again. At first people ignored the 55 mph and drove the speed they were used to, but after heavy enforcement the norm was about 60 mph (a cop usually won't pull you over unless you're doing more than 5 mph). When the limit was raised to 65, most people started doing 70.
As to the red light cameras, yes, those are put in for revenue, but in the name of safety. Ironically, they have been shown to increase the number of accidents, and some cities are discontinuing their use. Also, some cities have discovered that the expense of installation and maintenance isn't nearly covered by increased fine revenues.
And, as they say, the customer is always right.
Businessmen I know disagree with that. They say "the customer isn't always right, but he IS the customer."
That's the Jewish/Muslim bible, and for Christians was superceded by the new testament and the new covenant. God may hate sodomy, but in fact he loves homosexuals, whose sins are no worse than anyone else's. Actually, you might want to look at the list Moses brought down since you're so old tastament -- nothing in the ten comandments about homosexuality, but plenty against wanting what's not yours, against adultery, against slander, against murder. If "god hates fags" he hates the homophobic Newt Gingrich far more, that adulterous, slandering, money-grubbing asshole.
Actually, the new testament is down on rich people more than anyone. I don't think homosexuality is even mentioned in the new testament, is it?
Odd, then, that his wikipedia page puts so much emphasis on his athiesm (or "antitheism" as he put it) than anything else, even his writing. As I'd never heard of the guy, all I have to go on is wikipedia. I'm sure many of the mods are the same way. And, believe it or not, not everyone at slashdot is an athiest or antitheist.
You rant "I come to slashdot hoping to read some great comments about Hitchens and the first post i see moded up is someone being an religious apologist" yet you offer nothing of substance about him at all, yet you get a +4 insightful for your complete lack of isnight or information, and nothing interesting at all.
And religious apologist? I have many things to apologize for in my life, but religion isn't one of them. I will defend my religion against those who aould attack it, though. I'm sure the "religious apologist" you attacked feels the same way.
Mod me down for my beliefs and opinions, but from what I read in wikipedia, the guy sound like an A-grade asshole. Bashing Mother Theresa? WTF? I wouldn't have wanted to know the guy.
Removal of personal responsibility... has resulted in preventing Darwin Award winners from dying before they breed, thus steadily reducing the overall competence of the population.
It's amazing how few understand evolution. You do realise that you've had three years to breed before you can drive? That one can die without being stupid, and in fact the stupid can stupidly kill the intelligent with nothing more than stupidity?
You do realise that stupid people breed more than intelligent people? That redneck with an 85 point IQ and ten kids trumps my IQ and two kids. The slut that gets pregnant at age 13 trumps the intelligent girl who waits until college is over to have kids, only to be run over by the idiot with ten kids and a cell phone before she breeds? The childless nerd is the Darwin Award winner, not the retarded redneck with fifteen kids.
Darwinism doesn't work with people, not since we pretty much took care of all our predators.
How about instead of trying to toddler-proof the world, we teach little Johnny and little Sally how to be responsible
There's no such thing as a responsible five year old. It's the parent hat has to be responsible for their kids' safety. And you know what? I think the idea that leaving safety messages off of ladders and such is, well, STUPID. Double for dangers which aren't readily apparent.
You would do away with Billy's bicycle helmet, depriving the world of a first class physicist when his tire slips and he gets brain damage from the fall. If stupidity was fatal, you'd be dead by now.
This is why I've learned to deem Christianity as nothing more than hypocrisy.
Not Christianity, just many Christians. "And when thou prayest, thou shalt not be as the hypocrites are: for they love to pray standing in the synagogues and in the corners of the streets, that they may be seen of men. Verily I say unto you, They have their reward." -- Matthew 6:5
"You hypocrite, first take the log out of your own eye, and then you will see clearly to take the speck out of your brother's eye." -- Matthew 7:5
Bus? Have you ever ridden one? I can usually walk five miles faster than I can wait for a bus, then stop every single block taking a long, torturous route to where I want to be. All the while sitting next to somebody who hasn't bathed in months, who doesn't smell so bad with all the deisel smoke. And the trip cost a buck one way, which would get me twice as far if I used that dollar to buy gasoline with.
I want cars that drive themselves. What kind of a luddite are you, anyway?
I seem to recall reading that hte quake was twice as severe as the plant was designed to withstand.
As do I. The ones the GP is complaining about are a tiny minority.
The fact that your parents chose to live like that has no relevance for 99% of the world's population and their transport needs.
No, but it does have relevance for 99% of the world's population and their food needs. Those groceries don't just magically appear in the store.
Too many traffic accidents? Lets not bother to teach driving the right way, too much trouble. Lets just lower the speed limit to 55 MPH, because, speed kills, doesn't it?
But that's not why they lowered the limit. It was lowered to save fuel; we were in the middle of the Arab oil embargo when the 55 mph speed limit was passed, and fuel saving was the only reason put forth.
However, "speed kills" was a counter to people who wanted the limit raised after the crisis was over and the gas lines and rationing were done with.
if we start making lists of wicked actions I'm pretty sure which one will be the longest.
How will you be able to tell the truly religious from the wolves in sheep's clothing? It isn't always easy (the first hint is, if they wear a suit and tie, they really worship money). Christ spoke at length about these sorts of people, and in fact it was those very money-worshipers who ran the church (much like the medeval Catholic leaders) who had him put to a torturous death. They were a little upset that he got pissed at them for selling trinkets in the temple. Money worshipers disguised as religious people assassinated him.
Would I have behaved differently if I had a phone pressed to my ear?
Dark road, buzzed? If you'd been on the phone you probably wouldn't have seen the deer until you'd already hit it. It would have been *crash* *SCREECH* "WHAT THE FUCK WAS THAT????"
The whole "be nice to people" is a small part of Christianity.
I can't figure out if you're truly ignorant or if you're a liar. The basis of Christianity is forgiveness, its golden rule is "treat others as you would want to be treated." It carries no homophobia (although a lot of Christians do), no mysogyny, nor intolerance, and takes away fear of even death itself.
Seriously; if you told your child that you were going to throw her in the furnace for being bad
You might actually want to READ the book you're bashing. Christianity doesn't say you'll go to hell for sinning (that's Judism and Islam), it says that your sins have already been paid for with bloody, torturous death, and all you have to do to obtain eternal life is accept that sacrifice that was made for you.
Name one good, moral action that could not have been conceived of by a person of no faith.
Name one good, moral action that could not have been conceived of by a person of faith. Faith in a god or no god has nothing to do with a person's character or the ability to do good.
Leave driving to professionals, so the general public doesn't waste 2 hours a day on useless labor like driving
You make the mistaken assumption that the guy in the eighteen wheeler is a good driver. Why, then, did I see one blast through a red light in city traffic yesterday? Followed by a garbage truck that turned right in front of traffic, completely ignoring the stop sign?
A drivers license should cost at least $10,000.
In which case a bus across town is going to cost $20 and a McDonald's hamburger will be $30, because of the extra cost of transportation. Sorry, dude, but your idea is really stupid, and I say this as someone who was trained as a professional driver by the USAF.
Christianity especially have been used for lots of bad, and has always been used to control other people and is manipulative and evil by design.
Everything in the world, including all religions, have been used by evil people to do evil. But evil by design? That's just ignorant. Don't go bashing a book before you've read it. All the evil done in the name of religion goes against everything Jesus taught.
Theravada Buddhism is almost completely different. It promotes the idea of people thinking themselves and not just accepting what someone else tells them to.
I spent a year in Thailand in 1974, and you're flat out wrong.
It doesn't believe in some imaginary persons or miracles
Yes, it does. The devout Bhuddist Thais had little decorated bird house things to keep evil spirits out of their homes. You seem as ignorant of Bhuddism as you are Christianity.
Buddha has actually lived
And Jesus didn't? Son, I pity your willful ignorance. You might want to research a tiny bit before spewing your nonsense.
If only most Christians would actually follow that. Last time I checked bombing abortion clinics, beating up gays, starting holy wars, etc didn't fit the bill of "be nice to people".
First, you have to understand that a large number, maybe a majority of people who call themselves "Christians" aren't really. Take Newt Gingrich, for example, claiming to be a Christian? Gives his wife divorce papers as she's in the hospital dying? Going after Clinton for his affair when Gingrich was also having one? What a laugh, Gingrich is less a Christian than Hitchens was. Gingrich is the wolf in sheep's clothing we were warned about, as are the VERY few who bomb abortion clinics, beat up gays (and protest at soldiers' funerals because the military is letting gays in), etc.
Holy war? Where? When? The only holy wars I've seen were waged by people who worship money, not Christ. Are you thinking about that dustup in Turkey five HUNDRED fucking years ago?
Some nerds break into computers. A very tiny minority, is it fair to judge you and me for what script kiddies do? Likewise, don't bash Christians because some who call themselves Christians do unChristian things in Christ's name. Remember: wolf in sheep's clothing.
BTW, Pat Roberson converted more Christians to athiesm than Christopher Hitchens ever dreamed of converting. Robertson's another wolf. I have to give Hitchens and Dawkins credit, at least they're/were being/been honest about their beliefs.
Einstein was terrible at multitasking. Schroedinger, on the other hand, was a champion at it.
And his cat was terrible at it, but was a good multitasker anyway.
This was the passing of a brilliant man, but why is it an article on slashdot?
Perhaps the extreme coincidence of dying on the same day a war he championed ended? Although I suspect that the one thing that makes him slashdot-worthy is simply that he was an athiest. Lots of athiests here.
No. Speed limits are set so someone with bald tires and bad shocks can drive on it when it's wet and still not be that dangerous. Speed limits aren't set to what the "average" person would drive, but for the fastest an average driver in a less than average car can drive. Set the limit so it's safe for a professional in a Lotus and the limit would be well over 150mph.
If speed limits were to raise revenue* the fines would be smaller, which would give people an incentive to speed, rather than the disincentive the $150+ fines give. No way am I going to risk $150 to get to St Louis ten minutes faster. Ten dollar fine? Sure, I'll get there in 45 minutes rather than the hour and a half it takes (provided it's sunny, the road is dry, and my car's in good condition).
* Yes, there are some "speed trap" towns that lower the limit from 55 to 30 as you round a corner, these are indeed to generate revenue. But these are the exception, not the rule.
Ecclesiastes 8:15:
Then I commended mirth, because a man hath no better thing under the sun, than to eat, and to drink, and to be merry: for that shall abide with him of his labour the days of his life, which God giveth him under the sun.
Ecclesiastes 9:5-7
For the living know that they shall die: but the dead know not any thing, neither have they any more a reward; for the memory of them is forgotten.
Also their love, and their hatred, and their envy, is now perished; neither have they any more a portion for ever in any thing that is done under the sun.
Go thy way, eat thy bread with joy, and drink thy wine with a merry heart; for God now accepteth thy works.
That's not Jesus, it's RMS.
Well, actually, it's a rorschach test. What you see in the clouds, stars, or ink blots says a lot about your personality and thinking, and may even show mental illness.
Are you implying that a theist who believes in an afterlife would be more cavalier with their physical health since they consider life on Earth as merely a speed bump on the trip to eternal salvation?
I don't know about him, but that's how I am.
I know that holds true for many evangelicals with regard to our natural resources and the health of the planet (("F**k the earth, god gave it to us to rape and pillage so don't complain to me about my Hummer!")
Those people are idiots who don't read their bibles, particularly the parable about the vinyard.
most religious people I know are generally not smokers and drinkers.
I think you might be surprised, unless you live in Kansas or all your religious friends are Pentacostal or Southern Baptist. To most Christians, smoking and drinking is to be avoided for fear of becoming addicted to the substance, i.e. loving the smoke or drink more than they love God, which is a big sin. Most smokers and drinkers I know are, in fact, Christians (although not Evangelicals). Jesus himself was a drinker, you know.
And so they want to make it illegal for everyone. I don't think I like that either. The basic mentality there is "if too many people can'd do xxx safely, we're going to make it illegal for anyone to do xxx". That looks ok until you're one of the (minority/few/whatever) that can (or I suppose, think you can) do it safely, and lose the right.
A heavy drinking alcoholic isn't even buzzed at a .15 BAC. Should we raise the drinking limit because alcohoolics can drive better after a six pack than I can after three beers?