It is nice to see views from both sides of the coin when it comes to OSX. I work in education, have serviced Macs for going on 6 years. Heavily from OS8.6 and on. I have noticed many things that cross the board as far as Mac Hardware and OS Revisions. There is no such thing as a responsive or Fast Mac. I have serviced 100's of PPC 5260's all the way up to XSAN's with a 2 metadata controllers and a NAS Head. All of which share the same pace and feel when it comes to reaction time and general usage.The most important role the Mac's have filled for our educational uses is bridging the total novice gap. The most inexperienced computer users grasp the environment faster with one mouse button and the historical drag and drop Application installs, that OS9 touted.Simplicity and ease of use is the foundation that Apples have stood upon. This appears to me to be the source of devotion from Mac Fanatics.Macs have been in schools for years.This is how Apple grabbed its foothold. Other than that there are much better tools else where. Our district has finally left Mac's behind, cause of the lack of Software availability, and the costs. Each piece of software we have tested runs much better on a PC, jeez I wonder why. Maybe cause Software companies write software with profit in mind, so who would you put your money into if you were a software company, a Mac? Or would you right code for that which 90% of the Market controls. It is money. When Apple dropped OS9 they left a large niche they carved out in education behind. They will not recover from that. When most of the School Districts move to PC's the Children will not be brought up in a mac world, hence less fanatics, thus Apple will either need to conform or die. PPC to Intel that is an interesting situation.???? There is simply better Hardware available and much more software choices for everything else. There is no evidence that there is more or better software for Mac's. Quality of construction for Macintosh Hardware is another issue. Ibooks are flimsy, the plastic is cheap and not strong, hinges are weak,the power adapters connections constantly separate and break. There is no such thing as extended battery life for Macs It is amazing that Macs are typically much more expensive, and typically of less quality. An all around Bad investment. Unless you are a One Button needing novice. "Oh, but Mac's are not for simpletons the have robust BSD underpinnings." I highly doubt typical Mac users have even looked under the hood let alone used it to change rights, or Port some OpenSource Apps,ssh'ed somewhere. You don't need to pay for that "BSD Core" There are plenty of distro's that are free and will run on 1/10th the machine that OSX will run on. If one of the benefits of OSX is the ability to have access to Open Source apps then why pay a company to give you crap hardware to run it on? So you can have a Dock, and Genie Affect? There is no need to spend that kind of money for a GUI.
I agree with you exactly. You missed the part about the pieces of crap being forced on our organization. We have the situation where a characteristicly ignorant mac fanatic puts macntrash's where they shouldn't be. He forced Airports at us and everything else mac. All for the wrong reasons and in the wrong places.This explains your view of the most incompetent sysadmin ever,who is one who puts macs out there. Other tools should be used. That is my point, macs maybe have a place in the home for novice users.If you have to google around to get your info about how large scale mac networks operate, you really shouldn't be posting. Macs are definately not part of the solution for "building a system that gets the job done." You outlined that for me, Thanks again. Go read a book and get off of slashdot if my writing pains you.
Oh yeah I almost forgot who said anything about Active Directory? That part actually works to a lesser degree. It is not nearly as large of a problem as the OSX by itself. Nice try though. Try again when you actually use your Mac Outside of your mothers basement. If you really want to prove yourself I have to hear those "much more efficient ways of deploying macs" I would chose a better word that deploy to I don't know if it fits the point yer trying to make. If Workstation Manager can't even accomplish the "Deploying" as you call it the last thing anyone with a touch of common sense would do is try to use AD to do it. Your sweeping Generalizations, name calling, obvious attitude and lack of detail speak not of experience and knowledge but of opinionated garbage that lacks anything behind it. All computers suck dude. Microsoft Sucks Apple Sucks Linux Sucks etc...We All Suck, but macntrash suck more.
So what if I am an idiot that has nothing to do with OSX and Apple being flaming heaps of shit. Enormous hassels, shoe horn, call it what you will I don't care why it sucks it sucks. Superior workstation, yer confused OSX Struggles with marrying the gui to the BSD core.I can't tell you how many Apps still require portions of Classic to even barily run. How long has OSX been out and this is still necessary? I complain about websites and safari, cause I am forced into supporting the uneducated purchasing choices of others. They buy software that is written for the masses, get the shoe horn out.You can blame capitalism on the lack of software, You can't defend that. Apple will be out of business, They won't keep up it is a matter of time and simply a matter of money. Software companies write code for $$$ not to be cool. Geez they are changing their chip too I wonder if this is a pattern, who is shoe horning who? Could this be monetarily driven? This idiot wonders why. Apple claims to be what it isn't and if that is called shoe horning it into a windows paradigm. Then what is the rest of the world doing when Windows is the paradigm for computer software technology as we know it. You can call me names but I live and work in the real world with real issues. Not this facade that OSX is far superior and god must help me cause I am stupid cause Safari has no websites well written for it. You sound like you need to look at what Apple really is trying to accomplish rather than let your personal fanatical opinions cloud your reality. They started in education and trashed that business when they jumped to OSX. They shot themselves in the foot when they did that. Now Ipod's are their greatest representation,and now they are going intel, I hope you can see the pattern. Watch and learn my friend. God will help you.
OSX Blows.....Sorry, but this pissed me off to see so many people saying OSX has everything. Try to support OSX for 2000 users and not give them Admin rights. And Try to find software that allows for that, oh yeah then try to find an OSX server that doesn't have to be rebooted routinely. The hardware
is the cheapest constructed crap on the face of the planet. From the loudest fans I have ever heard on the Xserves.To the shoddiest constructed Ibooks, with keyboard marks on the screens, cheap hinges, soft white plastic,one Button Mice? We bought 300 airports all of which had to be returned and replaced. As far as the OS. Their updates to OSX break so much more than it fixes. Try using Workgroup Manager, don't break your list. How about 100mb Homedirectory Preference files. How well do you think that works wirelessly if at all.Think logins are slow? Font cache is fun. Owe yeah Using 10.4 with Word and network logins is impossible in a restricted multiple user environment. Mobile accounts that have to be recreated rather routinely. Don't try and setup location preferences for mobile users and expect them to beable to login with out changing their location prior to the move. Check out resolv.conf and see what network preferences actually reports. Managing the Dock with workgroup manager you never see ?'s it always works, right. Don't even think about using shortcuts to network shares. Launching Adobe Acrobat as a nonpriviledged user the first time for a 1000 users, then having to authenticate them. DVD Region Codes have to be set for each machine manually as administrator. Printer Drivers, don't get me started. Watch how apple talk only binds to one Network device, that is fun when using printers using appletalk. Yeah appletalk, another hunk of crap that is. How many friggin harddrive partitions do you need apple? Machines that simply logoff to a blue screen. What is up with Netbooting acrossed subnets yeah we can do it, but it wasn't fun at first, needing helper addresses and such. The Browser situation is the worst. How many company's really write for Safari, We have to struggle with IE on the Mac for many of our WebApps. Safari Fonts just losing touch with everything at random. Ipod Batteries they are great, That whole situation sucks. Apple is strung out in too many directions this is blatantly obvious when you try to get anything that resembles tech support. It is sad when you have someone come to your business and setup an XSan and admit that he know much more than any of the engineers at apple. What is even more sad is realizing he is right. His famous last words were don't start the metadata controllers out of order or you will blow the raid, not bad when we spen 130K on an XSAN backup solution we spent 4 months with only beta Backup software that the company would not install cause of lack of reliability. Apple is just putting stuff out with out supporting it or even expecting any sort of reliablility or consistency out of it. They make their money on preying on the ignorant abusing the concepts shiek and mystery. Pardon the run on rambling and lack of puncuation and spelling. If it wasn't for the lack of solid hardware construction I might recommend apple products to novice users. That need email, word processing and internet. I don't have the heart to recommend to people that they spend more money than they should and not get quality hardware. I have seen the consistency of 1000's of apples work come and go over the last 6 years. I don't like what I see.
PS, the only thing that is cool about OSX is Expose, Thats it, As far as the
french they use. That is plain cheezy, They need youth or someone with a clue
to come up with better names for stuff. How about black instead of white for everything, would that be alternative, goth or what? I ain't proof reading this cause I am busy working on Macs.
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It is nice to see views from both sides of the coin when it comes to OSX. I work in education, have serviced Macs for going on 6 years. Heavily from OS8.6 and on.
I have noticed many things that cross the board as far as Mac Hardware and OS Revisions.
There is no such thing as a responsive or Fast Mac. I have serviced 100's of PPC 5260's all the way up to XSAN's with a 2 metadata controllers and a NAS Head. All of which share the same pace and feel when it comes to reaction time and general usage.The most important role the Mac's have filled for our educational uses is bridging the total novice gap. The most inexperienced computer users grasp the environment faster with one mouse button and the historical drag and drop Application installs, that OS9 touted.Simplicity and ease of use is the foundation that Apples have stood upon. This appears to me to be the source of devotion from Mac Fanatics.Macs have been in schools for years.This is how Apple grabbed its foothold. Other than that there are much better tools else where. Our district has finally left Mac's behind, cause of the lack of Software availability, and the costs. Each piece of software we have tested runs much better on a PC, jeez I wonder why. Maybe cause Software companies write software with
profit in mind, so who would you put your money into if you were a software company, a Mac? Or would you right code for that which 90% of the Market controls. It is money. When Apple dropped OS9 they left a large niche they carved out in education behind. They will not recover from that. When most of the School Districts move to PC's the Children will not be brought up in a mac world, hence less fanatics, thus Apple will either need to conform or die. PPC to Intel that is an interesting situation.???? There is simply better Hardware available and much more software choices for everything else. There is no evidence that there is more or better software for Mac's. Quality of construction for Macintosh Hardware is another issue. Ibooks are flimsy, the plastic is cheap and not strong, hinges are weak,the power adapters connections constantly separate and break. There is no such thing as extended battery life for Macs It is amazing that Macs are typically much more expensive, and typically of less quality. An all around Bad investment. Unless you are a One Button needing novice. "Oh, but Mac's are not for simpletons the have robust BSD underpinnings." I highly doubt typical Mac users have even looked under the hood let alone used it to change rights, or Port some OpenSource Apps,ssh'ed somewhere. You don't need to pay for that "BSD Core" There are plenty of distro's that are free and will run on 1/10th the machine that OSX will run on. If one of the benefits of OSX is the ability to have access to Open Source apps then why pay a company to give you crap hardware to run it on? So you can have a Dock, and Genie Affect? There is no need to spend that kind of money for a GUI.
Dude... that is not nice. No need to draw lines, when there is so many things that suck about every platform. And thats not how you spell mousey:)
I agree with you exactly. You missed the part about the pieces of crap being forced on our organization. We have the situation where a characteristicly ignorant mac fanatic puts macntrash's where they shouldn't be. He forced Airports at us and everything else mac. All for the wrong reasons and in the wrong places.This explains your view of the most incompetent sysadmin ever,who is one who puts macs out there. Other tools should be used. That is my point, macs maybe have a place in the home for novice users.If you have to google around to get your info about how large scale mac networks operate, you really shouldn't be posting. Macs are definately not part of the solution for "building a system that gets the job done." You outlined that for me, Thanks again. Go read a book and get off of slashdot if my writing pains you.
Oh yeah I almost forgot who said anything about Active Directory? That part actually works to a lesser degree. It is not nearly as large of a problem as the OSX by itself. Nice try though. Try again when you actually use your Mac Outside of your mothers basement. If you really want to prove yourself I have to hear those "much more efficient ways of deploying macs" I would chose a better word that deploy to I don't know if it fits the point yer trying to make. If Workstation Manager can't even accomplish the "Deploying" as you call it the last thing anyone with a touch of common sense would do is try to use AD to do it. Your sweeping Generalizations, name calling, obvious attitude and lack of detail speak not of experience and knowledge but of opinionated garbage that lacks anything behind it. All computers suck dude. Microsoft Sucks Apple Sucks Linux Sucks etc...We All Suck, but macntrash suck more.
So what if I am an idiot that has nothing to do with OSX and Apple being flaming heaps of shit. Enormous hassels, shoe horn, call it what you will I don't care why it sucks it sucks. Superior workstation, yer confused OSX Struggles with marrying the gui to the BSD core.I can't tell you how many Apps still require portions of Classic to even barily run. How long has OSX been out and this is still necessary? I complain about websites and safari, cause I am forced into supporting the uneducated purchasing choices of others. They buy software that is written for the masses, get the shoe horn out.You can blame capitalism on the lack of software, You can't defend that. Apple will be out of business, They won't keep up it is a matter of time and simply a matter of money. Software companies write code for $$$ not to be cool. Geez they are changing their chip too I wonder if this is a pattern, who is shoe horning who? Could this be monetarily driven? This idiot wonders why. Apple claims to be what it isn't and if that is called shoe horning it into a windows paradigm. Then what is the rest of the world doing when Windows is the paradigm for computer software technology as we know it. You can call me names but I live and work in the real world with real issues. Not this facade that OSX is far superior and god must help me cause I am stupid cause Safari has no websites well written for it. You sound like you need to look at what Apple really is trying to accomplish rather than let your personal fanatical opinions cloud your reality. They started in education and trashed that business when they jumped to OSX. They shot themselves in the foot when they did that. Now Ipod's are their greatest representation,and now they are going intel, I hope you can see the pattern. Watch and learn my friend. God will help you.
OSX Blows .....Sorry, but this pissed me off to see so many people saying OSX has everything. Try to support OSX for 2000 users and not give them Admin rights. And Try to find software that allows for that, oh yeah then try to find an OSX server that doesn't have to be rebooted routinely. The hardware
is the cheapest constructed crap on the face of the planet. From the loudest fans I have ever heard on the Xserves.To the shoddiest constructed Ibooks, with keyboard marks on the screens, cheap hinges, soft white plastic,one Button Mice? We bought 300 airports all of which had to be returned and replaced. As far as the OS. Their updates to OSX break so much more than it fixes. Try using Workgroup Manager, don't break your list. How about 100mb Homedirectory Preference files. How well do you think that works wirelessly if at all.Think logins are slow? Font cache is fun. Owe yeah Using 10.4 with Word and network logins is impossible in a restricted multiple user environment. Mobile accounts that have to be recreated rather routinely. Don't try and setup location preferences for mobile users and expect them to beable to login with out changing their location prior to the move. Check out resolv.conf and see what network preferences actually reports. Managing the Dock with workgroup manager you never see ?'s it always works, right. Don't even think about using shortcuts to network shares. Launching Adobe Acrobat as a nonpriviledged user the first time for a 1000 users, then having to authenticate them. DVD Region Codes have to be set for each machine manually as administrator. Printer Drivers, don't get me started. Watch how apple talk only binds to one Network device, that is fun when using printers using appletalk. Yeah appletalk, another hunk of crap that is. How many friggin harddrive partitions do you need apple? Machines that simply logoff to a blue screen. What is up with Netbooting acrossed subnets yeah we can do it, but it wasn't fun at first, needing helper addresses and such. The Browser situation is the worst. How many company's really write for Safari, We have to struggle with IE on the Mac for many of our WebApps. Safari Fonts just losing touch with everything at random. Ipod Batteries they are great, That whole situation sucks. Apple is strung out in too many directions this is blatantly obvious when you try to get anything that resembles tech support. It is sad when you have someone come to your business and setup an XSan and admit that he know much more than any of the engineers at apple. What is even more sad is realizing he is right. His famous last words were don't start the metadata controllers out of order or you will blow the raid, not bad when we spen 130K on an XSAN backup solution we spent 4 months with only beta Backup software that the company would not install cause of lack of reliability. Apple is just putting stuff out with out supporting it or even expecting any sort of reliablility or consistency out of it. They make their money on preying on the ignorant abusing the concepts shiek and mystery. Pardon the run on rambling and lack of puncuation and spelling. If it wasn't for the lack of solid hardware construction I might recommend apple products to novice users. That need email, word processing and internet. I don't have the heart to recommend to people that they spend more money than they should and not get quality hardware. I have seen the consistency of 1000's of apples work come and go over the last 6 years. I don't like what I see.
PS, the only thing that is cool about OSX is Expose, Thats it, As far as the
french they use. That is plain cheezy, They need youth or someone with a clue
to come up with better names for stuff. How about black instead of white for everything, would that be alternative, goth or what? I ain't proof reading this cause I am busy working on Macs.