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So, PCLinuxOS includes Java? You know, you need license for that from Sun? And it includes Flash and other plugins for Firefox? So, what you trying to tell me is that PCLinuxOS is illegal Linux distribution?

AFAIK, only one company can distribute Java and that's Sun. Same thing is with Flash.

And Ian... Well, if you think Ubuntu rides on Debian backs, start reading Debian changelogs! And then, go to http://www.dccalliance.org/ and check out again who is riding on whos backs.

I think it is getting to the point (maybe it's always been this way) where Linux distributions are effectively different OS's.

Probably not.

First, we have wide LSB compliance. Next, we'll be getting an LSB Desktop spec later this year, which expands on LSB to be more meaningful to end-user needs (covers GUI components, etc).

There is also the DCC Alliance, whose members (Knoppix, Xandros, Linspire, MEPIS and several others) will all share the same LSB Desktop core. Ubuntu hasn't joined, but they now have an agreement with the DCCA to synchronize their kernels.

From the article: "We want less people hacking on frameworks and more people hacking on applications that use frameworks. It's not a technical problem so much as a social one."

We've got people who like OS hacking. But because no one has committed to a minimum specification aimed at the desktop, all creative types are likely to see is shifting sand where they cannot build or distribute without dozens more headaches than in a structured environment.

'Linux' is frightening to someone, say, with a lot of interest in small business accounting or background in the arts and who just wants a consistent framework for expressing themselves. People who aren't "systems oriented" need a less chaotic environment in which to learn and build.

OTOH end-users are frequently pressured into installing software ONLY from their distro's central repository. So the power users (people who like to sample and compare many different apps) among them are likely to feel very constrained, or that "nothing works" when they download software independantly-- The result is they forget about 'Linux' and about recommending it to family and coworkers.

Take a look at Mac download sites like MacUpdate and Versiontracker: Notice anything? Little bits and pieces of the OS are NOT dominant on the menu!

I suppose the upcoming LSB Desktop spec will be a big step in the right direction. There will be quite a few distros supporting it in short order.

Until then, Mr. Bacon should be reminded that no "Linux" exists which has real meaning to an end-user. They can't bring the "Linux" moniker into a CompUSA and use it to shop. If you wanted to open a "LinuxMall.com" online, what on earth would your criteria be for Linux-compatible products?! Plain LSB perhaps, but then that doesn't cover GUIs so you are back at the servers market selling to people who know more than you.

Now, what about those drivers...

This is what LSB 3.0 and the DCCA are going to address: A minimum spec for a functional desktop, and a distro that reflects it.

http://www.dccalliance.org/

http://dccalliance.org/

I think it's an organization trying to promote cooperation amoungst the debian based distro's. Cooperation towards better coordination (eg. bug fixing) and some standardizaton to make things easier for the end-user. Somebody correct me if I'm wrong.

All the major debian derived distro's belong to it other than Ubuntu. Obviously this is a major ommision which, on it's own, is enough to kill it.

Despite the original post, it wasn't Debian who pledged to conform to this standard, but the Debian Common Core Alliance.

Nor Debian nor Ubuntu are part of it.

Btw, in a recent post on his blog, Red Hat's Ulrich Drepper makes some criticisms of the LSB and its shortcomings of the v3 certification process.

Yeah, and Ulrich _says_ some distro's do it, but doesn't show any eaxmples. IMHO, this is the general whining of RedHat against the concurrence.

The story includes a link to the spoof website but not to the actual one. Great reporting.

The address is http://www.dccalliance.org/ btw.

To be fair, there *are* a hell of a lot of Linux distros out there, and not every one of them interoperate. Red Hat split their development version, Fedora, off from the main trunk of their "Red Hat Enterprise," and there is a "CentOS" repackaging of "Red Hat Enterprise" because Red Hat will not allow people to use their brand name on a Free release of their product. There are other forks of Red Hat, most famous being Mandriva which was originally called Mandrake.

At least the Debian people are trying to bring together all the distros based on Debian and using apt/dpkg in one way or another. The Debian Common Core Alliance (DCCA)consists of just about every Debian-based distro out there save for Ubuntu. (Ubuntu is quite conspicuous in its absence in the DCCA, in my opinion!)

The idea is not to pull together a single Uber-distro, but make sure that apps packaged for one Debian-based distro will work on all others. Some people like plain old Debian. (like me.) Some people like GNU/LinEx because it's so pure. (like Richard Stallman.) Some people, like MEPIS because it's so easy and because SimplyMEPIS fits on one CD. (like my buddy in SFVLUG, Kurt.) And some people, Goddess help them, like Linspire. It takes all kinds.

It's too bad that Ubuntu won't join the DCCA. Ubuntu right now is pretty hot, they have a big fan base, and Kubuntu allows KDE people to join the fun too. I suppose the reason is that Ubuntu seems bent on forking Debian almost to where it's unrecognizable as Debian. To each their own, I suppose. It would be nice for all the "biggie" Debian-based distros to be able to work together.

However, there is a reason why Mandrake forked from Red Hat, and it wasn't entirely because of Red Hat's insistence on its trademark rights. Mandrake, if I remember correctly, forked over a desire for Pentium-optimized binaries. There is probably a very good reason for Ubuntu to stay out of this. I can't think of one. Only Mark Shuttleworth knows for sure, and I don't think he's made a public comment on his reasons.