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Like global warming, evolution is a hoax. Educate yourself.

Ben Stein?

before i start i want to say something very quicky, ben stein has a movie on this very issue coming out in a month or two called expelled-

http://www.expelledthemovie.com/

there is a very strong movement to keep creationism out of the science room, and, although i am a creationist i do agree with it in almost ever single aspect- hear me out. creationism is by its very definition a world view born out of faith. i do not believe any teacher, being paid by your tax dollars, should be able to sit in front of your kids and forcefeed them their world view. BUT -- if there is scientific evidence that is in support of creationism, it should not be barred from the schools (how many of you have ever heard of polonium-218 radiohalos? didnt think so. it is scientific data that has passed peer review from many many people, it is decades old and completely shatters the foundation for a billion year old earth. very sad that the "debunking" page on talkorigins regarding it is the same dribble that DID NOT pass peer review once trying to combat it decades ago.. anyways i digress)

i will give you the creationist standpoint but knowing the /. hivemind my post will be -23479823473298 troll before 30 minutes are up.

creationists (as a whole, not the individuals, you can find wacky individuals in ANY stereotyped group) are NOT trying to get creationism taught in science classes as "God did all this, you better believe it or you are going to hell"-- that type of statement is completely unscientific in every respect. creationists, as a whole, are also NOT trying to get evolutionary teachings banned because, well.. thats exactly what is happening to us right now and we know we dont like it so we assume you wouldnt either. people should be allowed to believe whatever they want.

creationists simply want the BLATANT LIES that support evolution removed from the textbooks, thats what the stickers on the books were really about and you evolutionists simply didnt do your homework on the issue.
what lies, you ask? there are so many i dont think anyones made a good summary of all of them, but here are a couple.

http://www.fillthevoid.org/creation/Hovind/Brainwashed.html

many biology books are still claiming things like gillslits are proof from embryology of our evolutionary traits, that was proven false 150 years ago and yet its still in our books, why? whenever the why question is raised there is a very typical answer given from evolutionists, 'well... ok, yeah, that is false-- BUT, if we rip that page out what will we replace it with??'

anyway, i hope you read that book, its a whole 9 pages and by the end of it you will definitely learn that many of the things you thought were true (gillslits, piltdown man, nebraska man) were not at all.

A new movie about this topic is coming out

http://www.expelledthemovie.com/

Oddly, back in the 1980's when I was in school, I was always told that there was a scientific difference between a proof and a theory and that a theory was, in essence, a guess based upon a series of supposed inferences based on data.

Then someone told you a lie. A theory in science is the highest order of things there is. A theory is the most useful thing in science. It is the goal of all scientific work.

A proof was data that could be experimentally verified.

No, that is called "evidence".

Evolution is a guess; admittedly a complicated one but a guess nonetheless.

Wrong. Evolution is: "A well-substantiated, well-supported, well-documented explanation for our observations. It ties together all the facts about something, providing an explanation that fits all the observations and can be used to make predictions. In science, theory is the ultimate goal, the explanation. It's as close to proven as anything in science can be."

I am an advocate that if you're teaching an opinion then *all* opinions are valid.

So alchemy should be taught in chemistry classes? Astrology in astronomy classes? Flat earth should be taught in geology classes? Holocaust denial in history classes?

If you can show me an actual scientific proof

Please stop being dishonest. I just explained this to you: "Science doesn't deal with proof. It deals with evidence."

My other point is that Athiests and Secular Humanists have used evolution as a religion substitute

Please provide me with evidence of this. Not that it matters. Making an argument from how desirable something is, is a fallacy. Whether or not Evolution is true does not depend on whether it is true or not.

wrecks and ruins a world-view where the only morality is a self-imposed one based on nothing other than the whims and the moment-to-moment of the desires of the self.

False. Morality depends on the culture. Morality is basically the way society has organized itself and taught new inhabitants how things work. By the way, in more secular countries like Norway and Sweden, crime rates are extremely low compared to more religious countries like the US. Why is that? I mean, if what you say is correct, then all the atheists in those countries should have caused a lot of problems already, but they don't. Crime raes are extremely low! Your claim is pure nonsense.

Darwinism would have us give all of that up for a moral black hole since there would be no commonly accepted frame of reference for right and wrong

In case you haven't noticed, there's no such thing as objective morals. It is all passed on through society.

and a deepest sense of purposelessness because there is nothing to look forward to in a life that is short, brutish, and pointless.

Nonsense. First of all, you can enjoy life without believing in God. Secondly, lots of christians accept evolution. You are just being dishonest again.

As far as proof of Suppression Science goes: Check out http://www.expelledthemovie.com/

I asked you for ONE SPECIFIC EXAMPLE. How hard can that be?

The movie you are referring to is a dishonest hit piece full of lies. Such as the nonsense with Dr. Sternberg, who was fired from his position as an editor of a scientific journal. The claim in Expelled is that he was fired for being a creationist, but this is a blatant lie. Sternberg was a member of a creationist organization before he got the job, and his employer knew it.

Sternberg was fired not for being a creationist, but for circumventing the standard procedures for publishing in scientific journals. He ignored all the rules and published a religious text in the scientific journ

Oddly, back in the 1980's when I was in school, I was always told that there was a scientific difference between a proof and a theory and that a theory was, in essence, a guess based upon a series of supposed inferences based on data. A proof was data that could be experimentally verified. Evolution is a guess; admittedly a complicated one but a guess nonetheless. I am an advocate that if you're teaching an opinion then *all* opinions are valid. If you can show me an actual scientific proof, then I would happily go for the sole teaching of something that can be proven. My other point is that Athiests and Secular Humanists have used evolution as a religion substitute ("Conscience light and guilt free!") because the inference of an Intelligent Design or Creationism - and, IMNSHO, there are light years of differences between the two - wrecks and ruins a world-view where the only morality is a self-imposed one based on nothing other than the whims and the moment-to-moment of the desires of the self. In turn, that creates bigger questions come that come into play; at the base of all of our cultures is the view that we are created, that we are not an 'accident' or a 'mistake' and that we have a purpose for our existence and our lives and for the lives of our children and loved ones. Darwinism would have us give all of that up for a moral black hole since there would be no commonly accepted frame of reference for right and wrong and a deepest sense of purposelessness because there is nothing to look forward to in a life that is short, brutish, and pointless. As far as proof of Suppression Science goes: Check out http://www.expelledthemovie.com/

Expelled the Movie

Fabricating factoids to make your point doesn't do you any good.

4) By rejecting most of modern physics and geology, they can shoehorn in a reasonable sounding "interpretation" of the data. And of course, for that totally reasonable interpretation to work, we need merely reject most of modern atomic theory, quantum mechanics, cosmology, and geology. Then everything fits with only a few holes, and for all that effort, we get a theory with zero predictive power. Yay!