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I think they're mainly suggesting that it would be more efficient than storing the same energy in ordinary chemical batteries, which is the current method for storing energy from natural sources for times of higher demand (or lower production, in the case of solar). Presumably their calculations are based on minimizing the inefficiencies for both batteries and compressed air.

Pumped storage systems - essentially hydroelectric systems with a top reservoir, a bottom reservoir, and a system of pumps to move water back up to the top reservoir at times of excess generating capacity - are used in the UK at Dinorwig and at Ffestiniog, and in the US at Luddington, Michigan (and probably in other places I don't know about). This is a reasonably simple, reasonably efficient system of storing energy at time of surplus production and releasing it at times of peak demand.

I think they're mainly suggesting that it would be more efficient than storing the same energy in ordinary chemical batteries, which is the current method for storing energy from natural sources for times of higher demand (or lower production, in the case of solar). Presumably their calculations are based on minimizing the inefficiencies for both batteries and compressed air.

Pumped storage systems - essentially hydroelectric systems with a top reservoir, a bottom reservoir, and a system of pumps to move water back up to the top reservoir at times of excess generating capacity - are used in the UK at Dinorwig and at Ffestiniog, and in the US at Luddington, Michigan (and probably in other places I don't know about). This is a reasonably simple, reasonably efficient system of storing energy at time of surplus production and releasing it at times of peak demand.

Your idea of using some power dump is nice, but electrical vehicles are not the place. How are you ever going to switch on and off their charging for a start? When the wind falls, these chargers should be switched off. That requires some sophisticated communications, and is quite error prone.

Errr... it's being done already and has been being done for twenty years at least, in the UK. I know this because my firm has recently been involved in rewriting the software which drives it.

Essentially a signal is added to television broadcasts - in amongst the teletext data - which indicates to certain industrial plant when to switch on and off for cheaper electricity. A different signal can be broadcast by each regional transmitter, so you can switch on and off these 'energy dumps' on a regional basis. Systems which use the cheaper excess electricity are connected to a switch which picks up the television transmission and parses out the 'power available' signal.

One answer: Dinowig

Yes, it's done in various places. For example, look at http://www.fhc.co.uk/ffestiniog.htm

A couple of links to hydro storage installations:

Dinorwig

Ffestiniog

Not sure if these were the ones I saw as a kid, although the first one fits the time frame.

A couple of links to hydro storage installations:

Dinorwig

Ffestiniog

Not sure if these were the ones I saw as a kid, although the first one fits the time frame.

That means you NEED enough GAS powerplants to power the whole world too, as they're the only type of power plant you can literally turn the dial and turn up the output.

No, they're not. Hydro plants can do this as well. The UK uses several hydro plants like Dinorwig to cover peak loads. Dinorwig can go from 0 to 1320 MW in 12 seconds, and has a peak output of about 1800 MW. It is built as an accumulator system, pumping water up the mountain at night (using excess capacity from nuclear and fossil fuel plants) so it doesn't depend on a huge water supply (river). Efficiency (W generated vs. W needed to pump the water up the mountain) is about 70%.

1.21 GW no problem, you just need one of these. More here.

Come on people - think about this problem for a few seconds. Excess energy doesn't have to be stored in batteries - which is massively expensive and inefficient, we can convert to different types of energy - kinetic, chemical etc.

How about this doing this instead - Storing power in lakes. If I remember correctly - when there is a peak in demand the lake is emptied through the turbines, and when there is excess energy they use it to pump the water back to the top.

The old saying was that at 7:45pm (commercial break for a popular soap in the UK) - there was a huge leap in demand because of people turning their kettles on to make cups of tea!

A while ago, when I was a lad, doing 'A' level physics (16 to 17 years old), I did some research into renewable energy sources, to discover that some people consider the holy grail of renewable energy lies in the field of genetic engineering, and since hearing their ideas, I tend to agree. Some may consider it a `Frankenstein science', but just for a moment imagine a world where a photosynthesis reaction provides the decomposition of water to its base elements, hydrogen and oxygen. These may then be re-combined in an exothermal reaction to provide heat. Bearing in mind that it is heat which powers almost all continuous electricity generation to this day -- granted some hydro-electric power (eg. the Dinorwig plant in Wales) provide extra energy to the National Power Grid during eg. the cup final -- whithout which there'd be no WWW, no /. and I'd never have found out that it was researchers not far from home who discovered cold fusion.

Oh yeah, I mentioned a derivative of fusion energy. Well it's the Sun that fuels the plants that would energise the reaction, and we all learnt in school that the Sun is only the solar system's biggest ever fusion reactor.


PS. Why the nick? Well it's the mutt's nuts!