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Not all rotary engines suffer from these problems.

http://www.freedom-motors.com/techno.html

Mazda's Renesis engine in the RX-8 is a decent improvement over the previous versions. I must say they've got the coolest designs around (in the "affordable" range; a Ford GT would be pretty cool too) and I'd be all over a new RX-7 if they bring it back.

http://www.detnews.com/2003/autosinsider/0308/12/b 02-242629.htm/

I wonder if you could eliminate the transmission and do this with 2-4 Hub motors.

100kw would move most cars quite smartly with the low end capabilities of electric motors.

Use

http://www.freedom-motors.com/

in one of the 75 HP configurations weiging in at 80 pounds driving a DC generator with essentially a bigger battery/capacitor pack where the capacitors handle the heavy loads and acceleration. The motor provides LD sustained crusing capacity and keeps a minimal battery pack charaged up for a sustained power expenditure ( like climbing a mountain ).

Figure a battery pack would need to be able to sustain say 50kw ( in addition to the motor energy generation) for 5-10 minutes without going under 50% charge. Capacitors capable of sustainting max for 1-2 minutes similar to this device. Not that you would accelerate this long but that would allow for numerous stop and go cycles before you could deplete the charge.. esspecially with regenetarive breaking.

You eliminate the transmission and transaxel. Might be able to break even on weight and your connections (exception of steering most likely) becomes cabling rather than mechanical linkages.

Toss in the magnetic suspension from the other story on here and you could make a very interesting car.

You aren't that bright are you? Moller's engines are VERY
low emmsion. In fact they complete with Honda 4 stroke LEV engines but have a power to weit ratio that matches a Rotax 2 stroke. The motors that power the Skycar should be in every JetSki, Snowmobile, Ultralight/Microlight, and any other highpower low weight application. Hell these things should be powering hybrid gas electric cars for that matter.

Moller's been been taking investors' money for decades, and has exactly squat to show for it.

It's true that he has been taking money from investors for decades, but he's been pouring his own money into it as well. He made about $20 million from real estate investment and millions more from his invention of the SuperTrapp muffler. He invested that in his company. So while it's true that he has been taking money from others, he hasn't been getting rich from it, as the word "scam" implies.

Credible aerospace engineers say that, unless Moller's invented a radically new, ultra-compact engine, there's no way you can move enough air mass to actually lift the thing.

Dr. Moller is a credible aerospace engineer. He is the started the Department of Mechanical and Aeronautical Engineering at UC Davis. And he has invented a new type of engine for the SkyCar.

The spiffy model on the showroom floor is nothing more than a stage prop. It doesn't fly, it never did, and it probably never will.

As someone else pointed out, there have been tethered tests that have shown that the thing can at least hover.

Don't get me wrong. I think that Moller's claims are continually over-optimistic, even to the point that he got in trouble with the SEC for misleading investors. He's been over-promising and under-delivering for decades. But he has made slow, painful progress, and I've seen every indication that he really does believe in what he's doing.

To call it a scam is completely unfair.

SkyCar

It has 8 engines, that curently have a better power to weight ratio than a Rotax 2 stroke and a lower emission than a Honda four stroke. Burn some CWT TDP oil in it made from plants and we can use the large self regulating fusion generator that we orbit to power our computer controller no green house gas flying cars.

Almost got it

While your there I want a microlight with a freedom motor instead of a fucking Rotax

Pictures (and ads selling the units) like the personal 1 man helicopter are nothing new and can be found in the back of Popular Mechanics for DECADES - yet you see no one owning one.

Moller SkyCar is a perfect example of something, that to me looks quite dubious... why? Let's see...

• The main page shows the "Freedom Motor" which is a gearbox (ie: small motor transmission - you can find them on small AC power generators) with an automotive starter coupled to it via a flywheel... sorry, though they have lotsa torque, nothing near the power/HP that is needed to fly - much less drive at any decent speed - a car.
• Going to the Freedom Motors site linked to the pic shows all sorts of "motors" - which look more like standard US car alternators or generators (arent they inversely named??). Now, while a generator may be able to be used as a motor, again, the unit would not have enough power to move a car much less fly it...
• Installed engine power: 645 hp (Moller claim) - while their engine site shows 120hp max, a drawing of inconspicuous identity, with the images of alternators and starters being claimed as combustion motors
• While Solotrek seems to have more believable claims - perhaps that is also what makes them so less believable... they're working with lots of government agencies on this project... neat! (Really??? or have those agencies just said "Well, if you get it to work, call us, we'll be interested then").
• Fortunately, to make me a believer, they have a bunch of pictures of "tethered" (from above... ie: suspended on a "rope", superman style) flight. So.... wil it actually work on it's own one day, or does it come with the crane, and crane operator to hoist you into the air? And all for a whopping 19 seconds! Wow! I can make it all the way... across my yard... in that time! My travel problems are over!

Perhaps one day, someone will come up with something that works, or something that looks more realistic or believable. The Wright brothers actually built something and flew it... no tethers, no pictures of alternators and engine starters claimed to be combustion engines... make it, cut the ropes, fly it and then talk to us.

- Rob

The opinions expressed herein are entirely my own. Anyone who agrees with them may also suffer from the same mental problems I do... whatever they are. ;-)

From the SkyCar technology page:

"Moller rotary engines were developed from technology obtained from Outboard Marine Corporation (OMC) and are of the Wankel-Type. During each rotation of the rotor a four-stroke spark ignition combustion process occurs in each of the three pockets of a triangular rotor. After one full rotation of the rotor the engine has completed the four-stroke process three times. They therefore provide a high power-to-weight ratio at a reasonable cost and are very small for their power output. The 150 HP model used in the M400 can be easily carried by one person. Eight Rotapower engines are used in the production model volantor."

They're not using a jet engine, they're using rotary engines known to be incredibly efficient.

Check out this site for some good reading on the technology: http://www.freedom-motors.com/

He intends to capitalize on the unique properties of the wankel design in avation. Once started, nothing short of lose of fuel or destruction of the methanical rotor will stop the motor. (overheading, lose of sparkplug, incorrect fuel mixture are literally ignored.) They also have great mass to power ratios.

Mazda abandon their designs due to repeated failures in cold weather. (lubrication would literally hold the side seals in, thus no compression.) And mazda suffered from inablity to rework the engine after usage. This meant if the engine failed at 100,000 miles you basically needed a new engine.

It remains to be seen if Moller has overcome these problem as both were problems in mass production models that would not have appeared in the lab. As a replacement for a 2 stroke water craft motor, his motors are a good choice.

You can read more on his Freedom motors page

Anonymous with reason.

He's assuming a lot of regulations will be written just for these skycars. Such as them getting their own skyways, and not having to share space with other air traffic. Probably won't be happening anytime soon.

But as far as no good ideas in years, if you'd ever taken a ride in the rotary-powered jetboat they built, or their hybrid-electric car (you've never before seen a Civic leave 20 feet of rubber on the pavement), you'd have a different opinion of those rotary engines of theirs. Check out Freedom Motors for what they've been working on the past few years.

Nope, this guy has been selling investment opps in Popular Science for years. And yes the AvroCar sucked. But hell it was the 50's and people were supposed to be stupid. The moller site made lots of claims that were largely unsupported. I'll believe the flying car when space and aviation week does a demo. The AeroBots look very cool though, they just need a CCD camera, target aquistion software and subguns on 'em all running Linux of course. Check out www.moller.com and www.freedom-motors.com