Domain: vietnamveteransagainstjohnkerry.com
Stories and comments across the archive that link to vietnamveteransagainstjohnkerry.com.
Comments · 10
-
what about Vietnam veteran's rights?
Not everybody "gets" technology. I'd even make the claim that you don't have to "get" technology to be a good or even a great leader. Leadership is something orthogonal to technology. Dick Cheney's flub about factcheck.com versus the correct factcheck.org is a good example. Sure, it would have been nice for him to get it right, but it was a reasonable mistake, and made me realize how brittle this whole web system is for getting out information to people.
As far as vietnam veteran's rights go, you owe it to youself to find out what happened in 1971 when Kerry came back and started spewing falsehoods about his fellow soldiers. Seriously, when his own compatriats are calling what he did treason, you have to stop and think about it. -
Stolen Honor
There are more issues at hand than economics. Even if the economy tanked at the hands of Bush, I still wouldn't vote for Kerry given what he did after Vietnam. If you don't know what I'm referring to, watch the Stolen Honor video.
-
Re: at one point Kerry flipflopped on himself
If you read the details about what Kerry did in Vietnam, there's no question about which side Bin Laden is on.
-
I think history videos are good enough.
Seriously, if you listen to what the Vietnam Veterans have had to say about Kerry's actions in 1971, it's pretty powerful stuff. No need for a video game, just go ask the old guy in your neighborhood who came back from the war and had his uniform spit on. There's a film that gives some interesting details and background information.
-
Re:I think it matters, and here's whyI would think that a man who'd seen combat, in all its ugliness, served honorably, and then returned to civilian life and spoke truth to power about the horrors of war would be less likely to mislead the country into unnecessary war.
This is exactly the profile of JFK.
Decorated Commander of a river patrol boat.
Wounded in action and gets the Purple Heart.
Saves a wounded crewmate from drowning
Accomplished Senator from MassachussetsA man like that would never lead us into another useless war. He's seen too much.
Oops...wrong JFK. Thats John Kerry's hero, John F Kennedy.
The man who led us into Vietnam.
-
Re:Yeah, right...
Yeah, after 4 months he got bored and decided to throw in the towel. Oh, wait! No, I'm wrong! He got injured 3 times, in engagements which earned him bronze and silver stars, before being sent home.
Actually there are only two reports of Kerry's departure from Vietnam that I can find anything about. If he had truly been sent home due to valor or injury or whatever, that documentation would absolutely be in the collection of military records that appears on Kerry's website. It's obvious to anyone who has served (I was in the Personnel Records business when I served) that the records on his site are not complete. He's just offered the flattering highlights.
The first theory is that the other officers in his unit requested that he be sent home after his third Purple Heart, mainly because of his attitude and the fact that he was a loose cannon. That medal was not considered a very honorable thing to have by the SWIFT boat guys, because it meant they had made a mistake. Most minor injuries were never turned into Purple Heart citations.
The other theory about his departure from Vietnam is that he used the "three-and-out" policy. There was an informal Navy "instruction", numbered 1300.39, that allowed an officer to request transfer out of Vietnam after 3 injuries. He apparently requested this transfer on March 17, 1969. It's interesting that this request is missing from his military records on his website, since his request to go to Vietnam is included, you would think his request to return home, or especially orders to return home if he did not request it, would be included. Interestingly, there is no mention of his departure from Vietnam in the records posted.
You should read this recollection from the doctor who treated Kerry the day after he was "wounded". His injuries were not severe enough to be treated by a medic or evacuated by helicopter, by the way... he showed up the next day at sick call and the shrapnel, which apparently did not come from enemy fire, was removed without anesthesia and the "wound" was covered with a band-aid.
I heard part of the decoration citation for his Silver Star medal on TV last night, and the question posed was something along the lines of "why would the Navy write such a thing if it wasn't true?". Well that answer is obvious to anybody who was ever in the military. Most officers write their own citations and they get rubber-stamped by their chain of command. Most decorations are just things you get to enhance your career. When I was in the Air Force, for example, if you didn't have an Achievement Medal by the time you had been in about 2 years and a Commendation Medal by the time you had been in about 5 years, you had pissed somebody off. And the Meritorious Service Medal was the traditional award for a Senior NCO either retiring or transferring to another duty station.
Purple Hearts and the various Star medals require combat action, which is the only reason they're not handed out in the same way, and the only things which keep them from being just as worthless as the medals I mentioned before.
I also knew of a guy at my duty station who had gotten a Bronze Star for service he had rendered during an action (excuse the vagueness... the situation was so weird that I would give away who it was to some with ANY more detail), and everybody who knew anything about the incident knew it was BS. He had gotten cut or scraped or something, which qualified it as a "wound" during non-flight enemy engagement.
Don't get me wrong -- as a veteran, I have the highest respect for those who have served, particular those who have been in the line of fire, as Kerry was. But when people read citations and take them as something exceptional when they happen all the time and they're usually written by the recipient, I have to respond.
RP -
Re:Is There Some Story or Even Some Facts Here?On the Kerry side, the issue is Kerry's book from the 1970s, The New Soldier. It's out of print, and now selling used on Amazon.com for over $500.
There are some excerpts from it here, including small versions of the cover and some of the illustrations. Another site which had a copy of the cover (which has a picture of Kerry with an upside-down American flag) claims to have received this letter., insisting that they take the picture down or be sued for a DMCA violation by a photographer who claims to have taken the picture.
The photographer, George Butler, is listed as an editor of "The New Soldier". The Library of Congress entry for George Butler shows only his "muscle pictures". George Butler produced and directed "Pumping Iron", wrote a biography of Arnold Schwarzenegger in 1990, and took the photos for several exercise books.
-
Yeah, right...Vietnam Veterans Against Kerry (the website pointed to by the 'Kerry' link) is the organization running attack ads on US television, attempting to besmirch Kerry's war record. The adverts include the catchphrase 'I served with Kerry', which is stretching the truth a bit -- not a single vet in the adverts actually served alongside Kerry, they were merely in Vietnam at the same time.
This brought to you by the Republican party, the political group led by an imbecile cokehead who didn't even have the balls to turn up to his cushy National Guard posting. I have little sympathy for their copyright complaint...
-
Re:Not a bad forgery.....
I mean, she's a peacenik, or she goes around talking about how she wants to shoot down airplanes, but BOTH seems unlikely.
It seems unlikely to you because you don't understand her perspective. She wasn't so much for peace in Vietnam (the war to stop, the North to stop invading, the VC to stop attacking) as she was against the policy and involvement of the US. Therefore, there really isn't much of a conflict between wanting the US out or to lose, and wanting the North Vietnamese to shoot down US aircraft.
Many people in the '60s literally carried and marched under communist flags and banners. In those days Jane was pretty far to the left. -
Re:Not a bad forgery.....Some people think she went too far, to the point of actually supporting the North Vietnamese (I'll not go into whether this was actually the case, as I don't know or care).
You don't know or care. That would explain a lot about the rest of your post.
All without going into the fact that Kerry made a principled stand against the war...
Yes, it is a well known tactic of those taking "principled stands" to march under the flag of the enemy who is killing your country's soldiers.
I think it just makes it obvious that his critics on this issue are fully in the "all independent thought is treason" camp.
Independent thinking is fine. Taking the position of the enemy and marching under his flag is not.
For just as Mr. Kerry has a record as a naval officer that is universally praised, he has a record as an antiwar activist that is widely despised. A leading voice in the notorious appeasement group Vietnam Veterans Against the War (VVAW ), which frequently demonstrated under communist banners even as American servicemen were under fire, Mr. Kerry should now be called upon to defend that record, or to apologize for it. What does Mr. Kerry say now about having defamed American servicemen before Congress in 1971? About participating in "Hanoi" Jane Fonda-financed stunts and protests? About North Vietnamese Gen. Vo Nguyen Giap's 1985 assertion that without the antiwar efforts of such organizations as VVAW , Hanoi would have surrendered? And what does he have to say about the tens of thousands of executions, the torture and the re-education camps that the North Vietnamese inflicted on South Vietnam after the American withdrawal?
From the Washington Times
Principled stand indeed.