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Andover.Net and VA Linux Join Together
As you may have heard, VA Linux and Andover.Net are gonna be joining up. We thought it would be dishonest not to say something about it, but as you probably understand, we're sorta restricted in what we can say. Of course, you can say whatever you want, and you can
read the press release if you're curious about some of the details. Creative control of Slashdot will remain where it always has been.
i just want to know when RedHat and VA will merge :)
Cybie! aka Ralph Bonnell
It sounded more like an acquistion of Andover, to me.
--
"A dessert without cheese is like a beautiful woman who has lost an eye." -- Jean Anthelme Brillat-Savarin
Linux Daily News had Slashdot scooped on this issue by more than an hour, and I submitted this half an hour ago. It was promply rejected. I sort of wonder why Slashdot is now the last news source to get anything, even when it's about them.
Sam TH
AbiWord Developer
How does this affect the server51 (Andover) and sourceforge (VA) projects, since they both appear to have similar goals?
--
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Glad I held on to some of my VA stock, considering what mergers tend to do to stock prices. :)
"If ignorance is bliss, may I never be happy.
-- Veni, vidi, dormivi
Sorta puts that postponed Larry Augustin interview into a new light, eh?
BTW, you are opening yourselves to a lot of jokes by saying "Creative control...remains where it's always been".
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First, I like the idea of Andover and VA Linux marrying. Both companies seem to be to be of the rare breed that "get it", and seem to do the right thing in almost all circumstances.
I'm wondering how this would affect the potential for Slashdot in the future to on it's own, or in partnerships, expand into other subject areas with its brand of site design and format. Granted, with the emergence of the open source Slash engine and PHPSlash, dozens of Slashlings are sprouting up everywhere (my own site included).
I guess I was just thinking at some point down the road that a "portal" or "index" of Slash-based sites covering a wide array of subject areas would emerge, either under the direct auspices of SlashDot, or some other party...I'm not sure how this acquisition would affect that scenario, tho.
Either way, I'm not disaffected. I think it's a great merger and I can't wait to see the results of the open Slash engines on the 'net.
With the auto-posting perl scripts?
It can be found here.
BilldaCat
Oh boy, here it comes. All this is well and good, but how does it affect /.? This is not intended as flamebait but I think that since Andover bought /. The quality has gone downhill, mostly due to the increased traffic which also increases the trolls and the fray. When VA Linux takes over I'm curious how the flavor of /. Will change. Will added participation and content value come through more participation (on a massive scale)? Will the /. model change, part of what make slashdot so successful is the simplicity of the model. Time will tell, but I think that VA will add bureocracy and overhead to the site and change it in a way that takes it furthur from what has made it so great.
Never knock on Death's door:
More race stuff in one place,
than any one place on the net.
But of course you're now going to have to fire Jon Katz, because now you're one of those big media conglomerates... ;-)
Steven E. Ehrbar
So I'm at VA's site and I see the following press release titled: /. users but the tittle just seems to imply allot more than there is to it. I'm trying to picture Mr. T (Linus) and such people running around calling people saying "Oh my god! This is 'Most Significant Transaction in Linux History'"
"VA Linux to Acquire Andover.Net in Most Significant Transaction in Linux History"
I can't help but giggle a little at the hype. I appreciate that this important to me and allot of other
Sometimes corporate hype is just too darned funny to take seriously.
Creative control stays
with Anonymous Cowards,
Natalie Portman
---
Hand me that airplane glue and I'll tell you another story.
So what the hell does a hardware company need with a company that provides content? Why does VA think it can run Andover better than Andover? Do VA's shareholders benefit from this?
(Note, these are all rhetorical questions... the answer is, simply, that "Internet companies" have higher stock multiples, and VA will get a nice bump in their stock price with this).
DrLunch.com The site that tells you what's for lunch!
Is anyone else disturbed by this conglomeration of power? Andover has already bought most of the good Linux sites. VA Linux is busy sucking up the others, as well as other random companies. If Red Hat merges with VA someday, won't all our eggs be in one basket?
Frankly, I'd been occasionally worried about Andover's direction and commitment to free software, but I absolutely trust VA and their commitment, so in that sense I welcome VA's involvement. It also seems that since VA is getting so heavily into the media side of things themselves, this match makes a lot of sense and will reduce the squandering of resources by the movement as a whole. (server51 and sourceforge really just seemed like good ideas that didn't need to be competing against each other.)
Good luck, Rob- I remember the days when I contemplated getting some CD's through your links so you'd get some spare change from CDNow. Glad to see things have changed for you all.
~luge
IAAL,BIANLY
Back the ethics truck up for a minute. I believe that Twickler and Augustin believe in the profit stemming from the future of open source. They are profit modivated period. That's their job, they have to make money for the investors and the bankers.
Never knock on Death's door:
More race stuff in one place,
than any one place on the net.
But, regardless of the fact that you state "Creative control of Slashdot will remain where it always has been"... I find it difficult to believe that slashdot can really remain as independant as it was (especially when it was completely self run). I (and surely many others) come to slashdot because of the independant perspective presented by the editors and next by the readers. The quality/independance of the editors has already gone down since the andover purchase, I fear what will happen now that slashdot it owned by valinux...
donfede
Everyone knows this is all about server51. sourceforge.org is to become the nexus of opensource... With server51 in the picture, they saw an opportunity where there could be competition, not cooperation. I think that the server51 dudes and sourceforge dudes will be hooked up and all will be good.
:)
I dont think server51 had the hardware resources VA had. Just think.... the sourceforgenetwork. A whole ton of "mini" sourceforges that differ in setup and stuff like that. Heh.. perhaps not
Perhaps there will be skinning of sourceforge
Have a good one out to Andover and VA.
-- dieman - Scott Dier
Granted some important stuff is missed and comes much too slow and has been getting somewhat worse here. However I think an hour is pretty acceptable. If everything came up within a day of when the news broke I'd be quite content.
"...we're sorta restricted in what we can say..."
"Creative control will remain where it's always been."
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This means that one source is controlling 2/3 of all Open Source web pages! No one else hearing alarm bells ringing? It is really important to have no monopoly in the media, especially in this case where Open Source is going to have a strongly increasing influence on society.
This can only be good news.
/. "interview" and the severe disrespect towards the /. community's very basic and simple questions.
/. with VA Linux in the picture.
IMHO Andover has done crap with the money earned from their IPO while companies like RedHat and VA Linux have taken their money and put it to good use.
This makes me happy, andover hasn't made a penny while VA was in the black when they went public. Obviously Andover is getting the sweet end of the stick on this deal.
As for creative control.. I think the Tacos of this {/. world} might be in for a shock when they suddenly are required to take some stock in the words they publish. I somehow do not feel VA-Linux-in-charge would stand so quietly over something like the
Great news to hear... It can only mean more for
They are a threat to free speech and must be silenced! - Andrea Chen
Fish! LipHo
I think that their track record of support for major Open Source projects ensures that the Slash Engine will continue to be a strong project. I'm not sure what this will mean for the project that is called Area 51. It will be interesting to see how SourceForge and Freshmeat interact.
In any case, I think a combined VA-Andover has a tremendous supply of proven talent. They have the people in place to create a lot of new and interesting software and Web Sites. I think it will be interesting to see whether the majority of these people will stick around, or if they will leave, as many did when RedHat bought Cygnus.
--
Dave Aiello
-- Dave Aiello
This is flatly not true. If they wanted the biggest name in the Linux and Open Source community, they should have gone for:
VA LINUX
Or,
VIRGINIA LINUX
Or,
VIRGINIA LINUX
Or,
V-I-R-G-I-N-I-A L-I-N-U-X
Or,
V-I-R-G-I-N-I-A L-I-N-U-X
Or,
ANDOVERDOTNET A WHOLELY OWNED SUBSIDIIARY OF VIRGINIA LINUX INCORPORATED
Or,
ANDOVERDOTNET A WHOLELY OWNED SUBSIDIIARY OF VIRGINIA LINUX INCORPORATED
Or,
A-N-D-O-V-E-R-D-O-T-N-E-T A W-H-O-L-E-L-Y O-W-N-E-D S-U-B-S-I-D-I-I-A-R-Y O-F V-I-R-G-I-N-I-A L-I-N-U-X I-N-C-O-R-P-O-R-A-T-E-D
Or,
A-N-D-O-V-E-R-D-O-T-N-E-T A W-H-O-L-E-L-Y O-W-N-E-D S-U-B-S-I-D-I-I-A-R-Y O-F V-I-R-G-I-N-I-A L-I-N-U-X I-N-C-O-R-P-O-R-A-T-E-D
Or, A-N-D-O-V-E-R-D-O-T-N-E-T A W-H-O-L-E-L-Y O-W-N-E-D S-U-B-S-I-D-I-I-A-R-Y O-F V-I-R-G-I-N-I-A- L-I-N-U-X I-N-C-O-R-P-O-R-A-T-E-D, O-W-N-E-R-S O-F S-L-A-S-H-D-O-T
Or better yet,
A-N-D-O-V-E-R-D-O-T-N-E-T A W-H-O-L-E-L-Y O-W-N-E-D S-U-B-S-I-D-I-I-A-R-Y O-F V-I-R-G-I-N-I-A- L-I-N-U-X I-N-C-O-R-P-O-R-A-T-E-D, O-W-N-E-R-S O-F S-L-A-S-H-D-O-T
Never knock on Death's door:
More race stuff in one place,
than any one place on the net.
I'm not really financially-oriented, so could someone please explain what happens to Andover shareholders?
.425 VA Linux shares per Andover share, but then the press release mentioned something about cash payments?
They get
Can anyone suggest why VA is accounting for this as a purchase? I heard that many de facto buy-outs are accounted for as a "pooling of assets", because then it doesn't go on the books as an expense for the purchaser. Have the rules for this kind of thing been tightened recently, or does VA have some advantage in accounting for this as a purchase?
--
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send all spam to theotherwhitemeat@ropine.com
-- Consolidate the complementary networks of VA (including Linux.com, Sourceforge.net, and Themes.org) and Andover.Net (including Slashdot.org and Freshmeat.net) to create the Internet's leading destination for Open Source developers, with nearly two-thirds of the total traffic of major Open Source sites and putting the combined network in the top 100 web destinations worldwide;
Two thirds of the total open source traffic, discussion, and news will be 'owned' by one company?? This doesn't concern anyone? Sure, CT can claim that he will maintain control, but I'd love to see his contract proving that. Money changes things and people.
This article seems to indicate that advertising is already cropping up as editorial content. How different is this 'story' from this one? Sure, it might be nice to make notice of the live broadcast, but mentioning The Sync both times seems a bit inappropriate.
Now, before getting flamed and moderated, let me explain one thing: I'll give the Slashdot gang the benefit of the doubt. Most of them are younger than me by a couple of years, and I know I'm not fully baked. But I expect they'll have to learn fast. Just as important as actually maintaining independent editorial control (there was a story a few days back that mentioned someone trying to get andover to force a story, but CT et al. said no.) is maintaining the appearance of objectivity.
To that end, perhaps the main page needs to be redesigned with an announcements section that concerns
Jesus was all right but his disciples were thick and ordinary. -John Lennon
So you actually enjoy the idea that the "biggest network of opensource/linux advocacy sites" is going to be owned by the largest sole distributor of Linux systems?
Talk about slanting the tables a little!
If Microsoft tried to buy ZDNET, everyone here would cry foul.
If Apple tried to buy MacWeek and MacWorld from ZDnet, again, everyone would cry foul.
If Sun went and bought performance computer, AGAIN, everyone would cry foul.
But, if VA Linux buys Andover.net, it's a *good thing*?!?
Wake up, guys!
Kinda scary, don't you agree? One omnipotent ruler in OSS-land...
StarTrek.org Free Webmail
New XFMail home page
The way I read the announcement, this is a good thing for the shareholders of both companies and is an indication that VA Linux is doing well as well as the fact that Andover.Net is an attractice company to purchase. I am also happy because I have confidence that VA Linux will let Andover.Net continue to do the things that I think everyone reading this appreciates. The combined company will have a bit more weight to throw around as well and will be better able to weather shifts in the marketplace because of a broader base of services.
Okay, enough hype. All of what I've said may be and probably is true. But I am still concerned. Can VA Linux manage the rate of growth that has come with it's success? And as other people have pointed out here, as open source companies merge, are they bigger competitors or more centralized targets?
As long as viable new players with new ideas keep springing up and creating niches for themselves and the big players don't forget what makes their reputation in the open source community, I don't think I'll worry. If we end up with one behemoth as the only corporate player in the open source world, then I will suspect a problem. Not because that company got big; I hope that VA Linux and Redhat continue to grow. But any market that isn't spawning new ideas is dying.
So my message to the open source companies is simple. Stay young and alive for as long as you possibly can. It's more fun and you'll have the support of a lot more open source developers. Don't grow at the expense of who you are. This merger has every sign of being the right direction.
The net will not be what we demand, but what we make it. Build it well.
That's GOOD?!?
From now on, Slashdot, which has been actively covering every twist and turn with Redhat's and VA Linux's stock (which I personally got rather sick of) may need to stop and VA story when it comes time to announce earnings?
This is BAD BAD BAD! Why can't many people see that?
You get angry when AOL buys time/warner because they'll monoplize consumer content on the internet, and rejoice when ANDN takes over most of the good site and then gets bought by VA Linux, who will now oww 50%+ of the real Linux related sites.
Short sited.
What, pray tell, would be a larger transaction? It's skewed in the fact that the History of Linux isn't particularly long (esp when mixed with the word "transaction"), but I can't remember a bigger one. It's just PR speak anyway, filter it before you process it.
+&x
Ceterum censeo Microsoftam esse delendam.
I thought the reason you guys (Rob & Jeff) decided to be bought (or whatever the technical term is) by Andover was because it wasn't a Linux company, so it wouldn't seem like you would be losing any partiality. I realize you guys and VA have been buddies for a long time (IIRC, most of Slashdot runs on VA Hardware, bought through the barter system [they get free ads, you get free hardware]... right?), plus, Rob's (one of) the webmaster(s) (or some dang thing) for Linux.com, which they own. So VA and Andover were probably already pretty chummy... but what prompted this? I.e., why?
I don't know what you all are allowed to say, what with SEC restrictions and all that kinda stuff, but (how) will this affect Slashdot? Will we get even more editors (like the advent of Roblimo when Andover took over)?
I'm just guessing, but I assume Mr. Malda is pretty high on the Andover totem pole. What's going to be his new position at VA Linux, or is he going to remain at his current position inside Andover?
I think the Andover aquisition was a Good Thing, and VA seems like a nice company, so I guess this will also be a Good Thing. Then again, you know how the Open Source Community(tm) feels about monopolies...
Any info from higher-ups would be appreciated... and if you can't say anything, then say that you can't say anything! Otherwise I will have hurt feelings...
___________________
rooooar
While I like both VA Linux and Andover.Net, this is not a good thing for Linux consumers. Did anybody besides me notice that once Andover.Net took control of Slashdot that the ads for Copyleft disappeared and were replaced by ThinkGeek (which is owned by Andover). Now that VA Linux owns Slashdot what are the chances that we will ever see another ad for SGI or Penguin Computing?
--
Howard Roark, Architect
Howard Roark, Architect
I believe in a Man's right to exist for his own sake.
It seems to me that having a major community hubs like Slashdot and Freshmeat owned by a parent media company was bad enough. Having them owned by a particular producer of Linux products is downright scary. I'm sure that Rob & Co. will argue that content won't be effected. While they might believe this, I sort of doubt the reality of the claim.
Bear with me here: It figures that Slashdot and Freshmeat are the main portals for Linux information. Therefore, they are the prime ground for advertising by Linux-related companies (especially OEMs). How many Penguin Computing or Indybox ads are we going to see here when VA is fully entrenched? They might not vanish outright, but smart money says that VA will slowly muscle them out.
Not allowing (or rather, making it difficult for) other OEMs to post up their banner ads is just as bad as if VA imposed editorial restrictions. It also makes perfect sense from a business point of view to keep your competitors from advertising on your channels -- how many ABC superbowl ads did you see on FOX?
I hope I'm wrong. It could be that the people at VA are more idealistic than the average business types. Even so, management can change -- this cloud will forever hang over Slashdot, Freshmeat and any other major community site which ever gets aquired by a large company.
----
Every year during my review, I just pray the words "slashdot.org" aren't mentioned.
... if the Slash source hadn't been opened. As it is, if we feel that /. is compromised by their affiliation(s), and that compromise is disturbing enough, we can go start our own "FreeDot" or something.
/. has 'put up', to stick with these guys and their little website that could. I probably would have even if the source hadn't been released, but I would have had agita about it.
I'm willing, now that
This is also an important reminder to those of you who _weren't_ whinging about the source release: you don't get something unless you ask for it, and you need to call bullshit when you smell it, that's the true rationalist way (no hypocrisy permitted at all, strict and harsh self-editing must be imposed).. You don't have to be a flaming dick about it, but a polite reminder as needed is a _good_ thing, don't forget that.
Your Working Boy,
I know that in open source this is not a big concern (as far as it's continued existence is concerned) but, does this trouble anyone else?
The interconnection of huge companies is one thing, as long as there are alternatives. But mindshare is another concern. I suspect that VA Sys is caught up in the mega-merger surge, and is gobbling up the major players in the open-source field. Expect fusion with RedHat next...
The problem I see here is that with one false step, the reputation of open-source may be harmed. One large company controlling (effectively) the resources that the whole community relies upon (at this point) can be bought by... guess who?
Now, I know that the GPL protects the source against exploitation, and that we got to where we are without the reliance on a central authority, but... The instrumental people behind the movement have been gobbled up by these companies in the same way as the smaller companies have been absorbed into larger ones. They're under NDA now. Some may leave, others like the money and corporate status.
I'm getting the feeling that the grassroots movement is getting a new corporate domed stadium built over it.
-- What you do today will cost you a day of your life.
Please answer haiku
with haiku! Why, you may ask?
It is more polite.
Yes, i miscounted
syllables. It's too early
for me to count well.
No need to flame me.
I'm not perfect, but at least
admit my mistakes.
What shall i do now?
I'll gaze Medusa-like on
Natalie Portman!
Haiku is so cool.
Even Natalie Portman
jokes can almost work.
What else can i say?
Hemos sux? BSD rules?
Katz is a windbag?
---
Hand me that airplane glue and I'll tell you another story.
Geesh. I'm checking my morning news and stuff about Burning Man, and I come across this story about VA Linux buying out Andover.net ...
Not that I'm complaining, mind you, it's a smart move for VA Research\\\\\\\\Linux Systems.
Will in Seattle
I just saw you guys on CNBC for their merger coverage (quick pan over a convention floor). No mention of /., tho...
+&x
Is it time to get ready to fork? It is still a bit premature, let's wait and see how things work out, but the code for most of these sites is GPL, as long as we have that then if things start to smell fishy then we run.
Sounds reasonable?
And without marketing Crystal Pepsi would have been nothing too :-) Oh wait?
Never knock on Death's door:
More race stuff in one place,
than any one place on the net.
I haven't changed: I'm still building my recording studio, still waiting for the ADAT to get back from being fixed, still building all the auxiliary equipment I need (finally finished the recording multiband compressor the other night- thing is the audio hardware equivalent of a crazed Unix console app that can do anything, but with demented syntax- it's an art form just twiddling the controls on this bugger).
I'm also still looking for ways to tap into good publicity for 'free' ideas and inventions- will certainly begin sharing everything that goes into this hardware design as soon as it seems to be going to an unarguably public place. This is very heavily influenced by open source software. My whole approach to the world has been colored by open source software, the GPL, and my learning to identify with these values. In this way, 'our eggs' don't necessarily belong to one vendor, one company or even one platform or one field of endeavor- I think it's just as important to pursue 'free' audio electronics hacking and share information in a way similar to the GPL- specifically because going strictly philanthropic and public domain is just asking for abuse, it's just putting power in the hands of _collective_ entities such as corporations which can stomp all over individials. For software, the GPL puts some rules on behavior that legislates good behavior. I'd like to see something similar for strictly idea exchange and inventions, or we may be looking at an intellectual property Dark Ages, where you're not allowed to think or innovate because everything is already 'owned' in one way or another.
That said, of course this conglomeration is unpleasant and nasty. VA Linux has a fiduciary duty to not help other Linux companies, and at the same time is bound by things like the GPL to limit the extent to which they can hurt other people in the community they are theoretically a part of. The people behind things like Slashdot have ended up paper millionares in many cases- and we're not talking dollars, unfortunately, we're talking stock, which means their personal wealth is equal to exactly how much _their_ little projects or big companies can hurt the other people in the community. I think that unlike the hardcore e-business such as MS, many of the Slashdot people will geniunely choose to suffer financial losses rather than hurt the community- this is not unthinkable, for instance Richard Stallman actually declined offers of stock options. However, this can only be a personal choice- for instance, Rob Malda can and probably would choose to suffer losses of half his stock money rather than hurt the community by damaging another Linux company or project. But if Rob is a corporate officer, he's not allowed to make such a decision- he's required to hurt the other Linux company, because it is his legal duty to the stockholders and he is breaking the rules if he doesn't.
This, not the specific ownership of Slashdot, is the problem, and it's been a long time coming- there have been people pushing for the adoption of the corporate, big-business model (most notably ESR) for a long time, and people who've become upset and argued against it.
Well, now we get to see what Linux is like when it is all owned by corporations which aren't allowed to share or be nice to each other, and controlled by stock-option millionares whose riches are directly linked to their Linux competition doing badly or failing outright. We can expect to see basically the same state of affairs as commercial software, up to and including the privacy messes we've been wailing about in Slashdot columns...
It's a pity things have gone this direction, but freedom doesn't grow on trees. If you don't fight for it, it erodes and fades away- but you can usually grab a bit of it for yourself anyhow, if you try.
Because 3com, has had nearly 5 continious years of $ probs and needs the cash bad.
good bye editorial independance. Just like when Disney bought ABC, and others we could name, so too will the new heads of Slashdot control the content. it's too tempting _not_ too. I don't believe for one second that They can refrain from messing with it, Rob's comments aside.
I found this Upside article on the VA/Andover purchase, and was suprised by how much of it made sense. It touches on some good points that ESR made, and doesn't fall into the trap of "introducing" Linux and Open Source.
You forget that the good Commander was probably very cautious in his contract negotiations with Andover.. he says he has a very secure contract, allowing him to keep control.
Now, if you believe that he's lying, just to keep the audience... then I guess you should just go read another news source.