Slashdot Mirror
Virginia House Passes UCITA
Keith Kris writes, "Looks like Virginia [its House of Representatives] has passed the UCITA, got it through unanimously, too. This needs to be stopped quickly. Many people don't even know what this act is. Spread the word." Microsoft, AOL and the Business Software Alliance are pushing this heavily. Virginians, you need to call your state senators immediately since they're still considering the bill. Tell them who you are, tell them you're a constituent, tell them you oppose passage of UCITA because it will destroy consumer rights.
This is the normal process.
The rights of the individual have always been protected by the courts, never by the legislature. Legislators do stupid things by nature. They are motivated by popular opinion, funding by lobby groups, or whatever will get them reelected to another term. And if people's freedom gets in the way of that, them fuck them. How important is joe hacker citizen against big business, congresscritter's own career, and the bulk of voters? We simply do not have the numbers to matter at all.
It's the judges and especially the supreme court justices with no special interests and opinion polls to worry about that protect out freedoms. This is exacly why the constitution appoints the latter to life terms. God help us if they should ever fail us though. because it is risky to have the most important protections deciced by a handful of justices. And do people even know these last defenders of freedom? Thomas, Souter, O'Connor, Renquist, etc.?
You are wrong. That's the reason they have to pass it individually in all 50 states. So that the companies do not have to have different licenses conforming to the laws of each state.
the moderation system broke for a couple days - but is catching up now. We've got a couple things - please bear with for just a touch longer.
Yeah, I'm that guy.
Step 1: Advertise a brand-new program for handling taxes, personal finance, e-banking, secure e-commerce, speech recognition/synthesis and private e-mail.
Step 2: Write a EULA, which indemnifies you if the program fails to do anything at all, and which absolutely prohibits any reviews of the product without prior permission.
Step 3: Write a cruddy application which gives a basic spreadsheet and an e-mail form.
Step 4: SHRINK-WRAP the box, and make it clear on the outside that opening the box is accepting the terms of the EULA.
Step 5: Charge $150 a throw for the box. Under the UCITA, nobody is permitted to review the product, without permission, and this is doubly ensured by the EULA, preventing anyone online or in the press from commenting on the scam.
Step 6: Wait until the fur starts to fly. And it will! Something like this'll end up in court before the week is out.
Is this ethical? Nope, but there's nothing any court can do, without either placing VERY strict limits on the UCITA or (more likely) declaring it unlawful. Given the choice of allowing someone to publicly humiliate Corporate America, or re-writing a law, I'd put the bet on them getting the quill pens out.
It's a small world and it smells funny; I'd buy another if it wasn't for the money; Take back what I paid (SoM)
The bill is Senate bill 372.
Please call and oppose this! (You can only call if you live in Virginia). It took me less than 2 minutes to call.
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-- Slashdot sucks.
There is nothing new about allowing a company to repossess something it has sold if the buyer fails to pay for it, May added. Electric companies and other utilities end service to people who do not pay their bills, and banks repossess cars if the buyer does not make loan payments, he noted.
A bank cannot repossess your car because you told your friends how high the interest rate was. If I'm not mistaken--and I may very well be, ask your lawyers(ka-ching!)--the moment I breach my contract with the software supplier, they can shut off my software.
I inform my superiors that the database performs only at 50% of the standard rate, in violation of anti-benchmarking clauses in the contract, I can come to work next day and find my database performing at 0%.
Think the story ends here? Oh my, our database is broken and our data is trapped. Tsk, tsk, no reverse engineering, says so right there in the click wrap. So no wading through the propietary database file system to recover your data, and nobody else gets to sell you a tool either--they're just as bound by the No Reverse Engineering clauses as you are.
Forget Don't Copy That Floppy. We're down to Don't Whirl That Perl.
How sad. All the poor schmucks were tryin' to do was be c00l with the e-crowd...
Will somebody please track down the four major candidates and find out what they think about corporations being able to censor the reactions of their customers, or remotely disable their wholly owned property?
Yours Truly,
Dan Kaminsky
DoxPara Research
http://www.doxpara.com
> People from the US - WHERE do you get your politicians?
Big corporations buy them at whorehouses and donate them to the public.
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Sheesh, evil *and* a jerk. -- Jade
That the MPAA wants us all to agree to is here.
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-=DaveHowe=-
I'm probably sacrificing my karma for this, but the post to which I'm replying sure as hell ought to be higher than this one!
I think it should get points for being informative
and insiteful
Now I've been a good boy and reposted the information. Please don't waste points moderating me down, and instead moderate the other guy up. Thanks.
Sorry, but wrong. I ALWAYS read at 2, unless I am moderating. However, too many ACs get moderated up for no good reason. Additionally, too many people with high karma post junk at 2. I feel this is the real problem: people with high karma abusing it. In theory, the moderation system should fix this, since a person who posts junk gets moderated down and the poster loses karma, however this does not happen.
My analysis of the problems with the moderation system is that plus points need to be a scarce resource, and they are not. People like me, who have moderately high karma, have an unlimited number of plus points (because they post at 2). There are too many moderators moderating junk up.
My suggestions are:
www.eFax.com are spammers
...unless this hole is closed and closed quickly.
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For the past few days, the amount of moderation done has been practically non-existant. It's not just a case of moderation posts being wasted on trolls...I haven't seen very much positive moderation either.
CmdrTaco, if you have any desire to save Slashdot, here is what you MUST do:
1) People should get a rating based on the TIME they have been a Slashdot, not just this "karma". New members posts start at -1, no exceptions. After three months, they start at 0. After three more months, they start at 1. This means that if a troll wants to troll, he'll have to put in his dues for six months. If he then wants to blow it all on a single, grand, troll parade...fine. He can start all over.
2) Karma needs to weigh much, much more. People with karma over 50 should start posting at 2. People with karma over 100 should start posting at 3. People with karma over 200 should start posting at 4 and people with karma over 500 (if they exist) must be worth reading.
3) Each post takes exponentially longer to be posted to the system. First post takes one second to reach the forum. The next takes two seconds. The following takes four. Then eight, sixteen and so forth. In the end, if someone really wants to post more than 20 messages in a single day, they'll have to wait until tomorror for people to see them. That way these floods STOP.
4) More moderation. I'd much rather see a war of moderation than a war of trolls. Give anyone with karma over 100 permanent moderation status. The only way it gets revoked is if them make a posting, and then it is revoked for twenty-four hours (thought on that article permanently).
The fact is that there aren't enough moderators to keep the trolls in -1 land and put READABLE (I don't care if they suck at this point...so long as they aren't trolls) post at 3 or higher. 90% of the posts in the past few days have been 0 and maybe another 5% are the 1's and 2's that regular folks are awarded.
It has to stop.
- JoeShmoe
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-- I wonder which will go down in history as the bigger failure: the War on Drugs or the War on Filesharing
Over here we have a little saying that goes - "Customer is King". That means none of that ridiculous protection for companies selling stuff they know is shoddy.
Actually, I really don't get it.. Is Virginia one of the states also sueing Microsoft for Anti-Trust violations? If so, it just gets better and better.
People from the US - WHERE do you get your politicians? Actually I'm sure most of you reading this will be cringing at what the great mass of people is voting for in your country. I hope for your sake you get it turned around before they REALLY mess things up badly... Though they seem to be trying hard to do that as fast as possible.
Judicial legislation can be just as oppresive as any other kind of legislation, but it is always improper. Your rights are supposed to be protected by the constitution and bill of rights, which were created by the legislature! The interpretation of new laws against these documents by the supreme court is supposed to keep legislatures from oversteping their bounds. This is their proper role, and we should beware of expanding it.
That said, I'm not too worried about this. First, the courts can reasonbly frag the more sinister implications. Second, I'm moving away from comercial software as fast as I can, because certian (MICROSOFT) comercial software makers, already break their softare regularly.
Virginia does not intend for their personal computers to be searched and disabled at will by software manufacturers! Such things will never stand up.
People are not as stupid or evil as you think they are. If their box won't work, they will find another way to get things done. Microsoft will really kill itself if it goes around doing this.
Uniform rules for internet sales...That would be great if applied to vinyards.
I believe it was Martin Luther King who said, "Injustice anywhere is a threat to justice everywhere," and so I believe we ALL have the right to call this phone number, not just Virginians.
On another note, how could they not have passed this bill? I mean, AOL is based there and I'm sure has its lackeys pushing it like crazy. And after all, Virginia is the dot-com capital of America! Apparently that means they cater to dot-com corporations and care little, if at all, for the rights of their own constituents.
Ahh, the beautiful stench of politics as usual. Don't we elect these people to DEFEND OUR RIGHTS??? Ugh, don't get me started, I will get into my gun-control mania again.
I noticed there is nothing regarding UCITA's passing on CNN.com (as of 9:30 am). I wonder if that's an order from Case himself...
___________________
rooooar
IANAL, but I believe that now software companies can just establish an office in Virginia and claim that their shrinkwrap licenses are covered by Virginia state law. They can do this anywhere in the US. Correct me if I'm wrong, but as long as one state passes UCITA, we're screwed.
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For anyone who wishes to read the Maryland version of the Bills they can go here and grab the Rich Text Format (.RTF) version. I haven't HTML'd them 'cause WordPerfect does such ... oops no rant -- maybe I'll html them.
So, here is the index;
hb0018f.rtf --> Commercial Law - The Maryland Uniform Electronic Transactions Act
sb0003f.rtf --> senate version of the House Bill
hb0019f.rtf --> Maryland Uniform Computer Information Transactions Act
sb0142f.rtf --> senate version of the house bill
sb0505f.rtf --> Internet Consumers' Bill of Rights (cable access bill)
-d
There is a "hidden" forum at sid=moderation on the topic of moderation. While useful, comments posted to it have the unfortunate tendency to disappear after time.
There are obviously several very broken things about /. which are defeating the moderation system. These include troll posts, the apparent inability to restrict nonsensical or repeated posts, and an serious shortage of moderation points to posts. With karma 44, I've had moderation privileges once this millenium -- prior to December, 1999, it seemed I had mod priv typically once or twice a week. Comments get caught in a vicious cycle of failing to be moderated up once an article topic has reached a hundred posts or more -- for meaningful use, I'm forced to read at score=1, score=2, or higher.
Repeating comments I've made (and have since slipped from) sid=moderation:
Essentially, the idea is that AC posts would require vetting by at least one registered user. The user would face the karmic consequences of any moderation of the post, and would grant the AC post any karmic benefits: If the post is moderated up or down, the signer's karma is increased or reduced, and whatever default posting level the signer has is given to the post. This preserves anonymity while allowing a modicum of control over the AC process.
To do this, there would have to be a seperate viewing field for unvetted AC posts. Once vetted, the posts would enter the main forum and be subject to moderation. Only one vetting would be required to transfer the post to the main board.
There are other problems. Karma whoring, gullibility traps (posts written to look informative but actually false), etc. I believe that as other issues in the moderating system are dealt with, the magnitude of these issues will be diminished. Or they won't <g>. But there are bigger fish to fry first.
What part of "Gestalt" don't you understand?
What part of "gestalt" don't you understand?
Are you kidding me?
Not a single legislator dissented?
Not one?
Lemme get this straight. I'm sorry, this verges on the unprecedented:
A highly controversial bill with extremely distrubing implications against every single consumer, small business, and corporation in the country doesn't manage to get a single dissenter in the Virginia House?
Not one?
I don't buy it. I can't buy it. A resolution commemorating the life and work of Charles Schulz wouldn't pass unanimously, yet something that makes Virginia the battleground for hundreds of millions--if not billions--of dollars worth of lawsuits...
Oh. You've gotta be kidding me. You've seriously, truly, really gotta be fucking kidding me. Not even the worst trial lawyer would sink to *that*.
People, grass roots are great, but we need trees right now. Does your school use Samba? Does your company? Guess how long Samba gets to stay legal if UCITA passes?
Managers, do you want to be liable for asking your employees which database would serve your company better? Do you like reading unbiased reports? Maybe you don't. Maybe you're masochistic. Maybe you prefer the lose-lose scenario of years in court vs. solutions you've just been banned from knowing are inferior.
Unfortunately, that's just not your choice. As ever so many are happy to mention, a company's primary obligation is to its shareholders. You've gotta maximimize profit, right? Does UCITA help you to maximize profit? Or does UCITA expose you to a constant stream of risks from which only years of litigation is the possible relief?
Consumers gain nothing. Businesses gain nothing. Software companies get the right to shut down...everything, with the full force of the law behind them.
Managers, whose company is it anyway?
CEO's, ready for hackers to start using those backdoors that software companies are gonna be able to legally put in their software?
Lawyers, ready to start drafting feverish defenses? Treasurers, ready to go for broke?
Virginians, wake up. You're under attack. Under the flag of the geek, you're about to get bit hard by a rattlesnake. Now, you might be able to suck the poison out, but it might be a better idea to whip out a shotgun and give UCITA's tounge a few more forks.
Yours Truly,
Dan Kaminsky
DoxPara Research
http://www.doxpara.com
Dear Slashdot,
You have used our software in an attempt to encourage others to take a stand against UCITA, and therfore violate your license agreement. A signal shall be sent shortly to disable your software under our regulations.
Thankyou
It's turtles all the way down.
Tell them who you are, tell you're a constituent, tell them you oppose passage of UCITA because it will destroy consumer rights.
In case you haven't noticed, this strategy hasn't worked to stop DMCA, Copyright Extension or Dilution. It didn't work to stop the NCCUSL, and it won't likely stop UCITA.
Trying to oppose UCITA on the ground that it is the source of all evil, and devoid of all good will simply get you ignored. While such demagoguery may be a useful way to build up the negatives on issues all the population cares about, it isn't going to raise enough votes to scare a legislator who wants to have a "technology-friendly" state. This is particularly true in the face of an organized, well-monied, lobby of UCITA supporters.
If you *are* interested, you need to get out there with simple, rational and well-articulated amendments directed to what you feel are the worst points, and argue them with somewhat more substance and less sensationalism. To argue that UCITA will "destroy" all "consumer rights" invites a calm, rational rebuttal on the facts by the other side. In the face of specific amendments targeted at specific problems, it would be much harder to defend some of the places where UCITA overreaches.
This was an opportunity to make some changes. To have a think-in as to what changes are needed to actually make life better for the open source community. Instead, we took the role of "antis," and lost our place at the table, and will probably end up with UCITA in two or three dozen states, perhaps more, all with nothing else to show for it. Hopefully, the next time NCCUSL or the government shows an inclination to make wholesale changes to the laws most closely relating to what we do --if that happens again in our lifetime-- we'll be less silly about it.
With all due respect to the community, a call-in campaign to say that UCITA is all bad is probably the best way to assure that UCITA will ultimately pass exactly as drafted.
Here is the contact info for the sponsoring senator:
Senator Stephen D. Newman (R) - Senate District 23
In-session address:
General Assembly Building, Room 305
Capitol Square
Richmond, Virginia 23219
(804) 698-7523
email:snewman@inmind.com
Mailing address: General Assembly Building, Room 305 Capitol Square Richmond, Virginia 23219
(804) 698-7523
Here are links to the bills :
HOUSE JOINT RESOLUTION NO. 277
SENATE JOINT RESOLUTION NO. 239
SENATE JOINT RESOLUTION NO. 239
Member in charge of the study:
Delegate Viola O. Baskerville (D) - House District 71
In-session address: General Assembly Building, Room 525
Capitol Square
Richmond, Virginia 23219
(804) 698-1071
email: del_Baskerville@House.state.va.us
Mailing address:
P. O. Box 406
Richmond, Virginia 23218
(804) 698-1171
OK, If you actually bothered to do a little research at the VA state Senate site, you would have found that all that passed the House or Senate was a joint resolution to create a joint subcommittee to study the UCITA and its language. And of course that passed unanimously. All the legislators want to have more information on this, and a technical subcommittee is one of the best ways to get it. The bill was not passed. Not only that, but the report from the subcommittee isn't due until December 1, 2000. So it won't even be voted on until 2001.
Why did they do this? Because, as they say in the resolutions (which, by the way, is both HJ277 and SJ239), "the voluminous pages of the UCITA contain highly technical language and a legal scheme which even legal professionals may have trouble understanding," among other reasons, which are listed in the resolution.
So all I say is shame on Slashdot, michael, Keith Kris, and those prominent people who posted such as Dan Kaminsky. Shame on you for creating yet more sensationalist journalism because you didn't bother to check your references. Any geek with half a brain knows that InfoWorld, NetworkWorld and the like are not very reputable sources.
-Todd
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"The details of my life are quite inconsequential..."
A law that has been universally (except by the sponsors, of course) derided as anti-consumer and potentially dangerous to the industry gets passed unanimously?
I honestly believe that there are a lot of people who assume that "someone else" will be the person that makes the call/writes the letter/publically takes a stand. Everyone looks at eachother, no one does anything, and the law passes.
Don't let this happen! If you need to know more, there's a very accessible and interesting series of articles on the topic by Ed Foster at InfoWorld -- look at the GripeLine column (just ignore Metcalfe, K?)
Seriously. Make a call. Make a difference.
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Heres the consituents opinion line for both the Virgina House of Delegates and Virgina senate.
(800) 889-0229
Please all virginia voters please call and voice your opinion, Before the senate gets a chance to vote on this. One thing to note is AOL headquarters is Dulles, VA right over there near ashburn. So instead of letting the big companies like AOL and they're lobbiers deciding this for us pleae let your legislator know.
-Brian Peace