Ergonomic Keyboards

I've asked this before, but it's been awhile so I'm interested in knowing what people are liking in ergonomic keyboards these days. For the last several months I've been using a split keyboard mounted on my chair, but while overall it is excellent, it is having some problems now (it randomly died, forcing me to reboot and lose my 81-day uptime, but mainly it has only two mouse buttons on the integrated pointer which just isn't cool). My wrists aren't in the greatest shape after typing pretty much non-stop for the last few years, so it's time to try a new keyboard. Anyone have good suggestions? What has worked for you?

Comments

I swear by Kinesis kbds.

[haaz]

I'm typing this on my Kinesis keyboard. I don't leave home without it, literally, on long trips where I'm going to be typing a lot.

Here's my deal. Nearly 20 years of computer use have taken their toll. I remember having wrist pain when I was 12 after playing Ultima IV for waaaay too long one day. By the time I was 22, it'd become a chronic problem. Finally, last year, I started investigating ways to deal with it, as it was simply becoming debilitating and too painful to deal with. I was having trouble picking things up sometimes. Bad news.

Thinking fast, I looked up this topic on /. Found the old discussion on the same topic. Found Kinesis recommendations. Went to their site, read endorsements from people I knew. Was impressed. Conned company into buying keyboard for me. It arrived....

...and wow. Two weeks of using it as directed (it comes with a manual you should definately read, and advise that you should definately follow), my wrist pain had eased tremendously. I can now do push-ups with only a hint of discomfort. Before, my wrists would have buckled.

One of our developers has his plugged into his G4, which has no ADB ports -- it's USB only. Happily, the keyboard's "natural" port is a PS/2 keyboard port, which can easily be adapted to Apple ADB, or to USB. This is good, as sooner or later I'm going to have more USB hardware.

I also got a good three-button mouse. Being a PowerPC (read: Apple hardware) user, my computers shipped with one-button mice. Having a three-button mouse with Linux is darn near necessary, and I was tired of using our keyboard shortcuts for the mouse buttons. The new mouse (USB, plugged in via a PCI USB card) helped a lot. Less keystrokes == good.

Other things: I bought the foot switch for the Kinesis along with the kbd. I got the 2-btn switch, which is programmable (like the keyboard). It mostly does the shift key for me. It's nice. I should use it. ;-)

Other: Customize .bashrc heavily. I have lots of little aliases that save me from typing things like "vi index.ph3pf" or "cd /home/httpd/com/" dozens of times per day. More macros == good, as long as they're well designed.

So, Kinesis in my experience has turned my life around, insofar as my computing life. I get pain when I have to use other keyboards for a long time, like when my hard disk crashed and I had to use her iMac. (It's got LinuxPPC and the MacOS installed. ;) I like the feel of the little iMac kbd, but after a few days, it was killing my wrists again.

Exercise also helps. We geeks probably don't get enough. But anyway. Kinesis. I'd endorse 'em for the company. Do you hear me, Kinesis? ;)

Re:Take a weeks vacation

[dav]

This is not necessarily good advice.

It might work for the poster, but it won't for everybody. If your wrists ache to the point of actually constituting a repetitive stress injury such as tedonitis (which I have), then you have to undertand that you are fighting a battle to improve the health of your wrists.

What you really need is proper physical therapy. You should see your doctor of course, and she or an assigned PT should give you daily exercises which improve the strength of your wrists.

There's probably nothing wrong with taking a week off from typing, but you can't simply let your wrists atrohpy. It is imperative that they receive proper physical therapy in order to win the battle.

Just to share some anecdotal details: I have been typing on average of >8 hours a day for about a decade with no wrist problems. Last fall I took off on about 20 days of vacation in a 45 days period where I hardly typed at all. Soon after returning to regular work I went into a 4 day code frenzy (~15 hour days). On day 5 I had a finished project and I couldn't type my name without excruciating pain. I was in a panic for weeks, certain my career was over. I wouldn't wish this on my worst enemy.

Working with my doctor and a physical therapist, I can now function at an acceptable level.

• Daily wrist exercises with a special rubber band you can get form a physical therapist.
• a few minutes of wrist stretches and rest for every 20 minutes of typing.
• Ice is your friend. I bought an ice-bag from a drug store an apply it a few times every day. Ice is your friend.
• Do get wrist braces. Don't get the generic ones from a drugstore, get a set from your doctor or physical therapist, they are more comfortable. Wear them every night while you sleep, but only when you sleep.
• I replaced all of my keyboards with cheap ($30) Memorex MX 3000 split-ergo keyboards. This was difficult because I've always used and loved IBM fullsized trackpoint keyboard (I hate reaching away from the keyboard for the mouse), HOWEVER I can work all day on the split keyboards, but 5 minutes on a regular flat keyboard cripples me. I would NEVER have believed a split keyoard would help this much until my wrists became so sensitive to stress. It is really a HUGE difference. EVERYONE should stop using flat keyboards.
• I bought one of those Gyro- exercise balls which work your wrists and forearms. They are really cool, however it is still a little advanced for my stage of physical therapy.
• My doctor put me on Naproxen which is basically an industrial strength ibuprofen.
• When I was in my worst stage, I found that IBM ViaVoice technology was a great boon. Voice recognition technology has improved greatly in the past few years. I was able to dictate emails and IRC well enough. I'd really love to integrate viavoice with Konqueror.

Well I know this has been long winded, but I hope this can help.

-Dav

Kinesis is the worst keyboard I've ever used

[instant]

A lot of people obviously love the Kinesis keyboard, but I'm one of the ones that hates it. The finger motions required to use it are very different from standard keyboarding motions -- very slight side-side and up-down motions -- and they aggrivated my tendinitis much more than any traditional keyboard did. The Kinesis keyboard is also very awkward to use on a desk due to the high profile, and the lap tray is heavy and takes some getting used to.

Bottom line -- it's a very unique keyboard and has a lot of dedicated users, but it isn't for everyone and it has a high price tag and learning curve. And they lied about their money back guarantee. After I tried to return mine, I got hit with a very hefty restocking fee.

Personally, I would love to see a speech recognition product that lets me type with noises. Forget word/phrase recognition! It should be possible to make audio character recognition much more accurate. To me, this would be the real hand-saver. Open source, anyone?

When does damage occur?

[slashdot-terminal]

Hey.. Rob, I was thinking of trying that very same keyboard despite the somewhat prohibitive cost. Would you recomend using? I'de wrather keep using my regular mouse if that's possible - maybe mount it seperately on the chair
itself... Any thoughts?

I am wondering exactly when in the process of typing with a "normal" keyboard do you develop wrist degradation or damage. I have been typing for a while and still suffer no damage that I can tell.

What level of actual improvement are these keyboards over standard things you would find on a typewriter or a computer.

Solution to Bad Wrists

[Syn.Terra]

Wrists sore? Here's your solution: Aikido.

No, it's not a keyboard, it's not a hardware manufacturing company, or even anything (directly) related to computers. It's a martial art, and it does wonders for wrist strength.

I've been using a dinky flat keyboard for six years, and have been training with Aikido for half that time, and believe me, the second half of those six years were the better. Though I'm not suggesting every geek join a dojo, I am suggesting that every geek with sore wrists go out and do something physically demanding which will strengthen them.

Funny looking keyboards can help reduce strain, but if you want to be rid of bad wrists, you've got to strengthen them before you weaken them any further. Aikido worked for me, find something that works for you.

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Important information on Ergonomics!

[swordgeek]

Disclaimer: I'm about to marry a professional ergonomicist. :-)

Take a look at the message subjects, ( "I don't leave home without my Kinesis kbd" and "I HATE the Kinesis kbd!" ) you'll find the single most important and fundamental truth of ergonomics.

We're all built differently.

There is no single solution. There is no solution that will work for more than a certain percentage of the population. Furthermore, when you start to push your limits, the percentage that a given solution works for drops drastically.

Let's apply this specifically to keyboards.

If you use a keyboard for an hour or two per week, you can probably get away with almost any keyboard on the market. If you use a keyboard an hour a day, then some general purpose keyboards won't work for you. Others will. If you use a keyboard eight hours a day (or more!), then you are pushing the limits of what your hands and wrists can sustain, and will have to find the _precise_ ergonomic solution that works best for you. In other words, you have to go out and try as many keyboards as you can to find the one that causes the least problems ***FOR YOU***!!! The guy beside you might have stronger forearm muscles, narrower shoulders, double-jointed knuckles, or a thousand other more subtle variations which would make his perfect solution a disaster for you. EXPERIMENT! Try 'em all out, and try 'em again.

However, there's another side to the coin. If you're looking to minimise pain and/or damage, there's a good chance you're spending too much time at it. With the death of mechanical typewriters and manual carriages, we're currently often spending eight solid hours typing (with the odd bit of mousing on the side--the next time you give your sweetie a backrub, pay attention to where the tightest muscles are. If they use a computer extensively, I almost guarantee it'll be on their mouse side), without moving any other parts of our bodies. This is not what we were designed to do!

Make a point of getting some flexing in during the day. Get up and walk around for a minute every half hour or so. Shake your hands out after typing a long block.

If, after finding a good ergonomic solution and loosening up your muscles, you're still suffering, take a (real--weeks!) break, and see a professional.