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ABIT KT7 With Built-In CPU Multiplier Adjustment
Peter H.S. writes: "Abit and Asus seems to release AMD K7/Duron motherboards, with adjustable
cpu multipliers.
No more 'golden fingers' hardware hacks.
OC from the comfort of your BIOS.
This is truly good news. Check
[Insane Hardware] or Abit's homepage, etc." The actual scoop at Insane Hardware says, in part, "The KT7's SoftMenu III has special added features and functions that will allow the maximum performance and enhancement tweaks specifically for Athlon based CPUs, such as FSB settings from 100MHz to 183MHz in increments of 1 (84 settings). Moreover, ABIT has added CPU Multiplier Factor Adjustments, allowing the user to choose the proper multiplier factor."
This news should have been about AMD's new cpus supporting alterable clock multipliers, not about Abit's motherboard. All of their boards with SoftMenu II or III have supported that for a long time. It reads like a glorified advertisement.
Intel has one very important thing AMD doesn't: Developer support. With that I mean that they provide optimized math and signal/image processing libraries and optimizing compilers. Using an Intel tuned BLAS library (standard number crunching library) instead of the reference implementation written in Fortran 77 is much much much faster. So while higher clock speeds might impress home users that play games that extra clock speed wont help in scientific computing if you can't use a good implementation of number crunching libraries. (I can't run the intel libs on my AMD K6).
Seriously though, when cmos data is lost the abit boards just run at 66mhz fsb with cpu default voltage and multiplier until you enter the settings yourself which then persist until the next cold boot.
;)
While I'm not sure about asus boards as I have yet to see what they do on losing CMOS data, I suspect they behave similarly.
Of course, there is also the hybrid option that seems to be rather popular. MBs that can be set by either jumpers/switches or BIOS (though only one or the other at any given time of course). If the battery dies on one of those you can just fall back on the hardware if you aren't using it already.
BIOS-based cpu settings are damn convenient yet dangerous in the hands of the inexperienced, true... but IMHO a warning about the dangers of overclocking and the voiding of warranty is sufficient. If joe average tries to overclock his cpu and reduces it to slag it's his own problem after all.
Protective measures like making cpu settings jumper-only is a downward spiral (make something idiot proof, they make a better idiot). People don't need to be protected from themselves so much as they need to be educated.
Smoking a cpu would be one hell of an expensive lesson, but they'll learn one way or the other.
---
Where can the word be found, where can the word resound? Not here, there is not enough silence.
"Where shall the word be found, where will the word resound? Not here, there is not enough silence." -T.S. Eliot
Face it. Knowing how to use a Phillips screwdriver does not mean you are, or were ever, a hardware geek.
A few examples of what might qualify you as a historical hardware geek:
1. Using a propane torch to sweat soldered-in 256Kx1 DRAM chips out of scrapped non-PC memory boards so you can get all 640K on your motherboard for cheap.
2. Salvaging ribbon cable connectors for reuse in new configurations. Extra points if the connectors originated on non-PC hardware.
3. Recovering and reusing an old stepper-motor-indexed hard drive with a defective track-zero by gluing a little tab of metal onto the index wheel to offset physical track-zero in a bit on the platter. Extra points if this means you have to reduce the cylinder count by a few to get it to work.
4. Getting a 720K 3-1/2 floppy drive to work with DOS 3.3 on your XT motherboard.
5. Powering PC hardware with more than one linear-regulated power supply.
6. Fitting a standard-spacing motherboard into a case that started out with a different motherboard with non-standard spacing for expansion cards.
7. Overclocking a motherboard by actually replacing the quartz crystal (or clock module) on the motherboard itself.
8. Using a null-modem cable (must be home-made) to transfer files from one computer architecture to another.
There are certainly other examples that I can't think of, and can't remember having done in the past.
Bah.. Compaq used the same technology, licensed from Rambus, in their 5xxx Workstation. Using EDO ECC DRAM, (think SIMMs, on crack, from a SGI) 2 per bank in twinned banks, you only got a 40% speed increase. Maximum speed increase wasn't seen until all 4/8 banks were filled, and even then it topped at 65%
.sig: Now legally binding!
The rough basics of the idea is that they (being Intel corp.)
locked the multiplier on-chip.
There's not been a way to change that from the mb
if the feature is not present on the chip. This leaves bumping up the FSB as the only way to
o/c your cpu.
Amd has (for as long as I've followed the company)
not locked the multiplier on their chips.
In fact... they manufactured their slot-type chips
with gold-fingers (contacts) that allow you to
use an aftermarket or homemade device to change
the voltage/multiplier on-chip.. without having
to manipulate the fsb.. (fsb changes usually lead
to instalbility)
I'm speaking out of my nethers when I say that
it's my belief that when they changed to the socket
cpu design they introduced the abiltiy to control
this from the mb and bios... no gold fingers..
just extra pins that do the same functions.
This is just the first mb that has taken advantage
of those options.
I love AMD... I've used them since their K-6 series
first came out and have used them ever since.
My athalon 500 runs peachy at 750mhz with no
fsb changes and I couldn't be happier.
Let's give another cheer to Amd for making this
new motherboard possible.
Friends don't let friends buy Compaq's. (Dell/Gateway... same same) You want a good computer? Build it yourself.
1) jumperless processor tweaking (not new by itself)
;)
2) console-based chip multiplier changing
3) Duron support, which is neat considering that Durons are brand new, and will have at least one speed-enhancing MoBo from a reputable company basically from launch.
There are a lot of people who would like to play with overclocking but are too butterfingers to follow all the "Careful, this will void your warrantee" blowtorches-n-dremel tool directions of hardcore, "fine-line-between-treaking-and-destruction" insane overclockers. At least, I know there's at least one person in that category
timothy
jrnl: http://tinyurl.com/c2l8yr / foes: http://tinyurl.com/ckjno5
He just did say that about SIMMs.
--
Soma: because a gramme is better than a damn.
Combine that with BIG RED FLASHING warnings about how badly you could fuck up your system if you adjust these settings without knowing what you're doing, and MOST of the non-technical users will never touch them. They get worried when they see BIG RED FLASHING warnings and they steer clear of those settings.
I'm trying to teach myself to set people on fire with my mind... Is it hot in here?
Those of you in North America may wish to use this link... faster server, fewer pages to wade through...
Since the days of running more than one brand of CPU on the same motherboard seem now to be in the rearview mirror, is it time for affordable standardized passive backplanes? Wouldn't it be nice not to have to replace motherboard and case just to do a processor upgrade or be tied to one CPU manufacturer?
I see even classic Slashdot is now pretty much unusable on dial up anymore.
AMD is doing what Intel should have done. The problem with unlocked chips is that they get remarked. The rips off customers, pisses of resellers and makes the manufacturer look bad. So how do you fix it? One solution is to multiplier lock the chip so it can't be overclocked without OC'ing the FSB. This sucks. Increasing the FSB also overclocks the PCI and AGP ports. This can fuck a lot of older cards. The other approach is to allow easy identification of the processors rated speed. This stops the remarking and doesn't cost you the enthusiast market. It doesn't take a rocket scientist to realize that this is the solution the market will reward. (all other things being equal - which they never are.)
Back in the days of the P5, when remarking was at its height, Intel refused to release software (which it had developed) to identify the rated speed of a proc. Once this strategy started hitting them in the pocketbook (like I said, remarking is bad for everyone) they decided to stop overclocking (and thus remarking) by locking the CPU.
Why? Because Intel is a heavy handed company that doesn't give a shit about the end user. This is why they're forcing Rambus down our throats. This is why they haven't produced a chipset that even approaches the 440bx. This is why they refused to admit that the i820 with MTH was flawed for months after they released the buggy thing. That's why the Celeron still runs at 66mhz fsb.
Go AMD. Down with Intel.
--Shoeboy
I'd much rather have them fix existing products instead; especialy ASUS has atrocious enduser support and doesn't seem interested in fixing severe bux in their products.
Examples?
* P5A bios doesn't support harddisks > 32 GB (crash on boot). No released fix available. (there is a beta bios you can dig up if you look hard enough).
* The IDE Busmaster NT drivers for K7M Board don't support harddisks > 8GB (NT only sees first 8GB). No fix available from asus.
Guess how happy I am about buying a K7M board to replace the old P5A because I wanted to use a new big harddisk.
* Have a look at their own discussion board - lots of user questions and bug reports, absolutely NO reaction from asus tech whatsoever.
you have moved your mouse, please reboot to make this change take effect
115 millihertz?
180+ millihertz? Yes, I think there's room for you to increase your settings a little there, dude. Maybe you can even replace that monkey with a knife switch with a quartz-based CPU clock.
I noticed that the Asus board link was omitted. Asus' board allows CPU external (FSB) frequency settings to be set in 1 MHz-increments or reduction.
Very similar to Abits board, but unfortunately it has less expansion slots (1 AGP and 5 PCI, while the Abit has 1 AGP, 5 PCI, and a PCI/ISA combo).
"Imagination is the only weapon in the war against reality." -Jules de Gautier
This will give every user the chance to overclock his/her CPU and complain about the instability of the software without too much effort... Now you can even crash Linux...
You found a sword: +4 damage, +5 moderator points
I have never actually owned an Abit motherboard but you have to appreciate what they do with their spare time (read: dual celeron BP6, etc).
The cool thing about some of their motherboards is the Winbond Hardware monitoring chip that they use in some. The lm_sensors package allows linux users full use of the hardware monitoring features. Use it in conjunction with frontends like KLM or GnoLM.
Also, the "one MHz step" thing that they have can be used from inside linux. I mean, you can change the FSB from inside linux (in one MHz steps) because of the clock generator that they use.
Im not knocking other manufacturers, but I have found Abit to be a linux overclocker's best friend.
Useful Links:
FSB Utility for Linux
The lm_sensors Homepage
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o/c da world!
Both Slot connections were just Intel and AMDs way of packing cache chips on a special connection to the CPU. Now that they've both got on-die, full speed cache, it's just not necessary anymore, and I suppose having one more PCB/case/larger heatsink in the slot design adds $5+ to its cost.
With AMD, at least, you can still get their newest CPUs in slot or socket form, though, so you don't have too much to complain about.
To the people who want a "common backplane" - great, but whose? K7 based chips and PIII based chips use totally different bus designs now. Someone would have to heavily retool their chip designs to make them work on common motherboards.
AMD's new socket-A interface is used by Duron, Thunderbird (i.e. new Athlon) and will also be used by their Mustang due out later this year.
If you buy a socket-A Duron or Athlon now, you'd also have the option of upgrading to a dual SMP 760-MP DDR based mobo later this year.
I sent an email to Abit tech support when the Athlon first came out suggesting that they implement an onboard multiplier modifier function, but they said they had no intentions of supporting the Athlon at the time. I wish I still had that mail. Abit, if you are listening, please reply to this and I'll give you the address for the check.
The Voices cannot decide on whose base belongs to whom.
but for the wrong reason. You see VIA at one point released a chipset designed to put sound, video, modem, etc... on a Super 7 motherboard.
:).
The actual chipset sucked. Or at leased seamed to suck because the motherboards that ran with it sucked. However it still holds the record for the coolest chipset name I have seen.
It was called 'GRA'. Since it was made by 'VIA' the label on the board read VIAGRA. The fact that Socket 7 was old and near impotent at the time didn't help matters much
On to CPU sockets and Slots.
Why do AMD and Intel continue to pretend that CPUs are upgradeble ? It's been years since I have seen someone upgrade a computer by changing the CPU alone.
This is not a coincidence. Whenever new chips come out the older motherboards don't support them properly for one reason or another. This has even happened with Motherboards that had clock settings up to the higher speeds.
Typically a motherboard is limited to the fastest CPU currently on the market at the time it is released. If you save money by buying that board with a slower chip when it comes time to upgrade you generally find it prudent to simply skip the highest chip the board dose support and get a new CPU and board. Along with new RAM in some cases.
And speaking of RAM. Am I the only person who thinks the 72 pin SIMM was the pinnacle of module design ? Somehow the DIMM sockets we are all so fund of these days feel like they were designed to break easily. Having to push straight down with great force ( relative to what a SIMM requires ) doesn't help much.
It all feels like a scam but at least I can fondly remember those cheerful days when you could look a customer straight in the face and calmly recommend that he get viagra for his aging PC.
--= Isn't it surprising how badly I spell ?