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Audio Indrema Presentation
bigal3du writes: "Hardware Unlimited has posted an audio archive from last week's BALUG (Bay Area Linux User Group) with guest speaker John T. Gildred of Indrema. John talks for just under an hour about their upcoming Linux Console gaming system that is coming out in Spring of 2001. Be sure to check this out! The audio archive is in streaming audio and he gives away new information on the system in this presenation!"
Spring 2001 seems a bit late for this device, considering how much press these guys have been getting lately for just a few (not that) pretty pictures and some press releases. I remember the earlier Slashdot story on these guys when they initially announced the device. They even had pictures of it up on their website and we were led to believe it would be shipping soon. Now they have new pictures of a completely different device (it still looks like a cheezy CG rendering). If I remember, they initially said end of 2000 for the launch. Now it's Spring 2001. How much you want to bet that this won't ship until end of 2001, if at all?
It also sounds like they're trying to lock this machine down, prevent anybody from getting inside it, making tweaks, forcing vendors to certify their apps for the device, not allow playing of unauthorized MP3s (who makes that determination anyway?), etc. I say then, what's the point of using Linux? Perhaps they just want to get a ton of free press, but it certainly doesn't sound like this device will be open in the tradition of Linux devices. It seems they'll be adding proprietary extensions that developers will need to license. It'll use Linux, but no tampering with it? Why not just use Windows CE if you're interested in going the proprietary route? It doesn't make any sense.
Here's all you need to do: play CDs, MP3s, DVDs, RealAudio, MPEG-2, and have a TV inport or two that can play cable signals in some resizable windows. Make it very minimal. Forget the eMail and web browsing angle - it makes no sense to use your TV for eMail or serious Web browsing (aside from multimedia Web stuff like music and video - all that can be accessed through bookmarks and a portal, requirng no typing). And make it CHEAP. Remember, WebTV is only $100 and can already do most of what they're talking about today.
They're trying to make this thing do too much, which is the failure of so many similar efforts. They start out with a good idea, then the corporate hacks get all excited about it and start adding their money and input. And they overburden it with unnecessary features. Then the ship dates slide, and when the device finally ships, it's way too expensive and everybody's already lost interest.
Sounds like that's what's happening here. I say ignore these clowns until they demonstrate working technology.
1) They're competition is Microsoft (great hardware and a collosal marketing spend), Sony (good hardware and a gigantic installed base) and Nintendo (great hardware and great games). What have they got going for them? 'The awesome power of Linux' is not a valid answer unless qualified by some concrete examples.
2) The approach of sneaking a console into homes under the guise of being something else has been tried before (Nuon aka Project X) and it didn't work. The website is quite ambivalent about what Indrema *is*, whereas the major players all very clearly market their consoles as games machines first and foremost.
3) Linux seems to be a bit of a red-herring here. A modern console OS needs the standard C libs optionally with threading, and specialised APIs for 3D, audio, input, networking etc. It's not like Linux is going to deliver that stuff any better than a custom OS.
If this ever comes out, I'm gonna buy one and put Windows on it - not bad - a reasonable gaming computer for only $299...
Hu shuo! Wo ziji shuo hua de shihou, zongshi mei you yisi!
That seems to be typical console manufacturer SOP. Remember the big to-do with Nintendo and Tengen on the NES way back when? Tengen (Atari) didn't want to have to buy licenses of any sort, and skirted the system set up by the Big "N" by reverse engineering the lock chip. Good thing there was no DMCA back then, otherwise I'd have to be playing Nintendo's stinky version of Tetris instead of Tengen's.
The immediate problem with is that this is being called "the Linux-based console." Mentioning Linux is completely irrelevant, as would marketing Excel as "the Spreadsheet written in C++." Nobody cares that it runs Linux.
As several posters pointed out, why would you use an open-source OS like Linux if you're planning on making it so closed as to completely inhibit 'hacking'?
Price? Seems to me the cost of using CE or some other OS (QNX?) with better SDKs and APIs would offset that enough to keep the price low, and third-party developer interest high.
Aside from that though, what causes me to think this will probably fail is this:
14. Will nVidia be doing all future GPUs for the system?
[JG] No, future GPUs will be done by several manufacturers, hence driving the price down and making them more available.
I hope for their sake that the hardware will be ONE design, possibly manufactured by several competitors. If not, then hardware and subsequent software incompatibility will cause more headaches than the cost savings would ever be able to help.
Consoles have been and will continue to be successful because of their 100% closed architecture design. Once you start throwing variables this big into the mix, console developers turn and run.
sedawkgrep
Is that a salami in my pants or am I just happy to be me?
This sounds like a very guarded answer. Do you think he actually believes this, or doesn't want any possibility of flak coming down on his project?
Hopefully I didn't put any [] around my words.
I was thinking that this thing was vaporware, it claims to do a helluvalot of stuff like Progressive scan HDTV output. It would be nice to have a DVD player/gaming console/surfing box all-in-one that wasn't the (floored) PS2 or the 'x-box', hey if it playes Q3 full detail @640x480 at 60fps and looks good under my Loewe put me down for one!.
PS anyone know how to force new lines in comment boxes using lynx(283)?
-You'd better believe it baby!-
http://www.LinuxGames.com has a log... why would anyone want to sit through the whole talk in audio only when you can grep it?
Check out ioquake3.org for a great, free, First-Person Shooter engine!
[JG] Tweak ability is really restricted. Anyone can join the overall scheme of developing, but only Indrema can issue "Tuning packs" and they have to be certified and heavily tested for QA. You can not get into a command line on the system or tweak it from any of that standpoint I suppose by this that he means that people are not suppose to tweak it or get to a command line. Someone will, though, I am sure. But how can you have Linux without a Command Lin? , but you will be able to skin your environment eventually and minor changes like that. I am sure that Linus was sitting around one day, saying "Damn! I wish I could skin DOS! I'll have to program a new OS so I can make some minor changes! The menus and interface will features awesome gnarly dude 3D graphics when you move around the interface. For example, you click on a menu or select an object and you will hear sound effects and see an explosion or something of that nature. WHOA!!! EXPLOSIONS OR SOMETHING OF THAT NATURE. Whenever I know that I can get exploding menus, or something of that nature, things like kernels and commandlines and OSes fade from my mind...as I am sure is true if all of us.
Yep, I think this confirms it...this guy is a corporate drone...or else he was just reading from a press release. Of course, none of that means the machine is bad.
Hopefully I didn't put any [] around my words.