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How Do You Fight A Dress Code?
Borealis, would like to take off his tie, step up to the soapbox and put this question to the Slashdot Collective: "I work for a company (to remain unnamed) which is trying to implement a dress code throughout the company. While the code is not the worst I've seen, it does prohibit shorts, sandals, jeans and t-shirts. With the understanding that there are cases where a dress code does make sense, we are not one of those cases. Clients do not visit our site, nor are they more likely to if we have a dress code. We are located in a warm area of the USA and not having shorts and sandals makes the summers look a little less welcome. Further, all the present programmers were hired on with the specific mention that there is 'no dress code' (some as recently as a few weeks ago). Basically I would like to try to fight this move, but I need ammunition. Has anybody fought this battle and won? If so, how did you convince management to drop the issue. Are there any studies that show the negative impact on morale of forcing a dress code on techies? Does anybody have verifiable horror stories about companies losing out because they tried to force a dress code?" Of course, being hired under one impression, doesn't mean the rules can't change at any time and yank the rug out from under your feet. There is also quitting, but I'd like to think that companies can be sensible about such things. Hell, it's the 21st Century! I'd like to think that there can be companies that can implement an agreeable "dress code" that includes jeans, T's, shorts and sandals when appropriate. Note: This does not condone shirts with obscene language or imagery. Sure, there are limits, but why can't workers be comfortable when the work, as long as what they wear doesn't (reasonably) offend anyone else?
After a short period of time, the dress code just sorta goes away. Of course, we once went out for lunch, I took off the famous fish tie (for comfort, don'y ya know.) and it ended up stuffed and mounted on the department bulletin board.
Having the boss win the Ugly Tie award without trying also helped out.
Unionizing over the dress code? Talk about being petty.
Personnally, I don't see why one couldn't be comfortable and productive with a dress code. Where I work, we have to wear a uniform at least once a week. Everyone from the CEO to the coders and help desk techs has to wear a uniform. The other days are 'dress casual'. I actually wear a uniform most of the week because a) it's more comfortable than the other clothes I own, b) it's cheap and c) I can stumble into the closet and get dressed in the dark while being half asleep and not look like a dork once I arrive at work. I know of others that also value option c.
Besides, what's wrong with looking more professional? Heck, a pair of dockers & a button up shirt might even make one presentable, maybe even attractive to memboers of TOS. Na..you wouldn't want that to happen.
the good ground has been paved over by suicidal maniacs
Don't think that a correlation has anything to do with causation. At my company, managers are expected to dress up a bit (button shits and pants instead of jeans and tshirts), so yes, they do get listened to, but because they are a manager, not because they dress up.
As a punk (long dyed hair, facial piercings, jeans and tshirt), I think that I get a bit more respect than if I'd dress up in a suit because my appearance is so different from the rest. I obviously didn't get hired for looking pretty and kissing ass. People at my place of employment realize that I was hired because I know my shit. While I'm ignored in office small talk by the people who call me kid, when I speak up in meeting, or someone asks my help, they listen when I talk. This works fine with me as I usually avoid small talk, however as I'm a quarter century old I'll admit that I'd not mind never being referred to as "kid" again. While I agree that one is being paid at a job and that there should be a different attitude than one is relaxing, pissing off your employees doesn't help things. Unless someone can demonstrate why I must dress up (I have when going to a customer's site), I will not do so, and will leave any company which implements a dress code while I'm there and similarly would not take any job at a company with a dress code which interferes in my comfort. I'm paid either to write code, or be a unix-sysadmin, I am not paid to sweat, I am not paid to subsidize the suit industry, and I am not paid to be visually pleasing, something I doubt I could be even with lots of plastic surgery and the best suits and stylists in the world.
No, it implies that I show deference to my superioes, who feel that a semi-formal or formal dress code is appropriate for the place I work. It's fine that you do quality work, but you are not a programmer in the vein of Alan Cox, or Jeremy Allison, or Linus Torvalds, and so are, franky, easily replaced. You are of the opinion that the way you dress is simply a matter of comfort. However, the way you dress is representative of both you and your opinion of the place where you are going to.
I'm a contractor at a company in FL, where they typical dress code is, at it's most stringent, semi-formal: Dockers and polo shirts. The company I am at now is jeans and polo shirts. I still wear my Dockers though. Why? Aside from the fact that I bought $300 worth of clothes just before I started this job, being one of the best-dressed people here has garnered be more respect right from the get-go. The saying that "The clothes make the man" is almost hitting the nail on the head. I was able to walk in here, and within 2 weeks, start making recommendations about hardware usage and configuration, purchases, and things like that. Why? Because I looked like I knew what I was talking about. Now that I've had the chance to show that I know what I'm talking about, they think I'm the greatest thing since sliced bread.
Again, you work for them, not the other way around. If the biggest problem you have at your job is that they want you to look good while working for them, then shut yer whining, you've got it pretty got for the way the market's been lately.
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Ask Elton John if you can borrow his '70's wardrobe. Hire a colorblind fashion consultant. You're geeks, dress like geeks! Look like complete losers with no fashion sense. That'll show the PHBs.
Make sure everyone else does the same. And make sure they can't figure out who initiated the undermining of the dress code.
You see? You see? Your stupid minds! Stupid! Stupid!
Scene One: a small liberal-arts college in Pennsylvania, May, 1983.
George: I just got back from California. I interviewed to be a programmer at 3 companies out there, and do you know, I was the only one to wear a suit to interviews.
Me: No kidding! That's outrageous.
George: I'm gonna move out there. They just have a better attitude.
Me: Sounds like it. Good luck.
Scene Two: Philadelphia, 1991.
Jeff: The east coast is no place for gay techies. I've moving to California.
Me: Seems like a lot of my tech friends have moved there.
Jeff: Well they just have a better attitude.
Me: Sounds like it. Good luck.
Scene Three: Philadelphia, 1994.
Jim: I'm moving to California.
Me: That makes a definite majority of my tech friends who have moved there.
Jim: Well they just have a better attitude.
Me: Sounds like it. Good luck.
Scene Four: The Philadelphia suburb branch of a big-5 consulting firm, 1998.
Manager: You don't have a collared shirt on.
Me: Yeah, I'm wearing a T-shirt under this $100 sweater.
Manager: That's not the code, you have to wear a collared shirt.
Me: OK. By the way, our recruiter can't find any good candidates.
Manager: She should try harder.
Scene Five: Philadelphia, 2001.
Philadelphian: I wonder why Route 202 hasn't really become the "Silicon Valley East" like we always thought it would.
Me: Yes, somehow California has become the new economic capital of the world.
Philadelphian: I sure wish that kind of thing would happen here.
Me: I guess we don't really have the right attitude.
Postscript. Of course wearing T-shirts didn't make the Valley the new economic capital of the world. Being open about dress, however, is part of an attitude that allows for more individuality.
In a world that is so much smaller than the world of fifty years ago, when intelligent people can move thousands of miles and even cross borders to find the lifestyle they want, demanding rigid conformity is an indicator that a company values style over substance. It doesn't stop at dress code, either; and in the long run, it *will* be detrimental to the health of the company.
It only seems like a small thing. In the 80s, the most notoriously dress-code-happy company in the country was IBM. They enjoyed an incredible run of success for decades; they were the "old Microsoft"; and then, suddenly, the world moved and IBM failed to move with it. Stuck in their old ways, worshipping their own internal culture, they failed to develop new practices. Within five years they went from the elite rulers to a company that many felt might not even survive another decade.
It wasn't their infamous dress code that led to IBM's woes. But the dress code was a benchmark for their attitude, and a management style that did not value innovation and wasn't ready for change.
Today it's very obvious that any company has to be prepared to change 180 degrees in order to survive. Products can't take 3 years in design; 3 months is often too long. Innovation has to be a part of the mix. Finding good people at any cost is critical. And enforcing a no-jeans policy for tech people is not a good start to accomplishing the above.
The argument is that your workplace isn't your home where casual dress / behavior is acceptable but rather a different place where folks are paid to conduct themselves in a specific way and work towards a specific set of goals. Thus by having folks dress in a style that communicates this the message will be brought home to the staff and to those they deal with.
Along with this philosophy comes the no-dogs rules, getting rid of distractions like game rooms and ceasing to bribe employees to attend meetings by offering them food (it's part of their job to attend; they can feed themselves on their own dime.)
Part of the 90's Silicon Valley mantra was "We're here to have fun / let's bond together / we're one happy family / we're a different kind of company in a different kind of world breaking the old paradigms / we need do everything we can to hang on to employees they're our most valuable asset / we're not one of those stodgy old East Coast corporations with rules & hierarchies & parking spots assigned by seniority / we want you to grow as a human being / blah blah blah."
Part of the post-Internet-Bubble world is the focus on the bottom line / we're here to run a business / we'd be sorry to see you go but you're not irreplaceable-mindset. Three years ago the bubble was sucking in techies & everyone else to the extent that everyone had to adopt the startup's philosophies in order to compete, or at least look up-to-the-times.
Now without that pressure to compete and the "New-Economy" image tarnished many businesses are going back to the old ways. Sometimes they're doing it because they honestly do believe they're better, other times because they just want to present a more sober image internally & externally.
Now I can just hear everyone getting ready to rebut all of this with irate tirades: I'm just the messenger. My own views are below.
I have seen the effect that "dressing up" can have on interactions. The best dressed person gets listened to at meetings. The person in the T-shirt, no matter how knowledgeable & no matter how right they may be is operating at a tremendous disadvantage: We all may consciously know better but evolution tells us that the one with the shiny coat is the Alpha Male & should be listened to.
I once held a position that required me to visit branch offices around the USA, a new one every week or so. I'd fly in, spend a week or two on-site then move on. I quickly learned that how I looked made a profound difference in how I was treated. Show up in the $1,000 suit & the receptionist would buzz the General Manager to walk me around & ask if there was anything I needed. Khakis & blue broadcloth shirt got me a chatty receptionist who'd have a secretary come & show me my office for the next week Jeans & anything would get me waved in & asked to take a look at the fax machine when I had a chance. The difference remained to some extant even after I was familier to the locals or even back at my own office.
This can be easily tested by anyone: "Dress up" for a week at work and see if your interactions with folks change. Sure you'll spend the first day or two being asked if you've got an interview - smile it off. But notice how folks respond to you once the shiny new outfit wears off & you become just another person to deal with. Many folks report that their words gain weight, their opinions suddenly become worth more, and random folks in the halls are more deferential. Oftentimes people find themselves behaving somewhat differently too, being more "businesslike."
Of course none of this may be true for you and you may be in an enlightened place where things like this don't make any difference. Academia, R&D, theater, are all environments where dress (and many other social conventions) are less important and indeed casualness & even eccentricity may be respected or possibly encouraged. However outside of these places, and increasingly even in them this is not the case.
So what's my advice?
First decide for yourself how important this is to you & discover how flexible your employer is likely/able to be.
Sound out those above you, get a feel for how strongly this is going to be implemented. Will it be a memo that goes out where everyone plays along for a month then lets the whole thing slide back into obscurity? What kind of attire is expected - good jeans & a shirt with a collar / "business casual" / or the suit-'n-tie route? What can you live with?
Next how will opposition be viewed? Will dissent be respected or will non-conformists be directly rebuked or more subtly considered a "non-cooperative" employee and become marginalized, eventually passed-over for advancement or even candidates for RIFfing? Could it all become a learning-experience where the company listens to the will of it's empoyees? What do you expect from this place and what are your priorities, how important is this to you?
Once you've got this all figured out then make you decisions. Frankly the most important thing I can say is keep it in perspective & remember this is about you - esprit de corps is a lovely thing but all said & done this is your employment you're affecting along with your attire.
I don't read ACs: If a post isn't worth so much as a nom de plume to its author then I wont bother either.
Just word getting back to management that there's widespread discussion of Unionizing may well be enough to get something trivial like a dress code revoked.
Ben Masel: 51,282 votes for US Senate in the Wisconsin Democratic Primary
suit with green shirt and blue plastic tie.
That should get PHB attention. (If they get the joke, that's totally different matter)
I suggest you get a half-dozen like minded guys together, and come some warm July day, wear skirts.
Then, if your management tries to up the ante, you may have yourself grounds for a nice lawsuit. In my experience, they've backed down at this point, but you might get lucky.
As long as 2-3 of the most valuable employees don't like the dress code, and are willing to stand up for themselves, they could act thusly:
1: Don't follow the dress code
2: If sent home to change, come back in a different (non-dress code) outfit. Repeat.
3: When called into managers office lay out argument that dress code is silly, and they don't support it.
4: Manager is left with few options: Reprimands etc. are unlikely to influence. Threats of not getting a raise/etc. are ineffective as long as other well-paying jobs are on the horizion. Firing the irreplacable employee means putting in 4-5 other employees to take over their duties, losing massive amounts of money in the process, and exposing the company to a lawsuit. Or just drop the whole issue.
5: Once a few people have gotten away with this the whole thing becomes unenforceable, and dies on the vine.
If the valuable employee(s) get canned, they can still use co-workers as references and can pass the whole episode off to a new employer as a difference of opinion.
Risky, but showing a little backbone from time to time is a good thing.
It is also probably worth first sending an anonymous memo to the manager thats pushing/enforcing the dress code at the local site, that in essence declares war on the new policy. This gives that manager time to save face and back down on it. When push comes to shove, most managers would gladly send their company down the tubes rather than lose face over something as silly as jeans or a t-shirt.
"But actually trying to use m4 as a general-purpose langage would be deeply perverse" --ESR
On your lunch break take your fellow programmers down to the goodwill or salvation army and get some baggy baby-blue zuit-suits. You can get some crazy shit at the goodwill :) ...
You just need to remind your management that people need the freedom to express themselves -- and theres things MUCH WORSE then t-shirts and shorts.
Anticdote: I played in my high-school jazz band back in the day... and uniform is very important in a band -- Our uniform was black dress pants, tux shirts, vest, bowtie ... looked very sharp. So round about 94 the director decides, lets wear BALL CAPS with our suits! ... So I decide, I'm gonna show this fucker a ballcap ... I went to the closet and got out my vintage 1986 Lazer tag ball cap!! I can't find a picture of one on the net, buy immagine a silver ball cap with a huge infraread sensor array on the top, and on the forehead --6 leds and a speaker that beeps every other second. The director flipped out when he saw it and we never wore ballcaps with our uniforms again :)
Your mileage may vary :)
Free Techno/Jazz/DNB/MI Music by guys obsessed with monkeys!
Contary to popular belief, a suit and tie can be more comfortable then jeans and a t-shirt. however you need a tailor to custom make a suit to fit you exactly. If your boss flys you to a third world country (thailand is good) and gives you an two grand of spending money you can have a suit that looks great (to those who think suits look nice), and is comfortable. In the US expect to pay $30,000 for the same service. I strongly recomend anyone faced with wearing a suit for more then funerals to do this.
Why bother asking. You've got a job that pays you doing what you like. You're complaining about a dress code? Wah.
You are a professional. Just because clients don't usually come by your office doesn't mean they won't ever come by. You need to be ready in case they do. And it's not like your job involves crawling around under a raised floor pulling cables. I saw what someone else said down below and have to agree - if getting dressed in a pair of pants and a nice shirt is too much of a hassle for you, go work at your local corner convenience store. You get paid a respectable about of money, show some respect for the place that pays you that money.
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Are...weird to say the least,at least in this century. I see no reason why you can't dress comfortably, but not sloppily. When I worked nights, t-shirts were the rigor. When I moved to days, I immediately switched to khakis and polos, or button down shirts. I don't wear a tie unless I am meeting with the president of the college, or when I am giving a tour of the computer/server room to colleagues, or students. My boss doesn't even wear a tie anymore. Shorts are a no no, and who'd want to wear shorts in a computer room (20 tons of AC working 365/24/7)?? My point is, sometimes dress codes are good. If everyone is coming in in Think Geek t-shirts, while your co-workers may think i't cool, the other people you work with might get the wrong impression. Solution? Get MEGA COMFORTABLE Think Geek Polo's. I get tons of comments, even at the grocery store, when I wear my tux polo! ;) This is not a Think Geek commercial, just a satisfied customer.
Gorkman
Make yourself look as ridiculous as possible, while still in compliance with the code. If the code requires ties, wear a fish tie, a Dilbert tie, or some other atrociously ugly tie. If they require suits, wear an avocado green or plaid 70's style leisure suit. If you're a guy and the code says "Slacks or dresses required", wear a dress to work. You could also interpret "suit" to mean a 1700's style outfit, wig and all. By all means make sure your clothes have loud colors, colors that don't match, polka dots, bizzare styles and anything else that adds some color to your outfit.
When the PHB asks you about your outfit, point out that your clothes are in compliance with the dress code and make sure you tell everyone the look on his face.
Meldroc, Waster of Electrons
Further, all the present programmers were hired on with the specific mention that there is 'no dress code' (some as recently as a few weeks ago).
Were any contracts signed that mentioned this? If so, you'd have a breach of contract case. Failing that, you'd have to get a little more creative, of course. For example, you'd have to try and secretly organize enough employees to join with you on this, and do what you need to do to pressure management into giving it up.
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Money is always in issue. On interviews I mention that shirt and tie = $5,000 more for me, Add a jacket or suit, that's another $5k a year. Dressing up all the time costs money. Money I could better spend on electronics parts for my robots and coil guns.
I love my employer, but they recently started doing xyz, which really pisses me off. Since I have no real grievence procedure, and not xyz isn't written down anywhere but has been a kind of informal agreement I knew they could break at any time, what ever can I do?
An answer (not always the answer) to these sorts of questions may be to form a union. I know, I know, /. types (and tech types in general) often think unions are some kind of big evil thing that is just out to beat you up, make money off you, and/or force you to go on strike. However, unions are specifically designed to give employees power with their employers. A democratically-run union (and I know that some aren't, but many are) can be the solution to the problem discussed in this issue of Ask /., as well as many others.
// mlc, user 16290
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Ask for the company policy on company uniforms and what the clothing maitnance alowance is. Many states require this provision for upkeep of required uniforms and dress codes. The company may scrap it if the policy will cost them. My company for example buys me ergonomic shoes and perscription safety glasses as they are required.
The truth shall set you free!
This shouldn't be a difficult issue to resolve. Just pose two questions to your managers and see if they will reconsider:
1: Will the change improve their core competency?
2: Will the change enhance their revenue?
My experience with managers in companies large and small is that if neither of those two questions can be answered "yes", then that alone will prevent any change from happening. Change costs money. If change won't make money, it won't happen.
If the lack of good reasons doesn't stop the proposed change, argue (as I'm sure you would) that it will hurt morale and productivity. Write up a petition of protest, and have your coworkers sign it. I don't know where to find any studies suggesting increased productivity in comfortable settings, but they can't be hard to find. I even recall one that suggested that students are more apt to learn if they're reclining than if they're sitting in uncomfortable desks. I spent some time working from home, and I accomplished *easily* four times as much per day as when I was working in the office (and I've got LOC counts to back it up).
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Get all the Techies to ask and bug the managers about dry cleaning. Ask if you can get a loan/rase becouse you need to buy new clothes. Also open up monster.com and leave it wide on you screen, work on your resume, and make sure the boss notices. Complain that you don't know how to tie a tie. Come in dressed like a compete fool.
Of course you have to do this all casualy and its better if you do it all together.
And when the mention something about your clothes, ask about the WAN link that goes to there, or the documentation for something... Look busy and lost!
hmm... for fun I enjoy launching DDoS attacks against 127.87.42.5
I've been at 5 companies in the past 3 years,
one bank and 4 dot-coms in this area (philly suburb)
and I can definitely attest to this uptight, shitty attitude.
at my last dot-com, I was sent home for wearing
the copyleft.net dust puppy t-shirt (keep in
mind I am a senior UNIX architect, not some operator).
the reason--someone might be offended
by my shirt! it was explained to me that the
policy of "no writing or pictures on any t-shirt"
meant that no one could take offense to anthing.
what I found unbelievable was the fact that all
of the management types strolled around the
place wearing "Sun", "Veritas", etc polo shirts
without consequence.
[start sarcasm] lemme tell ya, I really do feel bad
that the company went under too [end sarcasm]
A year spent in artificial intelligence is enough to make one believe in God.
Tell them you'll agree not to wear sandals if they ease up on the other restrictions. Realize that some people have REALLY ugly feet, and you probably don't want to see them anyway.
If tits were wings it'd be flying around.
THe company where I interned had a dress code, but being the young upstart college guy that I was, at the beginning of spring, I was like, "What the hell? It's the beginning of spring, I'm gonna DYE MY HAIR!!!" So the next day I came in with teal hair. People were shocked, and whenever I walked down the hall, people gave me weird looks. But that company needed a bit of shaking up, and no one really said too much to me because I still got the job done.
Quando Omni Flunkus Moritati
Don't forget the FAQ. which addresses dress codes in regards to hackers, amongst other things. See Section 1.1.
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"Outlook not so good." That magic 8-ball knows everything! I'll ask about Exchange Server next.