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Professional Audio on Linux?
twilightzero asks: "Recently a friend of mine who is chief engineer at a medium size recording studio/radio station has become increasingly unhappy with Windows (and would like to stay away from Macs) and has asked me if there is any sort of professional audio solution for Linux. Has anybody, anywhere ever tried this? Is it possible to buy a pro audio card with Linux drivers and just run Sound Forge in WINE or do you need an entirely native package?" This is one of those questions that just needs to be answered. What Open Source sound packages out there are good enough for even the professionals to use when they need to make their squeaks, squeals, and whistles. Also, what can they use to put their created sounds together into some semblance of music?
As an addendum, coasterfreak asks: "Being an avid Linux user and composer is a bit of a problem right now. I've never run across any decent music creation programs for Linux. I've used Finale and Cakewalk before, but have yet to see them for Linux. I've heard rumors of something coming from the Debain crew, but nothing more than rumors." Can anyone confirm or deny them?
Just as a bit of a helpful hint, how many of you have tried Audacity yet? It looks to be a fairly feature rich sound editor, and it supports mixing tracks, plugin sound effects, and is cross platform, to boot! Maybe this is a decent spring board for those of you looking to start experimenting with sound under Linux, but I'm not quite sure it's ready for professionals yet...this based on the version number of 0.97 rather than any actual experience, so I'd take the word of those who have said they have used it rather than mine. It would be great if Audacity is further along than it looks.
"You can have one in any color as long as it is black." - Henry Ford
Steve Jobs does have diferent colored cutesy boxes, but you are very limited as to what you can do with the OS. Just look at the legal action against groups that think diferent and came up with a way to alter their desktop theme. I suppose there are also countless other things that Apple has proclaimed as evil, whenever a user or group of users wanted to "Think Diferent" than the Apple groupthink.
That is why I will personally never own a Mac. Sure, they make good hardware, sure the OS is pretty easy to use and functional. The thing that sucks, is you really can't think diferently than the Apple party line. It makes it sound a little like a dictatorship.
At least with Linux and Windows, there is nothing wrong with you changing the entire layout of the desktop and you have nearly limitless choices of what you can do with your system.
People just don't like Dictators.. Don't ask me why...
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If you ignore the other uses of a tool, does that make the tool less useful, or you less useful?
are there any valid reasons why he'd like to stay away from macs?
Probably the same reasons that many of us stay away from anything from Apple: It's overpriced, and you are locked in to Apple forever. People like to talk about Microsoft's "monopoly" but it's nothing compared to Apple. You are totally at their mercy, and they haven't exactly been merciful in the past.
That's the practical reason, but you can also choose to stay away from them for moral reasons. Apple lives and dies by the lawsuit. At least Microsoft doesn't sue everyone in existence for ridiculous reasons (like "copying" the concept of a computer with a built-in monitor in a bright color).
Or you could dislike them for how they stabbed the clone manufacturers in the back.
Or you could dislike them for flat-out lies in their advertising ("twice as fast").
Ironically, Apple now actually makes a product that I'm semi-interested in, namely OS/X. But I will never, ever EVER give Apple any money. I'm hoping that someone will make an OS/X clone.
Sometimes it's best to just let stupid people be stupid.
You are locked into Apple forever? Does Steve Jobs have a gun pointed at your puny little brain?
The point is that you are locked in if you don't want to throw away your investment.
I can run [...] Windows 95, Windows NT, BeOS, Linux PPC and Linux x86
Yeah, in a crappy, emulated environment. It's real convenient having to fire up the emulator. Why not just use the apps you want to use on a native hardware?
I can put it on eBay and recover more than 50% of my investment. You are not going to do that with a POS intel box -- no matter who assembles it.
Well, duh, of course you can. That's because it's an artificially tight market. The reason you can't sell used PC hardware is because you can buy better hardware for the same price because of the commoditization of hardware in the PC market. The resale value of Mac hardware is a disadvantage -- that's an indication that the newer stuff is not much better than the older stuff.
This is the sort of gripe I would expect from someone with ZERO interest in capitalism (your Anti-American article link shows your true colors).
LOL! I see you've never seen any posts by me in the past. I am one of huge defenders of Capitalism on Slashdot, not to mention the USA's right to destroy the barbarians (anti-american article!?). Which is why I hate Apple -- they are anti-competition. They are not protecting their "intellectual property", they are protecting their monopoly position. A colored computer is not intellectual property. A gumdrop-shaped button is not intellectual property. The GUI was not intellectual property.
Harley Davidson would not have the right to prevent other motorcycle makers from stealing the sound of their exhaust system. Which they do successfully when challenged. Are you anti-HOG as well?
Actually, I detest Harley Davidsons (too f'ing loud), but that's irrelevent. No, they don't have the right to an "exhaust note". That's simply absurd. And I'm a huge intellectual property advocate. I don't believe in music trading, and I don't believe in software trading. If H/D thinks their engine sound is what their about, then maybe they should think about making motorcycles instead.
When Jobs killed the clones, he saved Mac OS from running on sub par quality hardware like most x86 machines.
What Jobs killed was your freedom to buy what you want. Fine, if you don't like Power Computing's stuff, then don't buy it. But it really takes a Mac Zealot to say that you are better off without the choice.
Apple has demonstrated at MacWorld this fact time and time again.
Apple has demonstrated smoke and mirrors time and again, but funny how when people benchmark real applications, you don't see it. You can find certain things that have been optimized for the Mac, but on average, it's about 20% faster clock-for-clock. Their advertising used the bullshit, ancient "integer Bytemark" that proved absolutely nothing about real world performance. Apple is a pack of liars when it comes to their advertising.
Apple can only assure that by building the product itself. The clone fiasco proved that. Mac users will just point our fingers at you and laugh at your Mac bigotry.
And the rest of the world will laugh back as you convince each other that you're really better off with only Apple as your sole supplier. Competition is such an overrated concept.
Sometimes it's best to just let stupid people be stupid.
if you are into Pro Audio and aren't using a mac i don't know if you can call yourself a professional.
Kenny Sabarese
www.kennysabarese.com
When did Apple prevent you from buying a computer from another manufacturer?
Why they tried to sue everyone who had a competing computer that used pixels. They sued everyone who had a competing GUI regardless of whether it even worked like the Mac or not (Win 3.1 bears absolutely no resemblence to the Mac, but that didn't stop Apple).
Darwin is even free for the taking and can be installed on x86 equipment.
Yeah, thanks Apple, for giving me BSD which I can already get. But you'll note that anything above the Kernel is strictly verboten. You'll note that Apple threatens to sue anyone that tries to make anything that even looks like OS X (like the themes).
I think you need to open your eyes and see what Apple really produces.
Maybe you should open your eyes and see that what Apple primarily produces is lawsuits.
Sometimes it's best to just let stupid people be stupid.
First off, apologies for cross-posting if any of my fellow Linux users have already posted this info. Just trying to write a summary :-)
:-)
:-)
Here we go:
Linux OS has the best latency out there (after applying low-latency or pre-empting patches), having MIDI latency in sub-1ms and 2.6ms latency for multichannel DSP streams (up to 52 channels with RME Hammerfall). This DSP latency is not limited by Linux OS, but by the current construction of audio hardware (having the smallest possible buffer of 64bytes -- so you do the math). Mac has just now introduced 32-bit sound and native multichannel options, while both Linux and Windows have had that since ~1998.
Linux OS supports more than 150 soundcards including mainstram (sb, sblive etc.), laptop (ESS Maestro series and other), and high-grade (RME, MOTU etc.). See: www.alsa-project.org (look under soundcards/card matrix). There is also commercial driver called OSS (open sound system)
Linux OS has PLENTY of audio apps. Just check the following site, and you'll find numerous apps for every type of app:
http://www.bright.net/~dlphilp/linuxsound/
Just for reference, here are some apps to take a note of:
Protools equivalent: Ardour, Mixmagic, Multitrack, Rt, Audacity
Soundforge equivalent: Audacity, Ecawave, mxv, snd
Max equivalent: Jmax, PD
Video editing: Broadcast2000 (yes, it can do sorenson and 12-channel sound production and is loaded with audio and video filters)
DVD player: bunch of these, I'll let ya figure these on your own (some of them being OMS and MPlayer)
3D design: Maya (commercial), Softimage (commercial), Blender (free)
Sequencers: Muse, Timidity
VST-like plugins: LADSPA plugins
MP3 player: XMMS
Other: Csound, Cecilia, RTcmix, Glame etc.
etc. (you get the point!
x86 computers ARE superior almost in every respect to Macs, and that whole Photoshop benchmarking does not mean a thing due to fact that Apple has invested into Adobe in order for them to make a couple of filters use altivec engine (128-bit float point calculation engine that needs to be specially coded for, usually in a low-level language), while Adobe completely ignored the corresponding AMD/Intel SSE (streamlined SIMD extensions) engine which does the same thing for the x86 cpu's. That's what causes seeming performance "boost" on Macexpo's "benchmark charade" that Steve Jobs sells so well (by "benchmarking" using only one app in the whole world LOL). All other apps out there run faster on x86 cpu's than on Macs due to fact that simply altivec is not being used, OR it is being used, but Intel/AMD version also utilizes SSE in the same app, thus leveling the competition. Here are some sites that prove that (in respect to CPU speeds):
http://www.cpuscorecard.com/all_cpus.htm
http://no6.com/apple/
Other reasons why x86 cpu's architecture is better:
Mac's front-side bus is 100Mhz, x86's is 266Mhz for AMD and 400Mhz for Intel.
Mac's PCI bus speed is 33Mhz, x86 is either 66 or 133Mhz (depending on Motherboard).
Mac's IDE drive ATA form factor is 66Mhz, while x86's offers 100Mhz ATA/Raid capability.
Mac's best memory runs at 133Mhz, while x86 allow for Rambus memory.
Intel's chips (P4's) now offer SSE2 which directly corresponds to Altivec engine, except that there are more apps which utilize Intel's technology due to fact it is easier to code.
All of this speaks of faster data transfer on x86's (both Windows and Linux OS) than on Macs. And don't even get me started on Itanium (true 64-bit processor that can sustain continuous 6.5 Gigaflops calculations).
Also, x86 computers offer customizability and an ability to put as many soundcards as one can potentially stuff into them at the same time, thus leaving the freedom of choice to the user, and not cover up, lack of choice in some kind of a "think different" slogan...
Finally, x86 computers are cheaper, much MUCH cheaper!
As much as the OS X.1 is concerned, read the review given on Slashdot (on the 10/16/2001) written by a Mac person. He has described it rather well (read the conclusions), so there's no need for me to comment on that one.
Finally, if you look into the Windows XP, as an Intel/AMD machine alternative, you'll hear nothing but praises, even in the above-mentioned article written by a Mac person! Nvida reports up to 50% boost of their cards in the new OS, by just issuing new drivers, and they have already now (prior to these latest drivers) beaten Mac OS 3:1 in 3d benchmarking (check sharkyextreme.com's benchmarks of GeForce3 and Quake3 just to get some kind of an idea, as much as I remember, it was something like ~120fps on a dual G4 800 vs. ~230+ fps on a 1.5Ghz P4 with Gforce3,before this latest driver issued by Nvidia). Other news sources also report up to 50% performance improvement of Windows XP over Win9x.
nuff said