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Red Hat 7.2 Released
Spirit writes "Red Hat has anounced the release of Version 7.2 distribution with Gnome 1.4 and Nautilus, default ext3 fliesystem and according to ZDnet migration from LILO to GRUB"
Updated by HeUnique:There are some issues to note before upgrading: The kernel that comes with the RH 7.2 is heavily patched 2.4.7 and has been tested quite heavily on fully loaded Linux boxes - so the recommendation is to use it
If you're upgrading from the previous Red Hat 7.1 and you're using Ximian GNOME, then you might want to erase all Ximian GNOME RPMS (use the command: rpm -e `rpm -qa | grep -i ximian` --nodeps to erase the RPMS). Red Hat's GNOME RPMS has been more tested then Ximian's one and there is a conflict between them. You cannot use Red-Carpet on Redhat 7.2 as it will fail with the RPM libraries.
These are the most critical notes about Redhat 7.2. You might want to read the README & the Release-notes which appears on the 1st ISO image.
Oh, and if you already installed it - then have some fun with the new un-official RPMS from Enigma's section of FreshRPMS
I have been playing with the 7.2 betas (roswell) since it came out, and with the 7.2 release for about a week now.
I am very pleased with Redhat 7.2, it has given me very few problems, and it was the first Linux distribution that installed into my laptop without any tweaks.
The main enhancements (as visible by the user):
Grub instead of lilo (but you can still use lilo if you want to ..).
Grub is a great boot loader, similar to the "boot monitor" of real
Unix hardware. Grub understands the file system, so you do not need
to reinstall Grub every time you update your kernel (like you have to
with lilo). Once you are in the grub boot promt, you can boot any OS on
your system (eg. from a floppy)
Mozilla and Nautilus: (I am a gnome user)
Mozilla 0.9.2.1 is a rather old release, but it was the release chosen by Netscape for NS6.1 so it is quite good. Nautilus is 1.0.4 + a lot of patches from RH (Alan Cox ?) to speed things up. Natilus is still somewhat slow, but I don't use file managers so much, so I don't care. I think that you should have at least 128 MB ram to run it, is was slow on one of my test machines with 64MB ram and a sub optimal disk system. Seeing the speed and stability improvements of Mozilla in the last 6 months, I am quite confident that Nutilus will be a great file manager (++) in a short time frame. It is a very good "eye candy", and impresses every Windows user seeing it. If you for one reason or another, don't like Nautilus, use the good old GNU Midnight Commander instead (yes it is on the CD).
Kernel, gcc, ptyhon, etc
The kernel is 2.4.7 + a lot of patches. Since RedHat 7.1 is at kernel 2.4.9-6 already, I believe that we will see an updated kernel soon. The main compiler is RedHats own 2.96 + modifications, and python is at 1.5.2-35. You will find gcc 3.01 and python 2.1.1 on the CD which can be installed separately. RedHat 8.0 will probably use these as default.
Postfix, Apache:
Redhat has dropped support for Postfix (a sendmail replacement), which used to be on the Powertools CD. I really don't know why, but I hope that the next RedHat release will fix this major bug. Apache is the rock solid 1.3.20.
Executive Summary:
RH7.2 is a polished good distribution. Since it is a .2 version, RedHat
is going to support it for a looong time, and it will become the first
choice for many system administrators for serious linux servers (that is,
until 8.2 is released).
RFC1925
Have they improved their crappy installer? If they ever want to make it outside of the clueful user category they're going to have to improve their installation process under every conceivable condition. And if an installation is restarted it should continue from where it left off, if at all possible. And the install logging is pathetic. A list of packages that have been installed. Nothing about the state of the machine at each stage, which would be useful.
There, now my Monday morning rant, however lame, is done I can get on with my coding, which will be bug free and highly optimised, first time, every time.
Okay, maybe not.
:wq
But it may just as well be.
I've been using RH since 2.0.27 on a 386SX/12, and like many of you, have stuck with Red Hat in one form or another for many years. However, recently Red Hat's distrib has begun to suffer, largely because of oddball decisions like the ones we're seeing in 7.2.
LILO has been replaced with GRUB. Why? So we can confuse things even more for the people who we're trying to attract to the platform? If it aint broke, don't fix it, gang. You have an installed user base that knows the ins and outs of LILO, and has for years..Now that knowledge has been deprecated. Books will have to be rewritten, headaches arise, the whole nine yards will unfold as people have to sit down and digest yet another piece of Linux minutia..Why bother. LILO works. Sometimes switching one working part with another for only minimal gains is NOT a good idea..the situation doesn't mandate such changes.
Cheers, and yes, PROPAGANDA is still running,
Bowie J. Poag
By the way, folks, Nautilus is dead. The fact that they went out of business so quickly ought to tell you something about their product.
Was Eazel trying to sell people copies of Nautilus? I dont think so. They were trying to sell services offered through nautilus, which nobody wanted. They went under because they didn't have a revenue stream, not because Nautilus sucked. Nautilus is not dead, the release of 1.0.5 in the last week shows that, the work has been taken up by the community, and Nautilus seems to be benefitting from that.
[Disclaimer: I don't use Red Hat, I use a certain other distro, for whom I used to work, but...]
;-)
Just cos you don't like Red Hat's choices, doesn't make them bad, remember, Free Software is about choices...
a journaling system tacked on to the old ext2 system
Yes, it is, but that sort of makes it easier to migrate to (and revert from!). I personally use Reiser, but I recognise the benefit of ext3.
any rational reason for choosing GNOME over KDE2
Some people prefer it! I am one of them (and there are a lot of us...) And when RH fund GNOME development, it stands to reason that they'll use it as the default desktop. SuSE fund KDE and lo and behold it's SuSE's default. (and other distros choose one way or the other) You don't have to use the default, make your own choice - you choose KDE2, fine, it's a great desktop just don't moan about GNOME, ok?)
Nautilus is dead
No, Eazel is dead, and Nautilus has gone through at least two revisions since then, and is being ported to GNOME2 - that's the great thing about Free Software - it outlives any company if it's good, and Nautilus is goooood! (I don't use it - not enough memory, but hey, it's all about choice innit?)
type in a URL...fire up the appropriate program
GNOME does this too oddly, oh, and it does have a great browser in Galeon.
So, just because you don't use RH doesn't make it any less news. This is a significant revision (remember, noone uses a RedHat version line until x.2 if they have any sense
Listening for the sound of the coming rain...
Uh, wait. Without wishing to troll, have you read the list of "things you should know" above? At the retail / desktop/ even OEM level, this is not what people want to hear. They want to hear "Put the CD in the drive. Switch on the machine. Select your language and time zone. Wait."
I think that WinXP has goofed big time with its registration requirements. Now is a great opportunity for GNU/Linux distros to make a big play for the desktop, but they'll gain share only by being idiot proof, because (let's be honest) if we're talking about "knifing the heart" of the Windows market, we're really talking about people who are terrified of anything that comes with a README.
If you were blocking sigs, you wouldn't have to read this.
I Sig 11'ed everytime I tried to install RedHat 7.1, even though I had no problems with the same hardware in RH7. Anyone had a Sig 11 fault on install with RH7.2 yet? I'd like to be able to jump to that, if possible, but don't want to waste time trying to upgrade if I'm just going to have the same Sig 11 faults.
When Mandrake 8.1 came out many people flamed it for using a custom kernel. RH has done exactly the same thing again, but no flaming. What gives?
I just upgraded my home machine to Mandrake 8.1, which comes with the same general software packages that RedHat ships. While I (of course) haven't tried the new RH yet, I'll make a general observation based on KDE, Gnome and all the other little goodies which ship on a modern Linux distribution: Usability of Linux (on a well-setup machine) is no longer an argument against it's use.
...
Let me explain: when people talk about usabuility, they typically mean "it is (or it isn't) like on Windows" and maybe "it is (or it isn't) like on a Mac". This is not what I would call usability, but rather something like "environment inertia"; people don't like change even if it is for the (long term) better.
After seeing my mom (aged 60+, bought her first computer 1 year ago, never used a computer before that) struggle with Windows when needing to do rather simple/basic things, I've grown convinced that a (well set up) KDE desktop is just as usable as Windows and that the so often touted Windows usability is nothing more than a myth. Windows is usable once you're used to it; otherwise is't as difficult (or easy) than any other decent windowing system (yes, KDE certainly fits this description, GNOME probably does; this is *not* meant as flamebait but just an abservation of the way these Desktops are configured in the newest Mandrake 8.1 release; your milage may vary). These don't work quite the same way as Windows, but it basically do the same things, provides you with menus, with end-user friendly software (KOffice is pretty cool & looks nice, KMail is quite user friendly, etc) and nice GUI configuration tools. If you have a chance sometime, watch someone who's never used a computer try to figure out Windows; it's very instructive to see that Windows itself is not more or less intuitive than any other windowing
system; once you've mastered the concepts and abstractions, it becomes easy. The so called usability advantange of Windows is mostly imprinting, inertia and FUD; the functional differences are starting to disappear or become neglegible.
The biggest obstacle at this point is device/drive support and the need to recompile kernels to get some stuff to work. Usability is (generally speaking) just fine, provided you're working on a well-setup & installed box
-ext3 maybe will not score the best in a single FileSystems comparison table. But, overall, is a pretty darn good filesystem. It is stable, you can migrate easily, is fast... We are talking about RedHat 7.2, that is, a stable distribution
-Last time that I checked (5 minutes ago) you can choose between Gnome, KDE... as your default desktop environment/graphical login/workstation installation. Even if you choose to select as default graphical environment GNOME, you can select KDE for your use and set it as your default one. Nuff said.
-Who cares about a programming language? If you do not like it, port it to C++. Show me the code.
-You obiously have no idea of Linux. You can run Konqueror form within GNOME!.
-Nautilus is pretty cool. It has a whole bunch of interesting features, like the "tabbed" way of displaying multiple webpages (instead of having multiple separated windows). This is A Good Thing (TM). If you don't like it, don't use it. Linux is about choice.
-RedHat 7.2 comes with KDE 2.2.1.
BTW, you sounded like a Troll.
Enjoy the best RedHat!
Why do people not gzip the iso files before they put them on the ftp sites? It's something I have never understood. Even with a great deal of the content already compressed, I have got a typical saving of ~10-15% on various distro install disks. Saving 80 odd megabytes of download per disk, per user is a lot. And how hard is it to type "zcat blah.iso | cdrecord" when you have it?
Never mind that anyway - don't download it, buy it from Redhat instead. But does anyone else wish RH would sell cheap disk sets like mdk do? I bet it would only improve their profits. They would be bought mostly by ppl who currently download the isos (like me), not the ppl who currently buy the boxed sets ('cos they all want manuals etc otherwise they would download also)
MartinG.
-- MartinG To mail me: echo kewyjlcxyzvjfxbqwh | tr bcefhjklqvwxyz
RH 7.2 solves a real issue - sometimes (once a month) her harddisk stops working. A hardware error.
While it's great that journalling filesystems let you get started up more quickly, this doesn't solve the problem*. If the hard disk does not consistently spin up, you can be assured that some day it will never spin up again. Get the data off it before this happens.
Hard disks are cheap. I just bought a Seagate ATA IV ST380021A yesterday. It's 80GB with transfer rates from 24 to 41 MBytes/sec and unbelievably quiet: 2.1 bels idle (below a whisper). It only cost me $200.
* - "issue" is a pet peeve of mine. A problem is something that needs to be solved. An issue is a point of discussion. While this has become a point of discussion, it was first a problem and hasn't ceased to be. Don't be like Microsoft. Admit there are such things as problems and bugs.
Linux will never be idiot proof, because Unix hackers don't understand what an idiot is!
Most hackers will never look at the overall design of Linux. They will continue to sit in an ivory tower and code away, oblivious to the fact that the majority of computer users have in intention of ever using their baroque and complicated application. The only people who will use their product will be other hackers, who will gladly overlook any difficulty in installtion or use. "Its half the fun!" they cry. To a hacker, yes it is. To someone who doesn't even know the diference between MSN and AOL, it isn't even a problem. They'll ignore the product completely.
Linux hackers would need to understand that users will not learn. Aunt Jo will not bother to "learn a few simple commands" to install Super Mailer 0.0.1.432. Your Granny will not bother to figure out what the difference is between modules.conf and conf.modules, and which kernel & modutils version she requires. A question to Linux hackers: Have you ever heard of "path of least resistence"?
This is the main problem with Linux. Hackers write their code, which other hackers use. The people writing the code never hear from anyone but other hackers about their product, no one ever tells them it is too hard to use. Its a cycle of ignorance.
Give up on your ideas of Linux ever being easy to use, it won't happen.
4.2 in 11/2000, 4.3 in 4/2001 and 4.4 in 9/2001. And, none of these are significantly different.
This is an advantage. Some people don't want a completely redesigned OS every six months. Some just want the stable OS they've always been using plus bug fixes, new hardware support, etc. You won't see anything significantly different until 5.0. And after that you won't see anything significantly different until 6.0.
This is a Good Thing(tm).
A Government Is a Body of People, Usually Notably Ungoverned