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Aerie Networks to Reactivate Ricochet Service?

Posted by ryuzaki0 on from the still-up-in-the-air dept.

JimDog writes: "Aerie Networks is apparently buying the assets and IP of Metricom's Ricochet service and plans to reactivate it in at least some of the former coverage areas. A more detailed press release in PDF format is available here." There might be some hope for Ricochet addicts after all.

32 of 75 comments (clear)

  1. Hooray! by Galvatron · · Score: 3, Interesting

    I'm currently building a wearable, and a reestablished Ricochet would be excellent for that. Anybody remember what coverage was like in the SF bay area (where I live) and New England (where I go to school)?

    --
    "The question of whether a computer can think is no more interesting than that of whether a submarine can swim" -EWD
    1. Re:Hooray! by TheSync · · Score: 2

      Ricochet was great if you stayed put, but in a moving vehicle it had great trouble microcell-hopping. I find CDPD, as implemented as a virtual NIC by the Sierra Aircard 300, to be much more useful in mobile environments. It is even usable on most of the Amtrak trip between Washington, DC and NYC.

      I've used CDPD to build a portable webcam.

    2. Re:Hooray! by rjamestaylor · · Score: 3, Interesting
      Ricochet was great if you stayed put, but in a moving vehicle it had great trouble microcell-hopping

      First, why are you driving (most do) and using an Internet connection?

      Second, that's not my experience. I, a driver and a Ricochet user, drove 80 MPH down I-5 (between the 91 and the 405) often maintaining a constant AOL AIM chat session and an ssh telnet connection to my server(s). I also did this on PCH between the 55 and Long Beach (though only at 60 MPH). There was no trouble "hopping" -- AIM and TeraTermPro w/ SSH don't handle drop packets well at ALL.

      Don't try that at home, kiddies.

      --
      -- @rjamestaylor on Ello
    3. Re:Hooray! by rjamestaylor · · Score: 3, Funny
      As an aside, I was tempted to drive in the carpool lane and day-dreamt about telling the cop that I was hosting multiple users on my computer (I used my Richochet-equipped laptop as a backup server for development and had a couple people banging away at my mod_perl stuff running under Apache on Win32) and, thus, was "pooling" while in my car.

      Never did it. No guts, not nuts.

      --
      -- @rjamestaylor on Ello
  2. Old and slow. by ahknight · · Score: 2, Interesting

    Let's just throw some NAPs (Neighborhood Access Points) out there and give everyone an 802.11b card. Wireless modems are silly these days. Let it die.

    1. Re:Old and slow. by Galvatron · · Score: 2, Interesting
      Let's just throw some NAPs (Neighborhood Access Points) out there and give everyone an 802.11b card.


      Okay, when you've done that, let me know. Until then, I'd like to see Ricochet reactivated. Don't wish for something to die until the alternative is in place.

      --
      "The question of whether a computer can think is no more interesting than that of whether a submarine can swim" -EWD
    2. Re:Old and slow. by ahknight · · Score: 2

      Are you kidding? I wanted DOS to die from day one and look where that's got us. It took until this year for it to officially go away. No, keep wishing and if it's broken bad enough it will get replaced.

  3. coverage maps by JimDog · · Score: 5, Informative

    Although you can no longer get to it from the main web site (which has been replaced with a bankruptcy notice), the coverage maps are still available. I believe Metricom also built infrastructure in some additional metro areas where service was never officially announced and no coverage maps are available, but Aerie has the rights to that equipment as well. Some of those metros include Chicago and Salt Lake City.

    1. Re:coverage maps by theNAM666 · · Score: 3, Informative
      believe Metricom also built infrastructure in some additional metro areas where service was never officially announced and no coverage maps are available,

      You can find the location of every poletop Metricom ever put up as part of the bankruptcy sale asset list at the metricom sale site.

      but Aerie has the rights to that equipment as well.

      I'm afraid not. The poletop easements and the equipment on them were abandoned by the bankrupcy court, which is what caused Aerie to reduce their bid to $8.25M from $20M; see news coverage for details: Aerie will have to rebuild the equipment.

  4. Other info on this by NotAnotherReboot · · Score: 4, Informative

    At this url: http://news.cnet.com/news/0-1004-200-7783542.html? tag=owv there's info on Aerie Networks looking to talk to municipal governments resell their wireless services like utilities. So not only are they reactivating it in some areas, they're also looking for new ways to sell their services and hopefully turn a profit unlike Metricom.

    1. Re:Other info on this by rjamestaylor · · Score: 2
      and hopefully turn a profit unlike Metricom

      With an investment overhead of $8.5million versus $1 Billion, this shouldn't be too difficult. Heck, at $80 per month, 51,000 subscribers recoup that outlay in 2 months!

      I do hope they advertise. I had no idea that Richochet was in my area until stumbling upon Earthlink's site and seeing the option for wireless broadband. I bought in the same day. So did my employer (offered to pay for my service, and to get it himself), and my main client (for use in 50 to 100 sales reps travelling in the 14 markets Ricochet offered service. Before committing to the deal, the "dark" announcement was made. With a *little* attention to marketing this should be a cinch.

      --
      -- @rjamestaylor on Ello
  5. Background on Ricochet by Angry+Black+Man · · Score: 4, Informative

    I have heard mixed things about Metricom's Ricochet service when I was researching what high-speed internet I should look into. Here is some background information on the service if you don't know much about it yet: Metricom's MicroCellular Data Network technology operates via 900MHz radios atop streetlamps and utility poles. The technology doesn't sound isn't entirely new at first. It has been running since 1996 (at speeds of 28.8kbits/s) in some areas and for the low price of $30 a month that is still a bargain today. Recently, Metricom revamped the service and got it up to a more pleasing number: 128Kbits/sec. The problem now is that Metricom decided to sell the service through "Ricochet Authorized Service Providers." The prices on this were in the $75 range (not to mention a sweltering $300 for a modem).

    So what is so great about this service? Well it comes with a 10-ounce external modem that can be used on your laptop. Not only does this modem have its own rechargeable battery but it also connects via serial or USB. And even better is that the service is compatible with not only Win 9x and 2000 but also Macintosh, Linux, Windows CE, or any other OS with PPP software.

    So if you were wondering why some people liked the service so much hopefully you know now. The reason I didn't go with it was some of the reviews said that it ran too slow in my area. So I got AT&T Roadrunner... the service could be better and I can't take it on the road with me but this is fast enough for me and that's good enough for now. Maybe now that some more life is getting pumped into the service and a new owner is running the show I'll look into it once again.

    --
    the byproduct of years of oppression by the white man
    1. Re:Background on Ricochet by blair1q · · Score: 3, Informative

      Only the first PCMCIA modems were $300. The outboard modems were only $99.

      Toward the end, they started selling the service for $40 and below. That's probably where the new guys will price it. $75 was fine for the mobile power users, but prevented Ricochet from competing well with DSL and cable, and kept away the base of casual users that would have made them more sound financially without taking up a lot of resources.

      Technically, Ricochet was terrific for me once they cleaned up one or two network switching problems.

      I was one of the people who wrote Ricochet and told them I'd sign back up if they re-lit the network. I travel to work in multiple cities they serve, so it's a great way to keep my main computer on the same networking paradigm without using a ubiquitous 56k provider (one of which also went tits-up on me in the last year...).

      For purely non-mobile applications, though, if you have a choice between this and a cable or LOS wireless service at the same or lower price, you are right to go with that. You will get higher throughput. (I've never liked any DSL offer, but YMMV). Until we see what kind of service organization the new company builds, and what the stability looks like, you can't expect them to be any better or worse for downtime and technical support than any other network provider.

      --Blair

    2. Re:Background on Ricochet by gig · · Score: 3, Interesting

      I used Ricochet inside a tank-like commercial building with aluminum ceilings and got the highest connection rate. This was in North Hollywood. When I signed up, the guy said the biggest myth about Ricochet was that it was only good outdoors, or while you were moving. It can do that, too, but if your house or apartment or office was in a coverage area, then it will likely work fine.

      I even used it in my house right on the edge of San Francisco, and used it coming over the Bay Bridge from Oakland, and it got a signal right as we came off the San Francisco side of the bridge, so San Francisco seems pretty well covered. There are like 17 big hills here, so you can put stuff like this on top of the hills and get everybody.

      Even if you use it indoors most of the time, it's still a great deal. You don't have to hook your house or apartment up to the Internet, just hook yourself up with a PC Card in your computer. Taking it to the library was really great, or working at a coffee shop or whatever.

      I just got a new PowerBook, and I keep looking at the PC Card slot and wishing there was a working Ricochet modem in there 24/7. I used to think I'd just use Ricochet forever myself, combined with 802.11 when I bump into a network. Between the two systems you can go to a lot of places and be connected without having to fall back on the phone modem or regular Ethernet.

      I don't think there's anything wrong with having two different systems, either. Eventually, they'll fit 802.11 and Ricochet onto one chip/card and the computer could use whatever is available automatically. In the meantime, if one system doesn't scale well enough or has some other problem (like Ricochet is having now), then the other fills in the gap. Seems like some people think that they have to be against Ricochet because they like AirPort.

  6. Ricochet or 802.11?? by Lokni · · Score: 3, Insightful

    Let's just hope that Aerie comes to its senses and doesn't grossly overprice the service. For those of you that advocate 802.11B networks to replace something such as Ricochet: 802.11 works in densely populated areas where things were built up instead of out. (Examples would be San Francisco, and most definitely New York) On the flip side, places that grew out such as Southern California and 802.11 network is useless because without a sophisticated directional antenna, and/or illegal power outputs all that's going to be on the network is a few of your neighbors. Ricochet was a godsend to those of us that wanted to sit at the beach, visit the park, go to the coffee shop, and commute down the freeway while connected. My dad is a regional sales manager and spends all day driving. With Ricochet he was able to order stuff for his customers from his laptop mounted in his truck and he had access everywhere he went. Now he does it over the phone. People say 802.11B rocks, but unfortunately it will never be feasible for a Wide Area public network.

    1. Re:Ricochet or 802.11?? by Alcemenes · · Score: 2, Informative

      802.11 works in areas the grew outward as well. You can't simply put one tower to serve the world you have to spread your PoPs out to saturate your coverage area. While it is true that 802.11 is line-of-sight with proper location of access points you can still use the Internet from the beach or the coffee shop or even while driving. Ricochet put up many access points atop light poles in major cities. Had they not done this they would have never had the coverage they provided. Cellular phone companies use many towers to service a given area also. It is all the nature of RF.

  7. Hardware? by eracerblue · · Score: 3, Informative

    Unfortunatley, much of the hardware that was developed for Ricochet has been discontinued. Hopefully the AirCard 400 can be brought up to speed again.

    Although it may be tough, with GPRS, EDGE, 1xRTT gaining ground around the world. Word on the street is that Telus Mobility (Canadian) will have 1xRTT up for Q1 next year.

    This bad boy can run up to 150kbps on only 1xRTT.

    Just wait until 2x and 3xRTT hit the market.

    What I'm still trying to figure out is if ONE standard has been chosen for REAL 3G/UMTS. The recent AT&T adoption of GSM/GPRS would suggest that WCDMA is not the way to go?? anybody?

    1. Re:Hardware? by Zigurd · · Score: 3, Interesting
      There are two main flavors of 3G: WCDMA/UMTS and CDMA2000. The standards are at 3gpp.org and 3gpp2.org, respectively. Even though the 3gpp site looks like it was put together by 6th graders, 3gpp is by far the bigger, more influential organization, and WCDMA/UMTS by far the dominant 3G standard. But CDMA2000 (3gpp2) will be viable in the U.S., Korea, and a few other places.


      The current dominant standard, GSM, is evolving toward WCDMA/UMTS. This is the upgrade path all GSM and most IS-136 networks will take. GSM/GPRS uses the same data infrastructure and protocols as WCDMA/UMTS. Oddly enough, GSM is more different from WCDMA/UMTS than IS-95 (CDMA) is from CDMA2000. CDMA also has some technology advantage over GSM. But it's kind of a Betamax thing: it is better to be widely used than it is to be better technologically.


      Both 3G standards use CDMA technology, but they are not compatible. Maybe there will be dual mode radios that will be cheap enough to work on both kinds of networks.


      Anybody know what iDen's upgrade path is?


      How do I turn off the redundant things in the square brackets?

      --
      I wrote parts of this stuff
    2. Re:Hardware? by marxmarv · · Score: 2
      Absolute portable bandwidth isn't all that interesting anyway. It's only when the bandwidth is cheap enough to make casual, spontaneous use accessible to most that wireless applications will take off. If it costs you sixteen cents per second to feed that 32kbps file at full tilt, streaming a movie to your backseat costs US$5000 - US$6000 and wouldn't be worth watching anyway. Maybe you should've just gotten great seats at the opera.

      -jhp

      --
      /. -- the Free Republic of technology.
    3. Re:Hardware? by vought · · Score: 2, Interesting

      Interesting post - but someone already paid for the Ricochet deployment, while 1xRTT and other 2.5-3G technology has yet to be deployed, rolled out, paid for, etc.

      With voice revenues thinning, I doubt the cellcos will be able to subsidize all this data buildout with voice. They lost that critical mass months ago.

      Ricochet may be back, and with only 8.5 million and paltry operational costs (as long as the circuits stay up, the Ricochet NOCs can be run by TWO people), it'll take nothing for them to begin making money and possibly deploying the .5mbps Ricochet that was under development once upon a time.

      Then there's the National Semiconductor Ricochet chipset that was almost done....

  8. Damnit! by Xerithane · · Score: 2

    After Ricochet shut down, I had no reason to stay in the bay area. At least now there may be one redeeming quality in the valley.

    --
    Dacels Jewelers can't be trusted.
  9. It ain't the speed... Re:Old and slow. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Insightful

    802.11b has no accounting in it. I like the idea of small local Wireless Aaccess Points open to all, but I cringe when people call it "free" internet (which is what most seem to call it). How is that -free-? Someone is donating their access to that public WAP: It's philanthropy, not a foundation for ubuquitous high speed wireless access to the net.
    I can't see how -that- is a system to replace a -business- like ricochet. Unless you personally can pay for the hardware and wireline bandwidth...? (What is the price point when you're buying 5,000 WAP access points? : ) bk425

    1. Re:It ain't the speed... Re:Old and slow. by Ian+Bicking · · Score: 2
      People have forgotten about the notion of "public". Things like 802.11b access should be public -- yes, they are not free, just like roads aren't free. But roads are free to use, and in a wise society stuff like 802.11b could be free to use -- because it would be a public resource.

      It is quite true that charity cannot replace business. But public works can replace business. That would be really cool.

    2. Re:It ain't the speed... Re:Old and slow. by ahknight · · Score: 2

      Good point. I buy a registration from my state government to pay for the roads and to give me access to them. I would not mind another $60/yr to get WI access as well. Perhaps even more, you know? If they want authentication *sigh* then I'm ok with PPPoE. I just want access. There's a telco fight in my area and nobody can get broadband of any sort until they finish duking it out. It's been two years.

  10. Ricochet as an alternative to OnStar by SimHacker · · Score: 3, Interesting
    I'm a long time Ricochet customer, and reluctantly switched to a CDPD modem after they shut down. CDPD is horrible -- extremely slow at its best, and usually much worse. It must be really low priority relative to voice traffic, because my cell phone conversations usually don't drop out and hang up all the time like CDPD always does.

    I had one of the old Ricochet modems years ago before there was any security on the network. You could list out the names of all the other radio modems and poll top boxes that it could see. The pole top boxes had the names of the street intersections or buildings where they were mounted. Then you could dial into any of the pole top boxes, and remotely send them AT commands, to list out the other ones they could see, and walk around discovering the network that way.

    But then my van was stolen, and my original Ricochet was in it, with a "Big Brother Inside" sticker on it. I immediately called Metricom and asked if my modem had been turned on and reported in. It had, and they checked the logs and gave me the address of the pole top box in a dangerous San Jose neighborhood. I rented a car and drove all around the neighborhood looking for my stolen van, but didn't find it. But a couple weeks later the van did show up right around that neighborhood, totally stripped.

    -Don

    --
    Take a look and feel free: http://www.PieMenu.com
  11. More blah blah! by GlassUser · · Score: 3, Insightful

    I've been watching Aerie for months. They've been saying they're going to buy Ricochet for months. I'm waiting on ACTION. I was a serious ricochet user before they died, and soon as they light it back up, I'll be cruising.

    --
    funny munging
  12. The world is a small place... by n6mod · · Score: 2, Interesting

    Hi Don!

    I was the TSE on the other end of the phone when you called to trace your van. I remember that call well. ;)

    Like you, I hope Aerie does something.... I got rather addicted to the notion of web access everywhere.

    -Zandr

    --
    You have violated Robot's Rules of Order and will be asked to leave the future immediately.
    1. Re:The world is a small place... by SimHacker · · Score: 2
      What a small world! I'm glad I didn't get beat up for suspiciously driving around that neighborhood all afternoon, looking for my van. I found a lot of vans, but not mine.

      -Don

      --
      Take a look and feel free: http://www.PieMenu.com
  13. Sounds like a good deal... by d5w · · Score: 2, Interesting

    Someone please double-check my reading of the press pieces:

    Metricom winds up $1G in debt, with creditors expected to recoup about a quarter of that when you count cash in the bank and bond interest; so, about $750M loss for creditors.

    Aerie acquires all the interesting assets of Metricom -- that is, everything unique that would cause investors to take the risk -- for $8.25M.

    Chapter 7 protects Aerie from the ~$740M difference.

    I know it's hardly a unique situation, but the numbers jumped out at me this time. It's such a great investment strategy: if you can just figure out how to get someone else to spend 100x what's profitable and then have them lose so badly that you can buy the interesting bits at a garage sale.

  14. Ricochet has already been relit around ground zero by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Interesting

    Ricochet was relit around ground zero after the attacks to give the workers internet access http://news.cnet.com/news/0-1004-200-7372683.html? tag=owv

  15. $8.25 mil. by jcr · · Score: 2

    Ricochet went through about a billion in VC money, and Aerie is getting it for $8.25. That's got to be the best bargain since Manhattan Island.

    -jcr

    --
    The only title of honor that a tyrant can grant is "Enemy of the State."
  16. What killed ricochet by t0qer · · Score: 5, Informative

    I came into the company at a time when the .com boom was just starting to happen. I was young and didn't quite understand business politics yet, so I thought it was right to point out when things are outright ripping off the customer or in the very least preventing the company from dominating the market. My "self rightousness" cost me my job.

    You see my freinds, the ricochet development cycle really ended after the first modem was introduced. Sure it got smaller and faster, or so you think. The ricochet was allways capable of 128kbps speed. There was a s register that could change the modem speed to that maximum rate, but unless you were transferring from ricochet to ricochet at a distance of 100 feet or less, you would never see 128kbps from their network. This is because the poletops were set at 9600baud.

    Now to understand how you can get 28.8 from poletops set at 9600 you have to understand how the ricochet network works. Basically you are surrounded by these poletops, all shooting out bits at 9600 baud, they are multiplexed together by your modem and combined to get the desired bandwidth. Thus 9600 from 3 poletops would give you 28.8. Internally people who knew about this and thought it was wrong were fired over the years. There was a lot of them trust me.

    Whenever a new modem standard like 33.6 or 56k came out, metricom would release a new "Modem software upgrade" that "contained new code!" that would magically turn your 33.6 ricochet into a 28.8 one. All it did was change the default setting of that S Register, maybe some new stuff was added, but thats about it. Nothing really magical or fancy, they fired all the real engineers that created the modem in the first place long ago. All that was left was a skeletal crew that could never really improve the internal electronics design.

    When they were "Upgrading the Ricochet Network!" this was nothing more than more smoke up the ass of ricochet users. The poletops speed was simply set from 9600 to anything higher. Just a stupid S register that was allways there.

    I think Ricochet's real downfall wasn't the technology, when it was introduced allmost 5 years ago, it was capable of delivering 128kbps service. So the failure can only be found in the strategy used by the marketdroids. $20@month for 128kbps wireless internet service vs $20@month for a standard 28.8 isp would have sold a lot more modems than the $40@mo ricochet $20@mo standard ISP model that they took.

    They did do an amazing job creating the network, just a shame that they never put that same effort into people that acually understood the internet market. People have allways gone with the cheaper ISP simply because they want to save money. Anyways I hope no heads roll from my comment.
    ______
    / \
    I I
    IRicochetI
    I R.I.P I
    I 2001 I