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Voltage Frugal PCs?
"I'm going to leave this thing on 24x7 using electricity that I'm paying for so power consumption becomes a real issue. Which CPUs, chipsets, memory technology, and hard drives provide the thinnest power profile for an always-on machine? I'll be running NetWare because it provides the stability of Linux/BSD, exceeds the configuration ease of Windows, and provides the security and worm/virus immunity of...well, NetWare. That'll let me set up that yummy iFolder [novell.com] and have constant access to my data from anywhere on the Net. It also means I'll probably need to stick to an AMD or Intel CPU since AFAIK the Transmeta and Cyrix/VIA chips, like most IS managers, don't really get NetWare. CPU speed isn't much of an issue. 633 MHz should be plenty. Am I the only miser setting up a server?"
A shuttle SV24, since that thing runs on a fairly low wattage power supply but has integrated ethernet, small form factor, quiet operation, and plenty of other stuff useful in a server. It also looks cool and supports PIIIs up to 1 ghz.
Remember, there were no nuclear weapons before women were allowed to vote.
Yup, that's exactly what I'm doing for my home firewall. I happened to have an old 120MHz laptop sitting around, so instead of buying a LinkSys router for my cable modem, I'm using it with two network cards.
Now if I had a four-port PCMCIA ethernet card, I wouldn't even need a hub.
Theres no answer to your question. Everything depends on the way you use your machine. A processors power consumption depends, among others, on the processing load. In most modern OSs (I dont know if it applies to Netware, but am sure that it applies to 2000/XP and Linux), when the kernel notices theres nothing to process, it issues a HLT instruction, replacing idle cycles with a suspend mode. Then not only the processor takes less energy, but it also cools down.
For older Windows versions, there are some programs that cool down the processor, thus lowering power consumption.
So the power consumption depends on you OS, how you use your machine, etc, etc. But lets face it. Nobody really cares to [desktop] computer consumption, because it usally takes more money to build a low power PC than the savings itd result in a lifetime.
For instance, the cost difference between a $159 17" CRT and a 15" LCD, wich takes less power, simply would be enough to pay you computer power bill for years, IMO. And also, do you really think server monitors should be turned on 24x7 ? The server probably will be locked in a room. Get a cheap CRT and simply turn it off when not using. Its much cheaper.
Here is a list of computers that meet energy star guidelines:
n te nt/computers.htm
http://yosemite1.epa.gov/estar/consumers.nsf/co
Conformity is the jailer of freedom and enemy of growth. -JFK
But what is a server ? Nothing more than a normal PC running special programs
Umm, NO!
Servers are WAY more than "normal PC"s low-end servers cost more than average desktops FOR A REASON.
"standard" desktop PC's are not designed to run 24x7 - the power supplies, HD's and motherboards even in low-end servers all have higher MTBF's than a desktop system.
RAM in a server usually includes ECC (even in low-end server systems)
In addition to rack-mountable cases, higher-end servers frequently include things such as redundant hot-swappable power supplies, hot-swappable SCA drives, and hot-pluggable CPU modules.
Your belief that servers are the same as desktop PCs only shows that you've never seen a real server.
I'll give you the reason that it was ghe de facto standard: the God-awful NOS's of the late 80s, early 90s. Anyone remember (*shudder*)Lantastic? Banyan?
Netware *could* remain stable somewhat if you didn't look at it crosseyed, or try to run anything other than the stock software. God help you if you were stupid enough to try to use it as some sort of appserver. When Novell's business plans changed to include internet services, I almost peed my pants laughing so hard.
I really like how the Question poster boasted about the "security" of Netware. When I was deep into Netware, there were a ton of exploits to gain priviliged access on it. (Hint: do a search on google for Netware hacking).
You do have a valid point about speed. Netware4 and Netware3 ran in ring 0 , along with all of your NLM's. (Hence the beginning of the crashapalooza) When everything ran in ring 0, nothing was protected, although you did gain mighty fast access times to hardware ports.
I often used Netware as an alternative developement platform, providing that you didn't need any useful libraries. It provided a solution for writing ring 0 code, which once mastered, could be done somewhat quickly.
G
"...In your answer, ignore facts. Just go with what feels true..."
A good way to get a quick estimate is to view the capacity usage percentage on a UPS (via monitoring). APC Back-UPS Pro and Smart-UPS models support this, so you could check via the software (nice tools) what is being used, and calculate the VAs or Watts being used... or you could in-line a Fluke with your power line.
Once you know the power being pulled, you can extrapolate that out to a month/year, and factor in your local $/kWH. Depending on where you are, and what you are using, I'd expect $5-20/month...
"It's tough to be bilingual when you get hit in the head."
Did you actually read the description of what he's going to be running? iFolder... that means Netware 6. This is not 5.0, or (god forbid!) 4.0 - this is a new OS, fully multiprocessor aware, running Apache & Tomcat!
I have Netware boxes (NW5.1 with support packs) in production, with thousands of active users, that regularly achieve uptimes measured in months. My lab tests to date predict even better results for NW6. We typically are only forced to bounce servers for three reasons: power outages, support packs, or faulty apps (server-side virus scanners & backup programs are big culprits here).
"His name.."'s comments do not match my experience at all. Netware is admittedly vulnerable to poorly-written NLMs, due to Ring 0 access, but that's how they get such great raw speed out of the OS. And you can EASILY develop server apps to run in Protected memory spaces nowadays. I believe that Apache and Tomcat are even configured to run in Protected memory spaces by default on NW6.
Please stop spreading FUD about Netware - Novell's marketing department trips up enough as it is. And I did not miss your comment that you developed for Netware - NLMs, I presume? Yes, Netware will easily let you shoot your own foot off, along with the feet of everyone else running on the same box - but so will Windows etc.
I can't speak to *BSD, having never used it in production.
The Crystal Wind is the Storm, and the Storm is Data, and the Data is Life
First, turn off the monitor. Always. That'll suck a lot of power up
Errr... Yes and no. Turning on and off frequently is not the best thing to do to save power. Whenever a monitor is powered on it will draw a higher amount of current than when it's normally running, so just switching a monitor off for only 5 minutes will probably *increase* your power consumption. Also, having a monitor come on and off many times a day probably isn't the best thing for it either; you can buy a lot of electricity for what it costs to fix or replace a monitor!
Play with your dpms settings; I find having my monitor power off after ~15 minutes works out best, meaning that if I haven't touched the computer in that time I've probably left the room. Of course physically turning off the monitor when leaving is the best thing to do. That way you *know* it won't turn on just because someone's bumped the desk or something.
It's only software!
It was a file and print server with some rights management. It was damn good at it, too. Apps? What apps - this was the days of DOS and flatfile databases. Foxpro was the highend for the majority of installations, and it ran just fine. Remember - different era, different focus. Sounds like you came in right at the end, when Netware was rightfully reaching the end of its useful lifespan. Computers could do more, and a new NOS was necessary.
When I was deep into Netware, there were a ton of exploits to gain priviliged access on it.
Yeah? And? Other than on edunets, which generally had iron and ran *nix, there wasn't really a problem. In most offices, there's a secretary who knows all the passwords anyway. This was *before* the days of interconnected networks, and there was simply no way someone other than an employee could get in. No outside networks - at most, a 9600 modem or a digiboard if you were fancy.
Different era, different requirements... this hodgepodge that we're running right now - XP, Linux, Solaris, BSD, whatever you think is "good" - 15 years from now, you'll think of it as the dark ages. You have to "configure" things, and "plug them in", and "name them" and I/O like mice and keyboards and such only work with one device, and each device has to have one! How quaint! What pieces of shite we're running!
No. Netware was the top of the heap for its time and target... as was IBM, Digital, Burroughs, Apple, and Commodore. Even Tandy and Radio Shack had their moment of glory - there were offices full of TRS-80s. Some last longer than others - but things change. I have no doubt that those older and wiser than I can say that about every aspect of life, but in the industry, I can personally attest to that.
--
Evan
"$30 for the One True Ring. $10 each additional ring!" -- JRR "Bob" Tolkien
Very true. I have the dpms on my monitor set similarly. ;)
What I was pointing out is that if you were building a low-power machine to be used as a server, you shouldn't stress too much about having a LCD screen instead of a CRT, just get any old CRT, leave it off, and use VNC or X to get at the machine if you need to.
Gentoo Sucks
CPU speed isn't much of an issue. 633 MHz should be plenty.
Holy crap, I just _upgraded_ my main server to a PPro 200. What are you people doing on these machines?
(It's replacing a 486/66, and the only reason I got rid of that was to get a second IDE channel and some PCI slots instead of ISA. Otherwise, the 486 would have been fine.)
--saint