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Sharing Still Doesn't Hurt

Robotech_Master writes "Eric Flint has posted two new Prime Palaver rants. The first one is a continuation of the one that was mentioned here on Slashdot the other day, about the Free Library, the e-book, encryption, and you:'One thing you have to understand about this whole controversy is how much of it is sheer hot air. Many authors and most publishers, when they address this issue, give people the impression they're at risk of losing their shirt through electronic "piracy." That's pure hogwash[...]' The second is a response to the idea of boycotting Harlan Ellison for his anti-piracy stance (and I imagine some Slashdot faces will be red over some of what he has to say!)." We linked to Ellison's rant last year.

8 of 278 comments (clear)

  1. Flint does have a point... by neksys · · Score: 2, Interesting

    The fact of the matter is that people like books. Sure, I can read the entire PHP manual online, but there's just something comforting about having a big volume open in front of me. The same applies to fiction - while some may read, say, The Lord of the Rings online, many will not. The eyestrain alone would turn any reasonable person off of it. And can you imagine reading through several inches of printed pages? The cost of the ink and paper alone would be roughly the same as a cheap paperback version of the book.

    The way I see it, piracy is no different than buying the book for $0.50 at a used book store. The fact of the matter is that the type of person who would pirate a book would also pay half a dollar for it - it becomes a matter of cost. And of course, an author loses no money on used books.

    1. Re:Flint does have a point... by spectecjr · · Score: 2, Interesting

      But it seems we've taken a step back with books - just like it took a fair bit of time to get a (lower quality) copy of your friend's record or tape, it takes time to transfer a book into digital format. Unlike audio, however, the copying of real books into a digital form should not ever become as easy or as quick as ripping cds.

      Not if the books are in digital form to begin with - and that's one thing that they're looking at with this. Remember: It has to take into account the future and the present.

      For example, when E-paper finally comes out, the book is going to go the way of the dodo. And the Epaper books will be completely digital from the get-go.

      Simon

      --
      Coming soon - pyrogyra
  2. another evidence against RIAA by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 3, Interesting

    The RIAA wants taxpayers to pay for the cost of tracking down those who 'diminish the incentive to invest in creating music'

    First of all: Most of the money from sales of music goes to marketing of music. This is because the music listening public are too stupid and sheepish to be immune from being convinced to buy whatever crap BMG wants to sell. This marketing machine payed for by record companies does more to stifle the creation of music than CD pirates ever could. Since local bands could never spend so much to convince the public to buy their stuff, it takes a back seat to the stuff on MTV. Most of the value of the music IP that the RIIA is worried about is not in the music itself but in the marketing investment that the record company has made in pushing the music. For example: Britanny Spears mad diddly off her first album, but could command huge $$ for another one since the record company had already invested mega $$ in marketing her.

    Is this maketing a service? Should we thank the record companies for bringing us music we might not otherwise know about? I think not. I think that especially with the internet, bands can show the world what they've got easily, and people can find it on their own. In this wired age record companies who once were the only way to distribute music find that they no longer serve a useful purpose and are nothing more than leaches on society. They control what is on the radio, so that's what I hear, and that's all I know to buy. Without them the radio would play other stuff by artists who have placed their stuff on the internet for free, and who would be happy if I listened so I would want to go to one of their concerts. Music would continue to be created even if there were no such thing as record companies. Maybe artists would not get rich by leveraging the record company's marketing investment, but maybe lesser known artists would make a better living if they could get a little airplay.

    Second of all: Do we want an IP police to tell us what we are allowed to think without paying a fee?

    Do you think the cops can shut down p2p file trading of copyrighted material without snooping on everything that is traded on p2p? If the FBI can't stop illegal IP traffic on it's budget and using it's existing powers, then it still has use in stopping kidnappers and terrorists, in fact that 'failure' doesn't tarnish the public's image of the FBI because most people who want music and would rather wait for it to download than pay the money for it at the store download it guiltlessly, and don't want the FBI to stop them.

    But if there is a special agency who's only purpose is to stop illegal IP trading, they will called before congress if their agency is innefectual, and they will explain that the task is impossible, and that to enforce the law they need an SSSCA type law, and that Freenet should be banned, and that so should most p2p, and gpl software too.

    I would be willing to give up the notion of copyright and the patent systems altogether. What moral right does someone who creates an artifact that represents an idea to the very eternal notion itself? They should own only the artifact itself. Why should we subsidise the creation of such artifacts by granting copyright? I don't think the value of what is created in that way warrants the subsidy since the material created is mostly created with the express purpose of making $$ and not with enriching my life. Why is fostering technological growth good in and of itself? Is the car really a good thing? Has it actually benefitted mankind? If patents are granted to compete with other countries then maybe we should stop the war and sign a peace treaty outlawing patents.

  3. A duel of copyrights, patents, and trademarks by Zufall · · Score: 2, Interesting


    It's comical to see how various groups are attempting to use the DMCA,
    as well as traditional IP law, against each other, in a vain effort to control
    the ideas they call "their" "intellectual property." As Benjamin Franklin said,
    when someone else uses your idea, you are not diminished... you still "possess"
    it as much as you ever did.

    For example, see this humorous(?) dispute between a small web site and someone
    claiming to represent Wired Magazine, in which everything from the DMCA,
    to copyright and patent law, to the GPL(!), is invoked to assert one side
    or the other's IP claims:

    http://subintsoc.net/blowback_200203.php#wired2

    Just goes to show how asinine these sorts of things can get.

    --
    Here's a fun game to play w/
  4. There are other reasons to boycott by CaptainCarrot · · Score: 3, Interesting
    From the second Prime Palaver rant: Those of you who are conservatives will have to boycott Mercedes Lackey.

    I'm a conservative, but I don't boycott Mercedes Lackey because of her politics. I boycott her because of her contrived plots, shallow characters, stilted dialogue, and a preachy tone that annoys me whether it comes from her or Robert Heinlein. How this woman became a popular writer when she produces such crap is something I don't understand.

    --
    And the brethren went away edified.
  5. A consumer's rant... by DESADE · · Score: 5, Interesting

    (Posted to the Pho list last year),

    Seeing as I don't work in the music industry, I've been a little hesitant to
    post this, but I'm feeling a little froggy today. If I'm being a little
    presumptuous feel free to hack me to shreds, but here goes:

    The Nature of Demand
    It seems to me one of the key problems facing the music industry in the
    digital age is the "commodity" approach to marketing music. Who was the
    genius that first determined that the real product is a piece of plastic?
    When I buy a CD, it's not because I simply want to be able to play the music
    at my leisure. At the core of every music purchase is a connection between
    the artist and the consumer. For some, it's an association of ideals. For
    others, it may be image, lust, identity, craft or a myriad of other
    possibilities. This is the real nature of demand in this business and it's
    being completely ignored under the current model.

    Pissing Off the Consumer
    This whole idea came to me as I was driving to work one day listening to
    "Celebrity Skin." I'm on my third copy now and it irks my hide a little each
    time I buy a CD that I have previously owned. Especially considering the
    fact that I know so little money is going to the artist.

    Why can't I just buy personal rights to the piece of work and pay a media
    fee for whatever form of media I choose as a playback device? If I lose the
    CD, why can't I just pay a reasonable media fee to replace it? Why can't I
    be a patron of the artist rather than a consumer of plastic? The value of a
    CD is in the beauty of the work, not in its physical manifestation.

    In a Perfect World
    I'd pay $25 bucks for a CD. It would come with a serial number. I'd go to a
    Web site managed by the artist or their representatives and register. Once
    registered, I'd be able to download the CD in MP3 format. Maybe I'd get
    access to a couple of bonus tracks as well. Maybe I'd like a second copy of
    the CD or a tape for my car. I'd be able to buy a second copy for 5-7 bucks.
    Call it a media fee.

    A Different Approach
    Now here's the real power of this model. Now that I've registered, the
    artist can send me an email telling me about what's going on in their
    creative life every now and then. Maybe I'd be able to get an early copy of
    the next album in MP3 format for pre-ordering. Maybe the artist could send
    me a link to some live tracks from concerts or some things they have been
    playing around with in the studio between major releases. Maybe they could
    point me to a couple of older albums I might be interested in. Maybe once I
    have purchased the rights to three albums I would achieve "distinguished
    patron" status that allows me special access to other material. That's
    value. Now I feel like I have a relationship with the artist. Now I feel
    like a patron who helps support the artist so they can spend their time
    working on their art. Now the artist has a direct way to build a
    relationship with me the fan. Foster that relationship and the artist is
    meeting the real demand of a music consumer.

    Maybe when the artist comes to town, they can put on a special show at a
    small venue for "distinguished patrons." I think a show like this would be
    good for the artist and the patron. The artist would know they are
    performing for a select group that appreciates their craft and has shown it
    by supporting them. The patron gets to see his or her favorite artist up
    close and personal. The patron would be willing to pay a higher price as
    well. The next day, maybe a special commerative t-shirt would be available
    at the web site when the patron logs in.

    Also, think about how valuable the database would be.

    Watch the Money Roll In
    So under this scenario, I'd probably spend at least a couple hundred bucks
    with an artist. Under the current model, I might have shelled out $100 for a
    CD and a couple of concert tickets. Why allow labels to take so much money
    for "managing" the artist, when what they really should be doing is managing
    the relationship with between the artist and the patron? The marketing
    potential under this model is a no brainer. Some might abuse it, some might
    manage it well. At the end of the day, it's the relationship that counts.
    Piss off your registered fan base with a load of spam and chances are the
    fan won't cough up any more dough. Provide a real value to registering and
    watch the money roll in. The better an artist manages the relationship, the
    more money they make. Make the management earn their keep for a change.

    This Kills the Napter Problem
    Piracy will never go away. Instead of trying to limit access to an artist's
    work, why not take a different approach... provide real value for paying for
    the work. Why would I spend hours trolling Napster for bad MP3's encoded at
    different bit rates and labeled with no common format when I can just buy
    the CD and have access to clean copies encoded at a high bit rate for my
    desktop machine and maybe another set encoded at a low bit rate for my car
    or portable player? Napster's cool, but face it, it's still a
    pain-in-the-ass. Today's average MP3 collection is a sloppy mess. Why would
    I pirate when buying the work and registering offers me real value? Sure
    some people will pirate. Face it folks, it's going to happen no matter what.
    The loss from piracy would be more than covered by the additional revenue.
    This would also go a long way to killing the demand for used CD's.

    Eviscerate The Damn Middlemen
    I'm offended that the record companies skim off such a disproportionate
    amount of income from the process compared to the value they inject into the
    transaction. They get away with it because they control the distribution
    channel. That control is dying and all the industry seems to want to do is
    come up with another way to protect it. Wake up! Fans are pissed off.
    Artists are pissed off. Everyone is sick and tired of paying twenty bucks
    for a CD and knowing that the artist only ends up with a buck or two. That's
    why everyone is sucking songs off of Napster. We're all tired of feeding
    your machine. Let go and start fresh. Didn't most people in the business get
    into management or promotion or whatever because they loved music? Wouldn't
    it be nice to get back to that rather than working in a system that is
    basically a leech feeding upon both artist and consumer?

    Someday Soon
    An new act is going to make it big direct. No label. No management. No
    distribution deal. Self-financed. Self-promoted. Self-Published. Another
    possibility is a major act going direct successfully. The day is coming soon
    and when it happens, a lot of people in this business are going to face a
    rude wake-up call. Why not make a deal now while you still have a chance?

    Apologia...
    I've had all this bouncing around in my head for some time now. I honestly
    planned on writing it up as a coherent article. If I waited till I had time
    to do it, I would never have gotten around to it. I'm truly sorry to have to
    present it in such a disjointed rant.

    I don't have a chip on my shoulder. I truly love music. I work for a living.
    I don't have the kind of talent musicians have. The mere fact that there are
    beautiful souls out there producing such wonderful works of art makes the
    drudgery of my day to day a little brighter. I'm willing to pay for that. As
    a matter of fact, I'd feel damn privileged to be part of a support base that
    allows an artist to focus on their art instead of schlepping food at a
    restaurant for a living. I just wish doing it under a the current model
    didn't leave such a bitter taste in my mouth. Fix it and I guarantee you'll
    make more money, see a more diverse range of work and happier artists and
    consumers.

  6. Can't buy it anyway by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1, Interesting

    Not only that, but what about the music that the record companies REFUSE to sell, such as out of print albums and bootlegs? I want to pay them for copies (or did, at least before they slammed Napster!), but they don't want to bother to sell me the product.

    So I download it..... how are the companies losing from this?

  7. a word from the unpublished writer by technoCon · · Score: 2, Interesting

    Books, music, software have common elements with respect to distribution. Who is hurt by free copying of these products? I don't think authors are hurt.

    What's the difference between me and Erik Flint and Robert Heinlein? EVERYBODY THE HECK KNOWS WHO HEINLEIN IS. (Other differences include having a book deal and writing talent. Look at the New York Times Bestseller lists and you'll see books written by professional wrestlers. So, I presume that writing talent isn't everyting.)

    Let's go back to KNOWING who Erik Flint is. The more his books are copied, the more people are reading him. The more people who read him, the more people who might send some sheckles his way. If everyone in the free world reads Erik Flint, he'll be a bigger deal than Heinlein, or Clancy, or friggin' Faulkner.

    For this reason, I don't think "illegal" copying hurts the artist, author, or programmer. Now, it can hurt the publisher, since the publisher's pricing strategy is based upon the artificial scarcity it creates.

    The artist, author, and programmer are in a schitzo position: On one hand, we want EVERYONE to see our deathless prose. On the other hand, we want MAXIMUM payment for our work.

    They needn't be contradictory if we can come up with a way to allow unlimited copies at very low cost. What I think we'll eventually have is a tiered pricing scheme. The kids (like me) who haunted public libraries and checked out all the Heinlein books will pay with mindshare only. The poor college students who haunt used books stores (like me) will pay a little more. When they graduate, they'll start buying paperbacks. The professionals with good paying jobs (like me) will pay full price for the hardbook books.

    Conversely, the buying public may look at what appears to be greedy money grubbers, and say screw you. That's why I haven't bought any CDs lately.