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Sharing Still Doesn't Hurt

Robotech_Master writes "Eric Flint has posted two new Prime Palaver rants. The first one is a continuation of the one that was mentioned here on Slashdot the other day, about the Free Library, the e-book, encryption, and you:'One thing you have to understand about this whole controversy is how much of it is sheer hot air. Many authors and most publishers, when they address this issue, give people the impression they're at risk of losing their shirt through electronic "piracy." That's pure hogwash[...]' The second is a response to the idea of boycotting Harlan Ellison for his anti-piracy stance (and I imagine some Slashdot faces will be red over some of what he has to say!)." We linked to Ellison's rant last year.

7 of 278 comments (clear)

  1. what a goof. by geekoid · · Score: 4, Insightful

    To draw a connection to boycotting a dead creater to boycotting a living creater is spurious, at best.

    You have 0 chanve of getting Wagner to change his views, or even take a closer look at them, because he's dead. You have nearly 0 chance of getting HE to re-think his position, but nearly 0 is not 0, and if enough people do it, maybe he'll actually try to put a story onto the baen library to see if it works.
    I won't buy anything new from Ellison. No I won't boycot him, but I sure as hell will see that no money I spend ends up into his pocket. His thinking is draconion, and feeds right into the corporate misconception. Fortunatly I have a library card and easy access to a used book store.

    --
    The Kruger Dunning explains most post on /. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dunning%E2%80%93Kruger_effect
  2. 0 - 0 = 0 by MadAhab · · Score: 4, Insightful
    Holy shit that was the most clear-headed rant I've seen in a long time, and just about the only coherent one on the topic of publishing in the electronic age.

    Zero minus zero equals zero. Read the rant, learn the phrase. Seriously. RIAA types and the IP-martial-law crowd still won't get it (because they can't conceive of anything from which they can't get a percentage), but the average person understands that going to a public library and reading a book is not theft, and neither is 0 - 0 = 0.

    --
    Expanding a vast wasteland since 1996.
  3. A consumer's rant... by DESADE · · Score: 5, Interesting

    (Posted to the Pho list last year),

    Seeing as I don't work in the music industry, I've been a little hesitant to
    post this, but I'm feeling a little froggy today. If I'm being a little
    presumptuous feel free to hack me to shreds, but here goes:

    The Nature of Demand
    It seems to me one of the key problems facing the music industry in the
    digital age is the "commodity" approach to marketing music. Who was the
    genius that first determined that the real product is a piece of plastic?
    When I buy a CD, it's not because I simply want to be able to play the music
    at my leisure. At the core of every music purchase is a connection between
    the artist and the consumer. For some, it's an association of ideals. For
    others, it may be image, lust, identity, craft or a myriad of other
    possibilities. This is the real nature of demand in this business and it's
    being completely ignored under the current model.

    Pissing Off the Consumer
    This whole idea came to me as I was driving to work one day listening to
    "Celebrity Skin." I'm on my third copy now and it irks my hide a little each
    time I buy a CD that I have previously owned. Especially considering the
    fact that I know so little money is going to the artist.

    Why can't I just buy personal rights to the piece of work and pay a media
    fee for whatever form of media I choose as a playback device? If I lose the
    CD, why can't I just pay a reasonable media fee to replace it? Why can't I
    be a patron of the artist rather than a consumer of plastic? The value of a
    CD is in the beauty of the work, not in its physical manifestation.

    In a Perfect World
    I'd pay $25 bucks for a CD. It would come with a serial number. I'd go to a
    Web site managed by the artist or their representatives and register. Once
    registered, I'd be able to download the CD in MP3 format. Maybe I'd get
    access to a couple of bonus tracks as well. Maybe I'd like a second copy of
    the CD or a tape for my car. I'd be able to buy a second copy for 5-7 bucks.
    Call it a media fee.

    A Different Approach
    Now here's the real power of this model. Now that I've registered, the
    artist can send me an email telling me about what's going on in their
    creative life every now and then. Maybe I'd be able to get an early copy of
    the next album in MP3 format for pre-ordering. Maybe the artist could send
    me a link to some live tracks from concerts or some things they have been
    playing around with in the studio between major releases. Maybe they could
    point me to a couple of older albums I might be interested in. Maybe once I
    have purchased the rights to three albums I would achieve "distinguished
    patron" status that allows me special access to other material. That's
    value. Now I feel like I have a relationship with the artist. Now I feel
    like a patron who helps support the artist so they can spend their time
    working on their art. Now the artist has a direct way to build a
    relationship with me the fan. Foster that relationship and the artist is
    meeting the real demand of a music consumer.

    Maybe when the artist comes to town, they can put on a special show at a
    small venue for "distinguished patrons." I think a show like this would be
    good for the artist and the patron. The artist would know they are
    performing for a select group that appreciates their craft and has shown it
    by supporting them. The patron gets to see his or her favorite artist up
    close and personal. The patron would be willing to pay a higher price as
    well. The next day, maybe a special commerative t-shirt would be available
    at the web site when the patron logs in.

    Also, think about how valuable the database would be.

    Watch the Money Roll In
    So under this scenario, I'd probably spend at least a couple hundred bucks
    with an artist. Under the current model, I might have shelled out $100 for a
    CD and a couple of concert tickets. Why allow labels to take so much money
    for "managing" the artist, when what they really should be doing is managing
    the relationship with between the artist and the patron? The marketing
    potential under this model is a no brainer. Some might abuse it, some might
    manage it well. At the end of the day, it's the relationship that counts.
    Piss off your registered fan base with a load of spam and chances are the
    fan won't cough up any more dough. Provide a real value to registering and
    watch the money roll in. The better an artist manages the relationship, the
    more money they make. Make the management earn their keep for a change.

    This Kills the Napter Problem
    Piracy will never go away. Instead of trying to limit access to an artist's
    work, why not take a different approach... provide real value for paying for
    the work. Why would I spend hours trolling Napster for bad MP3's encoded at
    different bit rates and labeled with no common format when I can just buy
    the CD and have access to clean copies encoded at a high bit rate for my
    desktop machine and maybe another set encoded at a low bit rate for my car
    or portable player? Napster's cool, but face it, it's still a
    pain-in-the-ass. Today's average MP3 collection is a sloppy mess. Why would
    I pirate when buying the work and registering offers me real value? Sure
    some people will pirate. Face it folks, it's going to happen no matter what.
    The loss from piracy would be more than covered by the additional revenue.
    This would also go a long way to killing the demand for used CD's.

    Eviscerate The Damn Middlemen
    I'm offended that the record companies skim off such a disproportionate
    amount of income from the process compared to the value they inject into the
    transaction. They get away with it because they control the distribution
    channel. That control is dying and all the industry seems to want to do is
    come up with another way to protect it. Wake up! Fans are pissed off.
    Artists are pissed off. Everyone is sick and tired of paying twenty bucks
    for a CD and knowing that the artist only ends up with a buck or two. That's
    why everyone is sucking songs off of Napster. We're all tired of feeding
    your machine. Let go and start fresh. Didn't most people in the business get
    into management or promotion or whatever because they loved music? Wouldn't
    it be nice to get back to that rather than working in a system that is
    basically a leech feeding upon both artist and consumer?

    Someday Soon
    An new act is going to make it big direct. No label. No management. No
    distribution deal. Self-financed. Self-promoted. Self-Published. Another
    possibility is a major act going direct successfully. The day is coming soon
    and when it happens, a lot of people in this business are going to face a
    rude wake-up call. Why not make a deal now while you still have a chance?

    Apologia...
    I've had all this bouncing around in my head for some time now. I honestly
    planned on writing it up as a coherent article. If I waited till I had time
    to do it, I would never have gotten around to it. I'm truly sorry to have to
    present it in such a disjointed rant.

    I don't have a chip on my shoulder. I truly love music. I work for a living.
    I don't have the kind of talent musicians have. The mere fact that there are
    beautiful souls out there producing such wonderful works of art makes the
    drudgery of my day to day a little brighter. I'm willing to pay for that. As
    a matter of fact, I'd feel damn privileged to be part of a support base that
    allows an artist to focus on their art instead of schlepping food at a
    restaurant for a living. I just wish doing it under a the current model
    didn't leave such a bitter taste in my mouth. Fix it and I guarantee you'll
    make more money, see a more diverse range of work and happier artists and
    consumers.

    1. Re:A consumer's rant... by jcsehak · · Score: 5, Insightful

      Eviscerate The Damn Middlemen

      I was with you up to here. Labels serve a very important purpose: they let us know which artists are worth listening to. I don't know about you, but I don't have time to wade through piles of indie crap hoping to find something I like. Most of the good musicians out there, I (and most everybody else) am aware of because a major label spent money in putting them in the limelight. That said, I can't fathom why an artist would stay with a label after they've made it big (and their contract's out). But I'm sure they have their reasons.

      Someday Soon

      It's already happened. Ani DiFranco built up Righteous Babe records all on her own, after developing a huge and loyal fan base by touring her ass off. Aimee Mann started her own label after getting screwed by a major one. Incidentally, all you /.ers out there who don't buy CDs because they don't want to support the RIAA need to be aware that some labels are artist-owned and you should be going out of your way to support those. There are even some labels that are responsible and great to work with. Rory Block has recorded 10 or 15 albums with Rounder records, and the first few were done without even signing a contract. No, I couldn't believe it either when I heard it, but it's true. Some labels really exist to support the musicians.

      As an aside, anyone turned off by Ani should check out Revelling/Reckoning. Her politics still (and probably always will) annoy me, but the music is truly amazing. Just about everything about Aimee Mann is good, and Rory Block can play the old-time country blues like nobody's business.

      --

      c-hack.com |
  4. Sharing = Good for GOOD ARTISTS by dh003i · · Score: 4, Insightful

    Here's my true story about how sharing is good.

    I'm a young guy (20 years old). When Prince (aka, "The Purple One," "The Artist Formally Known As Prince," etc) was just getting started up, I was very young and not too interested in music. I knew who Prince was, however, and I remembered that.

    However, I didn't know who Morris Day was -- an artist who, in my view having heard him, is superior to Prince.

    Now, about a year ago, I saw the movie "Purple Rain". In that movie, I saw the story of Prince and Morris Day competing at a local club. They showed several songs of each artist. As it turns out, in reality, Prince and Morris Day were actually in the same band and good friends, but the movie is a dramatization which sets them up as being enemies.

    Anyways, in this movie, they showed Morris Day performing the song called "The Bird". I thought that song was really fun and great, so I looked it up on Amazon, and looked for Morris Day on Google. So I found out this was a real guy, and he had a alot of songs before he unexplicably quit the music industry.

    I thought cool. But I'm not going to buy an album by a guy just because he had one good song. So I downloaded Day's album's off from Grokster and LimeWire. Turns out, almost all of the guys music is good -- some real great songs, like Jungle Love, Fishnet (Black Pantyhoes), Color of Success, Get It Up, The Walk, 777-9311, etc.

    That's how I found out about Morris Day. And that's how I found out his songs were good. And that's why I've bought a few of his albulms. In short, he made money because of file-sharing. Of course, if he had sucked, he wouldn't have made money; but he also wouldn't have lost any either.

    The general point that can be taken here is that almost all people who download tons of stuff from LimeWire/Kazaa wouldn't have bought it anyways. I have about 40Gigs of songs. Do you really think I would have actually gone out and bought 40Gigs worth of songs if it weren't for file-sharing? Of course not, that's absurd. So in short, the artists who's songs I've downloaded haven't lost anything because I wouldn't have paid them anyways. Some gain alot, because I like them enough to buy their albums.

    In fact, everyone gains. Before file-sharing I wasn't an avid fan of music. Now, I am. All kinds of music too. I even watch M-TV once in a while, something which I never did before.

    In fact, I'd venture to say that the interest in music today is higher than its EVER EVER BEEN. And that's accounting for the size of the population.

    So, how exactly is it that artists and the music industry loses from this?

    1. Re:Sharing = Good for GOOD ARTISTS by LennyDotCom · · Score: 4, Insightful

      I thought you said you were a fan of music.

      MTV hasn't been about music for many years now

      --
      http://Lenny.com
  5. Re:Sharing is the tip of the iceberg by HydroCarbon10 · · Score: 4, Insightful

    Of course, it could be argued that if there was no money to be made in the arts then only those who truly love them will produce them. This would create a situation in which only the highest quality works would be produced. So what if copyrights were abolished? Take the above statement and change the word arts to software and you'll see my point.

    --
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