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Open Source... Mining?

farrellj writes "In mining, geophysical data is the "source code" of the industry, and is usually guarded as closely as Microsoft guards their source code for their programs, sometimes even more so. But one Canadian mining company opened up their data, and reaped the rewards of Open Source in higher profits. Read all about it at: FastCompany. NOTE: Originally seen on Linux Today."

14 of 81 comments (clear)

  1. What's the incentive to be secretive? by deanc · · Score: 3, Interesting

    If a mine has exclusive rights to mine in the area it has surveyed, what is the incentive to hide the geological data? After all, any additional information that outsiders provide based on the data will either help the mine or at worst help a neighboring mine. In neither scenario will the first mine be hurt if anyone else sees their data. So I don't see how the culture of secrecy became so ingrained.

    1. Re:What's the incentive to be secretive? by RatOmeter · · Score: 5, Informative

      It's more than just tradition. My experience is more from the petroleum exploration arena, so I'll speak it its terms.

      Almost no property owner owns the mineral rights to their land, only the 'surface' rights. The mineral rights (in most cases) were seperated years ago.

      Exploration for petroleum involves statistical analysis as well as physical discovery. Physical discovery used to involve guessing, based on prior performance or just a hunch, where there might be oil or gas. These days, there's a lot more technology to be applied. One method involves placing sensitive seismic instruments in a variety of locations. Then large machines called 'thumpers' are put in place to cause deliberate seismic disturbances. The effects of these disturbances and underground interference to them are measured, mapped and analysed using the instrumentation that's scattered about.

      This type of physical discovery is not cheap. It consists of:
      expensive instruments
      expensive machines
      well-paid geologists and other crew
      paying landowners for use of their land.
      costom analysis software
      and more

      The best ways for a venture like that to make money are to (a) sell the information to mineral rights owners, or (b) use the information to drill for petroleum themselves.

      In case (a), making the information available at no charge is contrary to the business plan. In (b), they would need to acquire/lease the necessary mineral rights and it wouldn't pay advertise what they were looking for where.

  2. Open source comparison is a sham by gewalker · · Score: 5, Insightful

    Come, open source as usually perceived and promoted is that by "contributing to the public software" and "scratching an itch", much good comes to all as you everyone can then use this freely.

    The valuable use of this data is pretty much restricted to the property owners of the gold mine. This was just a fancy version of a contest (not a random-lottery style one), whereby skilled competitors vie for the prize, but one without an entry fee, and no signup form. The data is inherently useless (in terms of mineral rights) to anyone that is not the property owner, or interested in control over what happends to the property (hostile takeover threat).

    If Microsoft had been the property owner, this story would have been on Slashdot, decrying the shameless use of skilled dupes working for Microsoft and getting a small return on their investment of time & talent. The mine owners were clever enough to capitalize on the positive name association with "Open Source" more than anything. A smart business that take a gamble (hostile takeover threat, etc.) that paid off well.

    1. Re:Open source comparison is a sham by gewalker · · Score: 3, Interesting

      Sorry, this bothers me, just thought of another analogy.

      Say Microsoft publishing its source code on the Internet, with the restrictions against using the data for profit (equivalent to mineral rights), and runs a contest whereby cash prizes acrue to winners for quality bug fixes or other enhancements.

      Has MS suddenly gone open source? hardly. MS would be exposed to much more financial risk than the mining company in this comparison, as the source code is arguably valuable to competitors wishing to drill in MS fields. MS would be keeping all IP legal rights (just like the mineral rights), and noone would be saying, "Wow another open source success story."

    2. Re:Open source comparison is a sham by caduguid · · Score: 3, Insightful

      Honestly, my first reaction was just like yours. But I think maybe both of us were missing a bit of the point... There is a connection with open source, however narrow. (Enough that I wouldn't call the comparison a sham.)

      Open Source/ Free Software and the like are loaded terms, and 'open source' in particular is almost more of a basket of loosely-related phenomenon than it is a specific thing. (Open Source Definition not withstanding.)

      Some of the things in that basket are itch-scratching and enriching the public domain, to be sure. But there are other things in that basket as well. One, which is receiving a fair amount of academic attention, is "peer-enabled content production". It may have to do with methodology instead of ideology, but the open source movements have provided much of its source material.

      So, was this contest "open source"? Well... there was open access to the known 'source' data of the mine. Is that enough for it to be open source? Maybe not. But it's enough for a comparison, imho. Was it peer-enabled production? Well... the winning entry was (I think) actually a collaboration of two teams, and they were 'peered' with the mine company halfway around the world. Enough for the label? I dunno. But sham seems too harsh.

  3. How about an open source designed mining robot? by NZheretic · · Score: 3, Interesting

    For either deep sea or deep space based search, mine and recovery?

  4. Good PR Prospects by Alien54 · · Score: 4, Interesting
    Although the prize money, which Archibald's team shared with Taylor Wall & Associates, barely covered the cost of the project, the publicity has boosted the firm's business. "It would have taken us years to get the recognition in North America that this project gave us overnight," he says.

    These are the folks that came up with the 3D mine map - so it looks like it was a good investment for them.

    And so it looks like the Open source model has been proven valid in areas outside of computing.

    --
    "It is a greater offense to steal men's labor, than their clothes"
  5. It's not actually "open source" ... by Taco+Cowboy · · Score: 4, Insightful



    From the story I've just read, I get the feeling that the "opening up of the data" does not sounds like "open source".

    Rather, I get the feeling that it sounds more like BOUNTY HUNTING.

    Like bounty hunters, there is a target. All you need to do is to get the target and you get your bounty. That's just what the company does.

    --
    Muchas Gracias, Señor Edward Snowden !
    1. Re:It's not actually "open source" ... by GigsVT · · Score: 3, Insightful

      Bounty hunting is a viable model for open source revenue though. If I see an open source program that almost does what I need, I'm likely to pay the programmer to add features that he might not otherwise. This is basically what Red Hat does with their large customers, and it's what every company can do by directly contacting authors.

      --
      I've had enough abrasive sigs. Kittens are cute and fuzzy.
  6. not a typo by e-gold · · Score: 3, Informative

    That's their cost for pulling an oz out of the ground. It has gone down as they've gotten bigger and better at getting the gold out due to economies of scale, etc.. The price they can actually sell metal for is another thing, altogether (thankfully...).
    JMR

    My opinions != those of any employer.

    --
    Try e-gold - (contact me). I'm NOT e-
  7. It isn't a sham, it is a hint at something greater by FreeUser · · Score: 4, Interesting

    Open source comparison is a sham

    No, it isn't a sham, but it is a poor choice of wording.

    Free Software, Free Media, and Open Source are subsets of a much more fundamental, and important, concept, namely freedom of information, freedom of thought, and freedom of expression, which together might be termed simply freedom were it not that that particular word has been so abused by pundits over the last century as to have lost much of its meaning. These freedoms are antithetical to secrecy at their most basic levels, and in their consiquences, whether that is secrecy of information, secrecy of methodology, or secrecy of design (to name just three).

    So, while mapping the benefits of open and free information to those of open and free software is a bit of a misnomer, clearly the underlying theme that free information is, unsurprisingly, bringing the same benefits to this particular mining company that free source code does to software companies is a valid parallel to draw, in that these benefits are a consiquence of freedom of knowledge and freedom of information, in other words, of the freedoms being granted, of which free software and free geological data are but two small examples.

    It is a shame that our intellectual property laws are such that these freedoms must be granted rather than assumed by default, making them (and their obvious benefits) so much rarer in our society than they need to be.

    --
    The Future of Human Evolution: Autonomy
  8. Oh give me a break by FallLine · · Score: 3, Insightful
    What this company did is fundamentally different from the freedoms that you speak of. The benefits to society at large are practically non-existent in this company's case. The information that they shared was: A) of little risk to themselves because they owned the rights already (and because a failing company has little to lose) B) of little benefit to society. This situation is far more analogous to Microsoft releasing some of their source code with the condition that it can essentially only be used to make improvements to MS's product and virtually nothing else. If anything, Microsoft is a far more sympathetic case because it can be argued that there is educational value to their code and that they're taking a greater risk. While I'm no fan of Microsoft, I must admit that the open source advocates are being extremely hypocritical to praise this "open geology" on one hand and utterly dismiss Microsoft's claims on the other. Perhaps MS' open license isn't as "open" as other open source licenses, but nor is this mining example as "open" as it could be in the idealists minds (at least if we assume that they're capable of critical thinking). In the crackpot mindframe of the open source zealots this company *could* open their hard earned information without any additional protections that give them advantage over and above of those that recieve the data and charge a fee for support or some nonsense.

    It is a shame that our intellectual property laws are such that these freedoms must be granted rather than assumed by default, making them (and their obvious benefits) so much rarer in our society than they need to be.
    Yeah, because we all know societies that do this (e.g., China, Cuba, etc.) are vastly more productive places for ideas than the United States.....err yeah. Show me a time in history or a place in the world that has been as productive or spends as much money on research and development (proportionately speaking). The United States is extremely successful in this reguard because of our strong IP, not inspite of it. It may cost you, say, 100 dollars to purchase that textbook and that may be something of a negative, and of itself, but then you're taking for granted its creation and that its secondary benefits (i.e., your education from it, ideas you may have taken from it, etc) are generally free AFTER that point. For all the complaints of information being locked away, it simply does not stand up by and large. There is a TONS of information out there for anyone that wants it, it may cost a little something and take a little time, but the vast majority of information nonetheless available (and productive) to an extent that it's NOT anywhere else in the world (because it largely does not exist in those other places). EOF
  9. The Spice by Myriad · · Score: 3, Funny
    Then large machines called 'thumpers' are put in place to cause deliberate seismic disturbances. The effects of these disturbances and underground interference to them are measured, mapped and analysed using the instrumentation that's scattered about.

    Hmmmm, personally I would have thought the sandworms a dead give away!

    --
    "They do not preach that their god will rouse them, a little before the Nuts work loose." Kipling, 'The Sons of Martha'
  10. Fake data by MSBob · · Score: 3, Interesting

    One of the problems faced by small software development houses in the scientific field is acquiring enough sample data that allows for meaningful testing of algorithms. Since most geophisical data is considered intellectual property of exploration companies it is closely guarded and hard to obtain unless you're already established in the market and have good reputation. Artificially generated data just doesn't have the same qualities real life samples have. I have seen the same algorithms work perfect on artificial SEG-Y data that crumbled when exposed to some real life heavily faulted seismic.

    --
    Your pizza just the way you ought to have it.