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Secret Court: Government Lied to Get Wiretaps Approved
Paersona writes "Ever wonder what Colleen Kollar-Kotelly is doing to pass the time while she waits for the next step in the Microsoft case? Apparently she is now serving as the lead justice of the FISA court that oversees intelligence agencies' requests for domestic wiretapping. Today, the Washington Post reveals that the FISA court has released a rare public report rebuking the FBI and Justice Department for their handling of wiretap requests." The New York Times also has a story about the FISA court. The court's opinion is available.
Hmmmmm....the FBI which holds american citizens without charge, denies them bail or access to a lawyer all based on secret evidence has been slapped on the hand for their tactics by....wait for it....that's right. A SECRET COURT!? Be very afraid......
He's absolutely correct. Slashdot spends A LOT of time doing nothing but bash Republicans. Slashdot isn't "News for Nerds", it's "Propaganda for Leftists"
If you understood the announcement of the FISA court you would understand this has everything to do with YRO. I imagne it wouldn't be a big step to go from phone tapping to packet sniffing, and the DOJ could say you are a suspected terrorist, monitor you, then send your name, address, phone number, penis size, whatever, to the FBI for criminal charges (got any MP3's to a CD you dont own, legally thats felony copyright infringement) with not warrant. Get it now? People should be EXTREMLY pissed off about this.
-- Insert wisdom here:
Louis Freeh was far from a saint. Nothing to do with the administration: it was often pointed out that Freeh paid little heed to the desires of the president or attorney general.
There should be a moratorium on the use of the apostrophe.
Max V.
NeXTMail/MIME Mail welcome
Nobody is going to jail
Nobody will be held accountable
It was all done to protect American lives.
Sometimes I feel that the federal judiciary is the only place that "gets it" about fundamental American rights and legal traditions. Then, of course, I think of Judge Kaplan and I get depressed again.
The Mongrel Dogs Who Teach
with the fact that a secret court exists and issues wiretaps authorizations?
This has been a test. Had this been a real emergency, we would have fled in terror and you would not have been informed.
"We believe the court's action unnecessarily narrowed the Patriot Act and limited our ability to fully utilize the authority Congress gave us," the Justice Department said in a statement.
So, in other words, Congress (Legislative Branch) attempted to give additional (unconstitutional?) power to the Justice Department (Executive Branch), and this power was taken away by the court (Judicial Branch). Apparently the system, corrupt and ineffective though it may be, actually DOES work sometimes.
Now, if only we can get the DMCA overturned.....
Think For Yourself. Question Authority.
Y'know, if Judge Jackson had NOT given interviews, the MS case might have been finalized by now. The appellate courts didn't overturn his Findings of Facts or guilty verdit. They didn't even say that his penalty was inappropriate. They merely said that his penalty *appeared* to be biased, based soley on the fact that he given interviews before the case was over.
-- Don't Tase me, bro!
Comment removed based on user account deletion
Campaign finance reform, Corporate reform, Patriot act and similar legislation, our involvement in Israel/Palestine conflict...
It's all about trust. Until issues of trust are resolved, we will never get anywhere. and remember that actions -should- speak louder than words.
I'm glad that this judge has exposed these actions of the FBI. The next time the FBI says that it's ridiculous that any agent would abuse these broad powers given to them under the Patriot Act, we can just point to this example. The next time the FBI says that these powers are necessary in order to combat terrorism, just point to this example.
-Sorry, you gotta earn my trust! and you haven't been doing a very good job (referring to this administration). Talk is cheap.
Me neither, but not if you go back far enough.
The number of wiretaps used by J. Edgar Hoover to root out Communists, M.L. King and supporters, Jews and anyone else JEH didn't like was a huge number.
There were less oversights then, though.
Still, it wouldn't surprise me if G.W. is going for a record.
Learning HOW to think is more important than learning WHAT to think.
Guess that hasn't been the case.
Refreshing.
I'm a nerd, and I find this interesting. Find another one, and you have "news for nerds".
"By comparison with that existing
today, all the tyrannies of the past were half-hearted and
inefficient. The ruling groups were always infected to some
extent by liberal ideas, and were content to leave loose ends
everywhere, to regard only the overt act and to be uninterested
in what their subjects were thinking. Even the Catholic Church
of the Middle Ages was tolerant by modern standards. Part of
the reason for this was that in the past no government had the
power to keep its citizens under constant surveillance. The
invention of print, however, made it easier to manipulate
public opinion, and the film and the radio carried the process
further. With the development of television, and the technical
advance which made it possible to receive and transmit
simultaneously on the same instrument, private life came to an
end. Every citizen, or at least every citizen important enough
to be worth watching, could be kept for twentyfour hours a day
under the eyes of the police and in the sound of official
propaganda, with all other channels of communication closed.
The possibility of enforcing not only complete obedience to the
will of the State, but complete uniformity of opinion on all
subjects, now existed for the first time."
"All the beliefs, habits, tastes, emotions, mental
attitudes that characterize our time are really designed to
sustain the mystique of the Party and prevent the true nature
of present-day society from being perceived. Physical
rebellion, or any preliminary move towards rebellion, is at
present not possible. From the proletarians nothing is to be
feared. Left to themselves, they will continue from generation
to generation and from century to century, working, breeding,
and dying, not only without any impulse to rebel, but without
the power of grasping that the world could be other than it is.
They could only become dangerous if the advance of industrial
technique made it necessary to educate them more highly; but,
since military and commercial rivalry are no longer important,
the level of popu lar education is actually declining. What
opinions the masses hold, or do not hold, is looked on as a
matter of indifference. They can be granted intellectual
liberty because they have no intellect. In a Party member, on
the other hand, not even the smallest deviation of opinion on
the most unimportant subject can be tolerated."
> before 2000
What do you smoke? well, maybe you actually missed it, but in that first link, it states that the court was upset with how the FBI acted in about 75 cases occuring in 2000 and 2001, not before 2000. Just because a good guy in the mix pointed it quickly, doesn't mean that all the abuse occured before the investigation began. Why is it that everyone is eager to blame the problem on someone else? The FBI is historically corrupt. That's why people don't like the Patriot ACT. Hoover abused his power as the head of the FBI, and no one trusts them til this day. After this ruling, we now know it's for good reason. They use any means available to them whether it's ammoral, unethical, or even illegal for their own agenda.
Karma Clown
say "make us".
Welcome to hell. (aka Republican USofA)
Fucking idiot people in this country make me sick, although people are fucking stupid everywhere so why should we be different.
"John Marshall has made his decision. Let him enforce it now if he can." -- President Andrew Jackson, historical precedent and general all-around tough guy.
Your right to not believe: Americans United for Separation of Church and
An AC wrote:
> The worst terrorist attack in recorded history
> occurred nearly a year ago,
Worst terrorist attack, yes. But no where near what it could have been. Nearly three thousand died. Many more were wounded. But in a tower complex that could have had up to 50,000 people in it, it is clear that the terrorist attack is only part of the story. The other part is the wisdom, courage and compassion of those who sacrified themselves, those who died in the line of duty, and ordinary people who helped each other. That part worked a shining miracle, saving tens of thousands. Those noble, heroic hearts put those heartless monsters to shame!
> followed by a Holy War against Islam,
9/11 had nothing to do with Islam. Since we are talking about the *World* Trade Center, you might keep in mind that good followers of Islam were murdered that day as well. That isn't Allah that Bin Laden is following. I don't care who he thinks his boss is, or how many Islamic poems he mutters. I'm sure Azi Dahaka gets a big kick out of being called "Allah" though. Right up there with "Great Devil that comes from the Sky" and Nostradamus's little nickname "King of Terror".
> and now Israel and the Palestinians as well as
> India and Pakistan are teetering on the brink of
> their own war,
Which is a really novel experience for them. Not.
> Argentina is in the midst of a financial crisis,
Yes, I know. My sympathies. Most of the world is having some kind of economic problems.
> America is considering launching attacks against
> Somalia and Iraq,
I've got a unique idea: how about we take down the Al Quada organization in all 60 countries before we add new enemies to our plate. But no, we must go after Saddam at all costs because he is using the "weapons of mass destruction" we gave him on an ethnic minority inside Iraq (kinda brings back memories of the Old West and those smallpox blankets). If there was honest hope of helping the Kurds, I might be more willing. But somehow I think any real humanitarian assistance is pretty far down on the list.
> and you people have the gall to be discussing
> the FISA court rebuking the FBI and Justice
> Department????
They need a good rebuking. Ashcroft needs to take the curtain off the statue of Justice and get reaquainted.
> My *god*, people, GET SOME PRIORITIES!
>
> The bodies of the thousands of innocent
> civilians who died (and will die) in these
> unprecedented events could give a good god damn
> about the FISA court rebuking the FBI and
> Justice Department (and I'm sure if they were
> still alive, they'd thank the wiretaps that
> could have saved their lives), your childish
> Lego models, your nerf toy guns and whining
> about the lack of a "fun" workplace, your
> Everquest/Diablo/D&D fixation, the latest Cowboy
> Bebop rerun, or any of the other ways you are
> "getting on with your life" (here's a hint:
> watching Cowboy Bebop in your jammies and eating
> a bowl of Shreddies is *not* "getting on with
> your life"). The souls of the victims are
> watching in horror as you people squander your
> finite, precious time on this earth playing
> video games!
>
> You people disgust me!
You disgust me, if your solution is to sit around quaking in terror. I will not dishonor the memory of those people by bowing to the will of their murderers!!! They want us to be terrified. It is the terror, not the deaths, that is the key to the definition of the word "terrorist". Anyone who huddles up in fear, drags the flag around for a security blanket, or uses the terror of 9/11 to further their quest for tyranny is basically inviting the King of Terror to come and put up a throne for himself in Washington D.C.
The terrorists took the right to Life away from people on 9/11. I will not surrender Liberty and Happiness too.
"Lola, kindness is not enough, look for the reason of hatred and anger.
When you find and understand that, love becomes the strongest power..."
Belabera, "Mothra 3: King Ghidora Attacks"
I have been feeling very bitter of late, watching the slide of America from democracy to corporate oligarchy and, finally toward corporate faschism.
... something all too many lower courts have seemed to be willing to do in any case regarding the aformentioned media cartels. Like you, I think of Judge Kaplan, or the supreme court's repayment of political debts to The Shrub in the last election, and my moment of optomism fades.
So much so that I have been seriously considering emigration, and have been giving a lot of thought to what metric I would use to determine the "drop dead" (ie. okay, no more delays, time to go) moment.
But this ruling is a rare breath of fresh air, and restores some of my faith in our tattered civil institutions. Not a great deal, mind you, but some. It is freightening to have two of the three branches of governmetn (legislative and executive) willfully and knowingly ignore the constitution in the persuit of their goals (howerver laudable [the eradication of terrorism] or despicable [the introduction of digital prohibition to prop up the media and copyright cartels]), but not nearly as freightening as it would be if all three branches had chosen to shred that venerable document
Nevertheless, this was a courageous and important act. A few more like this and we might actually save and reclaim our democracy. The odds are long, mind you, but the goal well worth persuing anyway.
The Future of Human Evolution: Autonomy
Your response falls under the general "you have nothing to worry about if you've done nothing wrong" category. This type of thinking only works until they come for you....
While it may be true that you and most of the people here on Slashdot are not really interesting enough for the government to spy on, "Big Brother" has a tendency to single out cases not so much by merit, but by image. Our "Lawyer General" John Ashcroft is especially good at rounding up the "usual" suspects and framing everything as a "Terrorist" issue.......with all of Congress's pressure, it won't be too long before P2P users are going to be "Terrorists." What's driving this you ask? Re-election my friend, all of our congress critters are looking for photo-op's and any way to show that they are "tough on crime," that only they could solve the problem of terror/drugs/comunism/boogie-man.
Have you read the FBI memo? Zackarias M's laptop didn't get searched because the management at the FBI would not pass forward the search request. The management even changed/watered down the request, against the wishes of the field agent who was conducting the investigation! There was no need for new, more invasive laws, those (the managers at the FBI)people simply needed to do their jobs! Do yourself a favor and look up the FBI memo. Read it. What you will see is a picture of an agency that doesn't need more approval to wiretap, but an agency that needs to have all of the "careerists" fired.
I don't trust these people (Ashcroft, FISA, FBI/CIA) any farther than I can throw them. They are hypocrites. They are only seeking power and control. They are driven by the same motivations that all humans are, and that's exactly why I don't trust them.
I believe that this "Terror" issue would dissapear around the world if we as the USA simply started practicing what we preach. We push this idea of a "Moral and tolorant society, governed by law and fairness"....we would do better to start acting that way. We need to stop helping dictators around the world, and start promoting justice. Even if that means we don't make quite so much money.
Picking the "lesser of two evils" is still picking evil!
The only thing that scares me more than the ease with which the government tramples on civil liberties in the name of "the War on ___" ...
... is how many people there are like you out there who are willing to let them. You get the government you deserve, indeed ... unfortunately, if there are enough of you (apparently, according to the Supreme Court, you don't even have to be a majority) the rest of us get the government you deserve, too.
The United States government is currently holding American citizens indefinitely, without trial, without attorney, without even informing them of the charges against them. If this doesn't scare the hell out of you, then you have no knowledge of history, at all.
I particularly like the part where you accuse others of naivete ... [snort]
The correlation between ignorance of statistics and using "correlation is not causation" as an argument is close to 1.
This is ALL about YRO. Today, it may be wiretapping, but I assure you, they are tapping other stuff. It is only a matter of time before the new McCarthyists are reading and listening to EVERYTHING we do.
Anything you say will be held against you.
So that's what they're calling perjury, lies and fabrication of evidence? Why the hell haven't these agents been prosecuted?
This is exactly why we should NEVER have secret courts and secret evidence. I can't friggin' believe this is being allowed to happen here.
If you actually read the opinion (page 16), you'll find: "In September 2000, the government came forward to confess error in some 75 FISA applications." So, presumably, those 75 errors occurred in 2000 or before.