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Microsoft Planning Digital Restrictions Server

Jon James writes "Microsoft is pushing further into digital rights management with a plan for a DRM server due to go into beta testing later this year, eWeek is reporting. Microsoft has already applied for a patent for a DRM operating system but would not say if the DRM server would be based on this. In an interview last week with eWeek, Jim Allchin, Microsoft's group vice president for platforms, said a DRM server is but one of three server infrastructure applications coming next year."

27 of 380 comments (clear)

  1. Palladium: the dark age of computing by cxreg · · Score: 5, Insightful

    I just hope that one day I can tell my kids about how close we came to losing our digital freedom, instead of having to explain to them why the software daddy wrote is now illegal

    1. Re:Palladium: the dark age of computing by gilroy · · Score: 4, Insightful
      Blockquoth the poster:

      Lay out the scenerio: EXACTLY how will Palladium make "software that daddy wrote" illegal.

      MS offers Palladium and convinces everyone (in Washington, DC) that it's the only safe, secure operating system.

      Some cracker or terrorist (or malcontent script kiddie or...) finds the Holy Grail of cracking, a heretofore uber-error that cripples all web-servers and desktops on the Net.

      The economy shudders.

      Congress mandates that the only computers allowed back onto a rebuilt Internet must run a guaranteed, safe, secure operating system -- including hardware lock-outs.

      Since there, at that time, exists precisely one such OS -- Palladium -- it earns huge market share. And because MS owns the patents on DRMOS and related topics, it becomes difficult and impossibly slow to develop an alternative.

      If Palladium is indeed a safe, secure OS, then it hardly makes sense to allow anyone to run anything else. Only crackers, terrorists, and the ilk would really want an open, "insecure" OS.

      While you might have the legal right to write any code you wanted, you would face charges if you distributed anything other than Palladium-signed code.

    2. Re:Palladium: the dark age of computing by cosmosis · · Score: 3, Insightful

      I'm not the original poster, but you have aboviosly not been following the trends. First off, M$ has monopoloy power as far as operating systems goes. Where they go most everyone is soon to follow. So where are they going? They are creating a DRM operating system that will be itegrated with Intels new DRM processor - the Pentium 5. Even AMD is likely to get in the game. This will be total digital lockdown. There are plenty of articles to inform yourslef about what this digital lockdown will entail - and it is not pretty. Any and all programs not specifically authorized, approved and certified by M$ will not be allowed to run. Read that line again so it will sink in. What this means is you loose many of the rights and freedoms that you have taken for granted up to this point on your PC. This will include no longer being able to run your own software on your own machine. You will not be able to create or obtain freeware ever again. You will not be able to run Linux, or any other program not directly or incorrectly kow-towing to M$ and the big boys at Hollywood. Say goodbye to free and open computing.

      Now I can hear you saying, but this won't be illegal. Well, certainly. But for how long? Try a couple of years at most. And besides, if the entire internet is built with this DRM stuff, you won't be able to run anything that is not compliant anyway. So although it will not be illegal it will technically difficult to impossible and completely impractical to do anything else. And finally, since this will be the de-facto standard, those in power will see to it to make it a legal mandate to precent cyber-terrorism in the future. Running non-secure software will become a federal offense punishable by life in prison or worse.

    3. Re:Palladium: the dark age of computing by MoneyT · · Score: 5, Insightful

      Crazy and paranoid? How about you try to go back to 1990 and convince people that in 10 years, the RIAA would be pushing to get a bill passed that would allow them to legaly hack your computer to see if you have any music files on there that you don't own. They would tell you you're paranoid.

      Try to convince them that in 2002, you will need to report to Microsoft information about the hardware your computer is running just to get a licence key. THey would tell you you're crazy.

      Try to convince them that in 10 years, linking or providing acess to code that would allow you to watch a video on a *NIX based OS would be illegal. They wouldn't believe you.

      Try to convince them that the RIAA would be pushing for legislation to make it illegal for you to make a copy of your favorite album to keep at work or in the car. They would tell you to go jump in a lake.

      Yet each of these senarios are equaly true today. Never underestimate the power of people with money. They can get what they want if they try hard enough and people don't pay attention.

      --
      T Money
      World Domination with a plastic spoon since 1984
    4. Re:Palladium: the dark age of computing by stratjakt · · Score: 5, Insightful

      > "Running non-secure software will become a federal offense punishable by life in prison or worse"

      Yeah you'll be executed for warez. Goddamnit, get a grip on reality.

      > Any and all programs not specifically authorized, approved and certified by M$ will not be allowed to run

      Simply not true.

      > those in power will see to it to make it a legal mandate to precent cyber-terrorism in the future

      Gack, too much TV.

      Remember when idiotic comments didn't get modded up as insightful?

      I don't.

      Frankly I'd rather see Microsoft (you know them as M$) control the world than the kneejerk reactionaries of slashdot. Though in the real world, luckily, neither scenario is likely.

      --
      I don't need no instructions to know how to rock!!!!
    5. Re:Palladium: the dark age of computing by jbolden · · Score: 5, Insightful

      I know 1990 sounds like a long time ago to you but...

      > How about you try to go back to 1990 and convince people that in 10 years, the RIAA would be pushing to get a bill passed that would allow them to legaly hack your computer to see if you have any music files on there that you don't own. They would tell you you're paranoid.

      A few years before 1990 it would have been perfectly legal for anyone to hack into your computer; there were no laws prohibiting examing other people's computer files. At the time such legislation was passed and certainly out until 1990 it was understood that it would take time for legal issues to be worked out. The only thing someone in 1990 would have been suprised at was that it was the RIAA not not something like ATT or Exxon.

      Try to convince them that in 2002, you will need to report to Microsoft information about the hardware your computer is running just to get a licence key. THey would tell you you're crazy.

      Not really such schemes were in use in 1990 just not by Microsoft. During the 1980's software was very often designed to only run on a particular machine and was often licenses that way. I don't think they would have found it suprising at all.

      Try to convince them that in 10 years, linking or providing acess to code that would allow you to watch a video on a *NIX based OS would be illegal. They wouldn't believe you.

      I think they'd be more suprised you could watch a video on a computer. As for the rest of your statement its false: a licensed software running on 'NIX based system to watch videos would be perfectly legal. DeCSS wasn't licensed. As for linking I think there is no chance that stands up in court over the long term. No way will NYTimes, CNN... hold that providing information constitutes trafficing.

      Try to convince them that the RIAA would be pushing for legislation to make it illegal for you to make a copy of your favorite album to keep at work or in the car. They would tell you to go jump in a lake.

      They were doing the same thing in 1990 and 1980...

  2. Scary... by grip · · Score: 2, Insightful

    Consumers have figured out the MHZ myth -- and aren't rushing to upgrade so fast anymore.

    They also figured out that Office 97 works just fine, so why upgrade to 2000 or 2002?

    Intel and Microsoft can read the writing on the wall -- revenue decline, so...

    Are they racing to get this DRM hardware and software in place to force upgrades? Think about it, if it requires secure hardware to talk to secure software, then the chance that Intel will give the hardware specs to open source communities is slim to none.

    So, will the next generation of hardware even be able to run Linux and display content off the Internet?

    Grip

    --
    Failure is not an option. It comes automatically enabled in every Microsoft product.
  3. skepticism is a good thing by bashbrotha · · Score: 3, Insightful

    The article was a fairly non-biased look at DRM, and I particularly liked the quote from Dave Debona, who works at a company that might use DRM to aid in IP protection. His quote:

    "But, of course, any technology [DRM] can be twisted and misdirected. Anyone proclaiming to protect assets for others is scary. We typically feel safer guarding our own chicken coop," DeBona said. "We will evaluate Microsoft's DRM offering, with extra attention paid to security. A healthy dose of skepticism never hurts."


    DRM, to me, is merely a tool, like you would call the Internet a tool or even a gun a tool. From a business standpoint (not just record companies,etc)DRM is not essentially evil, however, in agreeing with the above quote, DRM patented and controlled by one company is very scary. Don't let DRM == absolute evil, but instead, let the "one company to rule them all" mentality be attributed to evil.

    If DRM has to exist, it needs to exist with more than one entity (i.e. not even one goverment) controlling it.

    1. Re:skepticism is a good thing by bytesmythe · · Score: 2, Insightful
      If DRM has to exist, it needs to exist with more than one entity (i.e. not even one goverment) controlling it.

      While I agree with the sentiment, the problem is that many "monopolies" are actually clusters of companies ("trusts") that collaborate to control markets by fixing prices and manipulating supply/demand.

      It doesn't matter if you have 50 companies in charge of it if they're all run by corporate pigs whose only goal is to leech every dime they can out of regular citizens.

      --
      bytesmythe
      Hypocrisy is the resin that holds the plywood of society together.
      -- Scott Meyer
  4. Security through litigation by dnoyeb · · Score: 3, Insightful

    As I have said, the level of security is inversly proportional to the number of people with a desire to circumvent said security.

    The only deterrence will be litigation. Thus you can see the new microsoft security model forming before you eyes. I am assuming they will be hiring a new batch of lawyers. Now the RIAA wont have to sue, but M$ will be suing for violating their DRM server.

    Its getting nastier by the day.

    You can simply obey the law...Of course so could they ;)

  5. Next generation hardware by pieterh · · Score: 5, Insightful

    So, will the next generation of hardware even be able to run Linux and display content off the Internet?

    The answer is 'possibly not'. You have to assume that MS's agenda involves making this 'definitely not'.


    The question will be answered when Microsoft starts producing PCs (as compared to the X-Box, which is a simpler issue). Take - for instance - the upcoming Microsoft tablet PC. My guess is that it will not only come with Windows preinstalled (that is not a surprise) but also that it will be impossible to change the OS. The hardware will be keyed to the OS, and MS will have learned their lessons from the X-Box.

    If this does not already worry you, then consider the following scenario: MS then licenses this hardware platform, which will incorporate patented elements of DRM and TCP, to their current Windows licensees. The bargain will be: build PCs using our technology, or loose your margins on Windows. Once Dell produces a PC that cannot run Linux and where attempts to open the box can be countered by DCMA-style lawsuits, you wll see Microsoft's strategy.

    If the US government was serious about preventing MS from becoming a monopoly, they should ban them from producing PC hardware.

  6. It isnt the "Palladium spec" alone thats dangerous by cxreg · · Score: 3, Insightful

    It's the idea of the government getting behind it, such as the SSSCA or CBDTPA. One of these days, a bill like that might just pass and REQUIRE all software by law to have this sort of bullshit in it. I don't even know what Palladium is? Try again buddy.

  7. Re:"Palladium will not require DRM..." by stratjakt · · Score: 3, Insightful

    DRM exists.

    Palladium doesn't exist.

    So tell me how they're the same thing?

    If Microsoft wasn't developing DRM, someone else would.

    The status quo of "all yer base are belong to $SCRIPTKIDDY" can't fly, like it or not. The 'honor system' doesn't work.

    There are many who want a secure platform. It's a double edged sword, and will be an option for all of the forseeable future.

    You don't want rights management? Fine. You can't use this service. You don't want to run a trusted platform? Fine, you can't connect to my network/server. You don't want your personal info on a card? Fine. You cant drive a car.

    I'm getting really tired of the knee-jerk reactions from the average teenaged slashdot reader. Does anyone ever try to objectively think through both the pros and cons of a either DRM or trusted computing platform?

    --
    I don't need no instructions to know how to rock!!!!
  8. Re:Sounds great! by moonbender · · Score: 2, Insightful

    The more laws you force everyday users to break the more ridiculous you make yourself look and the more socially acceptable piracy gets[1]. Way to go, Microsoft.

    [1] And that's something, considering how utterly socially accepted MP3s already are.

    --
    Switch back to Slashdot's D1 system.
  9. With Rights Come Responsibility: by Shuh · · Score: 2, Insightful



    "You have the Right to use your computer however you want, but you have the responsibility to let "us" know exactly what you are doing at all times!" -- Official DRM Creed

    and on a related note:

    "You're not doing anything illegal, are you? What do you have to fear?"

  10. Curious... by CryptoKiller · · Score: 5, Insightful

    DRM technology enables content creators, such as record companies

    Funny, I thought that artists made records...

  11. Re:Should there be an open source DRM server? by Telex4 · · Score: 4, Insightful
    Well, yes, that would be great, because the DRM technologies would then be open.

    The biggest problem with DRM is not the idea of protection in the first place, but the idea that if company x goes bust in y years, then all documents "protected" by their technology become inaccessible, as there is no escrow agreement in most laws that would protect DRM (like the DMCA and EUCD).

    So if DRM could be done openly so that the technology couldn't be wielded by large media companies, then there would be less scope.for abuse. That said, there's still plenty of scope, just less ;-)

    We also need laws to protect the public from parties that might want to abuse DRM, like the RIAA, for example.

  12. Re:Security by great+throwdini · · Score: 3, Insightful

    [Granting Microsoft a patent] means no one else can create such an operating system without a legal battle.

    Or merely licensing the technology from the patent-holder. Duh.

  13. Re:Security by Black+Copter+Control · · Score: 2, Insightful
    I'm also worried about their patent. As much as I hate the idea of DRM, I see their patent as a method of attacking Linux. It could allow them to lock OS programmers out of an entire region of programming. I think that it would be a good idea for Free Software advocates to take a look at their patent and see if there are things like prior art that would nullify it.

    Far easier to convince the PTO to not issue a patent than to defend ourselves against a claim of patent infringement 5 years down the road. If Microsoft gets a pre-emptive lock on crytpographically secure systems, they'll forever (ok, for the next few decades) prevent OS programmers from doing the same thing.

    Even just forcing them to tighten their patent application would give us more breathing room in the future.

    --
    OS Software is like love: The best way to make it grow is to give it away.
  14. Re:More on this from CounterPane by fandelem · · Score: 2, Insightful

    Especially when they find Lucky owning some ill-gotten mp3, movie, or piece of software and threaten to throw him in jail unless he lets Microsoft do what they want..

    --

    --even a broken watch is correct twice a day.
  15. Free DRM by renehollan · · Score: 3, Insightful
    DRM is like anything else, a tool that can be used for good or evil. It is no worse than SSL, for example, and would rely on the same mathematical principles. If you decry DRM, then you should also decry online anonymity.

    However, the present impending applications for DRM certainly appear evil from a tradtional fair use perspective, you know, "copy for yourself but please don't redisribute" (yes, the legal definition of fair use is more tortuous, and "common sense fair use" might not qualify, but it damn well should). Part of the difficulty stems from a desire to control the user's computer, lock, stock, and barrel; or not at all, which will increasingly become impractical.

    Remember Sun's ideas about "write once, run anywhere?", "sandboxes", and "trusted executable content"? That's what DRM should look like (well, except the "write once, debug everywhere" part):

    DRM is a technology that, with hardware assistance, assures remote parties that their data is used in the manner intended while permitting the local "processing environment provider" (i.e. owner of the equipment on which it runs), to control third-party executable code. Microsoft's approach would remove that control.

    If the primary motivation is protection of content, then that content can be keyed to display hardware, with reduced resolution permitted for extracts for purposes of parody or criticism. Where full-resolution extracts are necessary, a list of extracts can reference a public "library" copy, necessary for copyright to be granted in the first place (much like patent disclosure and unlike the present copyright system). The issue then reduces to one of key management between and among the various pieces of digital hardware one owns (you don't want to relicense something because your TV breaks or to watch it on a different TV you bought).

    Executable code is a bit more problematic, since now one wants to control the execution environment provider's processor -- in general unknown third-party code should run in a restricted sandbox, the restrictions depending on how much that code provider is trusted. Sun got this right. This makes sense: how can you fully trust third-party code that you can't check for lack of source? It also means that DRM supporting code must be open, and preferrably free in the GPL sense. Microsoft just addresses the flip side: how can we trust that your processor will execute our code as intended, which is not an unreasonable concern, though not as pressing as protecting copyright content.

    To some extent, the need for a "trusted computing platform" is reduced if the decryption if protected content is done in specialized hardware: the hardware is the trusted platform for decrypting that content, and is acceptable to the computer owner as well because it is severely restricted in what it can do -- I have yet to see a video card format a hard drive or "phone home" and report one's viewing habits (not that such a thing couldn't be built, but it would be clearly out of bounds for a video card to do that.

    Trusted operating systems are problematic because this is the most important area where the computer owner, not a content provider, should be in control: getting such an O/S signed would be difficult due to the sheer number of user-patched varients, and ineffective, in case of a security flaw in the O/S itself. (Even Microsoft would not be immune from this risk: a trusted O/S might still be vulnerable to security-related bugs within it).

    So, while third-party trust of your execution of their code might involve relinquishing control of your computer, if the only justification for this is content copyright protection, there are other ways to achieve that goal via dedicated PKI-enabled display hardware dedicated to the task. The only legitimate need for this kind of third-party control is for distributed client-server applications (think SETI, multi-user online games, etc.). Let's deal with content first and hold off on "trusted computing" until it's clear that that kind of trust has to extend both ways.

    --
    You could've hired me.
  16. Re:Should there be an open source DRM server? by Dan+Crash · · Score: 4, Insightful

    The biggest problem with DRM is not the idea of protection in the first place, but the idea that if company x goes bust in y years, then all documents "protected" by their technology become inaccessible...

    Playing Devil's Advocate:

    Is that really the biggest problem with DRM? The hypothetical future in Stallman's "The Right to Read" emerges pretty naturally from the idea of universally adopted DRM. An open source, free software DRM server would speed adoption of these technologies tremendously.

    When I first read Stallman's RTR, it seemed loony and beyond belief. Now, several years later, it seems prescient and ominous. I can imagine something vaguely like it coming to pass. Donating our efforts to help create this future seems mindbending.

    Admittedly, there are lots of arguments for building open source DRM technologies, and one of them, like you said, is to prevent their monopolization by proprietary interests. But if we have a choice between helping them grow and stymieing their adoption in the first place, shouldn't we choose the latter?

    --
    He who refuses to do arithmetic is doomed to talk nonsense.
  17. DRM won't kill free computing by comic-not · · Score: 4, Insightful

    While I agree that DRM may be a terrible tool in wrong hands, I cannot see a scenario where it (or related legislature) kills free, unrestricted, multipurpose platforms. I am a scientist and like many other scientists that I know I write my own programs because that is the only way I can do the things that my research efforts require. A DRM platform won't let one run unlicensed programs. Most researchers work in non-commercial institutions which cannot afford the licensing cost. I can also imagine that most commercial entities would be extremely reluctant to release their specific code for the scrutiny from the fear of business secrets leaking out. So, it may happen that Joe Sixpack gets through his own ignorance thrown into a small DRM hell but I dare to say that it is extremely unlikely that any country is willing to pull nearly all of its scientific research down the drain just so that people could legally listen to Metallica on their shiny new DRMWindows box. Oh, and if the DRM is intentionally weakened to allow exceptions for scientists and the like, then the platform will instantly become hackable by anyone and the only ones who are screwed are the ignorant people. I could almost say that they get what they deserve.

    Comic-not

    --
    Existence usually comes as a surprise (Idem)
  18. Re:Should there be an open source DRM server? by captaineo · · Score: 3, Insightful

    I would never work on DRM software. Currently I spend hours each day writing software to try to let people do more with their computers. It's very difficult and time-consuming, and I'm not always successful... I'd hate to be writing software that makes people do less with technology. That's just a disgusting waste of resources.

    As Apple says, copyright infringement is a social issue, not a technological one. The media industry thinks ubiquitous DRM is the solution, when all they need to do is offer their content for download cheaply, in plaintext formats.

  19. Re:Security and MS patents by Black+Copter+Control · · Score: 2, Insightful
    If Microsoft manages to get a broad DRM patent, it will encourage them to implement such a system. I'm reasonably sure that their interest in doing this is to lock Linux out of the media display market.

    If they're either denied a patent altogether or locked down to a patent so narrow that other (reasonable?) solutions would be doable, I'm betting that they won't go in that direction. An unpatented DRM system would simply drive people away from MS-Windows in droves. This is something that MS might know better than to do. If they don't know better, then it would at least be a bonus for vendors of other operating systems (including Open Software solutions).

    --
    OS Software is like love: The best way to make it grow is to give it away.
  20. The problems with DRM... by travail_jgd · · Score: 2, Insightful
    If Microsoft wasn't developing DRM, someone else would.
    Perhaps. But Microsoft has the advantage of being a monopoly, and a history of leveraging that against all competitors. Compare this to credit cards and stocks: there are a lot of companies offering the service, all of them are fairly secure. Imagine what things would be like if there was only one bank, one credit card, or one securites company.
    There are many who want a secure platform.
    Other than the big media companies and Microsoft, could you name a few? Preferably consumers and consumer groups, not just corporations.
    Does anyone ever try to objectively think through both the pros and cons of a either DRM or trusted computing platform?
    Yes, I've given it some thought. The problem is that DRM is truly "Digital Restrictions Management" -- many of the legal things I do now with software, books, movies, and music would cease to be possible.

    The reason for the intense dislike of DRM is simple: DRM isn't about stopping piracy, it's about big companies getting bigger and richer at the expense of their customers. Most of the DRM proposals I've heard about have been aimed at companies making more money by taking ownership and first-sale rights away from customers, turning one-time purchases into subscriptions, locking content into a device, and screwing the consumer in general. Simple (and legal!) activities, like lending a book or movie, making a backup copy, selling a CD, or using media in more than one device aren't allowed under most (if not all) of the proposed DRM rackets.

    As for "trusted computing"... was it really problem before Microsoft's operating systems had such significant security problems? Trusted computing won't stop trojans, buggy software, or user errors. So what exactly is the point of it?

  21. 1st Ammendment additoon: Freedom to Compute by cosmosis · · Score: 3, Insightful

    The First Ammendment should be updated to read:

    Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the government for a redress of grievances or the right to freely compute on the machine of their choice.