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Still More on News Corp. Hacking Charges

Spike and others wrote in about this ongoing saga: subsidiary of Vivendi claims that a subsidiary of News Corporation cracked their satellite TV smart cards and posted for public download. (See our previous stories.) Two new stories from the Associated Press and Yahoo note that although the two companies are apparently dropping the original lawsuit (since News Corp. is making a large investment in Vivendi), Echostar is now claiming they were hacked too and the U.S. Justice Department is investigating possible criminal charges.

37 of 78 comments (clear)

  1. I got hacked too, honest by iainl · · Score: 3, Funny

    Can I have some of Rupert's cash now? I've no evidence, or anything, but that doesn't seem a problem.

    --
    "I Know You Are But What Am I?"
    1. Re:I got hacked too, honest by AftanGustur · · Score: 3, Funny
      I've no evidence, or anything, but that doesn't seem a problem.

      Your name isn's Goerge W. by any change ?

      --
      echo '[q]sa[ln0=aln80~Psnlbx]16isb572CCB9AE9DB03273snlbxq' |dc
    2. Re:I got hacked too, honest by iainl · · Score: 2, Funny

      "Your name isn's Goerge W. by any change ?"

      Nope. Given that wonderful new word you've invented, I don't suppose you are, are you? ;-)

      --
      "I Know You Are But What Am I?"
    3. Re:I got hacked too, honest by Melantha_Bacchae · · Score: 3, Insightful

      Ann Coulter writes:

      > It's people like you who are destroying this
      > country. You people feel entitled to everything
      > that you can never achieve with your godforsaken
      > attitudes. There were places in the world where
      > people like you poisoned with your way of
      > thinking. Your post isn't even funny. Joking about
      > the confescation of property is an assult on the
      > principles of this nation.

      Oh, for crying out loud, it was a joke! iainl was parodying what they thought Echostar was doing. iainl has a perfect right to do so, under the United States' First Amendment to the Constitution.

      > Major corporations made this country Great.
      > Civilians should not have the same rights as
      > corporations because they do not contribute as
      > much to our nation.

      So sorry, but we are a nation "of the people, by the people, for the people" according to Abraham Lincoln. The Declaration of Independence states that it is men that are created equal and given rights that can not be taken away, and lists among those "life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness." No mention of nations for the corporation, or any rights given to the corporations (a very recent concept).

      > The only ones who should be allowed to sue (and
      > reap irreperible damage to a corporation) are
      > corporations who have as much at stake.

      Thankfully, that isn't the case. Sometimes lawsuits are the only way to reign in greedy sharks that are negligent enough to make defective products that kill people. Of course, if corporations were always responsible and fair, there would be no reason to sue them.

      > Our Nation is founded upon the concept of a
      > Constitutional Republic(tm).

      Didn't know that was a trademark of some corporation. ;)

      A constitutional republic simply means that the citizens elect representatives to represent them in Congress. The representatives make the laws (following, in theory, the wishes of those who elected them and not the corporations that bribe them), and the whole process is governed by the Constitution.

      > We have class separations that must be enforced.

      Only if you are a snooty patuty rich person.

      > An average Joe Sixpack, or a mass of them,
      > should never wield the kind of power deprive
      > companies of millions.

      Yeah, well, a mass of corporations (and their greedy CEOs) should never wield the kind of power to deprive Joe Sixpacks of 7 trillion dollars of retirement money. But they did.

      > On the other hand, News Corp. has every Right to
      > hack their competition because they dominate the
      > market. People recieve more rights as they
      > ascend the ladder, and it should be that way or
      > otherwise we would have a ruling mob.

      Please quote the section of the Constitution that says this.

      > Those of you who believe in a parity between
      > Corporate rights and civilian rights are
      > socialists.

      There is no parity. Corporations still do not have all the rights of a citizen, and they never should. I am a citizen of the United States of America. News Corp. is not.

      > The fact of the matter is that America is an
      > aristocracy and that is what makes this nation
      > Great.

      No, what makes this nation great, despite all its warts and mistakes, is the great ideals on which it was founded, and the courage and compassion of its people. Justice makes us great. Liberty makes us great. Life and Happiness make us great.

      Greedy sharks, their willful actions and their bribes, are the problem, not the solution.

      "The path of peace is yours to discover for eternity."
      Japanese version of "Mothra" (1961)

    4. Re:I got hacked too, honest by MaxVlast · · Score: 2

      Are you defending her or are you joking? I'm usually pretty savvy, but it's sometimes hard to tell.

      As to your second paragraph, it seems you don't know the right as well as you think. It's chockablock with promiscuous women who use their sex as a weapon because of their inherent inferiority complexes. Yes, my friend, the sex life on the right is a complicated, dangerous game.

      --
      There should be a moratorium on the use of the apostrophe.
      Max V.
      NeXTMail/MIME Mail welcome
    5. Re:I got hacked too, honest by matrix29 · · Score: 2

      You twirp! How dare you call her Ms. Coulter. Its Mr. Ann Coulter to you, Max Vlast. Mr. Coulter recieved her J.D. from University of Michigan Law School; which I doubt if any slashdot reader has a Doctorate. You can read more about Dr. Ann Coulter from her biography [SlutsGoneInsane.com].

      As to your question, I doubt that Mr. Coulter is the promiscuous type. She is a conservative and therefore she is Right. She would never gave premarital sex, unlike most leftists who can't recognize morals even if it smacked them upside the head.


      She/He is a LANKY SKANKY NUTTY SLUTTY IGNORANT WHORE with one wasted existence to pass himself/herself off as a woman. She/He reminds me of those reptile people on the TV series "V". Cold-blooded and always spitting venom.

      Nice Adam's Apple for a "woman"?
      What about this one? Nice "Crazy Eyes" there Mr./Mrs. LANKY SKANKY.

      Ann "LANKY SKANKY" Coulter is a perfect example of the "Seduction of the Ignorant" crowd that fuels the rancid Criminal Republican Criminal Party Criminals and their twisted anti-American spew which regularly is vomited up on one of their many televised "happy to be retarded" love-fests. I see every Ann "LANKY SKANKY" Coulter appearance as yet another parade of a gaunt shemale which titillates the Rancid Criminal Republican Party while ENRON, WORLDCOM, & CHOICEPOINT robs those empty-dittoheads and their suffering children (suffering the torment of ignorant worthless parents who cheer Criminal Traitor Fraud President George Worthless Bush on while he robs them blind. These perverse demented Criminal Republican Criminals ought to be charged with child abuse for forcing these unfortunate children born to mentally defective washouts while they masturbate frantically to images of a shemale viper.

      She/He says the National Review only paid him/her $5 a month for her column. The National Review was ripped off by the spindly stupid slut for his/her constant bimbo-burps she claims to fame.

      Frankly I consider the LANKY SKANKY random word vomiter as most likely too scary for even Charles Manson (though those "Crazy Eyes" show even Squeaky Frome is a tame nutball compared to LANKY SKANKY).

      --
      "Face it, a nation that maintains a 72% approval rating on George W. Bush is a nation with a very loose grip on reality.
  2. So they claim... by viper21 · · Score: 4, Insightful

    But I can't see any reference to a shred of proof in these articles.

    So why did I read them?

    -S

    1. Re:So they claim... by cioxx · · Score: 3, Insightful
      So why did I read them?

      Something about the concept of middle-aged, corporate type businessmen hacking each other what makes it a compelling story.
    2. Re:So they claim... by Angry+White+Guy · · Score: 5, Interesting

      The evidence that they are citing is the $40,000 stuffed in electrical equipment.
      Although this is pure speculation, having your technology leaked to the hackers, forcing an industry-wide upgrade to new technology which is leaked to the hackers, forcing... makes an interesting business model.

      --
      You think that I'm crazy, you should see this guy!
  3. Isn't this breaking the DMCA? by suman28 · · Score: 4, Insightful

    I am sure there are copyright issues here. So how come a large corporation is able to get away but Dmitri Skylarov is still in jail? It always seems to be one rule for corporations and another rule for everyone else and yet another rule for the government.

    1. Re:Isn't this breaking the DMCA? by Jacer · · Score: 2

      The justice department picked up charges, even though adobe dropped them bone head. He's denied bail as he's a flight risk.

      --
      --fetch daddy's blue fright wig, i must be handsome when i release my rage
  4. "Security" by phil+reed · · Score: 5, Interesting

    It's interesting to note that DirecTV is in the process of sending out new smart cards for all of their satellite receivers nationwide. The letter announcing that fact cites "security", but it doesn't say whose security they are worried about. Unsophisticated DirecTV users will, of course, assume it's the user's security that's at stake.

    --

    ...phil
    "For a list of the ways which technology has failed to improve our quality of life, press 3."
    1. Re:"Security" by Angry+White+Guy · · Score: 5, Interesting

      Actually, it is for the users security. Not that someone is going to get their personal information or be able to track what they watch, but security of their investment. If anyone remembers the old pay-tv programs ON and IT, they remember that they went out of business because everyone was pirating their signal. Canada was a haven for home-brew on boxes. They filtered accross the border, everyone had them, and nobody was paying for them. Because it was a complete hardware solution, the company had to strike a balance between acceptable levels of piracy, cash flow, and cost to change the boxes of their subscribers.

      This is exactly what is going to happen to DirectTV, but they only have to send out new cards, not entire receivers. When piracy gets too high, they ship another card. It's much easier to ship a card, to have the user install it, and coordinate the effort. But once the piracy becomes rampant, then the legitimate subscribers will have lost their initial hardware investment.

      --
      You think that I'm crazy, you should see this guy!
    2. Re:"Security" by elvum · · Score: 5, Insightful

      They're still twisting the English language to their own ends. They need to explain why users have to install their new cards, but "security" sounds so much friendlier than "to protect our revenue stream", despite the two being far from synonymous...

    3. Re:"Security" by phil+reed · · Score: 2, Interesting

      Do you work for DirecTV? This post sounds like it came from their PR department.

      The card upgrade is for the security of DirecTV's revenue stream. Everything else is secondary.

      Since they are not replacing the receivers, that means the cards will be as hackable as before. Somebody will get a legit card, pop it in a debugger and watch the communications between the card and the receiver, then get to work on reverse-engineering the card. It will take a while, but the new cards will ultimately be hacked too.

      --

      ...phil
      "For a list of the ways which technology has failed to improve our quality of life, press 3."
    4. Re:"Security" by Angry+White+Guy · · Score: 2

      Yeah, I will agree with you, but I've been lied to before, I'll be lied to again, and if someone wants to lie to me without costing me money or time, they have that right. And it's much more pleasing than them telling you to replace your access card within X days or risk having your television subscription revoked.
      Some people might not understand that what they are paying for, people are getting for free. Some people might just turn around and start pirating it, if everyone else is.
      People are strange, and will do strange things. I've worked for millionaires who pirate software, who pirate satellite, hell, even try to cheat me out of money. And it's not being frugal or hard-working that got them their millions, and their actions are definitely not keeping them millionaires.

      --
      You think that I'm crazy, you should see this guy!
    5. Re:"Security" by Angry+White+Guy · · Score: 3

      Actually, no. I do not work for DirectTV. Actually, I have pirated their signals in the past, and helped others do so. But when I did do this, I did not delude myself by saying that I wasn't stealing, or helping others steal. I had two reasons for doing what I did: Canadian Television sucked, and money.

      I guess that I'm just honest about my dishonesty.

      --
      You think that I'm crazy, you should see this guy!
    6. Re:"Security" by NoMoreNicksLeft · · Score: 2

      Actually, in canada it is legal, or was until recently.

      Legal = Not stealing.

      But thanks for tossing some sympathy towards Dave, he needs it after all. I'm sure he's grateful to sniveling little asswads like yourself.

      BTW, for those that don't know. Canadians can't by law subscribe to directv, and a court ruling declared their signals to be public domain, across the border. He could have been a billionaire, and he still couldn't have subscribed to them, without immigrating to the US. So, he's not honest at all, and he's not even lying for his own benefit... rather, for the benefit of a big, fat, filthy corporation! Way to go, AWG.

  5. Re:Calling all proofreaders by keep_it_simple_stupi · · Score: 2

    Yeah yeah... You got the point anyway. However this brings up an interesting point... Even if they only posted only how the technology works, they are still breaking the DMCA and can go directly to jail w/o their $200. This is why it is so dangerous.

  6. Re:Calling all proofreaders by keep_it_simple_stupi · · Score: 2

    Okay so my grammar isn't the best this early either - "Even if they only posted how the technology works..."

    Happy?

  7. People who illegally recieve SatTV are not Pirates by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 3, Funny

    Pirates are gruff men on ships who say ARRR and steal your boat. People who illegally decode a signal being broadcast through their private air space are just people who illegally decode a publicly broadcast signal. The news corps is doing a disservice to the public by using slang terms and being unclear in their communication of a story.

  8. Corporate hacking by killmenow · · Score: 5, Funny

    Frankly, I don't care if companies hack each other...so long as I benefit.

  9. Interesting timing . by AftanGustur · · Score: 4, Insightful


    It was only yesterday (*not kidding*) that one of the bigger Vivendi owned satellite TV (Canalsat) upgraded it's encryption system to "Seca2".

    But I'm afraid the Seca2 system is DOA as it has already been cracked by Italian Crackers.

    --
    echo '[q]sa[ln0=aln80~Psnlbx]16isb572CCB9AE9DB03273snlbxq' |dc
    1. Re:Interesting timing . by AftanGustur · · Score: 2
      Where does it say (yes this is an automated Italian->English translation) that Seca2 is hacked

      Scroll down a bit and you find links to download the smartcard programs.

      Also, have a look at This page (search for "seca")

      --
      echo '[q]sa[ln0=aln80~Psnlbx]16isb572CCB9AE9DB03273snlbxq' |dc
  10. Continuous update by Zeinfeld · · Score: 5, Interesting
    An interesting feature of the satelite smartcard scene is that the protection schemes are designed with the knowledge they can be craked.

    Ultimately no security scheme based on commodity hardware is secure against a determined attack. Even the clipper chip was broken. If the adversary has a scanning electron microscope available they are going to be able to reverse engineer the chip. Ross Andersson did a paper on this a while back.

    The strategy the satellite companies use today is economic rather than purely technical. What they do is to design smart cards which are subject to progressive security flaws. They then send out different variations on the smart card to different customers.

    The trick is that the pirate does not know which of the flaws matter and which do not. So if the pirate clones a particular card perfectly the satellite company can respond cheaply and effectively by just replacing the small number of cards that have been compromised.

    If the pirate makes a more general attack the satelite co looks for any small difference between the cloned card and the genuine cards and programs a deactivation code to take advantage.

    Most cloned cards are not perfect since the pirates are in competition with each other. It is better to get a cloned card out in 3 weeks than to wait a n extra couple of months and allow a competitor to steal the market.

    The satelite cos generally wait until the pirates have sold a significant number of cards before sending out the deactivation codes. This discredits the pirates with more customers. If the customers learn that using a pirate card ends up costing them more than being honest in addition to being inconvenient they are more likely to turn honest. Another trick is to disable the cards right before big events.

    --
    Looking for an Information Security student project suggestion?
    Try http://dotcrimeManifesto.com/
    1. Re:Continuous update by Jordy · · Score: 2

      Ultimately no security scheme based on commodity hardware is secure against a determined attack.

      Rule #1: Security in an insecure environment is unobtainable.

      Be it commodity hardware or not, there is no such thing as 'tamper-proof' hardware and given enough resources, the best tamper-resistant hardware can be reverse engineered.

      The goal of a security system is to make the cost of breaking into it more expensive than what the system is securing.

      I think DirecTV has done a pretty good job at raising the cost (time more than money) of breaking the system above what your average individual considers excessive.

      --
      The world is neither black nor white nor good nor evil, only many shades of CowboyNeal.
    2. Re:Continuous update by thogard · · Score: 2

      I find it interesting that we hear about smartcard cracks with Sat TV systems but we don't hear about people cracking the smart card bank cards. If its worth 10 years in jail to crack a TV system to save $39.95/mo, how many people are going after the bank systems? The last numbers I saw showed chip card fraud something link 10x the dollar amount of mag card fraud and the only people that seem to be reporting chip card fraud to the public are the pay tv compaines.

  11. Re:Arrr, me Hearty, your a scurvy dog sea lawyer by elvum · · Score: 2

    That's because the English language is defined by usage. That means:

    1. People who say it's right to call copyright infringers "pirates" are correct

    2. People who say it's wrong to call copyright infringers "pirates" are also correct - as long as they're arguing that it's morally, not definitively wrong; if they persuade enough people to adopt their viewpoint they'll eventually be definitively right too!

  12. dismay, delight, dismay by gosand · · Score: 5, Insightful
    dismay: The title of the article says "hacking" when it means "cracking".

    delight: The text of the article gets the term right, saying that their smart cards were "cracked".

    dismay: The text then misuses the term again, saying Echostar was hacked.

    Come on folks, if a site that supposedly is "news for nerds" can't get the term right, how is anyone else expected to?
    (and don't give me the BS that hacking and cracking are the same thing)

    --

    My beliefs do not require that you agree with them.

    1. Re:dismay, delight, dismay by trb · · Score: 4, Insightful
      The set of hackers and the set of crackers intersect. A person who breaks into a system is a cracker, but the act of breaking in, especially if it involves figuring out how to break in, is a hack as well as a crack. Hackers have been figuring out how to subvert security mechanisms for a long time, it's an interesting pursuit.

      I think of it this way - solving a crossword puzzle is like hacking. Copying someone else's solution to a crossword puzzle is like cracking.

    2. Re:dismay, delight, dismay by gosand · · Score: 2
      When you give a speech, do you start out with:
      Webster's dictionary defines...

      Honestly, no offense to you personally, but quoting a dictionary is one of the most ignorant forms of educated argument you can make. Dictionaries are collections of what the dictionary writers think they know. Just because the American public misuses a term doesn't mean it is correct. Would you say that the words "your" and "you're" are interchangeable, since most people use them interchangeably? Dictionaries are to information what encyclopedias are to research books, or cliff's notes to literature. It is meant to be a starting point. Just because it is in a dictionary doesn't make it so.

      --

      My beliefs do not require that you agree with them.

  13. Re:Arrr, me Hearty, your a scurvy dog sea lawyer by Dannon · · Score: 2
    An interesting bit of English trivia, quoted from this page:
    Filibuster: This American political term derives from the Dutch vrijbuiter, or free-booter, a term applied to pirates in the Caribbean in the 16th century.... The modern legislative sense was common by the 1850s, probably adopted because the filibusterers were hijacking the debate much like a pirate would hijack a ship.
    So, Congress is full of pirates. Arrr, avast, ye mateys!
    --
    Good judgment comes from experience.
    Experience comes from bad judgment.
  14. ahh simpsons by Jonny+Ringo · · Score: 5, Funny

    Homer:Well I just bought some shares of News Corp.
    Lisa: Dad that's fox!
    Homer: Sell! Sell!

  15. It's a troll by overunderunderdone · · Score: 2

    You are responding to a troll. A real honest-to-goodness "troll" that is just writing nonsense to "troll" for a reaction. Not someone (often mis-moderated as a "troll") who really believes the nonsense they write.

  16. CARD SWAP = FALSE! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Informative

    DirecTV (aka "Dave") is NOT currently swapping access cards. They finished swapping Period 3 (aka "HU") smartcards for their Period 2 (aka "H") smartcards.

    Dave's H cards were completely exploited by hackers (aka "testers") and were completely protected from any electronic countermeasures (aka "ECM") by a method of testing called emulation. Dave had no choice but to instigate a card swap.

    The problem now is that Dave's HU cards are almost completely exploited also. About the only thing most testers can't do with Dave's HU cards is truly emulate. There is a form of pseudo-emulation out called C-Master and Kryptonite, but those don't truly protect the card from a ASIC-killing ECM.

    Dave's latest card out is called a P4. This card is immune to all forms of public testing at this point. There is currently a small group of elite testers who are attempting to perfect a method of bypassing the P4's security measures via a method called "glitching". It involves varying the voltage supplied to the card in a certain way in order to gain entry. Read/write entry via glitching the P4 has be perfected at this point. Bypassing the P4's security measures and reading/writing to the card can be done at will now. The last thing left to do is to finish up something called "unlooping". A smartcard can get looped if the voltages during glitching aren't applied correctly. Basically, the card gets stuck in an endless loop. Unlooping a P4 card is still difficult and can take 15-30 minutes currently. The testers are hoping to speed the time up it takes to do this.

    At some point, Dave may perform a HU to P4 swap. For the testers sake, let's hope that P4 unlooping gets perfected before that point.

    Hope that clears things up a bit.

  17. what do vivendi actually do? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Informative

    Now all this business is all pretty sleazy, vivendi claiming that their systems are invulnerable and could have only been destroyed by their competitor spending millions of dollars.
    And the dodgy business that news corp has done.

    These corporations are both pretty evil.

    However, Noone is really paying much notice to what vivendi has been doing is the last decade.
    You go to the vivendi site and they own everything. Here in australia they own monopolies on bus routes own a majority of the films that we watch and own almost all of the water sources that are here.
    I recently was on a train in sydney next to a farmer. It turned out he was heading to the city to consult with his solicitor. We're in the middle of the worst drought that has been here for a long while, And he was telling me that he had just recently been approached by legal representatives of vivendi water who were claiming that he has no rights to dams on his own land and that he had to pay them money for his own water. He was in sydney seeking legal advice on this matter.

    Whoever controls the water of the world controls the world and can basically hold the world for ransom and charge whatever prices they want.

    Vivendi seems to solely be a corporation bent on world domination.

    1. Re:what do vivendi actually do? by kubrick · · Score: 2

      As a letter in the Australian said recently "You really have to pity the Australian farmer; they have the drought of the century every two years."

      People must have short memories, as the rural sector always has its hands out. Telephone services aren't as good? You're living in the middle of the fucking desert! It's getting to the point where you can get better and cheaper high-bandwidth net access in some rural areas than you can in the city, and guess how much that's costing the taxpayers. Agrarian bloody socialism, that's what it is.

      --
      deus does not exist but if he does