Lucky Green vs. Palladium

CodeTrap writes "Wired has an interesting story "Can a Hacker Outfox Microsoft" on a fellow named Lucky Green that is attempting to force the issue surrounding MS's Palladium Gambit using a very creative method involving patents. If his patents are granted, MS will be unable to use Palladium to enforce software licensing. If MS challenges his patent, then we all know thier true intentions. Very clever indeed."

Comments

i think

[Gavitron_zero]

it's been proven time and time again that a hacker can outfox Microsoft. Look at all the copies of windows and office and other MS products out there that have product activation. There were hacks and cracks for that technology out before the software's release date.

Re:i think

[gallen1234]

What makes this interesting is that the hacker's are now taking them on in the business arena as well as the technical one and it looks like they may win the day there as well.

Re:i think

[mla_anderson]

That's because Microsoft is not a technology company. So outfoxing them in the technical arena is not difficult.

Now a hacker is moving into their turf, the legal arena, here is where Microsoft is very competent.

Re:i think

[The Fanta Menace]

Competent, or just wealthy?

It's very easy to win legal cases by either buying the enemy, buying the lawyers, buying the judges or just by buying the government.

A few other possibilities.

[FreeLinux]

In order of likelyhood.

1.) Microsoft has already filed patent applications for this process (pretty likely, I think), in which case Lucky Green will be too late.

2.) Green gets patent. Microsoft uses Palladium for license enforcement. Green gets rich!! Consumer is stuck with Palladium licensing.

3.) Green gets patent, enforces cease and desist on Microsoft, Microsoft finds another way.

Re:A few other possibilities.

[elmegil]

Since granted patents are public, we shall see as the paperwork progresses whether or not Microsoft has filed any. Which has the same effect as Lucky Green's attempts, and therefore is probably quite welcome to him.

Something that comes to mind

[A Cheese Danish]

It sounds like a very sound plan, and it does put M$ in a intesting position as far as the Palladium initiative is concerned.

However, my readings from /. have told me that the main issue with Palladium has always been to secure digital entertainment content (ie. movies, music, etc) However, there is nothing saying that M$ could not develop another "technology" separate from Palladium to work on software licences (therefore negating the "patent protection" this has bought us)

I can't really give too informed an opinion without reading the actual patent filed (and I find it interesting that Lucky Green's website hasn't been updated since the symposium), but I can see M$ being able to honor this and still work around it, should they choose to.

If all else failed, they could go back to the ??IA for the political power to pull it off. "We scratched your back with Palladium. Now, you scratch ours."

Of course, this may be all a bunch of paranoid M$ bashing. Maybe they will do the right thing about it all. It's just interesting to think of the possibilities...

Re:Follow the money...

[susano_otter]

You missed the plan:

1. File patents on methods for using Palladium-like solutions to enforce software licensing.
2. If the patent is not challenged, then Palladium cannot be used to enforce software licensing.
3. If the patent is challenged, then Microsoft's true intentions become obvious.

Note that this plan doesn't care if Microsoft wins the contest or not, it simply intends to discredit Microsoft.

Oh, I almost forgot:

4. Profit!

Am I wrong here?

[NitsujTPU]

I don't really care if MS uses Palladium to stop people from pirating software, good on them. The REAL problem is them using Digital Rights Management to control what software you can run on your computer regardless of license.

Without the right signature for DRM, you can't run a piece of software that isn't licensed to run on that hardware. IE, not "I don't have my 30 day license," but "I wrote some software, and didn't pay the company that made the OS so I could write it." In other words, bye bye Linux.

The article doesn't seem to cover if his patents cover this, since thats what I THOUGHT they were talking about until the last few lines where they talk about piracy.

Re:Yeah Right

[Glytch]

You're not getting it. He doesn't need to defend it. He just needs to have it either attacked or not attacked.

European Patent Office

[delphi125]

If he is granted the patent in the U.S., then if he also applies for it from the EPO, he would be able to contest it in Europe too. Although I hate Dutch lawyers as much as any others, MS will not be able to buy a Dutch judges decision quite as easily as in USA.

IANAPE, but his claim in the states should count as prior art for some period for him in Europe, both in applying himself and stopping MS doing so. And MS does target the global market, so they cant do it in USA but not elsewhere....

Re:What's more amazing to me

[intermodal]

believe it or not, there are actually groups out there who still call themselves cypherpunks. like it or not, they're real people. your post is like reading the LA times saying "the bloods and the crips are sooo cliche...." and demanding that they be called something else in print.

5. abuse patent system

[tbird20d]

You missed another goal, which is to abuse the patent system. The patent system should be used to protect long years of research and work, or truly dramatic insights (which often occur only following longs years of research and work). They should be a means of rewarding investment in research.

Something you can think of off the top of your head just after a conference really ought not to be patentable. It's a weakness of the system if it is.

Abusing the patent system by obtaining ridiculous patents is one way of demonstrating how broken the system really is. My all-time favorite is Method of Swinging on a Swing I laughed so hard when I read it that I cried!

Re:5. abuse patent system

[slow_flight]

Of course, there is the "fight fire with fire" course of logic that would easily defend this guy's actions. I think there's a difference between defensive patents and trivial patents.

Re:Follow the money...

[MrResistor]

And what makes you think this guy won't get help fighting MS from, oh say, everybody that would have to pay the MS licensing fees?!

It's a pretty common, and very sad, misconception about the US judicial system that the one with the most money always wins. The guys with the money only fight the battles they can win. If they don't think they can win, they very quietly settle out of court for enough money to keep it quiet, and you never hear about it.