Posted by
Hemos
on from the soylnet-green-is-made-from-people dept.
ihnm writes "Science Daily has a story on the harvesting of the first soybeans grown in a space station. Does this mean McDonald's will start selling Space Burgers?"
Since a near-vegan diet uses resources efficiently, that's what long-duration space travellers and colonists will be eating. Successfully growing soybeans in space is a big deal.
soya - cows - burger - major waste
by
DrSkwid
·
· Score: 4, Insightful
Feeding soy beans to cows to make meat is one of the grossest misuse of resources in farming.
5,000 gallons of water per pound of beef.
When water is becoming a scarce commodity it makes no sense.
-- There are places where the networks are not touching,and there are places where they are-Boeing's Lori Gunter
Re:soya - cows - burger - major waste
by
(trb001)
·
· Score: 2
When water is becoming a scarce commodity it makes no sense.
What are you talking about? Water is our most renewable natural resource, we have tons of it. It is relatively easy to purify and make drinkable. There are some places away from coastal areas that have difficulty getting water for crops, but we have a very ready supply of it for the rest of the world.
--trb
Re:soya - cows - burger - major waste
by
Anonymous Coward
·
· Score: 0
Purifiying and desalting seawater requires a lot of energy, which in turn usually does not come from regenerative sources.
Re:soya - cows - burger - major waste
by
torpor
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· Score: 2
I call bullshit on this.
Solar-powered desalination plants exist. They're just not commercially implemented because... drum roll... *anyone* can do it.
Having a high-tech gee-golly-whiz proprietary water desalination process is better for governments, because if only a few can do it, it creates an *economy* for it, which can then be taxed better.
Damn. My ear hurts.
-- ; -- the corruption of government starts with its secrets. a truly free people keep no secrets.
--
Re:soya - cows - burger - major waste
by
gerf
·
· Score: 5, Insightful
I was born and raised on a farm, so i know a bit about this.
If water is scarce, it is more expensive. So, cattle, and other water intensive things are usually done where there's a lotta water. like the midwest. You don't see nearly as many cattle around in the desert anymore, do ya
The real problem with water and food useage isn't that there isn't enough. God no. It's getting the food to the people who need it. there's two reasons this is hard
1.) We'd have to ship all this food/water hundreds and thousands of miles through bad areas, with little roads or rails. think Somalia here.
The people who need it can't afford it, and we can't just give away everything we have all the time. we're not a socialist nation, us americans (we have the biggest surplus of food though).
So, if you want to become a vegetarian, this is truly the right reason. but please, be sensical about it, and don't talk about what you don't know
Re:soya - cows - burger - major waste
by
Anonymous Coward
·
· Score: 1, Funny
Of course water's a scarce commodity! It's not like it just falls from the sky! No, wait...
Yawn. Wake me up when they grow ...
by
torpor
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· Score: 2, Troll
Be a far better crop to grow up there in the long run.
Not to mention the delivery options this would make available.
-- ; -- the corruption of government starts with its secrets. a truly free people keep no secrets.
--
Good source for interstellar travel
by
(trb001)
·
· Score: 5, Interesting
I know they say they're researching this to make soybeans "cheaper and better for the consumer", but I gotta believe that they're second goal (if not their primary) is to find a way to grow food during interstellar travel. That's always been one of the biggest problems facing astronauts, you COULD get to Mars, but it would take 10 years and you wouldn't be able to pack that much food. If they could grow food, though, people can live off of an all vegetable diet. Heck, you can breed animals given a renewable source of vegetable food for them.
--trb
Re:Good source for interstellar travel
by
vlad_petric
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· Score: 2
Heck, you can breed animals given a renewable source of vegetable food for them.
And how exactly are you gonna keep them in zero g?
I allways knew the space program was run by those damn liberals. I mean, why would they be growing soy beans? I'll tell you why:
Tofu!
They want our astronauts to eat Tofu. And drink soy milk. And eat "healthy". Dammit, what happened to feeding them steak. You think Chuck Yeager broke the sound barrier and then went for a nice vegetarian stir fry with extra tofu? You think Neil Armstrong was missing his veggy shake while wandering around the moon. I think not!
I say we start a campaign to get some cows up there. Our boys need meat!
If even our astronauts start eating tofu then all is lost. "Come on dear, even Buzz Aldrin eats tofu, why can't you?" I'll have no excuses left. I'll have to start eating that stuff. Aarrgh!
Come to think of it, can we get them to grow some hopps up there?
-- People couldn't type. We realized: Death would eventually take care of this.
If even our astronauts start eating tofu then all is lost. "Come on dear, even Buzz Aldrin eats tofu, why can't you?" I'll have no excuses left. I'll have to start eating that stuff.
Dude, if that argument works, you could always tell your wife that Buzz prolly swallows too, and see how she takes that lying down.
Or, erm, some other such lame reference to blowjobs...
-- ; -- the corruption of government starts with its secrets. a truly free people keep no secrets.
--
Re:Damn liberals...
by
Anonymous Coward
·
· Score: 1, Informative
Tofu tastes good and is quite good for you. Get over it.
One possible starting point is to stipulate a minimum amount of renewable water per head of the population, and to treat countries having less than this as "water short". At levels of internal renewable water availability of less than 1,000 cubic meters per head, FAO regards water as a severe constraint on socio-economic development and environmental protection. It has been estimated that 20 countries will be at or below this level by the year 2000 (FAO, 1995). Most of these are in North Africa and the Middle East. At levels of water availability of less than 2,000 cu.m. per head, water is regarded as a potentially serious constraint, and a major problem in drought years. 40 countries will fall into this category by 2000 (FAO, 1993).
For more information see http://www.fao.org/ag/agl/aglw/homeaglw.stm
-- There are places where the networks are not touching,and there are places where they are-Boeing's Lori Gunter
Re:That's not what the UN thinks
by
fean
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· Score: 2, Interesting
You're right... so lets all export all of the water from our farmlands to the needy countries of the world....
never mind that of the cows out here (in South Dakota)... I have NEVER EVER seen any actually irrigated... not with purified water, sometimes underground wells, but most farmers come up with this really neat idea of digging big holes in the ground, they call this a reservoir, it's a real nifty idea.
so this whole 5000 gallons of a resource we don't spend any energy "extracting" actually ends up being a bunch of bull-shit, as the water wouldn't be doing anything but SITTING...
just because you have an arguement, doesn't mean it's a good one... sure, there may be some places in the world where water is scarce... and we even felt the drought here in south dakota... but the point is that cattle can move to where the water IS, where you have to bring the water to the crops.... which do you think expends more energy?
there is nothing wrong with raising cattle, but there is something wrong with raising cattle where it's not viable
space farming?
by
Nmonic
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· Score: 2, Interesting
How viable would it be to in say, 25 to 50 years have huge orbiting farming (greenhouse) satellites, fully automated (sorry farmers) and we (er, machines) harvest them year round. Forget the seasonal growing limitations here on earth, and there's no shortage of "real estate" to grow crops on in space, either.
Its obviously not fiesable right now, but if we could get the cost per pound of placing something in orbit down, it could be a reality.
Feeding the troll, I assume...
by
Anonymous Coward
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· Score: 0
Water is becoming a scarce commodity? C'mon, it's a highly renewable resource.
Funding
by
Anonymous Coward
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· Score: 1, Insightful
Does this mean McDonald's will start selling Space Burgers?
simple concept... evaporate water and condense the vapor... The output is clean.
-- Go away, or I will replace you with a very small shell script.
If this a permanent solution, why does it say:
by
anthony_dipierro
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· Score: 1
Solar stills are not a primary water source, nor a subsititue for carrying adequate amounts of water in the desert.
Re:If this a permanent solution, why does it say:
by
sethanon
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· Score: 1
Because on a small scale you aren't going to get enough water out of the dirt to do anything more than survive. (Plus they obviously don't want idiots wandering about the desert with nothing but a sheet of plastic and a cup)
Imagine for a moment that you have ready access to salty/brackish water. Now spend some time scaling up the system, spend a lot more improving on the efficiency. Now make sure that your small crops are also in this greenhouse...
It is relatively cheap. Is it enough to support small villages / towns? Stuffed if I know.
Re:If this a permanent solution, why does it say:
by
anthony_dipierro
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· Score: 3, Insightful
Because on a small scale you aren't going to get enough water out of the dirt to do anything more than survive.
Right. But that directly contradicts the original statement, that "Solar-powered desalination plants exist. They're just not commercially implemented because... drum roll... *anyone* can do it."
They're more likely not commercially implemented because... drum roll... the solution is more expensive than other solutions.
Replicators - the perfect solution and so far away
by
yoinkslap
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· Score: 0
I have no idea of the science behind it all, but im pretty sure its about as hard as devising a transporter system. In any case, wouldnt a replicator ala Star Trek be just GREAT for intersteller voyages? the perfect solution, if it could work.
-- Dont ask me...Im just the bass player.
Burger King instead of McDonalds
by
jaydho
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· Score: 2
Since Burger King already has BK Veggies, they seem more likely to be the first space "soy" based fast-food franchise;-)
P.S. Does anybody remember Space Quest, Roger Wilco and the integalactic fast food place?
Re:Burger King instead of McDonalds
by
Anonymous Coward
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· Score: 0
Too bad the BK Veggie sucks compared to the Whopper. And get this - they _refuse_ to replace the meat patty with a veggie one!
Your way, right away? Yeah fucking right!
Re:Burger King instead of McDonalds
by
jaydho
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· Score: 2
Huh, that's really weird. Hopefully this was just a single screwed up Burger King, a lot of them seem pretty flexible (I haven't tried what you said though.)
Taco Bell is really good about being flexible, you can get their grilled stuft burrito minus meat and it is super tasty.
Re:Burger King instead of McDonalds
by
tqft
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· Score: 1
Oh yes - found my copy of Space Quest III when digging it boxes of old disks when setting up my "new" second hand machine - it even still worked! Bloody stupid video game
Re:Yawn. Wake me up when they grow ...
by
Anonymous Coward
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· Score: 0
Whoever modded this as a troll needs to get a fucking clue.
Re:harvestED
by
Anonymous Coward
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· Score: 0
Maybe as likely as it is for people who don't want to read things like this to actually....not read it.
Feed the world - burn your surplus grain.
by
DrSkwid
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· Score: 3, Insightful
So, if you want to become a vegetarian, this is truly the right reason. but please, be sensical about it, and don't talk about what you don't know
tbh I couldn't agree more but you do miss one vital aspect. AFAIK Meat is more perishable than grain.
I went vegan for these very reasons. Meat production is wasteful, it was only later that I became concerned with the cruelty.
The destruction of food in the EU is to maintain a false market because govt. is in the hands of the landowner, not the citizen.
In ancient Rome food was free, the Emperor was expected to provide for his capital city. Now that we are civilised, the landowners use penury and starvation as a threat instead of a one way trip to the colosseum.
And for once we can, in all honestly, blame the French - for that is the legacy of the Norman Conquest - modern parliament.
-- There are places where the networks are not touching,and there are places where they are-Boeing's Lori Gunter
Re:Feed the world - burn your surplus grain.
by
HBPiper
·
· Score: 1
Because we all know that all of the petty dictators and war lords in Africa and South West Asia are all secretly closet parlimentarians. No Really! They would stop all the killing and repressing if someone only shouted "Point of Order!"
This is ridiculous. Subsidies are about keeping your people in business when the costs do not justify it from a purely capitalistic approach. This is done in all kinds of industries for a variety of reasons. One main reason is usually national defense. If you can't do it yourself, some other guy can use it as a weapon against you. The farming subsidy business is a bit more complicated than that. But it still boils down to the fact that for whatever reason, people are not willing to pay what it actually costs the farmer to grow the particular crop that is being susidized, or some other guy can sell it that cheaply and it is going to put all of your guys out of business.
-- "I went on a diet, swore off drinking and heavy eating. And in fourteen days, I had lost exactly two weeks. Joe E. Lewis
How's a 35-year old dead-tree reference?
by
Spamalamadingdong
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· Score: 2
Look at "Direct Use of the Sun's Energy", by Farrington Daniels. You may be able to find it used, or at the library. (Would you believe a 6000 gallon/day still to purify brackish water? It was done in Chile almost a century ago; you are way behind the times.)
Re:How's a 35-year old dead-tree reference?
by
anthony_dipierro
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· Score: 1
I'll check out the book. Still, if it really is cost effective to use solar energy to purify water, I don't see why more people aren't doing it. Not that I care, I'm perfectly willing to set up the system anyway, if it's cost effective. Assuming it's a system that can be set up in a relatively small area here in New Jersey.
Re:How's a 35-year old dead-tree reference?
by
Spamalamadingdong
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· Score: 1
If you are looking for water in New Jersey, you might be better advised to collect and filter rainwater. Solar distillation is inefficient when sunlight levels are low or the weather is cool or cold. However, most places with serious fresh-water deficiencies tend to be warmer and have plenty of sun.
Re:How's a 35-year old dead-tree reference?
by
anthony_dipierro
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· Score: 1
Filtration isn't a renewable solution though, is it? I figured solar distillation was the only renewable way to get the water drinkable.
Essential for long-term anything, anywhere
by
Spamalamadingdong
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· Score: 2
Without a garden of some kind you aren't going to be able to have salad greens more than a few days out, or fresh vegetables more than a few weeks out. That may not be important to you, but sooner or later the mass-budget of stored food exceeds what you'd need for a garden to supply at least part of your needs. And if there's anything you ought to know before spouting off your mouth about space travel, PUSHING MASS AROUND THE SOLAR SYSTEM IS EXPENSIVE!
that's like saying 5000 cubic meters of air per pound = wasteful... or howmuchever energy that the cattle absorb from the sun = wasteful
water in the the areas where cattle are commonly raised is a resource that replensishes itself, so to say...
Re:you missed the point
by
thunderbird46
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· Score: 2
Like fean, I'm from South Dakota. There are many parts of this state where grain production is simply not feasible, due to inadequate precipitation, soils being incompatible with irrigation, and terrain forms being unsuited for farm equipment to operate on them. Cattle can be used to 'harvest' the resources that wouldn't be usable otherwise. Also, cattle are rather like the bison that used to roam this state, so in a way, they help preserve the environment. Now, raising cattle in space wouldn't be very efficient, I'll grant that. But in many places on Earth, especially places like western South Dakota, they're one of the more efficient 'crops'.
arh another simpsons quote
by
narkotix
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· Score: 0
mmmm soylent green
-- We played dungeons and dragons for 3 hours.....then i was slain by an elf
the magical soybean
by
tprox
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· Score: 2, Interesting
Soybeans are hardy and grow well in many conditions. Plus they provide the protein that people need to survive without having to require yet another living thing who is just going to end up being slaughtered for consumption (cow, for example).
Sure it sucks to eat tofu every day, but you have to give something up to survive in such closed quarters.
If the chinese do it, so can you!
Re:Replicators - the perfect solution and so far a
by
martyn+s
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· Score: 1
Well it doesn't have to be a replicator like in ST:TNG. I think a "protein resequencer" (a la Enterprise) would be great.
Scientists Shocked at Data
by
selectspec
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· Score: 5, Funny
Scientists scramble to understand the revelations exposed by the data gathered in this experiment: At nearly 15 million dollars per soy bean, growing soy beans in space is really expensive compared to growing them on the ground.
This shockwave rippling through NASA has put into doubt future projects, such as the herding goats on the moon project, the orbiting retirment home, and NASA's holy grail, the Europa Mineral Water bottling company.
You! Burger lord! How is it that this meat is so pure, so perfect?
Well, it all started in 1962... Utilizing advances in modern food synthesis, scientists at NASA began work on a germ hostile space meat-
Only recently has their hard work paid off. As even more advances in the field of space meat have been made and applied to what is now known as Operation Meat. Seeing this as a way to end their streak of being sued by angry costumers poisoned by their burgers, the Mac Meaties corporation decided to try this miraculous space meat.
Not having access to that technology, we make ours out of napkins.
-- They stuck me in an institution, said it was the only solution, to...protect me from the enemy, myself
Slashdot Mirror
Lose weight, eat space burgers.
Never mind the mass.
DNA is the ultimate spaghetti code.
Feeding soy beans to cows to make meat is one of the grossest misuse of resources in farming.
5,000 gallons of water per pound of beef.
When water is becoming a scarce commodity it makes no sense.
There are places where the networks are not touching,and there are places where they are-Boeing's Lori Gunter
This.
Be a far better crop to grow up there in the long run.
Not to mention the delivery options this would make available.
; -- the corruption of government starts with its secrets. a truly free people keep no secrets. --
I know they say they're researching this to make soybeans "cheaper and better for the consumer", but I gotta believe that they're second goal (if not their primary) is to find a way to grow food during interstellar travel. That's always been one of the biggest problems facing astronauts, you COULD get to Mars, but it would take 10 years and you wouldn't be able to pack that much food. If they could grow food, though, people can live off of an all vegetable diet. Heck, you can breed animals given a renewable source of vegetable food for them.
--trb
I allways knew the space program was run by those damn liberals. I mean, why would they be growing soy beans? I'll tell you why:
Tofu!
They want our astronauts to eat Tofu. And drink soy milk. And eat "healthy". Dammit, what happened to feeding them steak. You think Chuck Yeager broke the sound barrier and then went for a nice vegetarian stir fry with extra tofu? You think Neil Armstrong was missing his veggy shake while wandering around the moon. I think not!
I say we start a campaign to get some cows up there. Our boys need meat!
If even our astronauts start eating tofu then all is lost. "Come on dear, even Buzz Aldrin eats tofu, why can't you?" I'll have no excuses left. I'll have to start eating that stuff. Aarrgh!
Come to think of it, can we get them to grow some hopps up there?
People couldn't type. We realized: Death would eventually take care of this.
gus
.. if only.
"Does this mean McDonald's will start selling Space Burgers?"
That would require McDonald's to put something healthy in their burgers... I don't think they'll go for that.
When we can start growing random cow/kangaroo/moose parts in space, then we should give 'em a call
Mmmmm... moose burgers...
From here
One possible starting point is to stipulate a minimum amount of renewable water per head of the population, and to treat countries having less than this as "water short". At levels of internal renewable water availability of less than 1,000 cubic meters per head, FAO regards water as a severe constraint on socio-economic development and environmental protection. It has been estimated that 20 countries will be at or below this level by the year 2000 (FAO, 1995). Most of these are in North Africa and the Middle East. At levels of water availability of less than 2,000 cu.m. per head, water is regarded as a potentially serious constraint, and a major problem in drought years. 40 countries will fall into this category by 2000 (FAO, 1993).
For more information see
http://www.fao.org/ag/agl/aglw/homeaglw.stm
There are places where the networks are not touching,and there are places where they are-Boeing's Lori Gunter
How viable would it be to in say, 25 to 50 years have huge orbiting farming (greenhouse) satellites, fully automated (sorry farmers) and we (er, machines) harvest them year round. Forget the seasonal growing limitations here on earth, and there's no shortage of "real estate" to grow crops on in space, either. Its obviously not fiesable right now, but if we could get the cost per pound of placing something in orbit down, it could be a reality.
Water is becoming a scarce commodity? C'mon, it's a highly renewable resource.
Does this mean McDonald's will start selling Space Burgers?
Sounds like a good way to fund the program.
I'd like to see a link for how to build my own solar-powered desalination plant. Drinking quality output only, please.
Solar stills are not a primary water source, nor a subsititue for carrying adequate amounts of water in the desert.
I have no idea of the science behind it all, but im pretty sure its about as hard as devising a transporter system.
In any case, wouldnt a replicator ala Star Trek be just GREAT for intersteller voyages? the perfect solution, if it could work.
Dont ask me...Im just the bass player.
Since Burger King already has BK Veggies, they seem more likely to be the first space "soy" based fast-food franchise ;-)
P.S. Does anybody remember Space Quest, Roger Wilco and the integalactic fast food place?
Whoever modded this as a troll needs to get a fucking clue.
Maybe as likely as it is for people who don't want to read things like this to actually....not read it.
So, if you want to become a vegetarian, this is truly the right reason. but please, be sensical about it, and don't talk about what you don't know
tbh I couldn't agree more but you do miss one vital aspect. AFAIK Meat is more perishable than grain.
I went vegan for these very reasons. Meat production is wasteful, it was only later that I became concerned with the cruelty.
The destruction of food in the EU is to maintain a false market because govt. is in the hands of the landowner, not the citizen.
In ancient Rome food was free, the Emperor was expected to provide for his capital city. Now that we are civilised, the landowners use penury and starvation as a threat instead of a one way trip to the colosseum.
And for once we can, in all honestly, blame the French - for that is the legacy of the Norman Conquest - modern parliament.
There are places where the networks are not touching,and there are places where they are-Boeing's Lori Gunter
Look at "Direct Use of the Sun's Energy", by Farrington Daniels. You may be able to find it used, or at the library. (Would you believe a 6000 gallon/day still to purify brackish water? It was done in Chile almost a century ago; you are way behind the times.)
Scientists restrict study to entire physical universe; creationist
Without a garden of some kind you aren't going to be able to have salad greens more than a few days out, or fresh vegetables more than a few weeks out. That may not be important to you, but sooner or later the mass-budget of stored food exceeds what you'd need for a garden to supply at least part of your needs. And if there's anything you ought to know before spouting off your mouth about space travel, PUSHING MASS AROUND THE SOLAR SYSTEM IS EXPENSIVE!
Scientists restrict study to entire physical universe; creationist
5000 gallons per pound = wasteful
There are places where the networks are not touching,and there are places where they are-Boeing's Lori Gunter
mmmm soylent green
We played dungeons and dragons for 3 hours.....then i was slain by an elf
Soybeans are hardy and grow well in many conditions. Plus they provide the protein that people need to survive without having to require yet another living thing who is just going to end up being slaughtered for consumption (cow, for example).
Sure it sucks to eat tofu every day, but you have to give something up to survive in such closed quarters.
If the chinese do it, so can you!
Well it doesn't have to be a replicator like in ST:TNG. I think a "protein resequencer" (a la Enterprise) would be great.
Scientists scramble to understand the revelations exposed by the data gathered in this experiment: At nearly 15 million dollars per soy bean, growing soy beans in space is really expensive compared to growing them on the ground.
This shockwave rippling through NASA has put into doubt future projects, such as the herding goats on the moon project, the orbiting retirment home, and NASA's holy grail, the Europa Mineral Water bottling company.
Someone you trust is one of us.
they help preserve the environment
There are places where the networks are not touching,and there are places where they are-Boeing's Lori Gunter
You! Burger lord! How is it that this meat is so pure, so perfect?
Well, it all started in 1962... Utilizing advances in modern food synthesis, scientists at NASA began work on a germ hostile space meat-
Only recently has their hard work paid off. As even more advances in the field of space meat have been made and applied to what is now known as Operation Meat.
Seeing this as a way to end their streak of being sued by angry costumers poisoned by their burgers, the Mac Meaties corporation decided to try this miraculous space meat.
Not having access to that technology, we make ours out of napkins.
They stuck me in an institution, said it was the only solution, to...protect me from the enemy, myself