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Microsoft's New Hurdles

gnuadam writes "The New York Times (free reg. required) is now running a piece about how the recently accepted settlement between Microsoft and the DOJ will affect the ever-so-loving relationship between them and the "worldwide community of volunteer programmers" who work on Linux and associated programs. Of interest, one interviewee quipped, "My prediction is that within three years time, Microsoft will `give away' its operating system to preserve its revenue in the applications business." Would Microsoft give away Windows to sell Office? Stay tuned." Update: 11/04 19:33 GMT by T : In related news, an anonymous reader writes "In an interview with Linux and Main Free Software Foundation General Counsel Eben Moglen reacts to Friday's U.S. v. Microsoft ruling and describes how it and 'trusted computing' will figure in formulating the next version of the GPL, expected in the next few months."

19 of 336 comments (clear)

  1. Never by crumbz · · Score: 5, Interesting

    Microsoft will never give away the crown jewels to save the application side of the house. It can keep the source closed and fight open source for the next twenty years and make billions at it.

    If they were foolish enough to open their Windows source, all the links and hooks for Office would be out for everyone to integrate into Open Office. That would kill their app business within a couple of years.

    No, they will depend on:

    1) DMCA
    2) Palladium
    3) Congressional lobbying
    4) DRM
    5) FUD

    to maintain their lead.

    Just my 2 cents.

    1. Re:Never by trentfoley · · Score: 5, Informative

      Was anything mentioned about opening the source? I thought the idea was to just give away ths OS - Windows. That being said, it could remain closed. And, the "Crown Jewels", according to Microsoft, is the source code -- not the operating system itself.

    2. Re:Never by PCM2 · · Score: 5, Informative
      Microsoft will never give away the crown jewels to save the application side of the house.
      I guess that all depends on what you mean by "crown jewels." Office has long been more profitable for Microsoft than Windows has. Makes sense, if you think about it. Most copies of Windows sold come as a bundle with new hardware, which means they were licensed in volume to the manufacturer at a deep discount. If you want to install Office on the same machine, however, you often have to buy it separately. A lot of the time they only bundle a stripped down office suite (Microsoft Works?)
      If they were foolish enough to open their Windows source, all the links and hooks for Office would be out for everyone to integrate into Open Office. That would kill their app business within a couple of years.
      I didn't see anybody mention opening the source to Windows. They just said "give away" the OS. Free beer.
      --
      Breakfast served all day!
    3. Re:Never by ergo98 · · Score: 5, Insightful

      I realize that your posting panders to the "Microsoft bad...everything else good" crowd, however I would like to call you on a few assumptions.

      a) What amazing abilities does Microsoft Office derive via these secret covert hooks that the source to the OS will reveal? This is an oft stated claimed, and I'm curious what the thought process is behind it. Will the "MakeOfficeProgramGreat()" API call suddenly make Open Office that much better? Of course this is all moot anyways as open source programs usually don't capitalize on OS specific hooks even where there are advantages.

      b) While this might be hard for the kids to believe, Microsoft Office earned the position that it's in right now. I recall when it was an underdog, and then review after review after review found it to be best. While it's far from perfect, in any overall, non-biased comparison it came out on top. It's my personal opinion that Open Office doesn't even remotely compare with Office XP.

      c) This same thing can be said about virtually any other MS program. I run Microsoft SQL Server because it's a very powerful, cost effective database system. I use Visual Studio.NET because it's a fantastic development environment that I've never used a rival to.

  2. I'd actually like that by kannibal_klown · · Score: 5, Interesting

    I know I will get a lot of heat for this, but I think getting windows for free would be good for the consumer (though might screw Linux over big-time).

    First, let me say I am an avid fan of Linux. I only use it for light desktop work, but I see that it is great for servers and such.

    Now, let me also say that Windows is a good OS. While many people (most of which on this site) flame Windows XP... I think it's a great OS. The only thing that sucks is the draconian Activation scheme they used with it. Other than that, it's been even more stable than my Win2K box.

    Now, while this would be great for the average consumner, I'm afraid Linux would take a big hit. I mean, sure... Linux would be more powerful and not have all the GUI fluff of windows for server stuff. But a lot of people will look at the situation and say "Well, Linux was cool 'cause it was free, but now I can get Windows for free too. Who needs linux?"

    This might actually be the biggest step MS could take to squash Linux in the home.

    1. Re:I'd actually like that by hklingon · · Score: 5, Insightful

      ...giving away... essentially free...
      Umm.... No.

      If I'm a white-box OEM I have to pay ~$65 for XP Home or ~$105 for XP Pro at _miniumum_. This is for a sticker only. No CD, Manual, nothing. Office SBE is ~$150 and office pro is ~$250. Lets say some random person wants a $650 PC, for general purposes and working at home. The Microsoft tax is 33% of the purchase price. I'd hardly call that giving away!!

      Step into the wayback machine for a moment. It is early Fall 1992. I want a commodity PC. I'll have to spend about $2100 to get a reasonable system. Dos, Win3.1 for OEMs was less than $80. Office 4.0 (I think it was out then??) was about $85 for OEMs. This is about 7% of the purchase price of the PC.

      Dell, et al, have had to fight with MS tooth and nail to get non-ms products on their machines. Dell has some sort of really sweet deal on windows-- about $40 for the cheap version. Suddenly, MS wants to charge Dell $139 for that copy of XP Home because Dell is bundling RedHat. Or MS wants the volume agreement to include _every_ PC produced by dell to be licensed for MS Operating systems.

      And lets not even talk about some OEM copies of NT Server and 2000 Server-- Copies of windows that can not possibly be upgraded to more than 10 concurrent connections. You have to buy the "retail" version and your previous OEM version doesn't count toward upgrade. If by " pretty much Free" you mean "pretty much free" as in the same sense the local neighborhood crack dealer means "free", then, yes, I guess the oem copies of MS's stuff is "free".

      Windows XP Pro runs very well on our 3 year old PIII 550/256 mb ram systems. They used to have Windows NT 4.0 Workstation. XP runs remarkably well on these PCs. 2000 was slightly slower than NT4, but more stable, so I don't completely agree with the your apparent assesment that a retail software purchases don't really do any good.

  3. I think so, by iplayfast · · Score: 5, Interesting

    MS is in the business of selling software. The juggernaut of OS's is comming to a close, so they have for the last few years been expanding into other areas. (If you own 99% of the market in one area, why would you stay there?)

    So now they've got office software, game software, mouse hardware, keyboard hardware, xbox hardware...

    They need to decide what is the best way to keep making money. Competing against OS which they cannot compete against, (and have already gotten the most market share they will ever get). Or giving the OS away, to keep the monopoly of other areas viable.

    It's a no brainer folks.

    1. Re:I think so, by swordboy · · Score: 5, Insightful

      MS is in the business of selling software.

      That is the first mistake that people make when trying to understand Microsoft. They don't sell software but, rather, they sell you the right to use it for a preset amount of time.

      Businesses do not have the right to transfer licenses - we saw that with the Kmart fiasco. Now that the licenses are tied to hardware, consumers do not have the right to keep their MS software when they buy a new PC.

      So really, one can only rent the software. This is where the DOJ went wrong - they need to force MS to license users and not hardware or legal entities.

      "Hi - thank you from ordering from Dell. To finalize your order, please give me your Microsoft Windows and Office license numbers and we can eliminate that cost for you right now."

      --

      Life is the leading cause of death in America.
  4. In other news... by jez9999 · · Score: 5, Funny

    My prediction is that within three years time, Microsoft will `give away' its operating system to preserve its revenue in the applications business.

    In other news, Microsoft announced that it will 'give away' its operating system to schools in Namibia to preserve their education system.

  5. Mu by jACL · · Score: 5, Insightful

    Speech is conveniently located midway between thought and action, where it often substitutes for both.

    Ignore the noise.
    Keep coding.
    Keep releasing.
    That's what will win the battle.

    --
    "It remains to be seen if the human brain is powerful enough to solve the problems it has created." Dr. Richard Wallace
  6. LOL by giminy · · Score: 5, Insightful

    The Linux strategy is to undercut Microsoft,

    Wow, is this really the Linux mission statement? I thought it was more about making a great operating system for free, not controlling the market.

    This article really doesn't say anything, and says the above quite wrongly I think. I doubt Microsoft will ever give away windows...that would be an interesting day if they did. Over here in East Germany, almost everybody uses StarOffice because it's free and just as good. Free Windows and Free StarOffice...nobody would complain (except microsoft)!

    --
    The Right Reverend K. Reid Wightman,
  7. In The Beginning... by Bonker · · Score: 5, Interesting

    "My prediction is that within three years time, Microsoft will `give away' its operating system to preserve its revenue in the applications business."

    Stephenson hints around this concept in 'In the Beginning was the Command Line'. I don't remember the exact wording, but the concept was that the operating system is basically a commodity when compared to application software. The only thing that makes an OS necessary is that you'll use it to accomplish tasks necessary to run an application.

    We've seen this kind of commoditization in browser software. I know I'm not the only who remembers walking into an EB and seeing a boxed copy of Netscape on the wall. What Netscape realized and MS copied was that the browser was merely a commodity necessary for individuals to access the internet. There were already freeware browsers. Netscape essentially gave away its browser so that it's compliment, Netscape Web Server-- later iPlanet server-- would sell better.

    OS's are going the same way. Where does MS make its money? Windows revenue accounts for precisely *dick* when measured up against a million OEM MSOffice licenses, per-seat DB licenses, multiprocessor Exchange licenses, etc. (My company recently dropped $15k for MSSQL on a 2 processor box.) If Windows was more important in terms of revenue than Office, why is Microsoft still making Office for Mac? Why not force those users to switch to Windows to use Office?

    Microsoft wants to charge for Windows and bust people for using pirated copies simply because they still can get away with it at this point. When they can't-- such as currently is the case in the PRChina-- they'll start turning a blind eye to OS piracy and may even tacitly circulate a few copies themselves to increase 'market penetration'. Eventually, they'll start offering ridiculously low-priced 'Student Discount' copies of Windows, like they have in the past, with both OS's and development tools. Eventually, as OpenOffice, AbiWord, and other Office competitors mature, You'll start being able to get more and more Windows feature for free while MS continues to extract flesh for licenses for Office, MSSQL, Exchange, and other servers and apps.

    --
    The next Slashdot story will be ready soon, but subscribers can beat the rush and slashdot the links early!
  8. Nope, Linux isn't competition.. not at all by Grue · · Score: 5, Insightful
    Judge Kollar-Kotelly: Linux is not a viable competitor to Microsoft.

    Microsoft's own Steve Ballmer: "Linux is a tough competitor."

    Sombebody's been lying...

  9. Re:Crossover Office their biggest threat by WCMI92 · · Score: 5, Interesting

    "Right now, the biggest threat to their OS is Crossover Office. Why use Windows to run OFfice when Linux can do it so much better?"

    I wonder how long before MS uses the EULA hammer and the DMCA anvil to crush things like Crossover Office and WINE? Not long now that CKK has given Ballmer and Co. a mild tap on the wrist (not even a slap) despite their being CONVICTED of a corporate felony.

    Reading the CKK ruling, MS is going to be "monitored" by a comitte that will be made up of... MS board members. Not likely to see any evil.

    Frankly, I see one great silver lining in the stupid ruling of yet another federal judgetrix: MS will not be saved from ITSELF by the government.

    MS's greatest enemy isn't Linux, but itself. Management that thinks it's shit doesn't stink. Management that thinks that they can REALLY foist anything on the public, charge ANY price, and they will buy it.

    If you think what MS has done with XP, product activation, Office XP, and Licensing 6.0 are bad, just you WAIT until their strategy gets emboldened by their "win" in CKK's court.

    Every time you read about them sending the BSA after a school, threatening to block a merger (Bluelight), or price increases to the point where Windows/Office is by far the single most expensive part of a PC, Microsoft is marketing Linux.

    A billion dollars spent on Linux marketing couldn't do as good a job as MS's own actions.

    Ashcroft and CKK saved MS from breakup. But who will save MS from themselves?

    --
    Corporatism != Free Market
  10. Re:Hardly by b0r1s · · Score: 5, Funny

    Those bastards! Not supporting Windows 95! How dare them end-of-life a 9 year old piece of software!

    Nevermind the fact that Apple no longer supports anything other than OS X, and is planning on making most systems not boot into OS 9 after a date in the very near future.

    --
    Mooniacs for iOS and Android
  11. Re:.Net Runtime negates the need for this by Lemmy+Caution · · Score: 5, Funny
    Great. The reliability and security of Microsoft on the server back-end, and the ease-of-use, consistency, and interapplication compatibility of Unix on the client.

    Welcome to hell.

  12. Nothing from Microsoft is free by burgburgburg · · Score: 5, Insightful
    I was amused by your claims that a)SP3 is free and b)that by not installing it, you lose nothing.

    Considering the licensing requirements of SP3 can put a compliant company on the wrong side of the law (1, 2) I would not consider it to be free (in any sense of the term). But considering the number of problems/issues that SP3 supposedly addresses (in the areas of "application compatibility, operating system reliability, security, and setup"), leaving your system as is (in a potentially vulnerable state) is also not something that people would feel free to do. Because of one law, they are in violation if they don't patch, and because of Microsoft's licensing, they're in violation of the law if they do patch.

    So forcing users to make/keep their computers ineligible to be used legally seems to me to be a rather significant loss of functionality.

  13. Re:Windows is dead now. by sql*kitten · · Score: 5, Insightful

    Fast forward to the present. Microsoft Windows, as a platform, is insanely difficult to develop for (unless you are using VB). The learning curve to get started with C or C++ is insane. (eg: COM, COM+, OLE, OLE2, OLEDB, ATL, MFC, ADO, RDO, etc.) Not to mention the cost of getting your hands on Visual Studio.

    FUD, FUD, FUD. For a start, most Microsoft developers are using VB. Slashbots may flame them as not being real programmers, but they're as much programmers as those Linux people working in Perl and Python. The learning curve for VC++ is no steeper than the learning curve for gcc, but VC++ has a lot of stuff to help newbies that gcc doesn't, like code-writing wizards. MFC is certainly no more difficult than say Motif. And the plethora of APIs where have I seen that before? Look at the arguments between the KDE and GNOME camps for desktop applications. And C# is about as easy (or difficult) to learn as Java.

    Yes, Visual Studio Enterprise is expensive, but corporates pay for it; if you're a student it costs about $25. You can get a command line development kit including compiler and VM for .NET for free.

    Linux, on the other hand, is easy to develop for. The tools are free, the compiler is free, and getting your code up and running is as simple as make, make install.

    Developing is not the same as installing, my friend. After all, installing on Windows is as simple as double-clicking SETUP.EXE. I reiterate: writing a C or C++ GUI application is no easier on Linux than it is on Windows (and writing a tcl/app on Linux is no harder than writing a VB app on Windows).

    Also, Java never worked out on Windows. Even with the WFC extentions, Windows developers never used it to code Win32 apps.

    No, but Windows is the most common platform for developing Java applications.

    Windows is dead. .NET lives.

    You're completely right. It's just like when Win32 replaced Win16. And we all know how that turned out.

  14. Re:Wrong, wrong, wrong... by spitzak · · Score: 5, Insightful
    To the average *CONSUMER* Windows is free. I guess you just don't understand how to read the posts.

    How is it free? They look in the newspaper and see "I can buy this computer for $1295". They go to the store, and they buy a "computer". At no point whatsoever does it go through their mind that they are buying "a computer and Windows". They bring it home and turn it on. It is running Windows. At no point did the consumer ever think they were "buying Windows". At no point does the average consumer even have the tiniest smidgen of any concept of "I could save money by not buying Windows". For the average consumber Windows is FREE! in that it has no perceived cost!

    If MicroSoft gave Windows away for free, *all* computers would go down a few hundred in price because of the elimination of the "MicroSoft Tax". The result would be about the same as it is now, to the end user Windows is just as free as before. The fact that a computer is cheaper may be noticed, but the percieved cost of Windows would remain zero.