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MAME To Become GPL?
BigJimSlade writes "The 'What's New' file for the latest release of the Multi Arcade Machine Emulator (or MAME, as it is more affectionately known) states that the developers/maintainers are considering re-licensing the not-so-open source code under the GPL/LGPL. Currently the source is under a slightly restrictive licence that prevents modifications to certain areas of code from being redistributed. (L)GPL source for this project would be quite a boon for devlopers, who could reuse the CPU cores and other key components in other OSS projects."
There are several already:l
m e /Abandonware/
http://www.petitiononline.com/Abware/petition.htm
http://mivox.com/essays/petition.html
http://www.bhlegend.com/icas
etc..
And here are some directory sites that link to other similar abandonware sites:
http://www.inter-change.com/online/abandonware.ht
http://directory.google.com/Top/Computers/Softwar
In the Portland, Ore area and like card games? Check out: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/portlandgames/
Maybe there wouldn't have been as many forks if communication with the "official" MAME developers hadn't often feel on deaf ears. Granted this was a long time ago, But I don't remember enjoying much of a dialog with the MAME folks back when I was dinking around with BeMAME. I ended up staying inside the lines for the most part, but a few minor changes here and there (header file capitalization issues IIRC) would've helped a lot.
Whatever. Glad to see it opening up. It's fun stuff.
Except MAME predates MAME.DK by several years....
Actually I read a ruling that ROMS are legal ony if you have the actual media the roms came from. i.e. the ROM chips (or things like the MVS cart that Neo-Geo used). If you meant cartriges as in having the NES version of Galaga allows you to play Galaga in MAME, that's still illegal, oddly enough. Though owning things like the Playstion Namcomuseum does allow you to do this, because the Roms are included on the CD.
Bork Bork Bork!!
Foo! You ain't never heard of IRC! /me heads to #romland on EFNet
The roots of education are bitter, but the fruit is sweet.
--Aristotle
I don't know about arcarde ROMs, but all console games come with a license that says that you cannot make any copies of the game, including for back-up purposes. So even if you own the game, it might now be legal to emulate on the computer.
See here for Nintendo's policy.
Or try a google search for emulation legal
There is no legal grey area here.
Though the philosophies behind "open source" and "free software" are divergent, a piece of software that is open source is almost always free software (the only difference is on the margins, where OSI accepts a couple of more onerous licenses than RMS is prepared to).
Any sufficiently advanced technology is indistinguishable from a rigged demo
--Andy Finkel (J. Klass?)
The initial reason is that one of the cpu cores added in 0.27 had a gpl-incompatible license.
OG.
One of the reasons for our own license a long time ago was to deter those who wanted to make a quick buck from selling MAME (together with illegal ROMs). It worked reasonably well - the presence of this deterrent was enough to prevent at least some of them. Even though the reality is that selling the ROMs is illegal, moving back to GPL would open us to that sort of abuse again. You must have seen the banners and popups advertising DVD to CD copy programs for a low price of $49,95 - guess what, they are nothing but GPL'd software (MPEG-2 decoders and MPEG-4 encoders) slapped on a CD. Moreover, in the case of legal trouble, it would be easier to target the original authors than those who are redistributing the illegal material. In short:
Step 1. GPL MAME
Step 2. ?
Step 3. Profit!
;-)
The legal uses of MAME (together with legal ROMs) have been explicitly allowed previously (see the Capcom Classics CD), and it has been made clear that MAME itself isn't for sale, rather just a license for the game ROMs and a free copy of MAME on top.
Of course, we've had a fair share of problems because nobody is willing to try to enforce our current license on the most visible license violators, who currently do not redistribute the full source code changes: MAME32K (Kaillera) and the other MAME32 (not to be confused with the "right" MAME32). GPL would probably help here to force the source changes open, or to end the development of these particular derivative works. GPL would also allow us to re-use some non-critical code from other GPL'd projects, but personally I don't see this as a big advantage. Everything can be rewritten anyway.
In any case, even if MAME were to move to GPL, I don't think the development model would change much. Due to the dubious nature of ROMs, the developer mailing list and archive simply can not be public. A public CVS server would also be quite unlikely due to the support and maintainance nightmare. There haven't been any significant forks (unlike somebody mentioned here - changing one or two lines to remove the OK screen isn't forking) nor are we currently forbidding them - and I don't think GPL would change this situation.
Oh, and if you're wondering, mame.net is handling the Slashdot effect just fine. In fact, we've served even bigger audiences successfully. Moderators should frown any attempts of gaining karma through cut'n'pasting text from mame.net
First and foremost, the page that contains the version of MAME32K that we "redistribute" DOES have the full source code changes quite visibly available.
.dll that allow programs to communicate over the internet that normally would not do so. Emulation is the MOST NATURAL application of the Kaillera solution due to the popularity of arcade/console games, and the interest that people have in playing against real people, instead of the computer.
Let me move on to the next point. Kaillera is NOT, I repeat, NOT MAME32K. Kaillera is a client/server application and
You have stated: GPL would probably help here to force the source changes open, or to end the development of these particular derivative works.
This is a closed-minded view at the effects of moving to the GPL. The simple fact is that true open sourcing of a program with as much interest as MAME would bring more interest to its cousins. Frequently, Kaillera has been attacked by people that have no idea how the open source licensing works. We have also been attacked by MAMEDev members who were instantly jealous at the attention that we commanded when we released new versions of the Kaillera client. This took downloads away from the core MAME project and brought them to our derivitive, MAME32K. Most of the verbal attacks that we have suffered have subsided as people began to realize that we brought people and interest to the MAME project.
-soulctcher
(On a more personal note: It does dissapoint me that someone as involved with MAME as you, Gridle, would not do a little homework before tossing accusations towards Kaillera.)
>I have a colecovision and a handful of games, that >doesn't entitle me to run anything other than THOSE >versions of THOSE games in mame.
actually, no... it might give you license to run those game images in MESS's colecovision emulator... but unless you have the ARCADE PCB you only making yourself feel better about your piracy... Of course you're still better than me... I don't even have the colecovision carts of the games in my MAME cabinet... *Shrug*
e.
Build Your Own PVR/HTPC news, reviews, &
....yet I feel it's an important point.
iD GPL's the source for it's Engine, not the game. The levels, textures, models, even (I believe) the actual game code that says what a rocket launcher does, and etc. are still firmly in the hands of Carmack and all.
I think theres a group duplicating the original quakes textures and such with "GPL like" replacements.
Wiwi
"I trust in my abilities,
but I want more then they offer"
Ah -- actually we're both right.
The statute of limitations on CRIMINAL copyright infringement is 5 years; the statute of limitations on CIVIL copyright infringement is 3 years. 17 U.S.C. 507 (2002).
(I.e. the gov't has 5 years to get you, the actual copyright holder has only 3)
Thus, assuming there is no discovery rule (too lazy to check) you need only get away with it for a while. Once the clock runs out, welcome to The Perfect Crime. Population: you.
I don't recommend it. But this is almost exactly how adverse posession (aka squatter's rights) works.
-- This and all my posts are in the public domain. I am a lawyer. I am not your lawyer, and this is not legal advice.
I believe somebody mentioned this in passing, but it's possible to obtain at least a few legal CapCom ROMs if you buy the HotRod joystick or ArcadePC from HanaHo games. www.hanaho.com. While I'd love to see all the arcade games, past and present, console games, heck any game or piece of software ever created licensed under the GPL or a BSD style license, I just don't think it's realistic to believe this will happen. Nintendo is still releasing Mario Bros. games, and somebody else was correct in mentioning that most game manufacturers have realized that we really would pay to play the old games. They aren't going to GPL them and give up on future revenue for those games, or give up exclusive control of the characters in the games. In that vein, I'd love to see MAME go GPL and more deals such as the Hanaho one where we can legaly obtain old ROMs on CD, even if they're not open sourced. I'd be willing to pay a fair amount if company X said they'd sell a CD filled with ROMs for X amount of money, licensed just like any other game is licensed. Backups are okay, but redistribution isn't. Say 50-200 dollars, depending on how many games were included. A few companies might be willing to totally relinquish control of their games, but I wouldn't count on it.