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Dealing with Employers Who Perform Credit Checks?
Rick asks: "I recently accepted a Director level position at a small, 40 person, technology company. On my first day, I was provided with all of the standard employment paperwork such as the W2, NDA, healthcare, etc., as well as a document that is to provide my permission for the Company to do a comprehensive background check on me, including a credit history check. I am now in a stalemate position with my employer in regards to this background check document. I have refused to sign on the grounds that my personal credit information is of no business to the company and that they have no basis of need. The company argument (COO level so far, CEO is next) is that the company instituted this policy over a year ago for all existing employees and new hires, and to maintain consistency, every employee must comply. The company also maintains that the information allows them to identify potential problems with candidates or employees, in that people who cannot manage their own finances may not be good employees, or that those with troublesome credit may be more likely to steal from the company. The COO used less direct terms, but ultimately that was the argument. Have Slashdot readers successfully negotiated out of a mandatory employee credit check in the past? What arguments did you use?"
.... seriously this should be a privacy issue. People with bad credit NEED jobs to get out of the hole they've dug. Give me a break.
I'm the big fish in the big pond bitch.
What next ? DNA tests ?
If they're issuing you a joint credit card, it might have grounds to stand on, but the best piece of advice you can get here will most likely be: Consult a lawyer in your own jurisdiction.
Marriage is considered capital punishment for the theft of a goat in some third world countries...
I couldn't get out of it, but I negotiated who would see my credit report, why they would see it, for how long, and how it was to be destroyed after veiwing. I got everything in writing and made them sign it.
They also read your email and monitor your surfing habits... them's the dregs. But it's their company, their rules, they're hiring you. If you don't like it, vote with your feet and walk away. Right?
Personally I'd be more worried if they told me they were going to do a check to make sure I didn't have Smurfs (replace with your race of choice) in my family lineage going back 100 years. Now that would be problematic.
It strikes me that a company that cannot manage its finances responsibly would not make a good employer either...but would you be allowed to peek at their ledger when seeking a job? Even if it were a policy that you had set for yourself and you must apply it to all potential employers for the sake of consistent application?
The "cue the foo posts in 3, 2, 1..." posts will commence with no subsequent foo posts in 3, 2, 1...
That aside, I worked as a contractor many years ago for a very large software company (whose name ends in "soft") on a project dealing with a large financial institution. The process of checks was nearly as involved as those to get top security clearance. I understand the reason behind that, of course: by working on the project I became privy to information about how the large financial institution did business.
I am going to assume that the poster has bad credit. That in itself is not a reason to *not* get the job, especially if you are honest with your employer and state something like "I have had some bad luck in recent years, but, hey, who hasn't with the economy the way it is?"
All of that being said, I would sign the release. Companies need to cover their asses, and this is just one more way of them doing so.
Unless this is a job that you Really Want (or Really Need, for that matter), tell 'em to stick it. Times are tough for job-finding, but at the end of the day, it's just a job, and not worth sacrificing your principles over.
Whether or not such a credit check is deemed "necessary" for a Director-level job is not really relevant, in my opinion: if it's personal information that you don't want to give, don't give it, and if they don't like it, tough.
I wouldn't work for a company that wanted to a credit check, drug test, etc. on me, simply on principle.
Things *can* happen besides just lack of good sense. I.e., you make a purchase on your credit card... and then lose your job. Or a member of your family could suddenly fall ill and leave you without enough money to pay your bills *and* their medical expenses. Or your spouse could run your cards up just prior to a divorce. And so on, and so forth.
On another note, don't take the job. This time though, don't take it because you'll be forever marked by your superiors as "that troublesome guy who wouldn't go along with our policy".
Negotiating salary is one thing, and is expected in higher level positions, but arguing over their policy is another matter entirely, and likely won't go over well with the higher-ups at the company.
At the very least, if they cave-in, you'll have forever tarnished the all-important first impression.
That being said, I see absolutely no reason for an employer to stick their nose into my personal finances. They're trying to make a relation between your finances and your performance where there is no basis for one.
If your personal finances were indicative of your job performance or ability, you might as well go ahead and list them on your resume.
"A terrorist is someone who has a bomb but doesn't have an air force." -William Blum
I hate to say it, man, but the higher up you are in the food chain, the more important it is for them that they check you out. If I were them, I would already have told you to take a hike.
I know of too many cases of executive malfeasance to agree with your assertion that your financial history is none of their business. Particularly given that people are generally afraid these days to say anything honest in a reference because they might get sued.
> Is this the kind of company you want to work for?
Yes, and more importantly, the more people who refuse to submit to this the less companies will do it. It is hard and expensive to go through stacks of resumes, find a good candidate, interview, make an offer, get it accepted, etc.
I walked out on 2 different offers for this very reason. Just the looks on their faces made it worth it. They were back to square one. And my credit was average, OK. If we all would've used our integrity a little more when it would've really counted, and said NO we wouldn't have to pull down our pants and pee in a jar to get a job today. Now its probably too late.
Do yourself and everyone else a big favor, refuse to do it. Period. And make sure the company knows why.
Operator, give me the number for 911!
How far would you let them go with their checks? What happens if they'd wanted to do a DNA test and genetic screening? The test is easy, but is it a small price to pay?
What happens if you've had some bad luck in your life (e.g. your last business went bust in the recession, or you had some ridiculously expensive medical bills) and you're working your way out of bad credit? Does that mean you're going to be a bad employee?
This kind of information should remain irrelevant to an employer. It's none of their business, and they run the risk of convicting you of "pre-crime" (to use a Minority Report expression). If they get away with this, it will encourage them to get away with more in the future. Just because you're okay with it now doesn't mean that you won't be in the future, but for now you've supported the scheme. Just because somebody wants to hide something (or as I prefer, keep it private), doesn't mean that that something is bad. If you're lucky, the worst that will come of it will be somebody creating an invalid character profile that you will have to work hard to rememdy.
What is worse for this guy is that it is his first day on the job. That means he's already quit his previous job. His new employer has him in a bind because refusal could lead to unemployment, which is rather undesirable at any time, let alone in today's market. His new employer has been deceitful in someways as they should have been up front about the background checks and carried them out before offering him the job.
I never understood bad credit. Why would someone think he can spend more money he has and get away with it? If you can't afford something, don't buy it. Geeze.
Let me help you understand. When you move out of your mom's house you have to live somewhere and you have to be able to get from where you live to work. These are all long term obligations that might last longer than your current job. Rent that looked trivial with a normal pay check is hard to meet on unemployment. Housenotes plus utilities are worse. If you don't have decent public transportation where you live, you also bought a car. You will go "upside down" on the car as what you can sell it for won't cover the costs of the loan you made to buy it unless you got a really good deal on a used car. Obviously you don't have a wife or children.
Now for something that sucks. A company can look at your credit record and tell the difference between someone who's been honestly screwed as above and someone who blew loads of money on trivial bullshit like a home entertainment system, a sports car, and all the other joys of life worker bees like you and me are not supposed to enjoy. Most companies like for their employees to be good little self sacrificing suckers. Sailing, fishing, sking, that's for the boss. Sadly, companies are in a position to make these kinds of demands.
I'd comply, because I've been a good little self sacrificing fool and I've had family money to fall back on everytime I've been screwed. At age 36, with a 14 month old baby girl and wife to support, my decisions impact more than myself now and I can no longer stand entirely by my principles.
Still, I understand this man's pricipled stand and hope the best. He's right, it's none of the company's business and they can only use it pick out people they think they can abuse. We're not talking about possitions spying for the government where dishonesty is a given, we are talking about normal jobs at normal companies.
DMCA, Hollings, Palladium. What might have sounded like paranoia is now common sense.
If I were in your shoes, I would say no, politely and firmly:
If they didn't let the issue drop, I would talk to a qualified attorney. Pursuing the matter would probably irreparably damage your relationship with your new employer. But, then again, if they really pulled something this weaselly, maybe they aren't the good employers you thought they were when you signed on.
Easy, automatic testing for Perl.
The arguments have been made, and rightfully so, that your credit does not nessisarily reflect you as a person or how you will perform in their job environent. Bad times happen and people are forced to make choices to survive those times, credit be damned.
However, there's another point I haven't seen addressed. Credit companies are sloppy. I know of more than a few cases where it took somebody moving Heaven and Earth to get some error on the companies part rectified.
Creditor: "You owe $500!! Says so here!"
You: "Um, no. That was paid. Infact, I have the reciept here."
Creditor: "Oh! Just fax us a copy and we'll take care of it!"
You: "ok..."
~a month later~
Creditor: "You owe $500!!"
These people aren't exactly the pillars of timeliness and accuracy and certainly not a benchmark to be used in employment. Get a criminal record. Urinanalysis. Something. But not credit...
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