Making a House That Will Last for Centuries?

tcyun asks: "The intro text from kaisyain's review brought up a thought that has been floating around in my head as I am a new home-owner. If one wanted to design a home that would last for hundreds of years, what would one have to do? I, and many of my friends, have recently/ purchased homes. As with all homes, some things are in good shape, others are not. Many items are the fault of initial design, many are due to poor upkeep and repairs. Looking around, it is possible to have a home last for hundreds of years (my family's ancestral home is about 400 years old and there are castles in Europe that are older). If one wanted to build/modify a home, what would one need to do to make sure that the home would still be standing, and usable, hundreds of years from now?" M : Wired suggests going underground.

"A few elements come to mind: structural integrity, usability, reparability, ease of upkeep, physical location (geology and neighborhood), technology, and aesthetics.

• Structural integrity: Rock lasts a long time, but has a variety of draw backs. Concrete (poured or cinder block) foundations are common where I live but wood is still the material used for most of the structure. Should steel cross-beams be considered for parts of the structure? I have heard good things about laminated/engineered wood.
  
  
• Technology: Folks on Slashdot have talked about wiring homes with cat-5/7/x and installing empty conduit 'just in case.' Is this really useful with the proliferation of wireless? Would it be more useful if a crawlspace was made available between the ceiling and the attic so that any type of ducting/wiring could be run into a room? Should all rooms have access to a central column through which wiring, plumbing and ducting were run?
  
  
• Usability: I have a small house with a small, combined living-family-dining room. I am fairly sure that 50 years ago the designers were not laying out the space to take into account book shelves, a large television, stereo cabinet, gaming consoles, and more in addition to a couch, chair and dining table. Simply making the room larger is one option, but cavernous space is not necessarily good for usability. What would be a good floor plan and how might different sized rooms be distributed to be useful over time for multiple purposes? Would it need a bathroom? (joke)
  
  
• Reparability: the previous homeowners made a number of DIY 'improvements' which are nice, until one needs to make a repair. Many items are installed in ways where the only option is to remove entire installations. What types of modular improvements can be made that allow for easy repair/replacement over time as needs change?
  
  
• Location: How would one choose where to build a home that would last for hundreds of years? Do you pick an existing neighborhood, space that is at the edge of a town/city or somewhere further out? Does one pick a neighborhood that has been economically/geologically/stable/safe over the longer term even if it is not in great shape at the moment. At first glance, cities in the United States like San Francisco, Detroit, Chicago, Pittsburgh have all gone through 10-20 years spells of nastiness, but have been fairly stable cities at the macro level for a hundred years.
  
  
• Aesthetics: Does one simply design/architect and deal with the fact that it will variously become attractive/unattractive over time?

And to complicate matters, how different are the options if one imposes a budget for initial construction (depending on your own idea of what a realistic budget is)."

Comments

"Some of these buildings"

[Openadvocate]

Got me thinking about L.A. Story "Some of these buildings are over 20 years old."

The house I live in, is only 100 years old this year.

Re:"Some of these buildings"

[Anonymous Coward]

I get regular sex as well, but sometimes I have to occupy myself with thoughts of commas because the girlfriend has got her period.

Use Twinkies

[lostboy2]

I'm sure their shelf-life is around 200 years. :-)

Re:Use Twinkies

[Guppy06]

But what if we built them out of Twinkies thirty-five feet long and weighed approximately 600 pounds?

Why bother?

[Anonymous Coward]

You're only going to live, what... a hundred years? Maybe a little more? Screw it. Make a great house that falls apart right when you die. You don't want your deadbeat relatives prospering from your hard work, do ya?!

and human remains...

[Anonymous Coward]

Since the great wall is packed with the bodies of those that built it (and the pyramids probably have some poor saps crunched in as well), should we assume human skeletons contribute greatly to a structures durability?

-rt

Re:nothing beats hard work

[kzg]

Nothing beats slave labour.

You won't need a bathroom!

[dmp123]

All you'll need is a small room with a hole in the floor, and the three seashells :)

David

Re:Look at Japanese architecture

[James Durie]

I like the way that pratchett puts it when a dwarf talks about his axe. (paraphrasing)

This is the Axe of my ancestors passed down from generation to generation. Sometimes the handle gets worn and a new one is put on, after a while the head will get worn down and a new one gets put on. But it is still the axe of my ancestors.

And since he has a great big bloody axe in his hands are *you* going to argue with him.

First

[geekoid]

get a bunch of slaves,then have them cut some rather large blocks , than have them stack the blocks in some design, probably pyrmidal.

Re:How to build a house that'll last...

[meringuoid]

Step 1: use stone and concrete. The Romans used stone and concrete extensively, and many of their public works projects are STILL standing two thousand years later.

Step 7: Cultivate the area around the house into a wetland, then make sure every environmentalist in the area is aware that it's there. Then, get the EPA in to declare it a wetland. This is way easier than you might think. It makes it just about impossible for anyone to build anything there ever again.

All the other kings said it were daft to build a castle in a swamp, but I built it anyway! It sank into the swamp. I built another one; it sank into the swamp too. I built a third one; it caught fire, fell over and then sank into the swamp. But the fourth one stayed up! And that's what you'll be getting, my lad - the strongest castle in these islands!

Re:Flexibility

[pipingguy]

But I have two sad words to add: Formosan Termites. They are in North America and headed north; the frost line didn't seem to stop them

And don't forget about the Mongolian Concrete Borer either.

You need a good Hovel

[tarquin_fim_bim]

Much maligned in recent times, a traditional Hovel can last for centuries if properly maintained. In Europe there are some examples well over 500 years old. Most hovels are built into a hedge, thicket or clump of small trees and consist of a single room with no provision for sanitation, and usually without running water or cable TV. Costly ventilation systems are rarely needed as usually the builder would leave large openings for the smoke to escape. Construction materials usually comprise of sticks, mud and a dash of bovine excrement. Very cheap and can usually be habitable in a few hours. Insects can sometimes be a problem, but once a family of rats move in this usually sorts its self out.

Re:Flexibility

[scotch]

Let's look at your "architect friend's" theory:

• 1920s : 80+ yrs old : expected lifetime = 110 years, expected failure 2030-2040
• 1950s : 50+ yrs old : expected lifetime = 80 years, expected faulure = 2030-2040
• 1970s : 30+ yrs old :expected lifetime = 50 years, expected failure = 2020-2030
• modern (1990s?) : < 10 yrs old ; expected lifetime = 30 years, expected failure = 2020-2030

So basically, your friend's theory is that all houses will fail around the year 2030. Does he think they run 32bit Unix? Or maybe he is expecting the end of the world around then, and his theory has nothing to do with construction.

Extending the theory, we find that houses build in the year 2020 will last 10 years, and houses built in the year 2040 will fall apart before they are finished

In any case, if your friend is still building houses then, he sure is going to be busy!

Re:How to build a house that'll last...

[EvilNTUser]

"All the other kings said it were daft to build a castle in a swamp, but I built it anyway! It sank into the swamp. I built another one; it sank into the swamp too. I built a third one; it caught fire, fell over and then sank into the swamp. But the fourth one stayed up! And that's what you'll be getting, my lad - the strongest castle in these islands!"

Don't be so sure... Castle 4 will probably disappear too. But then, *then* you'll have Castle 5 -

The last best hope for housing!

Kill me now...

Easy, here is how :

[Anonymous Coward]

Build your house from diamond, platinium and quartz.
Burry it 200 feet deep and you can be sure it will last forever. It sure will be crap, but who cares about you anyway ?

LEGO!

[Anonymous Coward]

Make it out of Lego(TM) blocks. Is there really any other way to build?

Re:what about straw bales?

[cachorro]

Sure, it's all fun and games until a herd of cows eats your house.

And what a wonderful Henge it is!

[Pii]

And we had the Druids! Long white robes, long white beards, early transvestites, didn't get their shaving together. And they built Stonehenge - one of the biggest henges in the world. No one's built a henge like that ever since. No one knows what the fuck a henge is. Before Stonehenge, there was Woodhenge and Strawhenge. But a - but a big bad wolf came and blew them down, and three little piggies were relocated to the project. But they built Stonehenge. And it's built in an area - in an area called Salisbury Plain in the south of England. And the area of Salisbury Plain where they built it is very ah-ah-ah-ah-oh-ah-oh-oh-oh-oh. Cause that's good, you know. It's a mystical thing; build it in a mystical area. You don't want to build it in an area that's yaa-da-daa-da-daa-daa-daa-baa-daa-daa-bup-doh-doh- doh-bup-dee-dee-daa. No, you build Trump Tower. Umm... But yeah, so they built it there.

And the stones! The stones are 50 foot high, 30 foot long, 20 foot deep, and other measurements as well. And the stones are not from round there! That's the amazing thing. I mean, remember, this is B.C. *mumble*. This was before the B.C./A.D. changeover when everyone was going... You didn't have to wind your watch back - you had to get a new bloody watch! As if A.D.'s enough - fuckinell... And the Muslim people going, "A.D? Who's he?" Yes. Good laugh there.

And uh... So, yeah, the stones are from 200 miles away, in Wales. So these guys in Wales were obviously carving the rocks out of the v - very living mountain... "Fantastic, building a henge, are we? That's a fantastic idea. That's a marvelous religion the Druids have got. Yes, got a lot of white clothing, I like that. There we go." And they smash out a huge stone and then they put tree trunks down to roll it along on. "All right, walk it along, here we go, here we go." Buuuhbuuuhuuh. "Help you push 'em along. It's not far, is it?" And the Druids going, "Heave everyone, heave! Well done, everyone, you're doing very well. You'll love it when you see it. I've seen some of the drawings already, it's very special." After 200 miles, "You fucking bastards! You never told it was 200 miles! 200 miles in this day and age - I don't even know where I live now! *sigh* I wish the Christians would hurry up and get here!" And they set all the stones up and the Druids still there tinkering around going, "No that stone and this one - can we swap them around?" So that was the Pagans.

[Courtesy of Eddie Izzard: Dressed to Kill]

Tradition

[falsification]

Are you sure you want to spend your (probably large amount of) money on this? If so, here are my suggestions.

1. Buy a mountain. Research what mountains are available, Choose one that is not a volcano or on a tectonic fault. Make sure it is not too prone to rockslides. Choose one that is away from the big city. Make sure there are no precious minerals underneath your mountain. Make sure there is some freshwater source nearby. Get a geologist to look at the land for you.
2. Buy the mineral rights under the mountain and nearby. You don't want anybody kicking you or your descendants off the land so they can strip mine for gold, and in the process, leveling your mountain. Be sure to consult an attorney at all appropriate time periods.
3. Build a deep, spacious underground lair. Make sure there are two ways to get in and out. The first is at the top of the mountain. You can defend that point with machine gun fire, should there ever be a revolution. The second access point should be near the bottom of the mountain. This is your secret passageway. If worse comes to worse, you can always use it to escape with your life, or retake your home from an invader. Conceal the secret entrance. No one from outside your family should either work on this entrance or know about it.
4. Down the sides of the mountain, plant some nice vegetation. On top, build a nice, handsome house or cottage. Don't make it too ostentatious or you will attract thieves and vagabonds. It should look a little ramshackle from the outside. The inside would be a different matter.
5. Be sure to leave room on top of the mountain for a heliport and such.
6. Whatever you build, keep in mind multiple purposes. Your great-great-great-great granchildren may need to stop using the home as a home, and start using it for commercial activity, such as for a ski lodge. Whatever. The next generation can reclaim it as a residence. Make all the rooms huge. That way they can be subdivided as necessary, etc.
7. Give your home a good, stuffy, but non-arrogant name, like "Old Bramblethorn." Then, mythologize. Give your home a sense of the mystical, a mystique. If necessary, hire a specialist in the area, such as an anthropologist. Make up a legend. Something like this. "One day I was hiking through the mountains, and climbing this particular mountain. Alone, I encountered a ferocious cougar. It attacked me and we wrestled for what seemed like hours. It was a terrible fight. I couldn't get the great, fanged beast off of me until I rolled while prone several times into a nearby bramblethorn. The horrible, hairy cat yelped in pain and limped off. I brushed off the dirt, sat up, and just then I saw a rainbow in the western sky. I knew then that I was master of the mountain. This is where I would build a home for my family. And I would call it Bramblethorn. And that, my young grandkids, is how this home came to be. Now off to bed and catch your forty winks as tomorrow we have a big day planned! Off you go!" You see, that way your descendants will not just like the home; they will love it. It will become a tradition. Then, one day, hundreds of years after you are gone, when one of your descendants inevitably says that the family should sell Old Bramblethorn as it would fetch a huge price on the real estate market, the ancestral home will be protected by its tradition. Another family member, probably the young and well-liked little girl of the family, will chime in and say, "Oh, but we can't sell Old Bramblethorn! We just can't!" The home is safe.
8. Store up tons and tons of money. Your family will need it to fight off the inevitable stream of lawyers, tax men, extortionists, and all the rest who will try to take the home away from you. Diversify your portfolio. Put some of it in gold, and store the gold, secretly, deep in the underground lair. If war or revolution comes, your descendants will be prepared.

Re:Pyramids not built by slave labour

[l810c]

(CardboardSquare)
(font color="Black" face="BumHandwriting")

1. Will
2. 
   Build Pyramid
   For Beer!
   

(/font)
(/CardboardSquare)

Re:No, use concrete

[Anonymous Coward]

yea they mixed hemp in with the concrete.
Thats right hemp!

Re:The "Victorians" were the rich, had nice things

[surprise_audit]

On a related note, the first suspension bridge in the world, in Bristol, UK, is also one of the most stable. Why? Because, like most things that Brunel built, it is overengineered by several orders of magnitude.

Slightly off the topic of houses, but on-topic as far as lasting a long time - I remember hearing about another of Isambard Kingdom Brunel's bridges. I don't know offhand where it is (was), but apparently it was becoming unsound, so the Royal Corps of Engineers was called in to bring it down. They applied the calculated volume of explosives and hit the switch. The bridge went up and dropped back near enough in the exact same place, strong enough for the Engineers to drive their truck over...

I figure I should see at least three comments about how if it was the US Army blowing up the bridge, that bridge would right now be passing Pluto and heading for deep space...

Build them crooked & they will last

[ross.w]

Anyone who has seen a Tudor or earlier house England knows that the way to make a house last is to throw away the plumb bob and the set square

Re:How to build a house that'll last...

[crazyphilman]

Depleted uranium? What aisle of home depot is that on? It sounds expensive...