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Legal Issues Don't Bother American Downloaders
An anonymous reader writes "Ipsos-Reid has released its latest research on file trading. Bottom line, the great majority of users do not believe they are breaking the law. Only 9% feel there is anything wrong with their actions. With 40 million Americans identified as active file traders this is indeed stirring information, though not surprising. Another stat, 73% of US downloaders report that their motivation for trading was to sample music for later purchase. You can see the charts and original press release here."
After submitting data, participants were rumored to have disappeared. When approached by reporters, Hilary Rosen stepped outside of her Mercedes sedan and emphatically responded, "The result of this survey was entirely unexpected and blatantly anti-American. Like, who would've thought?" Screams emanated from her automobile, but Rosen was quick to assure her interviewers that they were merely products of her favorite Mafia films. Jack Valenti was hesitant to comment.
Do you like German cars?
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Piracy is a victimless crime, like punching someone in the dark.
Bottom line, the great majority of users do not believe they are breaking the law.
I beg to differ. Its pretty apparent to anyone you talk to that they know they are breaking the law, they just don't care.
OK, most people don't REALLY plan on buying more than one album in 10, 20, 50, 100 that they sample. It's not that they're saying to themselves, "Well I'll listen to this song and the maybe buy the album." No, they say "I want to here some 'X' today." Sometimes 'X' blows them away, and they DO buy the album.
The internet file sharing model isn't 'listen and buy,' it's just 'listen.'
The question we should be asking ourselves is why exactly is this any different from the library?
"People who do stupid things with hazardous materials often die." -- Jim Davidson on alt.folklore.urban
I have downloaded about 30 Gigs of music, all for the articles.
56% of americans said "I get mp3s off kazza but I dont file-share"
Why do I need to put my name and adress? You said this was an anonymous survey?
Oh, that's just for ehh ... our computer, eh... so he can list you in alphabetical order, and ehh geographical area... yes, that's it! *Scratches back of head nervously, looks away*
...are available in this month's issue of "Duh!" magazine.
Let's look at the facts:
-The music industry is actively hostile toward their customers, referring to them as thieves.
-Meanwhile, the music industry was found guilty of price fixing CDs for a DECADE. What must they give their customers as restitution? ALMOST enough money to buy ONE new CD!
Clearly, the only solution is mob justice-- in this case, the mass downloading of music by people who are presumed guilty by the RIAA anyway. Nobody loses sleep over this except the RIAA executives who stuff their mattresses with the cash we've paid for CDs where all but 2 of the tracks are pure shit.
People don't feel bad about getting back at companies that screwed them over for years.
News at eleven.
IF I could mod you to "+10, absolutely right", I would. You have hit the nail on the head. Most people realize (intuitively) that downloading music/movies/software is (at the very least) a victimless crime in that 99.99% of the stuff that is downloaded and not later bought would never have been bought anyway. I think the remainder is more than made up for by the increased sales due to increased exposure.
To make laws that man cannot, and will not obey, serves to bring all law into contempt.
--E.C. Stanton
In other news:
ok, i'm not sure what i'm getting at (especially with that last one...), but it's something along the lines of "law doesn't equal ethics." you can buy a law, but Leges sine moribus vanae ("Laws without morals are useless.")
Fermat's other theorem: "I have a simple proof, but I can't write it down as I fear it's a DMCA violation to discuss it"
Note thechoice of words. I'd be willing to bet that the majority of people who download mp3's are well aware that what they are doing is illegal, but may not believe in their heart of hearts that it is actually wrong - there's a semantic difference implied at the very least.
In Soviet Rush, today's Tom Sawyer gets high on you.
But, we look at it the same way as going 5-10 MPH over the speed limit while driving - we know that the risk of cops bothering to single any one of us out for a pullover while everyone else is speeding at the same time is slim, so we continue to do it.
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There is a difference between what is illegal and what people believe is wrong. Before the civil war, it was illegal to help a run-away slave, even if you were in the North. Many people worked on the "Underground railroad" anyway and didn't think it was "wrong" to help slaves.
Now a days, the whole concept that you could "own" a person seems pretty strange. But then, some people today also think that the whole concept that you could "own" an idea is pretty strange.
SPF support for most open source mail servers can be found at libspf2.
Look here. When I bought my first portable radio it had a cassette recorder so I could tape music from the radio. Then I bought a portable CD player that had a cassette recorder in it so I could tape music from the radio or CD. Then I bought I stereo with many components and fancy connections so I could tape from my CD and my FM receiver in high quality sound. Then I bought a VCR so I could record shows, movies and even music. Then I bought a fancier one so I could make even better quality tapes and copies of movies and shows. Now I have a computer and an internet connection, a CD burner and access to even more music than I could get from my radio or FM receiver with a high gain antenna. I can make tapes and CD's of music like I always have to listen in my car or elsewhere. Now you want to tell me I'm a 'pirate', a 'thief' or a 'criminal' for doing what I've always done and I might add-something that the technology has always allowed me to do. I'm surprised that 9 percent of the people think it's wrong now. In better news, 91 percent of the people are not so gullible as to believe something that's always been legal and encouraged is now illegal.
Enjoy your Karma, after all you earned it. Feel your Karma Joe, feel it burn.
(a) if it seems moral and ethical (for example, I'm not taking anything that somebody currently owns away from them, and
(b) the laws are complicated, unclear, currently in dispute, and seem to stake out large chunks of "what's fair" as "You Have To Pay For This From Now On" territory, then
(c) people are going to do it, regardless of any attempts by people with lots of cash and hubris to have the laws they want passed by those whose jobs are to write and interpret the law.
Folks are accustomed to being able to listen to copyrighted programs on TV or radio without paying extra. They don't expect to take things from grocery stores without paying. That distinction seems to drive a lot of behavioral choices.
We pay for Linux distros, knowing that we can DL them for free. Why? We're willing to pay people to save us time and effort, and we have the feeling that the prices they ask are reasonable for the time and effort they expend (actually, it feels like we're getting a great deal on the results of their efforts, and Thanks!). We're not willing to pay other people to cost us time and effort with their attempts to own our choices and limit our behavior with predatory laws. That's not what laws are for.
Think, write, think, edit, think...then post.
It prettymuch was popular interest that ended prohibition as well. The book "Drug Crazy" by Mike Gray made that point pretty clear. According to his statistics, heavy drinking (which was a crime) and violent crime rates skyrocketted. Getting rid of prohibition helped the economy (in the hospitality industry) as well as helped decrease the amount of gang activities. Human civilzation has advanced when information and communication became more common. By promoting free access to information, society as a whole ends up benifitting (that is, unless your idea of an ideal world still has outhouses and no deoderant.) What the record and software industries need to understand is that prettymuch no matter how illegal they try to make file sharing, it will still be around. Big brother isn't going to get them out of the quandry they now face. What they really need to focus their efforts on is attempts to proffit off of it, or how they should abandon what they're doing and move into a new industry. When the automobile replaced the horse as the popular form of transportation, the people who sided with the horse-based businesses had only themselves to blame. The masses have spoken, and filesharing is going to be around until it gets replaced by better, more popular and convenient technology. Those who still try to stand on their soap boxes and stop everyone have only themselves to blame when their efforts fail...
"Operating systems suck: you're better off using only the BIOS" --trainsaw.com
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...and apparently is having no difficulty finding the exits!
Information wants to be free...
"A microprocessor... is a terrible thing to waste." --
GeneralEmergency
Kid Rock Starves to Death: MP3 Piracy Blamed. Sad, but true.
No. It is not the "human condition" to steal. I do not steal towels or cutlery or glasses because that is physical property that someone had to manufacture and someone else had to buy. It would be immoral and unethical for me to steal those things.
Songs are not physical property, as much as the RIAA would like you to think they are. Songs are creative entities that are sometimes captured on physical media. Given the chance, most people would welcome the opportunity to reward the authors of these entities. But because the publishers have taken an aggressive position to get in the way, people have routed around them.
I respect and reward people and companies that offer me their product and ask for my monetary support. I shun and despise those who treat me as a criminal first, customer second, and demand my monetary support.
--K.
Sig: Bad people happen. Try to avoid being one of them.
Otherwise, every a new format comes out, people would demand to buy a new copy on that new format at cost. Instead, they can sell you the record album, tape and CD (and if the future DVD) all with basically the same content, but at full price.
If you walk in to a store and take a CD or a shirt or whatever, that means someone else can't buy it. If you download a song, other people can still download it too. If you could clone physical objects (something like the replicators on Star Trek), then would it be a crime to clone yourself a copy of that t-shirt?
The story writeup has a howler of a conceptual mistake: It conflates the idea of breaking the law and doing something wrong. If you had asked American downloaders whether they're breaking the law, I'm sure the great majority would say they are. But get with it. Sometimes breaking the law is the right thing to do. Now I'm not saying that filetrading is a sort of civil disobedience, but I think, understandably, many Americans think that filetrading is as immoral as jaywalking--so, not very.
Slashdot's article misinterprets the data in the report. 73% of the people didn't say their motivation for downloading was for a later purchase. The survey asked if they enjoyed the ability to listen before they buy. Enjoying the ability to listen before you buy doesn't imply that that was their reason for downloading.
--
silence is poetry.
Have you been using the Internet very long? Other than your monthly ISP fee, 99.9% of the data you get off the Internet, you don't have to pay for. So yes, to most people, downloading free songs is normal and expected.
I don't care if it's 90,000 hectares. That lake was not my doing.
I think that is they key statement. In the U.S., most of the time the things we think are wrong are the things that harm the innocent. We have no problem breaking all sorts of laws when we drive, because we do not think it is likely we will do harm to innocent victims. Industry and government knows this which is why they try to show, for example, the damage that drunk driving causes, or link illegal drugs to terrorism. Of course, some of these links are more valid than others, and such ads do backfire when the assertions are bogus.
Which is of course what is going on with the music industry. The industry wants us to believe we are stealing from artist, even though the artists I talk to say most of the money is made off t-shirts and sometimes concerts. They want us to believe we are harming the local retailer, even though the local retailer is harmed more by Wal-Mart and online sales than by copying. They have thus far resisted the urge to tell us that the high level executes are going to forced to sell their Escalades and give up their trophy spouses if we continue to trade music. They might have a better chance by citing the number of people the industry employs, but in a time when unemployment continues to rise with no end in sight, and no leadership to control it, I do not see that even that will get much sympathy.
"She's a scientist and a lesbian. She's not going to let it slide." Orphan Black
I agree wholeheartedly with your comments. My understanding of the RIAA argument is "Record sales are down, therefore that must be caused by filesharing". Perhaps they miss the point that the general public is bored and disinterested with the bland repetitive "product" which these companies provide. Today, the music industry is not about music but about product. When was the last time you saw a fat ugly woman with a beautiful voice in the Billboard charts. Pop music isn't my taste, but I'm not being snobbish about it - it has it's place. But the fact that it is mainly marketted to 11 year olds surely tells a lot about how adult interests aren't being considered.
The RIAA was borne out of the fact that these companies were able to utilise vinyl record technology to fulfill a service which the general public wanted, to provide popular music to the mass market. Today they've stepped away from that original premise. Mainstream music today is bland because it is easier to sell music that everyone finds inoffensive than sell music which some people think is great (and obviously others will hate).
For the record, I download mp3s from filesharing networks. And what I have found is that it has instroduced me to music I wasn't aware of before and I have purchased CD's off the back of those downloads. Those people who decry filesharing have obviously never used it. mp3 quality is ok for basic PC speakers, but usually sounds poor on a decent stereo. Downloaded mp3s are freqeuently incomplete. So it doesn't replace any other medium, but is an addition. I can't use my local radio station as a sampler for the sort of music I like. filesharing lets me do that.
The Romans didn't find algebra very challenging, because X was always 10
I find a big reason I listen to MP3s is because I hear new things all the time with them. On an average week I probably download 20 songs that I've never heard of, and put them into my random rotation. Often times when I'm listening to my collection I hear something I've never heard before... which is cool.
I find myself doing a similar thing in my car. I always listen to radio in my car, not because I love the music the radio plays, but because it's random. I don't know what's going to happen next (even though it'll prolly suck).
I dislike CDs cause they're a fixed format. Every time I listen to one, it's the same thing. I don't think I'm alone in liking the randomness of formats like radio and MP3s. It would be nice if record companies could offer me something legal to listen to my genres without having to worry about downloading stuff or hearing a song more than a few times. (Maybe I should try XM Radio.)
my blog
I could agree with the logic of song preview before purchase. In looking for download files, I have found MANY differenc music choices that I would not have seen otherwise. But with all the new CD's being "corrupted" and not playable on a PC, I have not purchassed anything in a long while.... Just a thought
No, actually people pay taxes because they face fines or jail time if they do not. People pay taxes because they are forced by the government to pay taxes. The average American does not think "Wow, I'm so glad that this money that I worked so hard for is going to help protect me now." while he or she is filling out their tax forms. Instead they are most likely thinking things that I should not even mention over the internet.
People in general don't usualy work to change things that they don't like. All too often people just roll ofer and do whatever is currently being done. People don't like making a stur. It is just not something that the average person does.
I do wish it did happen that way though.
--Forest C. Adcock--
I rarely hear of artists (except the big M) complaining about file-sharing. I haven't heard many artists come forward saying "hey, that's not fair" or "hey, you're hurting us."
:P
Instead, I hear the big music conglomerates shaking their heads saying "hey, you're cutting through our business model" and "hey, that's not fair." And, of course, when they first said "hey, you're hurting us" a few years back, their sales went up (for a time).
The obvious change is happening: consumers don't want to buy albums anymore - we want to buy songs. Individually. And once we have the song, we want to be able to shift it between mediums as we see fit. For a long time, music companies have gotten away with albums because it was the most conveniant way of selling a bunch of songs from a band. But the technology exists now to purchase songs on an individual level - and this scares them.
It scares the agencies because they can't try and re-sell the same songs on compilation CDs. It scares some artists because filler material won't cut it anymore. It scares anyone attached to the tired old business model of dictating to customers how music is to be enjoyed.
It really scares producers because where once a flavour-of-the-month artist could sell an entire album or two, the new methods would only allow them to sell that individual song. Heaven forbid that consumers have a right to pay for only what they want.
But what scares them most of all is that, in the "new economy", artists may no longer need big distribution companies to reach an audience. No, a band can strike up their own website and share their content globally without having to even pay for the servers - their listeners will do that for them. File sharing means that distribution companies no longer have a monopoly on distribution. And they are scared because their confortable monopoly is in danger. Real danger. And it's being decided, not in the court of litigation, but in the court of public opinion.
And they're loosing. And they're scared.
Price, Quality, Time. Pick none. What, you thought you had a choice?
The RIAA has been yelping and screaming ( "OW! My profit!!!" ) ever since they (well, their affiliates) brought us fabulous new talent like 98 Degrees and Sum41.
"Gee, Bob, I can't understand why people aren't buying the CDs, these bands are practically clones of the last big hits we signed... Ahh, must be those God-damned pirates again! Betty! Can you get my lobbying group on the line, please? We got some ass to kick!"
CAn'T CompreHend SARcaSm?
No business has a right to make money. It's like the pursuit of happiness -- you don't have a right to happiness, you have the right to seek it out.
In the same vein, businesses have the right to attempt to make a buck; they don't have a right to be profitable. If the RIAA/MPAA/TLAA can't embrace the new technology then that's their problem, and they should die like the buggy whip manufacturers.
Or as Heinlein much more aptly put it,
(I had to google for this. Here it is (scroll down to "What Inspired Heinlein?"))
I feel fantastic, and I'm still alive.
Okay... maybe not...
_______________________________________________
"A planet where walruses evolve from men?" - Get your flippers off me, you damn, dirty pinniped!
In 2006 Congress passed the Digital Piracy Prevention Act, increasing the minimum sentance for on-line piracy to 50 years in prison and a fine for the market value of the content pirated. The Homeland Security Agency was tasked with protecting the nations intelectual property and a new division created for the enforcement of on-line laws and regulations. In a bizarre parody of fiction, this force became known as Net-Force in reference to a partuclarly bad series of books published by the Tom Clancy estate.
Net Force derived most of of its power from the Patriot I, and II bills, removing its need for warrents, or even probably cause for its various searches and seizures. Rumor and accusation were enough to incur its wrath.
Ownership of a private personal computer soon became a liability in the United States. By 2014 every personal computer was required to have a unique government identification number and to pay a licence fee to the Federal Government to fund the organizations necessary to monitor it.
In 2015 the maffia entered the picture. Using chips and other components aquired overseas, small illegal hack-houses began building and distributing pirate systems. Specificly designed without the vulribilities Net Force and the DOHS required, these systems provided an expensive but unregulated medium to exchange information.
I suppose I could add more, but lets leave that up to someone else. Sure, it's largly based on that love song for napster peice... but is it really so much of a stretch?
Killfile(TGK)
No trees were killed in the creation of this post. However, many electrons were inconvenienced.