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Rocky Mountains Keep Europe Warm

Posted by michael on from the idiot-cheese dept.

fldvm writes "The Earth Institute at Columbia University says that the rocky mountains are more responsible than the gulf stream for mild winters in Europe. See the press release, or google cache. The long held assumption had been that the warm water of the Gulf stream makes Western Europe warmer than Canada and and other parts at the same latitude. The researchers said that with computer models they removed the Gulf Stream and Europe stayed warm but when they flattened the mountains over North America the Eastern US was warmer and Europe was colder. "

32 comments

  1. Good to know, now... by grundy · · Score: 1

    Good to know, now let's flatten those bastards because I froze my ass off this winter!

    1. Re:Good to know, now... by MarkGriz · · Score: 2, Funny

      "...now let's flatten those bastards because I froze my ass off this winter!"

      The Rockies? Or the Europeans?

      --
      Beauty is in the eye of the beerholder.
  2. So by Lord_Of_The_Beer · · Score: 2, Interesting

    Anyone know how this affects the theroy that Global Warming, might shut down the Gulf stream and plunge the northern Hemisphere into more severe winters?

    LOTB

    --
    D.A.K.D.A.E.---- Deny all Knowledge, Destroy All Evidence
    1. Re:So by melquiades · · Score: 4, Insightful

      Anyone know how this affects the theroy that Global Warming, might shut down the Gulf stream and plunge the northern Hemisphere into more severe winters?

      Before this finding about the Rockies: That theory about the Gulf Stream really sounds like wild speculation.

      After this finding about the Rockies: That theory about the Gulf Stream really sounds like wild speculation.

      Global warming is fairly strongly established at this point, but its actual effects -- even at macroscopic levels -- still remain terrifyingly unknown. Most scientists aren't managing much better than wild speculation. But it's all a moot question, since we get to find out through a nice fun emperical global experiment over the next thousand years!

    2. Re:So by g4dget · · Score: 3, Insightful
      Nobody knows, and it isn't really relevant to the discussion about climate change or climate change policies.

      We have no idea what large amounts of carbon dioxide in the atmosphere will do to weather in Europe, the US, or anywhere else. We have no idea either what they will do to sea levels or plant life. But we do know that it is quite plausible that they will have big effects and that it is quite plausible that those effects won't be good. We also know that getting rid of excessive carbon dixoide from the atmosphere may take decades or centuries.

      The conservative thing to do is to reduce our emissions to more historical levels which we know are safe, as opposed to engaging in a wild experiment on a global scale and see what happens.

    3. Re:So by Zaak · · Score: 2, Funny

      Global warming is fairly strongly established at this point, but its actual effects -- even at macroscopic levels -- still remain terrifyingly unknown.

      You knew that global warming was the only thing staving off the next ice age right? (see Fallen Angels by Larry Niven)

      TTFN

    4. Re:So by Mr.+Slippery · · Score: 1
      You knew that global warming was the only thing staving off the next ice age right? (see Fallen Angels by Larry Niven)

      When making claims about climatology, a reference to a scientific work - even a something of popular science rather than peer-reviewed journals - would be far more appropriate than science fiction.

      --
      Tom Swiss | the infamous tms | my blog
      You cannot wash away blood with blood
    5. Re:So by Zaak · · Score: 1

      a reference to a scientific work...would be far more appropriate than science fiction.

      #include <stdhumor.h>

      TTFN

  3. Speculative by amcguinn · · Score: 4, Insightful

    Leaving aside the headlines, the text of the press release reads "Research suggests..."

    This is good work, and part of the huge and valuable process of improving our understanding of climate, but it's quite possible that some group will run a different computer model tomorrow and come up with the opposite result.

    We'll know that climate modelling is starting to "get there" when they're able to make accurate predictions about the effects of things like volcanic eruptions and solar fluctuations.

    1. Re:Speculative by e8johan · · Score: 1

      All these models are based on chaos theory, i.e. a small change in the input may cause huge changes in the output (butterfly in asia, thunderstorm in europe - you know the drill). Thus just altering a very small parameter may mean a *very* long (>1000 years) winter in Europe. The biggest problem with this is that this small parameter change may be a rounding error, i.e. the reality means winter, the rounded simulated result means grapes growing in northen Sweden.

  4. Butterflies by oni · · Score: 3, Funny

    Are they sure? I always thought it was the butterflies in central park that determined the weather in Europe. Oh wait, no, I'm thinking of hurricanes

  5. Flatten them by regen · · Score: 1, Troll

    Well, I live on the east coast of the US, and after this winter, I say flatten the Rockies. Plus, it teach those europeans not to threaten to veto the US in the UN security council.

    --
    The Economics of Website Security
    1. Re:Flatten them by GiMP · · Score: 1

      Ditto. It was a cold winter. I wouldn't mind a warmer climate :)

    2. Re:Flatten them by mancuskc · · Score: 1

      Nice idea if you can convieniently forget the 14, count them, 14, US vetos of UN security council resolutions over Israel's recent behaviour.

      Don't forget:

      If it wasn't for the French you'd be English.

      If it wasn't for the English you'd still be in England.

      And if it wasn't for the USA the French would be German.

      You need to get a global perspective. And a grip.

      --
      When I were your age, all round here were fields...
  6. lets bulldoze the mountans!!! by Unknown+Poltroon · · Score: 4, Funny

    We can make them into "freedom plains" to freeze france!!!

    --
    All Troll + "offtopic" mods are meta moderated as "Unfair", because you abused the system.
    1. Re:lets bulldoze the mountans!!! by exp(pi*sqrt(163)) · · Score: 1

      Smarter than that...you can charge Europe plenty of money for the privilege of having warm weather.

      --
      Doesn't it make you feel good to know that our freedoms are protected by politicans, lawyers and journalists.
    2. Re:lets bulldoze the mountans!!! by Patrik_AKA_RedX · · Score: 1

      Why? Because they dared to disagree with "the greatest nation on earth"? replace the "nation" with "bully" and it would be more accurate.

    3. Re:lets bulldoze the mountans!!! by Guy+Harris · · Score: 1
      Why? Because they dared to disagree with "the greatest nation on earth"? replace the "nation" with "bully" and it would be more accurate.

      I suspect the person to whom you're replying is sarcastically mocking the "freedom fries" nonsense some idiots here in the US are coming up with, not supporting it.

    4. Re:lets bulldoze the mountans!!! by cornjchob · · Score: 1

      Judging by all the advancements I've noticed in and from France over the past 50 years, I'd say the freezing of them is already accomplished.

      --
      We now have confirmed reports from an informed Orange County minister that Ethel is still an active communist.
    5. Re:lets bulldoze the mountans!!! by Rocko+Bonaparte · · Score: 1

      Heh, and the action will be known as "The Gulf Stream War"

      --
      No I'm not trolling.
  7. cold Europe by WINSTANLEY · · Score: 2, Insightful

    It sounds like this contradicts the role of the Gulf stream in controlling the onset of Ice Ages
    in the popular climate models. Are these fact incompatible?

    --
    It is by coff... er, will, alone I set my mind in motion...
  8. just don't tell by Enrico+Pulatzo · · Score: 1

    Jerry Bruckheimer, or else some horrible summer movie will be made where we threaten to level the mountains and Bruce Willis has to single handedly save the day by trading his life for the weather of Western Europe. We'll call it "The Peak" or "Plateau" or something.

  9. Re:Bruce Willis doesn't die in his movies by Katravax · · Score: 1

    I think Bruce Willis only dies in one movie: 12 Monkeys. I don't think he "trades his life" for anything else in any of his other movies. I could be wrong though; I haven't seen them all.

  10. hmmm by Tumbleweed · · Score: 1

    I smell profit!

  11. Re:Bruce Willis doesn't die in his movies by pythorlh · · Score: 1

    Ummm... The parent post was a direct reference to Armageddon, where bruce sets off a nuclear bomb by hand to save the earth.

    --
    Do not confuse duty with what other people expect of you; they are utterly different.Duty is a debt you owe to yourself.
  12. Ding ding ding!!! by Unknown+Poltroon · · Score: 1

    Give that guy a prize!!

    --
    All Troll + "offtopic" mods are meta moderated as "Unfair", because you abused the system.
  13. Logically, by fldvm · · Score: 1
    if we just bulldoze the Rocky Mountains we could reduce our dependence on foreign heating oil and devastate French agriculture at the same time.

    I bet the oil companies know how the Rockies keep the US dependant on heating oil and that is why they started this puppet organization.

  14. Allergies and warming by SolemnDragon · · Score: 1
    this article talks about global warming and, of all things, allergies. Does anybody have anything on weather geographical changes can also really affect this? (If an earthquake drops the rockies, do we suddenly not have to renew our clarinex scrips?) this one talks about global warming in general. You can scoff in a few years from your new beachfront property ...in Wisconsin...

    but seriously, i agree that it's all almost irrelevant, since we're going to find out sooner than we expect.

    --
    "I'd say 'Have a good time,' but arson is still illegal.
  15. Re:Flatten them-or maybe... by Zhenya · · Score: 1

    George Bush: "The plan to flatten the...erm, mountain range is going well... it, however, it is taking a little longer than expected. No worries, though, because we're gonna nuke those evil mountains for as long as it takes to flatten them and show those European bastards who's boss!" -(Who's boss? I say Kevin Smith.) Honestly, I really wouldn't be suprised. What next, the icebergs "because they make all the water near them all cold and...kill fishes and stuff?"

    --
    Politics is derived from two words - poly, meaning many, and tics, meaning small blood-sucking insects.
  16. What if: by valkraider · · Score: 1

    What if they flattened the Rocky Mountains AND stopped the Gulf Stream? Don't just think big, think GLOBAL!

    1. Re:What if: by Casca1 · · Score: 1

      Hey, I like that idea... When you're tired of the lesser of two evils, go for Broke!

  17. northern europe by thomasiomichelangelo · · Score: 1

    What about northern europe? I.e. britain and skandinavia, I couldn't find any diagrams of the theoretical effect if the rockies weren't there. Britain and Norway both are said to have mild weather due to the gulf stream (or were previously said) I wondered how big an effect the air convection due to the rockies has on these countries.