Slashdot Mirror
Tempers Flare Over Ill-Tempered Sword Remarks
msaulters writes "The Austin American Statesman is reporting on Daniel Watson, a Hays County swordsmith who is suing a group of San Francisco-based techies, charging that they extorted him by posting negative comments regarding his sword-making business on the discussion forums they host and then offering to clamp down on such comments if he bought advertising with them. On the one hand, this sounds very chilling, as the defendants, Sword Forum International, are very well-known and respected in the world of sword-making, and abuse of that position would be very un-cool. On the other hand, they make some valid points in the article, and historically, the ability to express your opinions freely online is one aspect of the internet that arguably should never be curtailed."
If the site's staff are expressing an opinion, it is protected speech. It they are attempting to pass off BS as fact and damaging the reputation of the swordmaker, it's libel. He can sue them and he should win. You have the freedom to say anything you want in America, but that doesn't mean there aren't consequences if you're a liar.
"I think you suck" is an opinion.
"You suck and here's a bunch of untrue claims about you" is libel.
There are existing laws that can be enforced if any have been broken. There is no need for news laws, or any reason for this to have a chilling effect on web sites.
then offering to clamp down on such comments if he bought advertising with them.
On the other hand, they make some valid points in the article, and historically, the ability to express your opinions freely online is one aspect of the internet that arguably should never be curtailed."
Is Blackmail or Libel protected speech?
"Can of worms? The can is open... the worms are everywhere."
His [Watson's] lawsuit alleges that Ko attempted extortion by offering to have the moderators of his online discussions clamp down on negative comments about Angel Sword if Watson bought advertising.
The whole suit, both sides, is hooey except for this allegation. If this is true, it is extortion. "We will trash you in a public forum unless you pay us money." If not, the judge should open up his can of whup ass and let the complainant have it.
IANAL, IMHO, YMMV, RTFM, ETC
someone was going to say it
For every annoying gentoo user, are three even more annoying anti-gentoo crybabies. Take Yosh from #Gimp for example.
Daniel Watson's web site can be found at http://www.angelsword.com/ . After looking through the site carefully, I found no mention of "magic." Although the man may have some unusual beliefs about his work, it is clear from looking at his photo gallery that he is an amazing swordsmith.
I do not doubt the fact that the spreading of lies to damage another's reputation is libel, and blackmailing a fine craftsman like Mr. Watson is downright slimy. Take a look at his stuff, and if you're as impressed as I am, tell the guy in the cube next to ya. You don't have to wait for some court to award damages to get this problem solved....in a time when government seems unstoppable remember that all of the machinery of justice and corruption merely utilize a tiny fragment of the collective will of the apathy of our civilization.
But there is another kind of evil that we must fear most... and that is the indifference of good men.
A look at their website should excite this thread (knowing geeks anyway).
It's hard to take this lawsuit seriously looking at this. And with terms like "Avatar of Techno-Wootz(TM) Damascus steel".
I wonder if we'd get sued for slashdotting their server.
best web host ever
In my experience, it's usually a bad idea to piss off somebody with a sword.
Daniel is a cool guy, and as far as I'm concerned, anyone who would say bad things about his work is just a complete asshole. If you want to meet Daniel, just go to any major Texas renaissance festival.
And the men who hold high places must be the ones who start
To mold a new reality... closer to the heart
I think I have a new name for my laptop.
"Eve of Destruction", it's not just for old hippies anymore...
For the curious, here is a link to the "Living Steel" section of the angelsword.com site which no longer appears to be there, courtesy of archive.org.
Living Steel
Portable versions of Firefox, GIMP, LibreOffice, etc
If Watson has evidence that Sword Forum International tried to extort money from him, let him bring it forward now or forever hold his peace.
"In a lawsuit pending in federal court in Austin, Watson accuses Sword Forum International of driving away customers by ridiculing his work. "I was presented as a charlatan," said Watson, 51. "
At the heart of the lawsuit are posted messages such as one by a Sword Forum moderator titled "Muffinhead Alert." Watson said the message refers to Angel Swords and tells readers to "steer clear of them." Another posting by a Sword Forum staff member said some of Angel Sword's advertising is "just insulting to anyone with even the most basic science background."
If all Watson has are postings on a review site whose reviewers decided his "Techno-Wootz" was not up to snuff, then this lawsuit is frivilous. If he has actual evidence of an extortion scheme, then Sword Forum International is liable for civil or criminal penalties. But either way the outcome is very clear, and not at all specific to the internet. It does not "speak to questions of freedom of speech on the internet" (reporter shorthand for "it's about talking on that newfangled internet thingie"), it is a very clear case of either abuse of media outlets by people looking for advertising money or a frivilous lawsuit from a craftsman upset over a review, both old-media problems.
I'd personally like to stay on and find out who is right and who is full of bullshit, but I have a gripping George Bush vs. Saddam Hussein debate to return to on Fox.
The ______ Agenda
I wonder if tinfoil hats help you channel the
natural energy your body has as well as their
swords do. That page had me singing the highlander
theme song and saying "there can be only one!" in
a chrisopher lambertesque voice.
For every annoying gentoo user, are three even more annoying anti-gentoo crybabies. Take Yosh from #Gimp for example.
These two need to settle this like men. They should duke it out in a sword fight to the death at the next Texas Renaissance Fair.
It's good to use your head, but not as a battering ram.
Yeah, right.
Back in my SCA days, one local sword maker described how he did it. He started with blanks intended for use as auto leaf springs. After suitable grinding, he had them heat treated. This was Cleveland when it had steel mills. He went to a heat treating shop, handed over the sword blade, said "ASTM Process 50, 4 hours". They said "It'll be ready Thursday". The result was far better than anything in period; you could cut through logs with those blades without damaging them.
The truth can still be extortion, but only under narrow circumstances.
Extortion usually requires the threat of a criminal act. As long as the speech is not libellous, then it is legal. Even if it was libellous, it would have to be subject to criminal libel laws, not just civil ones. Of course this varies from state to state, talk to a lawyer if you want legal advice.
http://www.lectlaw.com/def/e073.htm
EXTORTION - The use, or the express or implicit threat of the use, of violence or other criminal means to cause harm to person, reputation, or property as a means to obtain property from someone else with his consent. USC 18
Blackmail and extortion laws are generally written very carefully, they do not apply to most of your run-of-the-mill situations.
I've had enough abrasive sigs. Kittens are cute and fuzzy.