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Testing Microsoft And The DMCA

sproketboy writes "I found a great piece about an MIT student and his XBox hacking over at news.com. Apparently he can't get his how-to book published do to fears with DMCA. I hope he at least can get it publish in China or Russia where people have some freedoms left. ;)." The student is doctoral candidate Andrew "Bunnie" Huang, the same hacker Microsoft declined to stop last August from presenting a paper on insecurities in the Xbox hardware.

19 of 281 comments (clear)

  1. Wait... by borgdows · · Score: 4, Insightful

    I hope he at least can get it publish in China or Russia where people have some freedoms left.

    You could say almost anywhere but USA! DMCA/Patriot/Patriot2 are US laws! not *world* laws!

  2. China? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 4, Insightful

    Russia -- MAYBE

    China -- NO WAY

    If you seriously think you're worse off than the average chinese person because you can't legally make a backup copy of your DVDs, then you seriously need to rethink your priorities. At least in the US we have the RIGHT to speak out against the DMCA while if it were enacted in China, anyone speaking out against it would be lucky ever to be able to speak again.

    Yes, the DMCA is a bad law, but it is in no way comparable to the conditions the average Chinese person faces on a daily basis.

    GET SOME PRIORITIES!

    1. Re:China? by Tensor · · Score: 4, Insightful

      Disclamer: I am not trying to defend China's regime by this.

      The big difference is that China is consistent in its image and its actions, you expect them to be repressive and they are, no surprise there, its not a democracy nor any kind of representative gov so your rights mean squat.

      OTOH the US has been traditionally portrayed as the world's bastion for freedom, civil liberties and rights, etc ... and lo and behold they are starting to pass laws to "circumvent" due process and send ppl to jail without trial, DMCA to prevent tinkering with just about anything, extending copyrights ad eternum.

      There used to be a time where opening up an Xbox or a cell phone, or a computer was not only encouraged in the us but subsidized, the US had (still has?) the largest gov tech research grants in the world. ALL those techs grew up breaking things apart looking inside them and putting them back together, and this is now illegal. Its like LEGO selling kits where its illegal to build anything else but what its portrayed on the box (stupid).

      Not only is the DMCA a bad thing but in the long run will hamper US tech developement. its these guys breaking up xboxes today that build the X2020 boxes in 20 years.

    2. Re:China? by the+gnat · · Score: 4, Insightful

      The big difference is that China is consistent in its image and its actions

      Nope. This is the country that's starting to allow *gasp* capitalists into its government, and has been allowing more and more limited free enterprise within its borders (particularly within Hong Kong) and whose economic health depends to a great degree on the continued relationship with the evil bourgeoise imperialists over in the USA. There's a great deal of hypocrisy there - I doubt more than a few of the leaders still believe in Communism; they're just trying to stay in power as long as possible.

      I asked a Chinese friend of mine why they didn't dump their government, since they knew it was corrupt and oppressive. He told me, "As long as things keep improving, we deal with it. Nobody wants to dump the Communists when the economy keeps getting better."

  3. Russia does nowdays by maedls.at · · Score: 5, Insightful

    less spying on ther citizens than USA do. Look on the development since 9/11... I just say: Developing brainscans on Airports... great idea.

  4. Implications. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Insightful

    The X-box has been accused by many of being a test run for DRM technologies; i.e., it's a completely locked-down, intellectually hermetically sealed box on which Microsoft has Power Absolute.

    This guy is now pushing out a book on x-box hacking and MS is not doing anything. While his problems publishing it is speaking volumes as a concrete example of how real and present the whole "chilling effect" meme is on defeating free speech, the point remains that he is refusing to be deterred and forcing this book through come hell or high water.

    And MS, realizing if they try to get a book banned because it talks about their video game system, they'll face public backlash, they'll have the EFF go "holy shit this is the big one", and they'll lose after years in the supreme court after having being hurt more by the case than the PHD student... is not taking action.

    So, here's my question: in six or seven years, someone is going to write a book about Palladium, and all known ways to hack it. And either it will end any use of Palladium as a security technology (though probably preseving its use as a monopoly prolonger)... or MS will try to have this book banned.

    Is there going to be any difficulty for MS, if they try to stop the book on palladium hacking then, considering that they didn't stop the book on x-box hacking now? Are they setting any kind of precedents that people can point at in the future and say "look, if XYZ is illegal, then why wasn't that x box book in 2003 illegal?"

  5. Re:No... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Insightful

    It's called censorship. There's also Freedom of speech in other countries even though americans don't seem to think so. Come on, you have to realize that you live in a country where the companies and the government run you, not the other way around. And there's not much freedom in that. The government just makes you focus on your Freedom of speech when your freedom gets restricted more and more every. And what about a law. An unethical law doesn't make it more correct. Does it?

  6. Re:... where people have some freedoms left by JaredOfEuropa · · Score: 5, Insightful

    "What kind of "freedom" does a citizen have in a communist country?"

    The same freedoms that citizens enjoy in every other country: everything, except those things forbidden by the laws made by your government. We citizens of democratic countries can choose our own governments and thus have some influence over what laws are passed, but that influence is very limited. Politicians do not necessarily always have our interests at heart, or your individual interests may be different to those of the voting mob.

    The US is an excellent example of a country where laws are being passed (DMCA etc.) that seem to benefit a small special interest rather than the general public. You have the freedom to choose your own government, a freedom that the Chinese lack. But I bet that in China you are free to publish any paper on Xbox modding that you can come up with. The Chinese government could forbid it and there would be little that their citizens could do about it, but they haven't done so.

    --
    If construction was anything like programming, an incorrectly fitted lock would bring down the entire building...
  7. Re:... where people have some freedoms left by Associate · · Score: 4, Insightful

    I hope this doesn't sound like one of those In Soviet Russia jokes.

    In Soviet Russia,
    anything not specifically allowed by the state is forbidden.

    In the US Republic,
    anything not specifically forbidden is allowed.

    --
    Someone hates these cans.
  8. Publish in Europe... by MosesJones · · Score: 4, Insightful


    Just like Michael Moore has done with Stupid White Men, he moved to Penguin because they gave him the support against the corporate heavyweights.

    And of course he could just publish it as an ebook on the internet.

    --
    An Eye for an Eye will make the whole world blind - Gandhi
    1. Re:Publish in Europe... by PerryMason · · Score: 4, Insightful

      Unfortunately with the DMCA, you can be arrested wherever it is that you disseminated the breach as long as you set foot on American soil. Just ask Dmitry Sklyarov. He published his work while living in Russia and only got arrested when visiting the States.

      I'd imagine that Andrew Huang would rather not leave the US never to return. He seems to have a pretty sweet deal with MIT atm, which I'm sure he doesnt want to give up and he also seems to be a pretty clued in guy. I can't see him pushing it if MS come down heavy.

      --
      "I'm tired of all this 'Aren't humanity great' bullshit. We're a virus with shoes" - Bill Hicks
  9. Ironic... by blincoln · · Score: 5, Insightful

    ...that US publishers now feel like they can't distribute books on hacking hardware, despite the array of them on other topics like:

    - Building unlicensed automatic weapons and explosive devices

    - Converting post-ban assault rifles for fully-automatic operation

    - Breaking and entering

    - Creating a counterfeit identity

    I guess it's like the view that violence in a film is more appropriate for a wide audience than sexual content.

    --
    "...always new atoms but always doing the same dance, remembering what the dance was yesterday." -Richard Feynman
  10. Re:... where people have some freedoms left by DarkZero · · Score: 4, Insightful

    I'm not neccesarily the paragon of legal knowledge. That being said, the last time that I checked China was a communist country.
    What kind of "freedom" does a citizen have in a communist country?


    China is a very oppressive country and Russia is still very oppressive as well. I think the idea behind the "where people still have some freedoms left" comment was to point out that the people in two much more oppressive countries than the US have a freedom that we do not. Even worse, it's an intellectual freedom governing knowledge and free speech, which is something that countries like China are usually much more restrictive about than the United States.

    In other words, it's like pointing out something that some black power/racial pride/anti-defamation group does and saying, "Wow! Even the Klan doesn't do that!"

  11. Re:Free Speech? WTF?? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Insightful

    HOW THE FUCK IS HACKING AN X-BOX A RIGHT PROTECTED BY THE FIRST AMENDMENT??? Why do people who do something illegal always try to defend their act by claiming their actions are protected SPEECH!


    If I own the damn hardware, I should get to do what I want with it. Including hacking it. It shouldn't be illegal - that's rather the point...

  12. Re:Free Speech? WTF?? by AgTiger · · Score: 4, Insightful

    Talking or writing about what you chose to do with your X-Box is the right that's supposed to be protected by the First Amendment.

    Doing what you want with your purchase is a long established practice under the doctrine of first sale.

    It should only be a problem if you use your purchased item in the commission of a crime against another person or their property.

    Posessing knowledge, or the dissemination of knowledge should never be a crime. If the information is that important, safeguard the information in the first place.

  13. Re:... where people have some freedoms left by donscarletti · · Score: 5, Insightful
    China and Russia have been seen as the epitomy of opressive totalitarian states in the twentieth century. The author was just being ironic.

    But anyway, both communism and capiltalism are simply alternatives, industry in communist countries is owned and controlled by the government, in capitalist countries it is controlled by the corperations. In communist countries the laws are tightly controlled to benifit the governement, and, not suprisingly, the laws in capitalist countries are beginning to be tightly controled to benifit the corperations.

    It is true that capitalism had allways been seen as connected tightly with freedom, but we must remember that during the early USSR, the people had unprecedented freedom, it just seems that capitalism takes a little longer to degenerate into a dictatorship.

    --
    When Argumentum ad Hominem falls short, try Argumentum ad Matrem
  14. Re:... where people have some freedoms left by JaredOfEuropa · · Score: 5, Insightful

    "A communist country explicitly subordinates the economic interests of an individual to the economic interests of the people as a whole."

    Whereas in a democracy, individual interests may be subjugated to the interests of the mob, the interests of elected representatives (or their pals), or the fad of the day ("protection against terrorists"). Democracy does not equal freedom; one can imagine a democracy where everything is decided by majority vote: laws, policies, but also what clothes will appear in the stores this summer, and what will be for dinner this evening. I exxagerate, but the point is that freedom does not follow automatically from democracy, but is derived only from limitations placed on what the government can and cannot do. Look at Afghanistan where an oppressive government of religious fanatics was voted in, by a majority who knew full well what they were voting for. If you happened to be a woman in that country who did not wish to have to cover her head in public, you'd be shit out of luck despite the fact you'd be living in a democracy.

    Democracies tend to place the emphasis on individualism, as opposed to communism favouring collectivism. But democracies can and do go overboard sometimes on regulations and laws that severly limit our personal freedom in favour of a (sometimes very tenuously) alledged Greater Good.

    --
    If construction was anything like programming, an incorrectly fitted lock would bring down the entire building...
  15. Re:Spelling by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 4, Insightful
    You're a joke, and so is your country. Freedom to assemble? Yeah, we've all seen that during the antiwar protests or the anti-globalization protests -- grandmothers being hauled away by SWAT teams like terrorists. It may be a surprise to you, but China allows demonstrations, too, as long as the government agrees with the purpose. Freedom from search and seizure? Sure, unless you're targeted by the "war on drugs" and your property is confiscated (and your ass is thrown into prison, probably for a couple of decades -- hey, the prison industry has to live!). Or you're part of the evil "warez" scene, or a "child" pornography peddler ("children" being everyone under 18 years). Freedom to bear arms? Yeah, we all know how much freedom and security this has given America.

    The US have the highest crime rates in the privileged world, and the highest number of people in prison in the entire world, more so than even China (by absolute numbers -- and China is much larger). The US are a police state ruled by the military-industrial complex. You have a president whose daddy was president, for fuck's sake, the only difference with China is that you pretend to be a democracy -- I won't even comment on your last "democratic" presidential election. Grow up and get a backbone, and stop repeating the same propaganda that you have been indoctrinated with since elementary school, otherwise things will never change. People like you are responsible for the situation the US are in. Ignorant sheep who will defend every idiocy and who will happily believe that their country is "the free world" and the rest are unwashed barbarians ruled by oppressive leaders. Fucking moron.

  16. This is bordering on prior restraint by Quila · · Score: 4, Insightful

    This man can't publish a book for fear of some type of prosecution. In another lawsuit against the DMCA, this could be cited as an example of how the DMCA is effectively exercising prior restraint to publishing, and in actuality creating a chilling effect.

    Judges do not take kindly to the words "prior restraint" or "chilling effect" as there is ample Supreme Court precedent firmly against both. An event such as this could help turn the tide of a future DMCA challenge.

    And this isn't internet, it's the publishing of good old dead-tree books that judges can understand.